AuthenticM
Member
Not offensive at all.
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but I personally don't give a shit about men walking around like this.
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Halo 4 Designer Calls Out Kojima on Sex (Pot to Kettle: "You are blue!")
- Thread starter Nibel
- Start date
Not sure if you're being sarcastic, but I personally don't give a shit about men walking around like this.
So what? What's the problem in that at all? She likes his characters enough to cosplay as them and Kojima tweets it...
What person out there wouldn't be honored by this?
I do not understand this mentality, nor some of the supporters of the original post. I do not understand how this is controversial. I can't even begin to fathom how this thread has lasted this long.
ThroneZwei
Banned
I didn't get to comment on this before I went to bed but.
Really? Are you serious? This seems to be a personal issue of yours. Quiet standing up, and suddenly she's just a sexual object and even getting tortured is secondary? That's seriously your problem If that's how you're viewing the character. And fortunately for alot of people, and for the characters in the game, the things they do aren't secondary.
And I noted in your other comment, about how women should feel because a sexual, fictional character is being pushed on them...yeah buddy, in real life it's much much worse. Opening up the tabloids or looking at billboards it gets pushed on you.
Winterfang
Banned
Am I in Off-Topic? The reality is a lot simpler than that.
Kojima made a terrible designed character with the sole purpose of appealing to horny kids who buy figurines and want to ogle at semi naked cosplayers.
David Twitterer call him out because this type of character is not letting the medium advanced beyond Shitty B movies.
Kojima is unapologetic and show his character's Ass and told cosplayers how he likes it.
David was told to shut the hell up for attacking a sacred cow while having a naked woman on his game. He retreated and decided to be Quiet.
Neogaf loses its own damn mind and this topic is not longer about the discussion itself.
She also has jiggly boobs. You can't really say they didn't purposely sex her up in the fourth game.
Happy-Bunny
Banned
Obviously Stefanie Joosten is ok with it...
no need to act overprotective.
no need to act overprotective.
Happy-Bunny
Banned
Been speculated to hell and back for months now, but outside of the actual actress saying there is a reason for the way she looks we have this footage from the trailer to show her skin does have supernatural powers.
No confirmation on whether she can cover her whole body
So basically her skin was the inspiration for the development of the OctoCamo?
Awesome Twist confirmed!
Winterfang
Banned
Not offensive at all.
LOL at the guy in the back checking his Ass.
jacksepticeye
Member
I think she just has the same power "The End" had. His skin went stripey black looking from time to time for his power
Also her design may be a bit over the top but what's more interesting to me at this point is how the character acts in game. If she's going around flaunting her butt at guys to grab attention or seducing people with ehr looks then it's a big problem. But if she's actualyl a hardened badass she could actually be a good character. Like her personality could contrast her beauty or something like that. SOrt of like the beuaty and beast corps
So it would have been OK for a MGS dev to tweet about how the new Cortana was designed by sexist man babies?
The Silver
Member
I wonder what today's reaction would be to the golden shower in MGS2 if Raiden was a girl.
Mithos
Member
Nothing short of a Nuclear meltdown.
No! She's being exploited! White knight powers activate!
Also mega lulz if she does end up having some sort of supernatural skin-based ability like photosynthesis or camouflage. That means that there will actually be a legit reason for her to be dressed like that, and Cortana still has no reason for being naked. Except to attract the 13 year old COD fanbase.
Celestial Mortal
Member
Should I also learn to keep my head down?
Winterfang
Banned
Absolutely.
For fuck's sake, now you want a dev fired for voicing an inoffensive personal opinion? Ever wonder why developers rarely say a word beyond those boring PR approved scripts?
It would have made an interesting thread, at the least.
Happy-Bunny
Banned
Man the way she looks into the camera at the end of the video is totally badass and I hope it will be also reflected in gameplay.
semiconscious
Member
no, it wouldn't've. mainly because it would've kinda lowered my otherwise very high opinion of kojipro as a studio above such petty bs. not to mention, it would've struck me as a bit hypocritical
...
Dude Abides
Banned
White knights to the left, manbabies to the right.
