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[ecurbj]

Now after reading through this:

Surprised and delighted this got posted, because I was planning on doing it and likewise probably getting ignored.

Great song and Supa is a great rapper, although I do think he needs to switch up his lyrical content about his struggles getting further in his career, etc; it's only holding him back at this point, especially after he came back from retirement.

I feel like if this is the direction we're going then quality hiphop/rap will never come back to the forefront. It'll be the club, forever. If 2Chainz can get a pass because he's "fairly" intelligent and could maybe, someday, write a half-decent verse if his career depended on it, then it's already gone. 2Chainz is the most non-versatile rapper in history, he writes in the way my nephews would write a rap song. Random words, stops, no meaning, no connection, just pure shit and a gifted beat. It blows me away to this day that he made it this far, and taken seriously. Every time I hear his voice I think in the back of my mind that everyone he knows is using him as a joke and he's just oblivious.

On top of already having two of the worst rap names in history.

A lot of ignorant rappers come off as decent and not completely stupid dudes though.. That doesn't mean they'd necessarily make good conscious raps.

That said, I don't think conscious raps will ever be at the forefront again. As long as music reaches the amount of people it does now, the easily digestible, context-less party music will stay popular IMO. Most conscious rap anyway is still somewhat connected to the ghetto and drugs, which is just not as universal as hey let's have a good time.

In the back of my mind I know that quality hiphop will never be mainstream again; however that still doesn't justify thinking 2Chainz is acceptable.

Ever.

Conscious rap is the way it is because at some point they became more concered with delivering a message and forgot people like to be entertained. Back in 90s they made party friendly singles. Nowadays not so much

...were you? Rap since the very first track was party themed. It don't really matter, because basically the very next song up was a conscious track. It's always been both sides of the coin and anybody who says different needs a history lesson.

When the only thing that gets played on the radio to the mass public is something that inspires nothing but the epitome of ignorance and stupidity, somebody should. Especially when you realize that most of this garbage out there is supposedly inspired by people like Bob Marley, MJ, Marvin Gaye, Miles Davis, etc., they have no regard to the respect for music itself in the slightest to even put a sliver of the same effort into anything they create.

They make background music. That's all it is. It gets forgotten within months, sometimes weeks.

You can make quality club/dance/party music. It was done decades ago, and still meant something. The argument that that genre is fundamentally forgettable or lyrically uncultured is stupid. They're repetitive, sure, but can mean something decent.

I now understand the drawling of the line between real Hip Hop versus the party style Hip Hop I'm getting this generation. Granted I grew up listening to Gospel music every day of my life until recently branched off and got hooked on Hip Hop. I was comparing Jay Z's earlier albums to today's Hip Hop and I can see a drastic change from what it once was.

Sad but I can understand the hate some have for Drake, Lil Wayne, and others. It's clear now.

Before I didn't understand why people hated these new so called Rap artists but now I understand.

Thanks for that analysis Devil Theory. That certainly helped me out.

 

[Devil Theory]

Thanks for that analysis Devil Theory. That certainly helped me out.

No doubt.

It doesn't take a lot to understand the conflict and comparison, all you have to do is go search any list of the top 10, 50, or 100 greatest hiphop albums ever, and listen to some of those. You'll see how quality can be entertaining, and that "conscious" hiphop doesn't have to be boring -- I dislike the use of the word "conscious" as it has a certain stigma of lesser quality or enjoyment around it, like it's the "no fun allowed" of hiphop; which simply isn't true given it's history.

Way back when there wasn't such a thing as "conscious" hiphop -- it was all just hiphop, all good, and all inspired by something of value.

 

[ecurbj]

No doubt.

It doesn't take a lot to understand the conflict and comparison, all you have to do is go search any list of the top 10, 50, or 100 greatest hiphop albums ever, and listen to some of those. You'll see how quality can be entertaining, and that "conscious" hiphop doesn't have to be boring -- I dislike the use of the word "conscious" as it has a certain stigma of lesser quality or enjoyment around it, like it's the "no fun allowed" of hiphop; which simply isn't true given it's history.

