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[Mr Waluigi]

Interesting in how there's no education funding on the dangers of pregnancy. I view it as immoral to force a woman to carry a pregnancy to term where it's 100% her body and life on the line while men have no other contribution than the initial fertilization. I'm not saying men are just sperm donors.. but we also absolutely do not have even the slightest tiniest bit of risk in a pregnancy whatsoever. A pregnancy for a woman can outright kill them, maim, and a whole host of other effects, including mental health issues even with modern medicine.. A man can soft-abort by taking the next bus out of town. Women can't do that. I cannot force them to stare down that barrel and tell them they have to go through with it.

Isn't sex ed pretty incompetent in some US states anyway? I hear horror stories about abstinence-only education, demonization of contraceptives, and as you said, little information on the actual risks of pregnancy.

there is nothing immoral about abortion.

I consider abortion to be murder, plain and simple. That's apparently where we disagree and I doubt that debating this would be anything but a waste of time for either of us.

Pregnancy can end in death, coma, or amputation from complications.

It's way more dangerous than you think it is. Like, way more.

I am of course not saying abortion must be illegal even when the woman's health is in danger. That would be ridiculous. Or that the woman must be kept alive by any means even if there is no actual way for the fetus to survive, that would be ridiculous too, and a fanatical interpretation of the fundamental right to live.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

This contributes literally nothing. You would think after the Trump win, people would learn that you can't change other people's opinions by attacking them and not discussing it.

If by "anti-choice asshole" you mean Aristion, he's been arguing his points in a totally reasonable manner, though I disagree with him, and has definitely contributed more to the discussion than this worthless post.

I was talking mostly about those asshole legislators trying to take away women's rights, but don't let that stop you from being outraged at the real bad guy here...

Also, Artistion has been posting outright falsehoods, like this ridiculous post that is completely devoid of reality. It's not my job to educate people on basic facts.

I consider abortion to be murder, plain and simple.

No you don't. If you sincerely did, you'd be working way harder to stop elective abortions from happening.

Unless, of course, you don't actually care that much about murder...

 

[FyreWulff]

Isn't sex ed pretty incompetent in some US states anyway? I hear horror stories about abstinence-only education, demonization of contraceptives, and as you said, little information on the actual risks of pregnancy..

Yes, but access to contraceptives are limited due to the all or nothing attitude of a lot of groups on it, even including condoms. There are also other things to consider, like marital rape and so on, where the woman cannot use contraception because it can mean being attacked even more violently.

 

[HiredN00bs]

there is nothing immoral about abortion.

Really? Even if the child has consciousness and can feel pain? I think an abortion could absolutely be immoral. Forcing women to have children they don't wish to have is also immoral.

 

[Pantaghana]

The mother's life isn't terminated without her having a say in it.

I am not knowledgeable on the subject. How is the woman treated like an uterus belonging to the state in countries in which abortion is illegal (Ireland for instance)?

Instead she is forced to have a child and has no say in it.

The woman's wishes and opinions are discarded in order to cater to the mass of cells inside one of her organs. How is she not treated as nothing more than a uterus?

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

I consider abortion to be murder, plain and simple. That's apparently where we disagree and I doubt that debating this would be anything but a waste of time for either of us.

That is absolutely absurd, you are now completely changing what the meaning of that word means.

Again, I would like to press the logistics of outlawing abortion. What exactly do you think this would accomplish? How are you going to handle individuals who have a back alley abortion, 'fall', etc.?

 

[Dice//]

I don't think any pro-lifer has offered a scenario where in some world they got pregnant and what they would do. Getting pregnant when you don't want it is a scary thing.

I'm 2000% in favour of being pro choice but even in the event I needed an abortion it wouldn't be done with anything less than a heavy heart. It's not a decision anyone does lightly but the importance of having that option is important. I'm sick of people thinking it's okay to tell women about their bodies and feels it's a law that should have way more women giving their input

 

[Mr Waluigi]

No you don't. If you sincerely did, you'd be working way harder to stop elective abortions from happening.

Unless, of course, you don't actually care that much about murder...

What can I do but vote? Even then, voting for right-wing policies would fuck over people who are already alive, so what am I supposed to do? Abortion isn't even recognized as morally ambiguous anymore. I'd rather have abortion, which I consider to be murder, stay legal than it become illegal (which would cause revolt among the population and wouldn't mean abortion doesn't happen anymore, just that it is now more dangerous for the woman) and a bunch of inhumane policies come along with the de-legalization of abortion.

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal, but that would be fighting an uphill battle in my country. There's still a chance for abortion to become illegal in the US but politicians seem to be more focused on what happens to a person before they're born than what happens to them after, if their other policies are anything to go by. They seem to be more "pro-birth" than pro-life.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal, but that would be fighting an uphill battle in my country. There's still a chance for abortion to become illegal in the US but politicians seem to be more focused on what happens to a person before they're born than what happens to them after, if their other policies are anything to go by. They seem to be more "pro-birth" than pro-life.

