Grampa Simpson
Banned
Good answer.Saitou said:
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Media Create Sales 5/19 - 5/25
- Thread starter Cheesemeister
- Start date
JoshuaJSlone said:
This, and the "PSP is dominating DS" discussion, got me thinking in terms of rates - if the poster perceived that the PSP was accelerating its market share growth relative to the DS looking only at 2008 data. In other words, is the "PSP catches up to DS in xxx weeks" number getting smaller and smaller each week over the recent past?
The green line shows the difference between PSP and DS sales over the last 20 weeks. The answer is "No, the PSP is not accelerating its market share growth."
Edit: The Google Doc is available at http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=pXmD-p5GmIuD7zHlxT3UHdg. Sorry I couldn't figure out how to get Google to host the image as well.
Dragona Akehi
Retired
Damn, I was wondering how the thread exploded.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Dragona Akehi said:
same way it always explodes :lol
What is impressive about the PSP's current sales is not the fact that it is "catching up" to those of the DS (It's too far behind to ever catch up). What is impressive is that from the launch of the PSP slim last fall, to its first anniversary this fall, the PSP will have sold more units in the past year than it did in the previous three years combined.
A year ago, it looked like the PSP was heading for an eventual 8-9M LTD. Now I'd say that the PSP has a decent chance at catching (or at least coming close to) the GBA's 16.8M LTD.
Of course, next to the DS's potential 30M LTD, the PSP is always going to look worse off (hardware wise) than it really is in Japan.
A year ago, it looked like the PSP was heading for an eventual 8-9M LTD. Now I'd say that the PSP has a decent chance at catching (or at least coming close to) the GBA's 16.8M LTD.
Of course, next to the DS's potential 30M LTD, the PSP is always going to look worse off (hardware wise) than it really is in Japan.
-WindYoshi-
Banned
Valkryia Chronicles.
Very sad... though it would of lacked the oomph, it should have been made for the Wii.
Would have done slightly better at the least.
Very sad... though it would of lacked the oomph, it should have been made for the Wii.
Would have done slightly better at the least.
Paracelsus
Member
-WindYoshi- said:
I prefer it this way.
Quality >>> Sales.
WrathOfOtaibah
Banned
Its like we traveled back in time to 2005
Grampa Simpson
Banned
I'd actually really like to see this graph on a weekly basis.Sage00 said:
Phife Dawg
Member
I wouldn't be so sure. But otoh production would have been a bit on the cheaper side.-WindYoshi- said:
No sales = No more quality games thoughParacelsus said:
It also depends on your personal preference how highly you rate graphical fidelity. Plus I really like the shading technology used in VC but everything looks pretty low-poly to me and technically speaking not very impressive.
Vinci said:
There's no doubt that's an amazing short term battle until one or the other (probably WiiFit at least until MGS4 establishes some clear unambiguous dominance). Long term though I find it AMAZING the PS3 would need to sell around 54,000 units on average every week till the calendar year ends to sell as many units as the Wii did after 53 weeks on the market, and of course that number has been rising steadily week to week. I would so completely and totally love a week by week comparison of how many weeks it'd take the PS3 after each week's sales to reach the Wii's first year.
KoR's basically guaranteed to outsell Vesperia in every market already... I don't think it'll outsell Symphonia anywhere though honestly. Not only is it a spinoff, but the series has lost a lot of steam with the endless milking and schitzo platform selection since Symphonia's release.
Yes. I think this is the most interesting thing in Japanese sales threads at the moment. Though, PS3 is obviously at a disadvantage, representing the old and that which the Japanese no longer want, but still, it's an interesting fight.Vinci said:
As for PSP, well, it's clear most of its owners think its library is very poor, overall, because they're able to buy sw if they find it appealing enough. The piracy thing not particularly relevant imo, in the sense it's obviously not much more rampant than any system has ever been.
Sony really needs to get their act together if they want a chance at being what they were in Japan again. Personally, I don't think they'll ever be able to do it. Unlike Nintendo, broadly appealing sw isn't their strongpoint, they're a hardware manufacturer at heart, which is currently their biggest problem. So, now they're losing their main advantage in being able to sell sw for 3rd parties, they're going to find it very, very difficult to gain support for current and new systems. As Nintendo has found out, once you get the, '3rd party sw doesn't sell' moniker, it takes a hell of a lot to get that support back, to the extent, Nintendo is clearly the dominant system this gen, yet we still haven't seen 3rd parties come into the fold in any meaningful way, and I mean NES, SNES, PS1, etc.