Broder Salsa
Banned
Punchy4486
Banned
Seriously, our reactions to these alleged controversies are always more embarrassing and revealing than the "controversies" themselves.
travisbickle
Member
I used to be bothered by these things, but I've seen exhibitions by Takashi Murakami and I now view fantasy sex symbols as a consequence of subcultures trying to create an identity. I have bigger issues with pornography, and the threads that pop up that illustrate GAFers relationships with pornographic stars.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Once again: won't somebody pleaaase think of the poor oppressed straight males? My heart bleeds for them.
Because it's impossible to both be a sex-positive feminist and still have a problem with the overly abundant of objectifying and sexualizing of female characters in gaming, right? Mutually exclusive and all that? Give me a break.
And here we go again. Those feminists are really just prudes deep down, amirite?
....Wat
Why would having a "story reason" for her being half-naked change anything? "mega lulz" indeed. Once again, if I write a story with a 12 year old loli having sex with a 45 year old man, and tell you that the little girl is actually an immortal 200 years old elf, does that make it not creepy because "it's justified in the story"? -_-
Maybe but my overall point, to counter Opiate's, is that video games are too diverse in 2013 to be labeled one way or the other.
Cortana is how a computer would design a female, MGSV's "erotic" female is how Kojima would design a female - for a Kojima universe.
Anyway, my guess is that people who finds Cortana's sexiness in the same ballpark would probably get an erection from looking at a woman’s bike.
Anyway, my guess is that people who finds Cortana's sexiness in the same ballpark would probably get an erection from looking at a woman’s bike.
RockTurtle
Member
that's a condescending statement
That's because Halo is a MS game, if it was a Sony game he wouldn't have posted that.
It's amazing how some people try to downplay the sexualized nature of Cortana.
Yes, here we go again ignoring that the so called feminists are promoting puritanism through their supposed activism. Like them using moronic terms like objectification for anything involving sexual attraction in the age where my girlfriend was pausing True Blood to see Skarsgard's dick. OMG objectification! Or isn't it because only males can do it? This shit is why this kind of puritanical feminists are considered a joke especially by progressive societies.
Neuro
Member
Nope, she has the same condition as The End from MGS3 (Synthesizing energy from the sun). Someone posted something on that in the thread
Steve Youngblood
Member
I feel like this is counterproductive to the conversation in the same way that calling people that like Quiet's design sex-starved manbabies is. I think both display a wanton dismissal of any nuance that either side might be arguing in favor derision that only makes these conversations more adversarial than they need to be.
Yes, I'm sure the original reason as to why Bungie designed Cortana to be 'naked' was to attract the non-existent 13 year old CoD fanbase.
Come on now.
Why does simply having an attractive character in a work of fiction need to be justified?
Prosecution complex much? Were you not around when GoW:A was released and what sessler and many have argued about on the forums? Or the GoW games in general?
Some people...
TheGravemind
Banned
i find valentine vulgar in her dress while i don't think so about cortana,
a designer can show female bodies without the need to use stockings and thong as if the character is a stripper in the middle of a desert
a designer can show female bodies without the need to use stockings and thong as if the character is a stripper in the middle of a desert
KugelBlitz
Neo Member
One doesn't necessarily have to rationalise for consent, however I just find it safer if one could justify it.
However what I am not so fond off, is having a character purely designed on the basis of wanting to make female cosplayers dress in such a particular skimpy manner. Designing an attractive for poor reasons, if you will.
That's not really a valid reason for having an attractive character, for one could definitely use that as the basis for a degrades women argument.
So if the creator wants to design attractive females for the purpose of wanting female cosplayers to dress in a particular way, I think he should at least justify his opinion why, especially to those who possess concerns that this *could* be seen as degradation of women.
Like I said, I shall not render full judgement already, not when the game isn't out which is what I require for context for, apparently her dress sense will be rationalised.
Don't know how, but the character design is stated to be contextualised by the narrative, rather than just acting as a guidance to revealing cosplayers.
This contextualisation will hopefully show the character is much more than a walking, skimpy fashion item, with an engaging personality.
Ladies and gentlemen, I swear I'm not a feminist extremist, I swear!