Way back when there wasn't such a thing as "conscious" hiphop -- it was all just hiphop, all good, and all inspired by something of value.

So are you saying the material (lyric, beat and flow) today is ignorant hip hop. And the hip hop back in the day is conscious? Like having meaning. Because I can see the bridge has broken and the hip hop today is influenced by clubs. Earlier Jay Z albums definitely wouldn't be considered club material but material to knod and listen to. To catch what the hip hop artists is saying.

Am I right on track?

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

that last line was ether! Lol...i like this guy

Fail.

I still refuse to believe anybody legitimately listens to Keef in here.

This why you my boy jo, always talking that true shit. Domino the only fan. And hes happy, so fuck it.

More men arguing over Keef, smh. Y'all ninjas need to cut the courtship and just start fucking. You can get a dreadlocks wig at the local party store, some ky jelly, couple boxes of condoms, and just go ham on some booty holes. Maybe get Siddx to dj so he can put Guap on repeat.

DEAD

hours of entertainment today.

Shits comedy. Nothing like a waste of life like keef to get GAF-Hop to collectively freak out.

I imagine this shit woulda got way more heated if Recon was still here.

 

[Blackace]

So are you saying the material (lyric, beat and flow) today is ignorant hip hop. And the hip hop back in the day is conscious? Like having meaning. Because I can see the bridge has broken and the hip hop today is influenced by clubs. Earlier Jay Z albums definitely wouldn't be considered club material but material to knod and listen to. To catch what the hip hop artists is saying.

Am I right on track?

I wouldn't say that exactly

A lot of hip-hop had little meaning

Even if you look at the forefathers you can listen to the sugar hill gang and hear nothing of substance

 

[Devil Theory]

So are you saying the material (lyric, beat and flow) today is ignorant hip hop. And the hip hop back in the day is conscious? Like having meaning. Because I can see the bridge has broken and the hip hop today is influenced by clubs. Earlier Jay Z albums definitely wouldn't be considered club material but material to knod and listen to. To catch what the hip hop artists is saying.

Am I right on track?

Conscious is just a word people use today to associate any hiphop that's not about the following: money, partying, drugs, 'bitches', or being a gangsta.

If you rap about Politics, you're a conscious rapper. If you rap about anything remotely deep, you're a conscious rapper. Early Jay Z yes, is not club music, but Jay is unique in that he can bridge subjects into the club or something that has a particular meaning, like '99 Problems.' Most rappers can never achieve this so he's more the exception than the rule.

Kam Moye describes it fairly well in "Black Enough"

 

[thabiz]

http://plug.dj/the-jamz/

If anyone fucks with DUB

 

[kamspy]

Devil Theory obviously hasn't been eating on that Finally Rich. Shit is Porterhouse.

 

[ecurbj]

Conscious is just a word people use today to associate any hiphop that's not about the following: money, partying, drugs, 'bitches', or being a gangsta.

If you rap about Politics, you're a conscious rapper. If you rap about anything remotely deep, you're a conscious rapper. Early Jay Z yes, is not club music, but Jay is unique in that he can bridge subjects into the club or something that has a particular meaning, like '99 Problems.' Most rappers can never achieve this so he's more the exception than the rule.

Kam Moye describes it fairly well in "Black Enough"

Wow. Supa is wow. Talk about a conscious rapper. Now I see your point. Drake definitely isn't on Supa level, lol

Thanks DT. That was dope. Did Supa hit mainstream yet? Like signed by a record label?

 

[siddx]

Siddx forgot to tell you I fucks with this track super heavy. Need a mp3 : )

Here you go good sir
Siddx - Nobody fucking with you


I'd like to make a better quality version with better vocal quality, leveling, blending and all that. Eventually, eventually.

 

[kamspy]

Conscious rap dat shit I don't like. Don't like. Don't like.

Nah really. Shit is no fun. Not what I listen to music for. If I want someone to drop some gems about respecting women or eating right, I'll check out a book or a blog.

1 conscious song per album is feasible, so long as the song is really good. It's like the weed song, you can have one, but only one. If you have more, you're afro man. Conscious rap is just the wikipedia version of Afro Man.