There are incredibly tough times ahead for Sony.
WrathOfOtaibah
Banned
Sony fucked up their chances with the PS3. It will get sales spurts here and there but for the most part, it will have to duke it out with the Xbox 360 or like in the US, settle for a respectable third place. Their best chances is to keep the PS3 to where soon they can make a profit off of each system sold so their losses won't be totally disastrous.
I have no doubt they are going to rush to get the PlayStation 4 out, much like Microsoft did with the 360.
PSP is getting a second wind but I doubt it will materialize into anything significant. Once Monster Hunter G2 has run its course, it will be back to the sales dregs with 360 and PS3.
I have no doubt they are going to rush to get the PlayStation 4 out, much like Microsoft did with the 360.
PSP is getting a second wind but I doubt it will materialize into anything significant. Once Monster Hunter G2 has run its course, it will be back to the sales dregs with 360 and PS3.
test_account
XP-39C²
As far as i know the PSP was released about 1 week later than the DS in Japan so i would say that these 2 systems were pretty much released simultaneously (if you're refering to the DS and the PSP). But as i wrote earlier, it all depends on how you define "dominating"Gaborn said:
If you mean the LTD, if you mean weekly and/or monthly sales, if you only mean hardware, if you only mean software or if you mean hardware and software combined. The stuff that was quoted earlier was the hardware sales only. JoshuaJSlone's comparison carts compares the different systems on a weekly basis if i'm not mistaken, thats why i took into account how the hardware sales is doing at the moment. PSP is the best selling system in Japan so far this year. If people want to call that dominating or not, thats up to each person Just alittle side note, the DS is actually about 3.5 years old in Japan now. Its about 2 years since the DS Lite was launched (i guess maybe that is what you ment?), but afaik the DS sold about 6 million units before the DS Lite was launched so it did sell quite some units before the DS Lite were launched. About "crushed the PS2 LTD", that can be discussed in my opinion. At the moment the DS LTD has a lead on about 1.44 million over the PS2's LTD. Looking at the pure numbers and taken the time frame into account, the DS is no doubt the winner of preformance, its no doubt about that. However, one system is a "home" console (maybe usually 1 unit per household) while the other is a portable system where maybe several of units excist per household. Nevertheless, its an amazing preformance by the DS, no doubt about that, but i'm just saying that there are some differences between the 2 systems so it can be discussed in my opinion
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
jarrod said:
I really wonder about "Tales".
First, Namco does TotT (well, has someone else do it). It bombs spectacularly. Then, they inexplicably announce that the DS is the new home for "Tales" games. They then proceed to announce one DS game, one Wii game, and one (?PS)360 game. Tales of Innocence also bombs, but their expectations are tempered and it is well received, effectively erasing at least some of the bad will from TotT.
So where do they go from here?
They have console games that cost more and don't perform as well as the old console games. They have cheap ass remakes and ports, which sell adequately but possibly further dillute the brand. They have the DS which may or may not do well for another Tales game--it'll depend pretty entirely on whether or not ToI did poorly because of bad blood over TotT or if it's just fatigue.
Further, what do they do about the US? There's no proven JRPG market on any platform. Last gen's major offerings did well, but Tales of Phantasia bombed very badly. It strikes me that this is why they're hedging their bets with a three pronged strategy. They have no idea what to do, and they're not willing to retire the series for a few years.
On a personal level, I'm pretty indifferent. I've enjoyed the entries I've played of the series (finished Phantasia, played a good chunk of Symphonia, watched my little sister play part of Abyss, watched a friend play Eternia/ToDII US) and I'll certainly buy Tales of Vesperia when it comes out, but the franchise does need a little bit of a revamp and it won't get it until it bottoms out.
