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PoliGAF 2017 |OT6| Made this thread during Harvey because the ratings would be higher
- Thread starter Aaron Strife
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Lol?
Autodidact
Banned
Lol;
Random Human
They were trying to grab your prize. They work for the mercenary. The masked man.
Perhaps Kelly isnt the adult you want running the daycare after all.
Dominican Power
Member
People gave Kelly the benefit of the doubt just because he was in the military. Like the military hasn't produced countless amounts of scumbags.
Businesses will always have influence! They will never not have influence. You will always be making concessions to power and influence. Trudeau has to tiptoe around Alberta's dependency on the oil industry. Obama had to work with Insurance companies.
Complaining that they have "too much influence" is silly- you can't legislate that influence away. You also cannot legislate away the massive shifts in technology and communication that have led to mass consolidation. The consumer gains from those consolidations are real- look at people in far-out Canadian provinces being able to order things via Prime far cheaper than the prices charged in their local stores, saving them a lot of money!
edit: (why do we keep getting SARGENT instead of Sergeant?)
SerAardvark
Member
Kelly's main selling point is that he's (at least relatively) sane - I'd like to think people recognized him as more of a "least bad" option for that role than anything else.
*terrorist fist jab* My man.
*terrorist fist jab* My man.
KirbYuuYuu
Member
If they're picked for Trump admin. They're shit. If they're not shit, give thgem some time
Just to be clear, youre saying most of the people who call themselves leftists support the abolition of all private property?
That would surprise me, to be frank. And I say this as somebody who believes in the abolition of private property!
lol I forgot this one. good suggestion
Me asking about this Uranium story (note I haven't even ventured into that thread bc its a mess), because there's no reporting on it and I honestly don't fucking know what the deal is isn't me trying to make hay of of this.
I specifically posted this regarding the DNC ousters, note the emphasis on the fucking bolded language.
And this Trump controversy is super dumb.
Its the classic Trump stupidity where he says something horrific and racist and then it gets picked up and both sides go back and forth, until we hit the next controversy. And we, as a society, don't move forward, progress policy, or make any real progress (outside of learning what we already know: Trump's a racist asshole), and then move on, while the people in the crossfire get hurt, in this case the military families.
THANK YOU
Every time we prop up one of these guys as The Long-Suffering Adult in the Room, they prove us wrong every single time.
It's disgraceful what Kelly just did in defense of a man who launched his campaign on attacking vets and Gold Star families.
balladofwindfishes
Member
You will look up in 50 years and have a holy shit how did we let this happen moment. You're literally making a right wing argument, btw, when you talk about the benefits to the consumer. What would actually benefit consumers are jobs that pay a living wage with benefits that won't be automated in the coming decades.
Not me. I use every opportunity to remind people that Kelly is not a good person
This does not make the controversy "dumb"! Trump getting heat for treating military families like shit is a completely earned controversy!
The employment rate is under 5%
This is the same stupid anti-Steam Engine argument - "OH NO WE'RE PUTTING PEOPLE OUT OF WORK".
Most people are not going to sit on their asses- they will find something else to do! The problem is that this is going to require moving, and we've shackled a lot of people to their homes via our misguided homeownership push!
I don't think its a bad thing. This will probably hurt his numbers somewhat in the short term and is definitely a distraction.
Rebel Leader
THE POWER OF BUTTERSCOTCH BOTTOMS
What does it do?
The Obama era my god so many stupid things.
Okay, but will those people earn a living wage? Will those people have any benefits or stability?
We're having these issues NOW, and not addressing them; not sure how you can feel so optimistic about the future.
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
Kelly thinks all refugees should be banned from America and thinks that Mexicans will smuggle WMDs over the border.
Kelly's stupidity is matched only by his cruelty and lack of humanity.
Neuters most of Trump's attempts at sabotaging Obamacare in exchange for some semantic changes that the GOP can sell as a win. It's about the best we can possibly hope for with a government under Republican control.
balladofwindfishes
Member
What are those GOP changes?
My position is that the government should be providing a lot of those baseline benefits in lieu of the company, because employment is inherently unstable!
Asking for companies to provide baseline pensions, medical benefits, etc. to their employees is stupid! They're profit-oriented self-interested companies, not something that's ostensibly supposed to be acting in the public interest!
Stability is an illusion. I moved all the time as a kid. It's not a bad thing.
The reason we have trouble getting these things passed is because the American Electorate has been very unhappy with the Dems ever since they passed the Civil Rights act.