 

[Devil Theory]

Wow. Supa is wow. Talk about a conscious rapper. Now I see your point. Drake definitely isn't on Supa level, lol

Thanks DT. That was dope. Did Supa hit mainstream yet? Like signed by a record label?

Lol no, unfortunately I strongly doubt that will ever happen. He was signed a few years ago but left due to a label transfer and is now independent, although I'm sure with his upcoming stuff he may be able to grab something, just don't expect Def Jam.

Conscious rap dat shit I don't like. Don't like. Don't like.

Nah really. Shit is no fun. Not what I listen to music for.

To each their own, however this is what I was referring to earlier.

 

[Blackace]

Conscious rap dat shit I don't like. Don't like. Don't like.

Nah really. Shit is no fun. Not what I listen to music for. If I want someone to drop some gems about respecting women or eating right, I'll check out a book or a blog.

1 conscious song per album is feasible, so long as the song is really good. It's like the weed song, you can have one, but only one. If you have more, you're afro man. Conscious rap is just the wikipedia version of Afro Man.

Now we won't have any bad mouthing of Afroman up in here

 

[kamspy]

Yeah, I'll take Afro Man over some bang you in the head conscious rap.

I had my phase where I was really into it in my late teens. Now it's just really not something I'm checking for when I'm listening to music.

Guilt Raps. nah

 

[DominoKid]

No doubt.

It doesn't take a lot to understand the conflict and comparison, all you have to do is go search any list of the top 10, 50, or 100 greatest hiphop albums ever, and listen to some of those. You'll see how quality can be entertaining, and that "conscious" hiphop doesn't have to be boring -- I dislike the use of the word "conscious" as it has a certain stigma of lesser quality or enjoyment around it, like it's the "no fun allowed" of hiphop; which simply isn't true given it's history.

Way back when there wasn't such a thing as "conscious" hiphop -- it was all just hiphop, all good, and all inspired by something of value.

The 'conscious' rappers brought it on themselves really. The separation originated from them in response to the hot shit in the mid/late 90s.
see: The Roots - What They Do (a great song btw) for an example. 'Conscious' cats fucked up by defining themselves by everything they were not.
We don't disrespect women. We don't sell/do drugs. We don't buy the bar out at the club. etc etc.

Then the hot rappers ran with it and let them dig the hole even deeper for themselves until you have the uphill battle that now exists for 'conscious' rappers.
(edit: this is partly why the kendrick and his album was such a big deal)

 

[ecurbj]

Lol no, unfortunately I strongly doubt that will ever happen. He was signed a few years ago but left due to a label transfer and is now independent, although I'm sure with his upcoming stuff he may be able to grab something, just don't expect Def Jam.

It was worth asking. lol. Which is to be expected because again as you said. No one. No one that listens to mainstream hip hop wants to listen to that type of rap because for one it would be boring to this generation considering its all about clubbing, dancing, booty clapping, pussy this, pop that pussy, money, etc. My current library doesn't have very conscious rap.

I have Big Boi, Big KRIT, Dr. Dre, Eminem, Game, Jay Z, Kanye West, Kendrick Lamar, Kid Ink, Lupe Fiasco, Macklmore, Mase, Mos Def, Nas, Notorious BIG, Pusha T, Slauhterhouse, Young Jeezy, and 50 Cent. Those who I would say try to push messages in their music but also have some club-eccentric flow.

 

[Blackace]

The 'conscious' rappers brought it on themselves really. The separation originated from them in response to the hot shit in the mid/late 90s.

Then the hot rappers ran with it and let them dig the hole even deeper for themselves until you have the uphill battle that now exists for 'conscious' rappers.

Were you even alive then?

 

[siddx]

And if ya'll think that whole keef conversation was a "freak out" you haven't been on hip hop gaf long enough or you have some pretty shitty memories from all that dirt weed you smoke.
I won't deny it got taken up a notch out of the blue, but gaf has had some truly WTF freakouts before.