Personally I think both designs, Cortana and Quiet(?) have become stupidly oversexualized and cringeworthy. Makes me sick. I'm a fan of games like TLOU, where they designed strong female characters that didn't need their boobs and asses hanging out to play a good role in the game.
But I love me some MGS and it really is pot meet kettle in regards to the topic, so Meh.
But I love me some MGS and it really is pot meet kettle in regards to the topic, so Meh.
More or less. It's really pathetic.
I don't think anyone's written an intelligent post worth reading where the point was to point out platform allegiance or bias. They are inherently unintelligent posts. Best to just ignore them.
Designing a character to encourage cosplayers to dress like the character sounds like he's fashioning it after their sensibilities rather than wanting to see half naked fans for his own pleasure. Just my opinion.
I like both designs. I think there's room for many different kinds of characters in the video game industry. Enjoy Ellie and Alex while I enjoy Bayonetta.
KugelBlitz
Neo Member
Perhaps...But like I said, when he posts a picture of a lovely bottom and states "something like this"
I find it quite easy to interpret that as designing a character to please the male audience at the wanted expense of females cosplayers.
I mean, if someone raised legitimate concern about how females are portrayed by raising such points I'd find it sincerely hard to refute.
It's a tough subject, and believe it or not, I am torn on the subject...
I just believe the honourable opposition should not be discarded.
Devilinthiscity
Member
Been speculated to hell and back for months now, but outside of the actual actress saying there is a reason for the way she looks we have this footage from the trailer to show her skin does have supernatural powers.
No confirmation on whether she can cover her whole body
My guess is that maybe it will be similar to what Greed in Fullmetal Alchemist can do. It will probably be camo instead of a layer of armor.
I don't think it's a stretch to assume he thinks cosplayers would be attracted to an all round sexy/appealing design than lsomething neutral or plain.
I don't personally like the design or kojimas statements to be honest. It's great these issues are being discussed. I just don't like the attacks/assumptions on his character.
KugelBlitz
Neo Member
Then I guess it's a matter of interpretation, for I believe, especially with the suggestive picture/tweet that one could raise concern, and use his tweets in a legitimate manner to raise concern, as one could argue that the female character created, was designed primarily for eye candy at the expense of the female body.
But a matter of raising such concern was to never attack Mr. Kojima, I don't believe for one second he possessed malice intentions when making such characters, he was merely having fun.
However, I still do believe it could be a valid concern to raise, but I'd never want it to escalate into a personal attack.
I'd say learning to be more open would help. Not being as sensitive over fictional material. Whatever. Honestly, people will believe what they want at the end of the day. If they're upset, they'll stay upset.
Steve Youngblood
Member
I tried to touch on this much earlier in the thread, but this gets to the fact that I think it's a complex issue to tackle. Is it sexist to have such a motivation if it leads to women voluntarily cosplaying as the character? I don't know. On the one hand, it doesn't behoove us to look down on a woman that likes the attire or feels empowered by looking sexy, because it might come across as condescending to appear to be trying to save women from themselves. But on the other, one shouldn't discount a more self-interested motive.
Arguably, women may like feeling sexy for their own benefit, and there's nothing wrong with that. Maybe some enjoy having men notice that they are sexy, and there's nothing wrong with that either. But if my prime motivation in an outfit design is "I want to see sexy women dressed like this," I think it's somewhat difficult to argue that the intent is purely empathetic while ignoring completely a manipulative motive perhaps existing.
KugelBlitz
Neo Member
A great post, demonstrating the complexity of such a tough subject.
It perfectly illustrates why I am torn on the subject, even if I am playing devil's advocate and voicing the honourable opposition.
Thanks for the contribution!
TheRedSnifit
Member
Yes, it does. If two demographics respond differently to something in art, than it's inequal in art.
It doesn't take much to see that most of the "sexy men" in the series are thrown in for laughs (as has been pointed out ad infinitum), whereas Quiet is designed to be "erotic". This isn't even an opinion, because Kojima himself has said that she's designed to look extra "erotic"; people are conveniently skipping over his own comments.