BishopLamont
Banned
test_account said:As far as i know the PSP was released about 1 week later than the DS in Japan so i would say that these 2 systems were pretty much released simultaneously (if you're refering to the DS and the PSP). But as i wrote earlier, it all depends on how you define "dominating"
Just alittle side note, the DS is actually about 3.5 years old in Japan now. Its about 2 years since the DS Lite was launched (i guess maybe that is what you ment?), but afaik the DS sold about 6 million units before the DS Lite was launched so it did sell quite some units before the DS Lite were launched. About "crushed the PS2 LTD", that can be discussed in my opinion. At the moment the DS LTD has a lead on about 1.44 million over the PS2's LTD. Looking at the pure numbers and taken the time frame into account, the DS is no doubt the winner of preformance, its no doubt about that. However, one system is a "home" console (maybe usually 1 unit per household) while the other is a portable system where maybe several of units excist per household. Nevertheless, its an amazing preformance by the DS, no doubt about that, but i'm just saying that there are some differences between the 2 systems so it can be discussed in my opinion
Hardware aside, the DS dominates software sales even more so then the PS2 did in it's primetime. Barring significant software launch weeks, I doubt the DS has ever sold less software then any console/handheld in any week since the DS Lite launched.
It's been awhile since I've visited GAF for awhile since MC threads are pretty boring now that Nintendo and to some extent the PSP are the only things that's relevant in Japan. I'll be back once Wii Music gets released.
test_account
XP-39C²
Yep, the DS software might be the one that does it the best of them all. I wonder which system between DS and PS2 that has most released software. What do you mean with the last thing you said there by the way, that the DS has sold most software combined compared to any other systems?BishopLamont said:
Rushing the PS4 would be stupid. The GameCube was a failure and Nintendo scrapped the N5 plans they had for 2004(thankfully). They should just wait it out, try to make a small profit since the PS3 was a huge investment. Another Playstation in two years would cripple Sony.The Experiment said:
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
test_account said:
Not even close at this point; Using Josh's database:
Code:
c platform
1541 PS2
358 DS
354 GBA
185 PSP
144 GCN
98 X360
75 Wii
54 PS3
54 XboxTWO RESTRICTIONS:
1) Nothing pre-PS2 in the database.
2) Because we have full Famitsu Top 500s for all the old years, but don't yet have them for 2007 (and I don't know if Josh has the top 500 entered for 2006; too lazy to check), it's likely that the DS, PSP, X360, Wii, and PS3 are all missing at least a few games.
Still, I'll one-up myself. The PS2 was released on March 4, 2000. The DS was released on December 2, 2004. That puts the DS at around 3 years and 6 months old, so I'll sort of round off and check for all ps2 software released before September 4, 2003.
Code:
c platform
569 PS2Ta-da!
This isn't perfect, but it suggests the PS2 is a little ahead of the DS. It seems the US has just shy of 600 DS games released (579 as of a few weeks ago, according to DigitPress's "complete US DS collection" thread). I don't have stats for PS2 in the US.
Bandai Namco tries to get more money by "expanding" the series. They got the semi-independent Tales Studio with a stable staff with little to no fluctuation reliably churning out new major games about every year at low budget with reliable high sales. They try to partake with internal and outsourced projects in the hope of eventually digging gold and getting a reliable second "Tales Studio" (Alfa System was pretty close). I don't see any brand "management" happening outside of this effort, "saturation" seems to be a term unknown to them.Stumpokapow said:
test_account
XP-39C²
Is it really that big of a difference between the total games for the DS and the PS2? I had no idea. I guess i have been "blinded" by the DS titles dominating the list the last last 1-2 years or so hehe. If some games Wii, 360, PS3 etc. games are missing from these numbers i guess its not that many so the numbers will look totaly different if they were added? But as you say, the PS2 is relatively much older than the DS so in afterthough it maybe not a big suprise that the PS2 has fairly more game releases than the DS up to this point. If its about 569 PS2 releases in the same time frame as the DS has been out it seems that the PS2 is alittle ahead ye. But damn, over 1500 PS2 releases in Japan only? Its been about 8 years, but still, thats a crazy alot of many games in my opinionStumpokapow said:
Also in the US, i didnt know there were that more DS releases there compared to in Japan.