I don't understand though, how anytime anybody has an issue with a rapper that is considered ignorant, it means he's some wool beanie wearing backpacker looking for the next mos def or talib album. The keef/trinidad issue being discussed, at least on my part, wasnt about subject matter, it was about rapping ability. Gucci, Wacka and 2chainz just to name the big three ignorant rappers, all sound like rappers. They may not always put out a brilliant verse, they may sound drunk and lost sometimes, but they have shown me on enough occasions that they know how do what they are being paid to do, rap. They can write some fairly clever things on occasions, they can find a great beat and ride it, they can use adlibs as a way to enhance the song, not to cover up deficiencies in their ability to write a bar(well most of the time). They aren't A+ caliber rappers, on their best days they are C grade rappers (2chainz overacheives sometimes) but they meet the requirements to be classified as a rapper in my own little crazy head. Those other two lames do not. If you're requirements are different and keef and trinidad pass with flying colors than good for you (and I hope you seek help for your issues) but I'm just telling you what I feel. Nobody has to follow.

 

[DominoKid]

Were you even alive then?

no but the history is readily evident.

(edit: idk why i said i wasnt alive then lol. reading fail.)

 

[ecurbj]

no but the history is readily evident.

I'm curious to read up on this material. Do you mind providing me some links to get me started?

 

[Blackace]

It was worth asking. lol. Which is to be expected because again as you said. No one. No one that listens to mainstream hip hop wants to listen to that type of rap because for one it would be boring to this generation considering its all about clubbing, dancing, booty clapping, pussy this, pop that pussy, money, etc. My current library doesn't have very conscious rap.

I have Big Boi, Big KRIT, Dr. Dre, Eminem, Game, Jay Z, Kanye West, Kendrick Lamar, Kid Ink, Lupe Fiasco, Macklmore, Mase, Mos Def, Nas, Notorious BIG, Pusha T, Slauhterhouse, Young Jeezy, and 50 Cent. Those who I would say try to push messages in their music but also have some club-eccentric flow.

Oddly enough rap hasn't changed all that much at it's core

Guys are talking about money pussy popping mollys because it's reality for them
90s had a lot of gang bang rap because it's reality for them
And so on

 

[Devil Theory]

The 'conscious' rappers brought it on themselves really. The separation originated from them in response to the hot shit in the mid/late 90s.

Then the hot rappers ran with it and let them dig the hole even deeper for themselves until you have the uphill battle that now exists for 'conscious' rappers.

I don't really think they dug a hole, they just didn't jump on the bandwagon of essentially almost changing genres just to make more money.

My current library doesn't have very conscious rap.

There's nothing wrong with variety. I love Ace Hood and K.R.I.T. as much as the next guy, I just don't ever want to hear that 2Chainz et al. has a good flow or that he does something unique in a way nobody else could do. Give anyone the same circumstance and they could do the same, or vastly better by default.

 

[Blackace]

no but the history is readily evident.

Riiight

 

[thabiz]

no but the history is readily evident.

Being there is a lot different than looking back on it.

 

[K.Jack]

Someone link me to their definition of a "conscious rap". What does it have to be conscious of, exactly, to qualify?

It's like we're talking about it but no one is naming names.

 

[DominoKid]

I'm curious to read up on this material. Do you mind providing me some links to get me started?

ill see if i can dig it up during the laker game.
it was a while ago that i ran across it.

 

[Devil Theory]

Someone link me to their definition of a "conscious rap". What does it have to be conscious of, exactly, to qualify?

It's like we're talking about it but no one is naming names.

Conscious hip hop or socially conscious hip-hop is a sub-genre of hip hop that focuses on social issues. Like several cases within many genres of music,[examples needed] the umbrella term was originally coined by audiences and music critics rather than the actual artists themselves. It is not necessarily overtly political, but it discusses social issues and conflicts. Themes of conscious hip hop include religion, aversion to crime & violence, culture, the economy, or simple depictions the struggles of ordinary people. Grandmaster Flash's "The Message" was an early and hugely influential political and conscious hip hop track, decrying the poverty, violence, and dead-end lives of the black youth of the time.