WTF, so basically you want to punish women.

 

[azyless]

Really? Even if the child has consciousness and can feel pain? I think an abortion could absolutely be immoral. Forcing women to have children they don't wish to have is also immoral.

Luckily these both happen around the time the fetus starts to be "viable" outside the womb !

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal, but that would be fighting an uphill battle in my country. There's still a chance for abortion to become illegal in the US but politicians seem to be more focused on what happens to a person before they're born than what happens to them after, if their other policies are anything to go by. They seem to be more "pro-birth" than pro-life.

Haha you're so disgusting I don't even know what to say except insults so I'll just put you on ignore. Nice try initially trying to make it as if you're "against murder" when in fact you just hate women unapologetically.

 

[Mr Waluigi]

That is absolutely absurd, you are now completely changing what the meaning of that word means.

murder
/ˈməːdə/
noun
1.
the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.
"the brutal murder of a German holidaymaker"
synonyms: killing, homicide, assassination, liquidation, extermination, execution, slaughter, butchery, massacre

?

Instead she is forced to have a child and has no say in it.

The woman's wishes and opinions are discarded in order to cater to the mass of cells inside one of her organs. How is she not treated as nothing more than a uterus?

She does not have to keep the child. As for complications, taking the chance of a person dying during childbirth is certainly preferable to definitely ending a person's life before they can be born.

 

[InfiniteBento]

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal, but that would be fighting an uphill battle in my country.

Both abortion and contraceptives should be illegal to you?

You don't give a fuck about women at all. Don't even try to clarify because how selfish and ignorant you are is already shining through.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

murder
/ˈməːdə/
noun
1.
the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.
"the brutal murder of a German holidaymaker"
synonyms: killing, homicide, assassination, liquidation, extermination, execution, slaughter, butchery, massacre

?

?

 

[Vincent Grayson]

murder
/ˈməːdə/
noun
1.
the unlawful premeditated killing of one human being by another.
"the brutal murder of a German holidaymaker"
synonyms: killing, homicide, assassination, liquidation, extermination, execution, slaughter, butchery, massacre

?



She does not have to keep the child. As for complications, taking the chance of a person dying during childbirth is certainly preferable to definitely ending a person's life before they can be born.

The bolded is the issue. You can call it killing if you want. But murder is illegal, so it can't be murder if it's legal.

As for the latter, it's preferable to you, because you don't have to actually do anything or absorb the consequences of being forced to carry a child to term.

 

[Mr Waluigi]

WTF, so basically you want to punish women.

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.

Haha you're so disgusting I don't even know what to say except insults so I'll just put you on ignore. Nice try initially trying to make it as if you're "against murder" when in fact you just hate women unapologetically.

Sorry if that offended you. If being in favor of the sanctity of life means I hate women unapologetically, then I learned something today.

 

[Pantaghana]

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal

...the fuck?

According to you, women shouldn't be allowed to have sex except for the sole purpose of having children, and that is fucking abhorrent.

She does not have to keep the child. As for complications, taking the chance of a person dying during childbirth is certainly preferable to definitely ending a person's life before they can be born.

...the fuck?

You essentially said: "If an abortion can save a woman's life, let's not save her life because life is sacred."
Take a moment to realize just how hypocritical that statement is.

 

[LiquidSword]

She does not have to keep the child. As for complications, taking the chance of a person dying during childbirth is certainly preferable to definitely ending a person's life before they can be born.

And if they both die because action wasn't taken? That just a BOGO deal for God?

 

[Mr Waluigi]

The bolded is the issue. You can call it killing if you want. But murder is illegal, so it can't be murder if it's legal.

I guess that's right.

As for the latter, it's preferable to you, because you don't have to actually do anything or absorb the consequences of being forced to carry a child to term.

My wife is also strongly against abortion for the same reasons I am. Besides, that's like saying I shouldn't be against the death penality because I haven't had a criminal murder one of my relatives.

 

[AlexMeloche]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.

...are we back in 1916?

 

[Morrigan Stark]

What can I do but vote? Even then, voting for right-wing policies would fuck over people who are already alive, so what am I supposed to do? Abortion isn't even recognized as morally ambiguous anymore. I'd rather have abortion, which I consider to be murder, stay legal than it become illegal (which would cause revolt among the population and wouldn't mean abortion doesn't happen anymore, just that it is now more dangerous for the woman) and a bunch of inhumane policies come along with the de-legalization of abortion.

Okay. I mean I'm happy you are so flippant about what you consider murder, I guess.

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal

What

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral.

What

As for complications, taking the chance of a person dying during childbirth is certainly preferable to definitely ending a person's life before they can be born.