Wait, what the fuck?
People don't need jobs or wages. People need wealth. Reducing the cost of producing and distributing goods means they'll have more wealth. Jobs are merely the capitalist strategy for coercing you out of your labor by refusing to provide you the wealth you need to survive. So "good jobs at good wages" is really the right-wing argument here. This is really stuff you should learn if you want to be a socialist.
Cesare Borgia
Banned
Still think the congresswoman made a mistake by inserting herself into this.
A few modifications of state waivers, that's all. Nothing really changes on that front and doesn't seem like actual bad changes.
Aaron Strife
Banned
To expand on that, restores the funding that Trump cut off for the next two years while giving the GOP some token concessions with regards to waivers for certain regulations. I was worried before about what that might mean but it seems pretty minimal and more administrative than anything.
And yes, one of the things I assumed from the outset was that ACA was dead as a doornail under Trump. Not only protecting it, but including the GOP in actively protecting it, is only a good thing for the long-term livelihood of the law.
If I were in Republican leadership, Id be more concerned with keeping it as-is than shitcanning it entirely, just so Bernie and his cohorts wouldnt have an excuse to start from scratch with a single-payer plan next time the Democrats assume power. ACA clearly doesnt fly in the face of any actual conservative ideology, and from that angle its better than the alternative of going full Medicare for All.
But then again Im not Republican leadership!
States could come up with new options
It could become easier for states to get around the Affordable Care Act's insurance rules. States could not undermine protections for people with pre-existing conditions or eliminate essential health benefits, according to an analysis by health care experts Billy Wynne and Timothy Jost.
But the proposal would let states make changes to insurance requirements as long as the options have "comparable affordability" to ACA plans. That is a little more forgiving than the current requirement that plans be "as affordable as" ACA coverage.
A summary provided to GOP lawmakers suggested states could, for example, set higher co-payments for opioid prescriptions combined with lower co-payments for cholesterol-reducing drugs.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...lth-care-proposal-could-affect-you/775886001/
balladofwindfishes
Member
cartoon_soldier
Member
Kelly likes Trump, he likes his vision for USA and he is fine with what Trump wants to do.
Certain other changes are in the link.
Yes, I'm sure there would be changes in practice. I think these could potentially make life a slight bit worse for people in certain ways, but really minor in the aggregate.
excelsiorlef
Member
You noticed that too?
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
Bonen and I have been down this rabbit hole before, I think that the Marxist delineation of private vs personal property gets really messy and we need to have some open conversations about what exactly constitutes "social ownership"
ItWasMeantToBe19
Banned
But he also had the Benghazi mother say that Hillary should be in prison for emails at the RNC so that's better.
Does this mean Dems are fucked
http://www.epi.org/blog/the-racial-wealth-gap-how-african-americans-have-been-shortchanged-out-of-the-materials-to-build-wealth/
Pigeon is very much right about the problem (even if we very much disagree on what the ideal end-point solution should look like!)
Here's some more charts: http://apps.urban.org/features/wealth-inequality-charts/
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
I'll broadly agree with this, and I do think that some parts of leftists movements get too hung up on labor specifically as having some sort of virtue. Labor is a means to an end, and we live in a time of plenty where we should be able to just give a lot of people the ends
I'm not a socialist, but fair points.
My post was trying to address the innate issues relating to corporate consolidation. Tha'ts my field, so I see the daily effects of that.
Someone build a time machine and shoot this back half a decade, see what comes.
https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/921102207793160192
Sahil Kapur (@sahilkapur)
SIDEBAR: Menendez sole D defector.
:thinking: But it was a non-vote, not a no.
Also Cochran didn't vote. (Someone send a search team)
Also for those watching,
That presser the went from the 2nd grader writing trump to tell him how great he is, to dead soldiers...new normal, folks.
https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/921102207793160192
Sahil Kapur (@sahilkapur)
SIDEBAR: Menendez sole D defector.
:thinking: But it was a non-vote, not a no.
Also Cochran didn't vote. (Someone send a search team)
Also for those watching,
That presser the went from the 2nd grader writing trump to tell him how great he is, to dead soldiers...new normal, folks.
Fenderputty
Banned
I was going to comment on this irony but figured it would be covered in a couple posts. lol
This seems like going for a short term win, or political grandstanding. Long term this seems like it's just a potential anchor. Please note I said potential lol.
Agreed. Hard to say if "lol you flip flopped" matters anymore.
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