The audience for conscious rap is largely underground.[3] Most conscious hip hop artists (MC Chill, Jimmy Spice Curry, and numerous others) have not attained the same level of commercial success as mainstream hip-hop,[4] though there are some notable exceptions to this such as KRS-One,[5] Mos Def, Talib Kweli, Hopsin, Lupe Fiasco, Kanye West, Killer Mike, Atmosphere, Immortal Technique, Charmingly Ghetto, Shad, The Roots, Poor Righteous Teachers, Tupac Shakur, Kendrick Lamar, Macklemore, J.Cole, Big K.R.I.T. Nas, DCP, OutKast and Common.

There are hundreds of artists whose music could be described as "political": see the List of political hip hop artists page for a partial list.
[edit]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_hip_hop

In retrospect I probably should have just quoted this a long time ago.

 

[thabiz]

Someone link me to their definition of a "conscious rap". What does it have to be conscious of, exactly, to qualify?

It's like we're talking about it but no one is naming names.

Public Enemy, KRS, Dead Prez, etc.

Basically anyone trying to preach knowledge over money, bitchez and ballin.

 

[ecurbj]

Oddly enough rap hasn't changed all that much at it's core

Guys are talking about money pussy popping mollys because it's reality for them
90s had a lot of gang bang rap because it's reality for them
And so on

I can see most of that hasn't changed. But I'm trying to figured out there is definitely sub genres within the hip hop genre that should be bridged apartment. That's what I'm trying to figure out where would you draw the line between someone like Eminem and Drake for example. I for sure Eminem has a very message-centric flow to himself. And Drake is more into the club-centric genre of hip hop. Recently he branched into the R&B with Take Care.

There's nothing wrong with variety. I love Ace Hood and K.R.I.T. as much as the next guy, I just don't ever want to hear that 2Chainz et al. has a good flow or that he does something unique in a way nobody else could do. Give anyone the same circumstance and they could do the same, or vastly better by default.

My library is very full of variety from the different sub genres of Hip Hop. But I definitely feel you in regards of 2 Chainz. Anyone can produce or replica his flow or have some similar gimmick and get back getting millions.

ill see if i can dig it up during the laker game.
it was a while ago that i ran across it.

Good look, DK. I'm seriously trying to read up into Hip Hop. Like I said before. I grew up around a very religious family. So my Hip Hop experience is all of what's being showed today. So when someone recommends a earlier Hip Hop artist my side was with today's artists like Drake, lol.

 

[MuddyDonut]

Someone link me to their definition of a "conscious rap". What does it have to be conscious of, exactly, to qualify?

It's like we're talking about it but no one is naming names.

rateyourmusic.com/genre/Conscious+Hip+Hop/

 

[ecurbj]

Conscious hip hop or socially conscious hip-hop is a sub-genre of hip hop that focuses on social issues. Like several cases within many genres of music,[examples needed] the umbrella term was originally coined by audiences and music critics rather than the actual artists themselves. It is not necessarily overtly political, but it discusses social issues and conflicts. Themes of conscious hip hop include religion, aversion to crime & violence, culture, the economy, or simple depictions the struggles of ordinary people. Grandmaster Flash's "The Message" was an early and hugely influential political and conscious hip hop track, decrying the poverty, violence, and dead-end lives of the black youth of the time.

The audience for conscious rap is largely underground.[3] Most conscious hip hop artists (MC Chill, Jimmy Spice Curry, and numerous others) have not attained the same level of commercial success as mainstream hip-hop,[4] though there are some notable exceptions to this such as KRS-One,[5] Mos Def, Talib Kweli, Hopsin, Lupe Fiasco, Kanye West, Killer Mike, Atmosphere, Immortal Technique, Charmingly Ghetto, Shad, The Roots, Poor Righteous Teachers, Tupac Shakur, Kendrick Lamar, Macklemore, J.Cole, Big K.R.I.T. Nas, DCP, OutKast and Common.

There are hundreds of artists whose music could be described as "political": see the List of political hip hop artists page for a partial list.
[edit]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_hip_hop

In retrospect I probably should have just quoted this a long time ago.

Public Enemy, KRS, Dead Prez, etc.

Basically anyone trying to preach knowledge over money, bitchez and ballin.

