I'm an animation whore. I like looking at new things!
Nothing wrong with the old animations... but we've been looking at them for years now. Would have been nice to add some flair to them even if it's not "needed"
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
DigitalFoundry: Destiny 2 PS4 First Look + Frame-Rate Test
- Thread starter Theorry
- Start date
Nothing wrong with the old animations... but we've been looking at them for years now. Would have been nice to add some flair to them even if it's not "needed"
Poimandres
Member
Bungie have never been cutting edge visually. What was the last Bungie game that really tried to push visuals? Halo 2? Remember how Halo 3 looked compared to other 2007 titles... Decidedly behind the times. I think both Destiny games look fine by the way.
Halo 3's water and HDR lighting blew most console games out of the water at the time. Arguably texture quality too
I would say Halo Reach really tried to push the visuals but before then Halo 3 and ODST were disappointing, especially the nightmarish faces from Halo 3.
In a moment of boredom I went back and looked at some reloading comparisons from the Halo games and was unsurprised to find that Bungie reused many animations there with minimal changes.
In a moment of boredom I went back and looked at some reloading comparisons from the Halo games and was unsurprised to find that Bungie reused many animations there with minimal changes.
draliko
Member
I was tempted to go the pc route, but being the majority of stuff on the client side I'm quite scared about cheating and i believe the community will be way bigger on console than pc, even tho I would really like to play destiny 2 maxed out at native 4k 
btw will the game have any kind of HDR support? Could be the time I'll bite on a HDR tv
btw will the game have any kind of HDR support? Could be the time I'll bite on a HDR tvCompared to the other gameplay videos I've seen, this actually IS a graphical jump from D1. The strike gameplay is just a lot more open and empty so I guess we're just waiting for an E3 blowout for a look at other areas.
Twilight Gap
Member
Bungie have always been conservationists
The only one "spinning" anything is yourself by making it seem like I am defending them when I am only repeating what they said word to word.
If you would actually read my posts (which you pretend to have, hence your claim that I try to spin everything) then you will notice that I specifically mentioned and agreed that the "financially feasible" means "we don't wanna spend our profits on it" rather than "we can't afford it".
Really..just go read man. Before you start pretending that you know all that I've posted. It's not even in a different thread.
Here's something, BF4 - BF1 is NOT that big of a technical improvement. It looks way better but that's because it's using photogrammetry and PBR with a better art style to boot. But the technical additions to the renderer were as incremental as you see here. It's still using the same console.
Also before someone in this thread quotes me, calls me mad and shows me screenshots. READ that I am talking about technical additions i.e. things related to lighting, shadows, particles, etc etc...not how the game "looks" to your naked eye (which is irrelevant because the original point was about technical improvements due to it not being cross gen). I can very well see but there are differences here. Destiny however does not change its art style at all and sticks to it's consistency with the sequel and photogrammetry is not really possible with its almost cartoony art but when it comes to technical upgrades the refinements seen here are par for the course.
I need to see more, but like the DF video I saw mostly refinements than any dramatic bump in visuals. People saw rain and sparkly things during the campaign mission and blew their load I suppose. It really boils down to either people being too hard to please or a liberal use of the term "massive" in the context of a jump in visual quality. Personally, I find Destiny visually mediocre as a cross generation game and now as a current generation game, but that art tho.
Yes, but if a console is only acting as a client all it needs to worry about are the things in the same domain as the player character, not also doing the work for randoms on the other side of the map.
-hadouken
Member
Reach was a beautiful console game for the time.
recursive
Member
This is more similar to Borderlands than it is to Skyrim or other similar open world games. Little if any NPC simulations beyond enemies.
Poimandres
Member
It's true the game had impressive elements, but it was widely criticised at the time for its overall visual impression.
This is basically where I was going with this. Bungie have a history of being iterative with the tech used in their games. No need to throw out what already works... I think they got burnt pretty hard learning this lesson with Halo 2.
Then again, how many of thr current Bungie staff go back to that era?
That's an asinine comparison - Why not compare environmental shots of the old game against environmental shots of the new game, because there is a clear step up
Kssio_Aug
Member
I think the game looks good artistically, very colorful. But watching this video in 1080p you can see this is not impressive really. I don't think it's a big jump from Destiny 1.
I don't know if the 30 fps is justifiable, but Digital Foundry backs them up:
https://youtu.be/Smn_ZUGK7ZQ?t=164
Even Pro/Scorpio may not be that much more capable than regular PS4/XB1 CPU wise according to them (31% boost) to justify double frame-rate. And there's of course the case of the advantage for Pro/Scorpio users, it wouldn't be fair to the regular users.
I don't know if the 30 fps is justifiable, but Digital Foundry backs them up:
https://youtu.be/Smn_ZUGK7ZQ?t=164
Even Pro/Scorpio may not be that much more capable than regular PS4/XB1 CPU wise according to them (31% boost) to justify double frame-rate. And there's of course the case of the advantage for Pro/Scorpio users, it wouldn't be fair to the regular users.