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaat

Spoiler

Sorry mods if that's shit posting, but that's just... holy shit. What year is this?

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.

There is vast difference between saying you find it immoral/unethical and you feel it should be illegal to have this stuff. You want divorce and same-sex relationships illegal too?

So what kind of punishment do we have for being gay or getting divorced in your world?

 

[M0nochromatic]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral.

Can you please elaborate further on what leads you to believe the things you listed here are immoral?

 

[Matsukaze]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.

Really?

Really?

 

[Hollycat]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.



Sorry if that offended you. If being in favor of the sanctity of life means I hate women unapologetically, then I learned something today.

What? What the fuck? How are divorce, contraceptives, same sex relationships unethical or immoral? Are you saying every time someone has sex they should make a baby and nobody should be able to end a bad relationship?

 

[Veritigo_X]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.

What exactly is it immoral and unethical about using a condom? Or being in a relationship with someone of the same sex?

 

[InfiniteBento]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.

Fuck you. Your ignorance has contributed nothing but hate to this world. I feel sorry for you to have to live in such an entitled ignorant bubble.

 

[Kinsei]

What can I do but vote? Even then, voting for right-wing policies would fuck over people who are already alive, so what am I supposed to do? Abortion isn't even recognized as morally ambiguous anymore. I'd rather have abortion, which I consider to be murder, stay legal than it become illegal (which would cause revolt among the population and wouldn't mean abortion doesn't happen anymore, just that it is now more dangerous for the woman) and a bunch of inhumane policies come along with the de-legalization of abortion.

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal, but that would be fighting an uphill battle in my country. There's still a chance for abortion to become illegal in the US but politicians seem to be more focused on what happens to a person before they're born than what happens to them after, if their other policies are anything to go by. They seem to be more "pro-birth" than pro-life.

I assume you also believe that male masturbation should be illegal as well? Think of all of those potential lives being lost.

 

[Horse Detective]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral. It's obviously not a possibility, though, as modern Western governments are very secular and more focused on keeping society together than on upholding morality.



Sorry if that offended you. If being in favor of the sanctity of life means I hate women unapologetically, then I learned something today.

Hahaha.

 

[zoukka]

What? What the fuck? How are divorce, contraceptives, same sex relationships unethical or immoral? Are you saying every time someone has sed they should make a baby and nobody should be able to end a bad relationship?

He's obviously fundamental religious so I wouldn't get too worked up.

 

[Kard8p3]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral.

what a joke

 

[azyless]

Does the immortality of being born gay cancel out the immorality of abortion hmm I'm stuck in my extremist religious logic.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

He's obviously religious so I wouldn't get too worked up.

Most religious people don't think contraception should be illegal, nor for that matter divorce and/or same-sex relationships.

 

[CadetMahoney]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral.

Top kek.

These threads seem different nowadays. Where were all these guys prior to Trump winning?

 

[Mr Waluigi]

...the fuck?

According to you, women shouldn't be allowed to have sex except for the sole purpose of having children

Neither should men! But as I've said, it's not feasible in the current society we live in.

You essentially said: "If an abortion can save a woman's life, let's not save her life because life is sacred."
Take a moment to realize just how hypocritical that statement is.

Oh, I wasn't talking about aborting during childbirth. I was rather thinking of doing an abortion before childbirth can happen because childbirth has bigger risks of complication than abortion does.

And if they both die because action wasn't taken? That just a BOGO deal for God?

Why would action not be taken?

 

[zoukka]

Most religious people don't think contraception should be illegal, nor for that matter divorce and/or same-sex relationships.

Yeah edited my post a bit.

 

[Horse Detective]

They shouldnt even ban you, they should let you continue posting and link your posts in a tag.

 

[FyreWulff]

Abortion, contraceptives, divorce, same-sex relationships, etc. all should be considered unethical and immoral.

andthereitis.gif

 

[Hollycat]

Neither should men! But as I've said, it's not feasible in the current society we live in.

?

so in your opinion should I as an infertile woman not be allowed to have sex?

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Yeah edited my post a bit.

Even those groups don't call for outlawing same-sex relationships. He is on the fringe of the fringe.

 

[Psychoward]

What can I do but vote? Even then, voting for right-wing policies would fuck over people who are already alive, so what am I supposed to do? Abortion isn't even recognized as morally ambiguous anymore. I'd rather have abortion, which I consider to be murder, stay legal than it become illegal (which would cause revolt among the population and wouldn't mean abortion doesn't happen anymore, just that it is now more dangerous for the woman) and a bunch of inhumane policies come along with the de-legalization of abortion.

Ideally, abortion and contraceptives would both be illegal, but that would be fighting an uphill battle in my country. There's still a chance for abortion to become illegal in the US but politicians seem to be more focused on what happens to a person before they're born than what happens to them after, if their other policies are anything to go by. They seem to be more "pro-birth" than pro-life.

