George Lucas made Star Wars 1. Doesn't mean Indy aliens were a good idea.
Seriously, if they haven't touched the system in 6 months (~2 dev kits) why is what they say relevant?
I'm not saying it's not true, I'm legitimately asking.
The thing is the hardware within the dev kits likely haven't changed in any meaningful way in the last 6 months, so I'm not sure if that really matters. The APIs were probably optimized for the hardware at this point in development. This isn't some unique architecture like the Cell where developers are unfamiliar with it. It's an older PPC core coupled with what looks to be some ARM processors and a DSP (I'm assuming for sound).
There are more reasons to believe this guy than there is not to believe him is all I'm saying.
I was looking at benchmarks of the 6490m gpu . I was also looking at things like the liano a4-3300 reviews and other similar systems. where they used metro 2033 on the pc as a benchmark.
It seems to me they just do not want to port it since it can run on a pc with similar specs just fine.
Sorry but this doesn't make any sense to me.
There I bolded the part.
I didn't move the goal post, you keep putting it where I never put it in the 1rst place.
The Conduit is a tech accomplishment for Wii too but I don't see anyone praising that anywhere.
I'm confused, were you or were you not saying the tech in the game was impressive?
for me it's not so much that good tech compliments good art, it's the other way around: shitty tech destroys good art. When I'm looking at an aliased, shimmering, low-res mess I cannot for the life of me appreciate the art.
Well shit tech will destroy anything, I agree there. However my line of thinking was you can have a great looking game using ok tech with great art but the same is hardly true with great tech with ok art.
Well, honestly, if you make a statement like that, these reactions are what's to be expected really. Go to an apple forum and have some supposed tech-guru claim the new *whatever* is crap in a rather harsh statement and see what happens. The same would go for MS or Sony fans in the same situation. No need to pull the "lol, Nintendo(fans)" card, it only discredits your opinion.
I think you misunderstood me. I have nothing against fans of Nintendo. I consider myself one of them even though I don't care for many of their games these days. I still respect and love the company.
However it's one thing to favor a company and their games and it's entirely different to be a blind raging fanboy where all logic is lost. These are the types of people I question and I do it for the warriors of any system.
I understand the same will happen with MS and Sony fanboys, but as long as both systems offer a similar and decent leap in performance, I would imagine the majority of the fanbase would be more civil than what we see here.
Further more, i think people have every right to search for the right context in which this statement was given. No need to act as developers are never wrong, can't be biased or can't have other factors play their hand. This is not "just" an opinion. The fact that he uses the term "horrible" instead of "too slow" or "outdated", shows he is not being purely factual or technical, but a bit emotional. The statement seems to leave no room for interpretation, and yet is also seems rather subjective in the way it is made. Like saying "you suck". No question about what that means, but does said person really "suck"? I remember a statement about Wii not being able to run the start screen of Resident Evil 5. Were we supposed to take that statement "as is" as well? In both cases they go about it in a dismissive way, not interested in really figuring it out, not worth of another look. One might see that as a sign of arrogance and prejudice. The developers track record is of no concern in that case.
I completely agree that context is key and I never think it's wrong to search for it. What many don't seem to understand is the context of his comments are related to the game he is developing. For Metro, the CPU is horrible. That can mean many things, but to figure out what it is exactly, we would have to know more about the Wii-U's CPU and what it's strengths and weaknesses are. We have a good idea that the chip sucks with floating point performance, lagging behind the CPUs in the PS360. We know there are fewer threads in the CPU than what's found in the PS360. So it's not outside the realm of possibility that one of the few known weaknesses is what he's directly referring to.
Based on the footage we have, Metro looks to be running a decent amount of similations from AI to destructable/interactive environments. So it wouldn't surprise me if the game did put a good load on the CPU.
To me, this statement is of no more value than the statements made by Shin'n, a dev team that made Jet Rocket as a Wiiware title, outperforming 95% of actual retail Wii games.
IMO both have the same amount of value. Their games are just designed differently and have different demands. Some games are CPU bound while others are GPU bound for example. Assuming Shin'n is developing a Wii-U exclusive, it wouldn't surprise me if they ran into less issues with the CPU since they are designing their game around the hardware. Multi-platform developers don't have this luxury, instead they need to do their best to find a middle ground with the design and do what they could to make the hardware cope with the demands of their game.
oh i remember when every lazy ass developpers crying like a bunch of wuss about 6 yrs ago saying "baaaaaaaw developping on ps3 is really hard"
i guess its just the begining with nintendo.
The PS3 was really hard, there was no question about it. Seriously "lazy devs" should be a bannable term on every gaming forum, especially those like GAF that have developers as members.
Chances are he didn't even touch it if you read the tweets. Considering how each gen we get excuses saying how the AI and physics will improve and how that's barely the case every time I wouldn't put to much behind it.
Yeah, the more I see you post, the less I can take you serious.
Physics and AI have improved this gen, especially on the physics part. AI is harder to measure as that tends to be more of a design issue than a computation issue, though more power does help with AI as well.
I never claimed he didn't know his stuff. The guys from Shin'n know their stuff too. But somehow because you are blunt, borderline rude, your opinion should be more credible? Factor 5 knew their stuff too, spit out GCN games up there with the best of the Xbox, yet many xbox devs spoke about the GCN in the same manner as this guy about WiiU. So, some perspective can't hurt. The guy basically glanced at the WiiU hardware and dubs it horrible.
I don't understand how he was rude in any way. For his needs, the CPU is horrible and slow, or horribly slow, however way it's worded.
Using Factor 5 is a poor example since they never made a xbox exclusive so who's to say they wouldn't share these other dev's opinions if they had the chance to make exclusives on both systems. Like you said, some perspective can't hurt. =p
Somehow he'd have us believe the WiiU launch ports which are suffering, took as much or more development time than the original games on the 360 instead of the other way around.
I'm not sure how you got this from his comment.
In fairness, there was at least one or two posters in there harping on and on about 600Gflops in the GPU - which would be on the 3x end of that scale. I don't know how seriously people were taking them...but it came up a lot.
I don't think anyone was ever speculating much beyond that though, not least 6x.
I remember plenty of people assuming that next gen down ports would be relatively easy. Doesn't seem to be the case now.h
So all we have are heresay and rumors based on old dev kits and quick ports?
Cool
What is your opinion based on everything? Honest quesiton.
Wasn't Xbox 360 CPU bottlenecked anyway? It had to use one thread for the OS and Sound processing each. This basically takes 30% away from any given game.
How does that compare to the WiiU which is not bottlenecked and has more access to CPU power during gameplay? I think on paper it will look weaker, but given that the WiiU is extremely balanced, it should outperform Xbox360's CPU.
No. The OS uses 1.2-1.5% of a thread on core 1 and core 2 (the three cores are labeled as cores 0, 1, and 2).
Sound processing is different for every game where it can take up a thread or an entire core.
Every CPU, or hardware component, is bottlenecked in some ways. There is no such thing as a system without any bottlenecks. While the CPU may outperform the Xenon in some ways (my guess is general purpose code and as Durante mentioned before, branchy code), it underperforms in other ways such as lower floating point performance or lacking the same number of threads. So it should outperform the 360's CPU in some ways while lagging behind in others.
Is the CPU slower than 360/PS3?
Slower in some respects but faster in others.