Thanks for this. This is helping me out.

 

[enzo_gt]

I always considered conscious hip hop to include more than social issues and more introspective issues as well.

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

We only bout that REAL hip hop yo

 

[Blackace]

There's nothing wrong with variety. I love Ace Hood and K.R.I.T. as much as the next guy, I just don't ever want to hear that 2Chainz et al. has a good flow or that he does something unique in a way nobody else could do. Give anyone the same circumstance and they could do the same, or vastly better by default.

First of all, 2 Chainz is by no means the greatest rapper in the world.. but he has very unique wordplay.. His flow is nothing special but his lyrics are pretty dope. I really noticed it with this

my girl got a big purse with a purse in it
and her p**sy so clean I can go to church in it

and this

I'll take ya girl kidnapper
Feed her to my mattress

It's not about changing the world and it is ignorant but it makes you have to think about the angle he is taking..

My library is very full of variety from the different sub genres of Hip Hop. But I definitely feel you in regards of 2 Chainz. Anyone can produce or replica his flow or have some similar gimmick and get back getting millions.

Nope, if anyone could do it they would have.. you have a lot of one hit wonders but 2 Chainz has had staying power..

 

[Blackace]

We only bout that REAL hip hop yo

*autotune voice*

OOOOOOOOooooooonnnnnnneeeee Finger in his anus, finger in his anus and repeat until that ninja is sanging dis! Finger in his anus, finger in his anus and repeat until that ninja is sanging dis!!

 

[thabiz]

So i checked the Keef album, out of curiosity, and are we sure this guy doesn't have down syndrome?

 

[The Return of]

So i checked the Keef album, out of curiosity, and are we sure this guy doesn't have down syndrome?

Hahaha no clue. But it has been brought up here before

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

*autotune voice*

OOOOOOOOooooooonnnnnnneeeee Finger in his anus, finger in his anus and repeat until that ninja is sanging dis! Finger in his anus, finger in his anus and repeat until that ninja is sanging dis!!

This the hook of your debut single? Ill cop it...

 

[Blackace]

So i checked the Keef album, out of curiosity, and are we sure this guy doesn't have down syndrome?

He just is truly ignorant.. For what it is the album is aiight

 

[Blackace]

This the hook of your debut single? Ill cop it...

Think you already copped it

 

[cousins]

Hahaha no clue. But it has been brought up here before

I think I read that he has Aspergers.

 

[Devil Theory]

I think I read that he has Aspergers.

Excuses.

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Think you already copped it

Fo sho. No idea where Maccas got the impression i didnt, but i love a finger in my anus.

Spoiler

No pause

 

[Macca]

Only conscious rap allowed in the AOTY thread.

 

[Blackace]

Only conscious rap allowed in the AOTY thread.

Droop-E!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Enter The 36 Chambers]

Only conscious rap allowed in the AOTY thread.

Food and Liqour 2 AOTY then.

Lupe knows what we should know. College courses should be taught on his genius.

 

[DominoKid]

keef should've put a remastered john madden on there as a bonus. but it is a really old song. but its his hardest song imo.

Good look, DK. I'm seriously trying to read up into Hip Hop. Like I said before. I grew up around a very religious family. So my Hip Hop experience is all of what's being showed today. So when someone recommends a earlier Hip Hop artist my side was with today's artists like Drake, lol.

this isnt the exact one i remember reading but its sort of what im hitting on.
http://www.spin.com/articles/death-and-resurrection-conscious-rap-pt1

i'll keep looking for the right one.

 

[ecurbj]

this isnt the exact one i remember reading but its sort of what im hitting on.
http://www.spin.com/articles/death-and-resurrection-conscious-rap-pt1

i'll keep looking for the right one.

Thanks, man. I'm reading it now and will report back. Thanks for looking for the right one, though.

 

[The Return of]

http://plug.dj/the-jamz/

If anyone fucks with DUB

http://plug.dj/music-is-fun/ in this one now

 

[ecurbj]

http://plug.dj/music-is-fun/ in this one now

I would like to join you guys. But do you have to sign in with your Facebook or Twitter log in?