The Lamonster
Member
I'm fine with the graphics looking mostly the same if it means the engine can support more AI on screen, bigger geometry moving around, etc.
Hopefully at a certain point they will introduce some fun.
KrM DeLorean
Member
Where's option 3, New content AND New animations (fluff)? Is that too much to ask for a Triple A game studio?
When you see a HUGE '2' on a screen you expect HUGE upgrades, not sidegrades or small graphical improvements. To many people, going by what they have shown (not promised, but shown) that's what this looks like. So far at least.
If you have to break down all of the changes and improvements they have made for other people that they cannot see for themselves, that means you've failed in presenting your game in some way.
Calling Destiny 1 "open world" is stretching it. Corridors and fields with 8ish players max in each "zone" compared to something like Zelda or GTA?
Of course we'll see how D2 handles this.
Lots of games do things that are great. Do I want to keep looking at the same things over and over? There's always room for improvement and evolution. How many hours have you put into Destiny? We've been killing these same enemies, running around samey environments for hundreds of hours. This is a sequel, let's evolve and make everything better.
There's a difference between people who create something and say "This is fine, let's stick with this" and the people who say "This is fine, now let's do better"
I've put hundreds of hours into Destiny, I'm excited for D2. But I cannot defend some of the decisions they are making so far. Of course we'll see what else they have up their sleeves, but so far I'm pretty disappointed by the reveal as well.
Watched the full thing on lunchbreak. Looks fine and will pick it up for PC but there was one thing that was confusing and that was the mention of there being no recoil on the PC versions.
I'm gonna assume that's just because of the early showing because otherwise that'd make the gunplay kinda awful.
I'm gonna assume that's just because of the early showing because otherwise that'd make the gunplay kinda awful.
The Lamonster
Member
I didn't understand what they meant by that either.
Also mentioned earlier in the thread but why did they say base PS4 when Bungie said all PS4 demos were running on Pro?
RobotMoses
Member
So much this. New, better and smoother animations are always better. Seeing the same old handgun reload animation during the Destiny 2 reveal disappointed me. One of my biggest problems with CS:GO is that the reload animations are WORSE than CS 1.6!
...I have a problem.
It's interesting that GamesIndustry just published an interview with the CEO of Improbable and he said explicitly he'd love to see what Bungie could do with this technology in a future Destiny game.
Where the two domains don't intersect there's no need for consensus. Each player has their own local computation to deal with what's happening around them, and in many cases it makes sense to perform redundant computations when you can guarantee the same outcome, or if the exact outcome doesn't need to be identical in all cases, as with purely cosmetic elements with no gameplay impact like particle systems.
I don't disagree. My main issue with the reveal is they haven't really shown anything new. But at the same time for them as developers it would be a waste of time to throw away perfectly good animations that don't need to be changed.
So far they have shown only one campaign mission, one strike and one PVP map and mode. They have promised new things in patrols, a bigger and better campaign but after the "Whole thing is playable space" from the D1 reveal I am skeptical until I see it.
In an ideal world we would get that third step, more content and better graphics and animations but from the troubled development of D1 and D2 getting delayed a year it is clear there were some major teething problems moving from D1 to D2.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
You should explain the technical parts of the demo shown then if I deserve to be laughed at for seeing a visual upgrade with my eyes. By the way did you used to have a halo avatar? Your post style is awfully familiar both in this thread and others.
MrChowderClams
Member
Yeah, it seems like most of the upgrades on the visuals come from engine improvements and not asset improvements. I think they were a little too tepid in pushing the boundary WRT the art. It feels much more like a facelift than a reboot. It's a pity because I would have liked to see them expand more on some of the unused art from their 2013 GDC talk: https://youtu.be/ZiDbv7nftM8
anothertech
Member
Oh I admit completely there is a noticeable step up. But you do have to look pretty hard to see it unless you are very familiar with the game. It's easy to look at them and think they could be the same game ATM. And honestly, that just attests to the amazing job they did with the original.
I could see the differences from the first cut scenes. But it's not a night and day difference. Thus the arguments.
I think this video is relevant to this thread. It's just a quick comparison between Destiny 2 and Destiny 1. The two games are similar, but Destiny 2 has prettier graphics and effects. The gameplay looks exactly the same, with the exception of the new supers.
https://youtu.be/1U5g_OJsKcg
https://youtu.be/1U5g_OJsKcg
anothertech
Member
This is a great comparison. You can see how similar, yet how different they look in gameplay.
Wasn't there some confirmation that this first mission was actually demo'd on a PC? If so, this comparison wouldn't be a very fair one (the PC version of D2 is likely to be much prettier than the console versions across the board)