Thanks for all the numbers!
test_account said:As far as i know the PSP was released about 1 week later than the DS in Japan so i would say that these 2 systems were pretty much released simultaneously (if you're refering to the DS and the PSP). But as i wrote earlier, it all depends on how you define "dominating"
Sure, I guess I can see the point if you're only talking about this year so far hardware only. What I'm saying is that dominance doesn't exist in a vaccuum. You're right, the PSP and the DS released around the same time, but it's less relevant because you're changing the metric by looking at yearly sales. The DS has probably sold a good deal more of whatever it's potential LTD in Japan will be in the DS because it saw unprecedented demand week after week for months, and years, and dominated in software and hardware, and it's at a point where no system has ever been and STILL having solid sales without a price drop. Looking at sales in the narrow window of this year, or even the last 6-7 months isn't an accurate picture of what is actually happening in the market this generation.
That's exactly what I meant in fact. Let's look at the two facts you just provided and look at the market relatively speaking. The DS sold about as much as the PSP has (I'm assuming perfectly linear sales, a poor assumption but work with me) in it's "dominant" period with the Slim and crisis core (and monster hunter) with relatively few games early on of inconsistent ("launch" quality). After the DS lite was releast it sold 3/4 (or thereabouts) of the PS2's LTD in 1/4 of the time. So, to me, "dominance" is in part defined in a console's ability to close in on another console's sales at a rapid pace, realistically enough it's going to change something (that is, catch the system it is chasing).
About "crushed the PS2 LTD", that can be discussed in my opinion. At the moment the DS LTD has a lead on about 1.44 million over the PS2's LTD. Looking at the pure numbers and taken the time frame into account, the DS is no doubt the winner of preformance, its no doubt about that. However, one system is a "home" console (maybe usually 1 unit per household) while the other is a portable system where maybe several of units excist per household. Nevertheless, its an amazing preformance by the DS, no doubt about that, but i'm just saying that there are some differences between the 2 systems so it can be discussed in my opinion
Dude. The PS2 was the fastest and best selling system in Japan all time. The DS caught it in 1/4 of the time. It doesn't matter if it was a handheld or not, NO SYSTEM HAD DONE THAT BEFORE THE PS2, and yet the DS caught it in 1/4 the time. 1/4!
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
Frillen said:
It took me a while to grasp the Japanese market. Some people still don't get it. The Gundams and the Everybody Golf's are like the Maddens and Halos in the states. Those have come and gone. Japan is Wii World now. People just need to respect that notion and move on.
BishopLamont
Banned
Yes total software for DS vs any other console/handheld in any given week.test_account said:
Hcoregamer00
The 'H' stands for hentai.
Stumpokapow said:
I for one think that it is a mixture of many factors.
Tales of Innocence was an excellent game, no doubt, but it was made by some unknown development team. If this new tales game is done by Team Destiny, a very well known branch of the Tales Studio, it could sell very well. Innocence's failure is because of tales of the tempest that soiled the name, a release of a massive amount of games that are not of good quality lately, and a lack of marketing for the handheld versions.
Vesperia is definitely the big budget tales RPG, and it shows by production values and how Namco is willing to push the game in the US market. On the other hand, the tales of symphonia spinoff is a poor showing for the Wii. The game was not made from the ground up for the console, nor it was it a ground up development from any of the Tales Studio's.
With that said, I really don't know which will sell better. If Vesperia was simultaneously released for the PS3 and X360, there is no doubt that the game would be the best selling of the home console versions, because the PS3 is strong in Japan and Europe while the X360 is strong in the states, so it capitalizes on both of the markets. The Wii is strong everywhere, but it isn't getting a mainline game. If the Wii got a brand new tales game that pushed the console the same way Symphonia pushed Gamecube, and that Abyss pushed the PS2, there is no doubt that the Wii version will be the best selling version. The problem is that the Wii isn't getting a mainline game with the huge marketing behind it.