Dude WHAT?


Like I was raised a Catholic, I can kind o see the POV of anti-abortion folks even if I heavily disagree but even the priests I spoke to believed in contraceptives lmao.

Like. What?

 

[RedStep]

Encouraging a pro-life culture would inevitably lead to less abortions. Whether we like it or not, the law acts as a pedagogue in ways that social movements usually do not. If we gradually pass legislation that restricts abortions, over time the public would be educated on the moral status of the unborn and perhaps more women wouldn't resort to illegal means of procuring abortions.

We have thousands of years of history to tell us that this is not the case. I'm not going to take your uneducated guesses as a good indicator of what will happen.

 

[Sabotage]

As a woman, who at the age of 15 had an abortion after being with an abusive alcoholic and only managed to do so because i went to court alone and struggled for weeks to find a free lawyer to represent me in my case, fuck you.

Having an abortion saved my life and my future. To say its a barbaric practice, you clearly do not understand the trauma women go through in our daily lives and sacrifices we must make for our health and our futures.

Let me see you carry around a cluster of cells to full form for 9 months that a man decided to put inside you by raping you then talk shit.

The fundemental issue here is what man fundementaly thinks of himself. Man is taught and believes and thus acts out that he is no more than an evolved beast, albeit a "smarter" beast; but a beast no less.

A beast doesn't care about himself, he'll eat his own feces, or drink himself to death. A beast doesn't care about others and will take what is not his, or rape.

Perhaps if we thought of ourselves and others as something sacred, instead of merely sensual we wouldn't have this problem. Perhaps instead of teaching we're a son of a beast, we'd teach that we're children of God

 

[Psychoward]

Neither should men! But as I've said, it's not feasible in the current society we live in.

No Fun Allowed.jpg


Sex is great, try it sometime. Also does that mean in your fantasy world homosexual sex should be outlawed because it can't be used for reproduction?

 

[Veritigo_X]

Neither should men! But as I've said, it's not feasible in the current society we live in.

Was this ever feasible in society? Like, in your head when do you imagine the "golden age of fucking to only make children" was?

 

[Horse Detective]

The fundemental issue here is what man fundementaly thinks of himself. Man is taught and believes and thus acts out that he is no more than an evolved beast, albeit a "smarter" beast; but a beast no less.

A beast doesn't care about himself, he'll eat his own feces, or drink himself to death. A beast doesn't care about others and will take what is not his, or rape.

Perhaps if we thought of ourselves and others as something sacred, instead of merely sensual we wouldn't have this problem. Perhaps instead of teaching we're a son of a beast, we'd teach that we're children of God

Is this really the first reply to her admission? Lmao

 

[Sou Da]

The fundemental issue here is what man fundementaly thinks of himself. Man is taught and believes and thus acts out that he is no more than an evolved beast, albeit a "smarter" beast; but a beast no less.

A beast doesn't care about himself, he'll eat his own feces, or drink himself to death. A beast doesn't care about others and will take what is not his, or rape.

Perhaps if we thought of ourselves and others as something sacred, instead of merely sensual we wouldn't have this problem. Perhaps instead of teaching we're a son of a beast, we'd teach that we're children of God

This is a non answer. You had absolutely nothing to say and still made a post.

 

[Kinsei]

No Fun Allowed.jpg


Sex is great, try it sometime. Also does that mean in your fantasy world homosexual sex should be outlawed because it can't be used for reproduction?

He already said that it should.

 

[Netherscourge]

Male masturbation will be banned next.

We're murdering millions of potential babies every time we grab a kleenex!!!!

Government-issued steel (or PVC for those allergic to steel) underwear will be distributed to allow us to pee and have erections, but without any hands-on assistance or stimulation. When it's time to procreate, you must visit your local Priest who has the special key to unlock your Holy Rod of Divination for use with ONLY your spouse's vagina.

That's how Jesus would have wanted it.

The bill will be named, Pence-a-care, aka, the AEA - Appropriate Ejaculation Act.

 

[Hollycat]

The fundemental issue here is what man fundementaly thinks of himself. Man is taught and believes and thus acts out that he is no more than an evolved beast, albeit a "smarter" beast; but a beast no less.

A beast doesn't care about himself, he'll eat his own feces, or drink himself to death. A beast doesn't care about others and will take what is not his, or rape.

Perhaps if we thought of ourselves and others as something sacred, instead of merely sensual we wouldn't have this problem. Perhaps instead of teaching we're a son of a beast, we'd teach that we're children of God

What does this nonsense have to do with the quoted post?

 

[Psychoward]

He already said that it should.

Jesus fucking christ.


I can only assume he's asexual or something and just can't comprehend sex.