test_account
XP-39C²
I just commented on the simultaneously releases because you said that i didnt see two simultaneously released consoles (unless you ment DS Lite VS PSP slim, but JoshuaJSlone's comparisons include both DS and PS "phat" numbers as well, atleast as far as i know). I agree with what you're saying, DS is indeed the dominating system between the DS and the PSP if you're looking at the big picture and domination does not excist in a vacuum indeed, well, it totally depends on what you mean with domination and how you look at it as i wrote in my previous posts.Gaborn said:
Jaruru's said that people needed to read JoshuaJSlone's comparison before they said that the PSP were dominating. Maybe he was thinking about the DS and PSP's LTD when i said that, but that is why i said it depends on what you mean with "domination"
In my opinion there are different forms (or what i shall say) of domination. I.e if a sucky soccer team plays against the top leading soccer team, and the sucky soccer team outplays the good soccer team with like 6-1 in result, then i wouldnt say it is wrong to say that the sucky team dominated that match eventhough the really good soccer team will win the whole league in total. So if people are saying "the PSP is dominating" if the PSP outsells the DS quite a bit for some weeks i would not say that this is a wrong statement.I agree here too, looking at the big picture with software and hardware the DS is the dominant one between PSP and DS. And no system this generation will doubtfully reach DS's LTD. It seems that the DS Lite has sold alittle more than the PSP since the launch of the PSP Slim by the way due to the big spikes for the DS around christmas (i think) just so that is saidGaborn said:
What about the aproximately 6 million DS "phat"s that are sold?Gaborn said:
It took the DS about 3 years to reach PS2's LTD. The PS2 had been about for about 8 years at that time. 8 divided by 3 is about 2.66. If my math is correct it means that it took the DS about 1/2.66 of the time to outsell the PS2 I'm not downplaying the DS numbers at all. As i wrote in my previous post, the DS is showing an amazing preformance. Looking stricktly at the LTD numbers the DS is over the PS2, and that in a much quicker time as well. I'm just saying that home console and portable systems are 2 different things when we are touching that subject so things can be discussed alittle around this subject in my opinion test_account
XP-39C²
*double post, sorry*
Ok, thats what i thought, i just had to ask to be sure that i didnt missunderstand, thanks for the answerBishopLamont said:
WrathOfOtaibah
Banned
[Nintex] said:
Sony executives may think that the more PS3 turns out these kinds of performances, the greater the chance that Sony will lose whatever relevance they might have had in the console marketplace. The PS3 should not be below 10,000 for any reason in Japan, its native country.
I don't think Sony can write off Japan as easily as Microsoft. Sony is trailing Microsoft by a good amount in the US and while it is beating Microsoft in Europe, it is not by margins that compensate for the gap in the US. It would be a significant loss to developer confidence if Sony decided to say "Fuck it" and let the PS3 settle for 3rd.
Yea, just let the Sony fanboy have his day in the sun.DeaconKnowledge said:
The good moments are so few and far between for Sony fans these days anyway. Haze was a wash, GTA4 failed to push hardware, Sony CEO Howard Stringer just admitted PS3 isn't doing so hot, and how many times has Home been delayed now?
test_account
XP-39C²
Is this comment directed to me? If so, what have i said so i'm a Sony fanboy? Have you read what i have written? I havnt downloaded any numbers or anything, i just stated my opinion that i think there are different forms of domination.31 Flavas said:
test_account
XP-39C²
Ah ok, sorry! :\ My mistake. I asked since you quoted something that DeaconKnowledge said and he replied to something i had written. Thats why i thought you were refering to what i had written so i had to ask to be sure31 Flavas said:
Again, i am sorry for the missunderstanding.Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
31 Flavas said:
There is a time and a place for that. When it comes to Japan, he wasn't living in reality.
Look at this. The situation has virtually flatlined for a year and more important games to the Japanese consumer has been released. Only thing left now is to see if the Wii can make a run for what the PS2 established there.
manueldelalas
Time Traveler
Agent Icebeezy said:
It's an average... the more weeks charted, the more flattened it will be...
Grampa Simpson
Banned
From 11/08/2006:
PS2 - 20,982 / 19,921,688
GC - 647 / 4,163,243
Xbox - 0 / 475,569
That's a total of 24560500 consoles.
PS2 - 81.11%
GC - 16.95%
XBOX - 1.94%
At the current rate it will take a very long time for the Wii to hit 81%
PS2 - 20,982 / 19,921,688
GC - 647 / 4,163,243
Xbox - 0 / 475,569
That's a total of 24560500 consoles.
PS2 - 81.11%
GC - 16.95%
XBOX - 1.94%
At the current rate it will take a very long time for the Wii to hit 81%
I remember the times when these threads easily made 15 pages or more. Sales-Age need a new generation or something, it's so much easier to root for a platform instead of individual games.
Only if sales trends stay the same - and that's the point Icebeezy was trying to make. Crazy Sony supporters predict a reversal of the sales trends, which is completely and entirely insane at this point.manueldelalas said: