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Star Wars: The Old Republic |OT2| In a F2Play galaxy far, far away

S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
CzarTim said:
That's fair. Make it $20 bucks a year for unlimited WZ then. Or like BM said, only limit ranked matches and/or limit restrictions for previous subs.

The reason it's hard to speculate, is because we have no idea how they plan on charging for any leveling content. Whether that will be free, or a one-time fee, or maybe given to subs before everyone else. If F2P doesn't take off, then my assumption is that the amount and scope of the content will greatly lessen after the current pipeline dries out. I have no idea what to realistically expect from this dev team.
Click to expand...

Yeah there's a lot we still don't know. We don't even know the value of cartel coins yet. I'm getting 1500 atm. Is that $15 worth? $5? $40? We have no idea.
 
H

HBroward

Member
I hadn't seen this mentioned, but this was from yesterday's meet the developer:

Q: Any update on plans to convert the non-HM Flashpoints to HM versions? Will there be more Tier 2 Flashpoints?

Jesse: We will be creating Hard Modes for all of the Flashpoints that do not have Hard Modes yet. That's something that I'm personally very excited about. As for Tier 2, the Group Finder categories will be reconfigured with the level cap increase so as not to split the Flashpoint queue into two populations. I think the challenge posed by Lost Island has offered a lot of entertainment, but it's also a PUG-killer that doesn't fit into a random mix very well. The newer Hard Modes will be balanced for a more consistent experience, both in terms of difficulty and length, and that should help keep queue times in check.
Click to expand...
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
Yea I like some of the other FP's and would like to see them in hard modes for more variety. I assume they will lock out all those crew skill shortcuts out of them since all but one of those they left had em. Would have made them in hard mode way to quick and easy.
 
A

Alur

Member
LTTP and all but looks like 1550 cartel coins for me. Sell me some saber crystals or new outfits and I'll be happy, I'm easy to please.

EDIT: Still subbed but not currently playing for the past bit.
 
Vigilant Walrus

Vigilant Walrus

Member
When I look at my friends gaming habits when we talk about games we want to play, the reason why games, games like LOL and DOTA2 always end up winning is because that their Free 2 Play models, does not make ANYONE feel like second-rate citizens.

TF2, and Guild Wars 2 also have great alternative cash shops that don't restrict, from enjoying the game to it's mass potential 24-7.


I really think that restricting things like Warzones and Flashpoints, is a very bad idea, and it's something that is not in line with reality. It's not like SWTOR would just become massively popular, if it went F2P, there is too much other stuff that's free that will preceed it.

I want to play SWTOR with friends because it would be a good co-op game, and if they enjoyed it on a casual level, playing to lvl 50 with me and doing lots of warzones, at least I would have incentive (because im more "hardcore" than them) to buy fluff and convenience stuff like extra character slots, bag space or a new race or what ever.

But with these types of things my friends wont even touch this. They will stay with LOL or wait for DOTA2.. even if its not their favorite genres, nothing has as much pull as going were your friends/guildies/community are.
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
Bringing up TF2, LoL, and DOTA constantly is just mind boggling. They are not MMOs and are one trick pony games that really have no alternative to restrict the gameplay in anyway. At least compare to other MMO F2P. And GW2 required a $60 purchase. TOR should have had a similar system to GW2's buy once, but they simply can't at this point, people are not going to flock to the game at this point and be willing to pay even if they got rid of the sub fee. They needed to have done so from the start, but at this point they want people to come and try the game, they have to just have a free entry fee.

For those who play F2P MMOs, how many really play hardcore and actually are into the hardcore grind elements? The restrictions mainly affect that portion of the game so I wonder how much its going to really affect player interest. The warzone restrictions are the major issue really still though as it's the most popular thing for players to do at all levels. The other restrictions mainly only affect those end game players who would be wanting to grind for endgame gear to do operations.

They also have to make being a subscriber worth it, if they give permanant unlocks for everything it would likely be cheapest to just buy those and makes subscribing pointless. Often subscribing doesn't make any sense in these games, though perhaps they should really focus on microtransactions. They have to have major exclusive incentives to get people to sub but they often don't offer any it feels, it kinda feels like they want to promote new subs here but that isn't the right approach. It's been said many times over how microtransactions sales can outdo p2p
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Free To Play preview video is out - http://www.swtor.com/info/media/trailers/free-play-preview-1

I took a screenshot of the brief glimpse of the store itself. As you can see they blocked out the prices.

swtorshop8pskl.jpg
Click to expand...

Pretty much what you'd expect. I hope you're not going to need that many coins to get a decent amount of stuff though!
 
A

Anoregon

The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
BattleMonkey said:
They also have to make being a subscriber worth it, if they give permanant unlocks for everything it would likely be cheapest to just buy those and makes subscribing pointless.
Click to expand...

That is probably not true. As I mentioned earlier, premium content can easily be legitimately priced in such a way that for someone to have permanent access to everything (or even just a majority) of features and content that a subscriber has, they would have to shell out hundreds of dollars. If you think that is "too cheap to make subcribing worth it", then I'm just going to have to disagree with you. And with new content and features coming out in patches, there will always be new things for the "free" players to purchase, even after they have bought everything the would otherwise have been interested in.
 
C

Cystm

Member
Youtube link.

16,000 coins? My 1900 coins are not looking too good right now. Let's see some prices BW!

Higher res shot:

9MgoU.jpg
Click to expand...

That armor in the bottom left looks like is going to cost 3k coins. Everything else seems to be 3 digits.

Edit 15: That item next to the armor... wtf is that?

Edit 16: His emergency fleet pass is bound to the 5 key

God those youtube comments.
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Cystm said:
Youtube link.

16,000 coins?

My 1900 coins are not looking too good right now. Let's see some prices BW!

Higher res shot:



That armor in the bottom left looks like is going to cost 3k coins. Everything else seems to be 3 digits.

Edit 15: That item next to the armor... wtf is that?

Edit 16: His emergency fleet pass is bound to the 5 key

God those youtube comments.
Click to expand...

Well, obviously the character is a dev toon since he's level 50 and he's on the first quest :p

I'm wondering if that's not just armor in the bottom left but some sort of appearance thing. The Crime Lord's Cartel Pack is a 3 digit price and seems to come with a lot more stuff.

If my 1500 coins can't even buy one set of orange armor I'm going to be very disappointed.
 
C

Cystm

Member
Yeah, there is no way those are finalized and not simply place holders. The evidence is everywhere in that screenshot.

I just want to know already.

I am all for the XP boost with Cartel Coins. My ass is broke on JC.

Wonder if they will stack with legacy bonuses.
 
H

HBroward

Member
They have said that the "cheating" method of obtaining RE's from already crafted mods and armorings is ok.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showpost.php?p=5296169&postcount=2

We've seen players ask about this before, and have some clarification for you from Jason Attard (Senior Game Balance Designer):

This behavior was unintended, but we do not consider it an exploit. We do intend to make reverse engineering more consistent in the future, and that may be by not allowing this or by allowing players to reverse engineer this type of mod by design. We do not consider this a violation of the rules.
Click to expand...
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
Anoregon said:
That is probably not true. As I mentioned earlier, premium content can easily be legitimately priced in such a way that for someone to have permanent access to everything (or even just a majority) of features and content that a subscriber has, they would have to shell out hundreds of dollars. If you think that is "too cheap to make subcribing worth it", then I'm just going to have to disagree with you. And with new content and features coming out in patches, there will always be new things for the "free" players to purchase, even after they have bought everything the would otherwise have been interested in.
Click to expand...

But it s true in various f2p mmos. In Star Trek Online you get almost everything for free and with a few purchases, it really makes subbing pointless. Only benefit is you are given "free" credits each month for the cash shop. Over a period of time, buying a few unlocks is cheaper than being a subscriber. And subscribers always have dangling over their head the time limit of their sub locked features. Also new content for subscribers, most just don't offer content fast enough. What do I care paying for 4-6 months for an update, when the f2p player gets it when it comes out for a one time fee? DCUO for example put out three content updates that f2p players could buy for a total of $30, while a subscriber in all the time had paid over $180 in sub fees. The few restrictions placed on f2p players could be overcome with a few cheap transactions and allowed players to avoid what they didn't actually care about. Again only incentive subscribers got was some credits to buy cosmetic outfits n such.
 
C

CzarTim

Member
BattleMonkey said:
But it s true in various f2p mmos. In Star Trek Online you get almost everything for free and with a few purchases, it really makes subbing pointless. Only benefit is you are given "free" credits each month for the cash shop. Over a period of time, buying a few unlocks is cheaper than being a subscriber. And subscribers always have dangling over their head the time limit of their sub locked features. Also new content for subscribers, most just don't offer content fast enough. What do I care paying for 4-6 months for an update, when the f2p player gets it when it comes out for a one time fee? DCUO for example put out three content updates that f2p players could buy for a total of $30, while a subscriber in all the time had paid over $180 in sub fees. The few restrictions placed on f2p players could be overcome with a few cheap transactions and allowed players to avoid what they didn't actually care about. Again only incentive subscribers got was some credits to buy cosmetic outfits n such.
Click to expand...
As I said earlier, subs for F2P games are there for die-hard players there for the community -- the people who would be playing even if it wasn't F2P.

You have to get money from people who don't want to be locked down to a game where you can: impulse purchases and one-time unlocks.
 
W

Won

Member
Subscription models in "turned into F2P MMOs" exist mostly for lifetime subscribers. They have to give these people something, usually making an already bad deal even worse.
Subs shouldn't exist in F2P otherwise. They obviously don't work well together.
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Heysoos said:
Man, having a blast with my Gunslinger.
Click to expand...

That's my main and still favorite class :D

I have a 43 tank and he's fun in flashpoints but I can't figure out how to play him in PVP at all.
 
H

Heysoos

Member
Just played a few ranked matches with my Sent(Focus spec). LOL at how easy it is to pad your DPS if you have a healer. 600k and I was in the wrong form too. So much AoE burst.
 
V

vilmer_

Member
Oh gawd, Gunslingers/Snipers are the bane of my existence as a Guardian in pvp. I can't do anything lol, can't force leap, force choke or force push just have to sit there slowed and eat a ton of damage while hacking away :lol That is IF I can even get into melee range.
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Oh yay, a SWTOR thread in the games section. I wonder how it'll turn out?

EDIT: Yep, pretty much as expected.
 
U

UltraMav

Member
I've been hitching more than usual in-game but no charcter select issues.

Looks like there won't be any fixes tomorrow, hopefully that means 1.5 is chugging along well.
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
So how long does the whole HK-51 quest thing take? Hope it doesn't dissapoint by being trivial short after such a long time coming. Game needs some meat to get me back into it.
 
Z

Zafir

Member
Heysoos said:
My GPU goes hard during character selection screen. :/ Does this happen to anyone else?
Click to expand...
My old GPU used to do it, but it was just because that was one of the very few places in the game where it could use my GPU fully and wasn't bottlenecked due to my CPU and RAM. My ship was another place.

Not that I'm without problems with my new one. I've still gotta keep shadows turned off on my 660 TI because otherwise the driver just fails and restores itself on the imperial fleet occasionally.
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
BattleMonkey said:
So how long does the whole HK-51 quest thing take? Hope it doesn't dissapoint by being trivial short after such a long time coming. Game needs some meat to get me back into it.
Click to expand...

You can do it in an afternoon. Depends on if you follow a guide or not. It also requires
doing a HM FP.
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
So it seems that 1.5 update is going to also be the launch of F2P update.

Also Section X the new daily hub area will only be available to subcribers it sounds.

Respecs are also now free, mounts can be had at lvl 15, and extra 2 UI bars, but only if your a subscriber. So guess this is what the video of subscriber perks was meaning....
 
H

HBroward

Member
Free respecs and 2 extra bars? Sold! Now if it could save our bars everytime we respec so we don't have to set them back up, that would be awesome. I will henceforth be referring to this update as the "Bind Everything" update.

Edit: Not liking what I'm seeing so far. Crystals with 41 expertise that only require level 35? PvE Crystals with +41 stats that require level 10? Those better be available off the store or it's getting pretty close to pay to win territory.
 
U

UltraMav

Member
Cool, time to go check out the Cartel Shop!

EDIT: Wow, looking over patch notes there are some cool updates coming. CE and CC Vendor speeders scaling with license level... weapon previews (OMG finally)...
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
Yea from looking at the cartel shop, it looks like theres going to be lot of restrictions on the free players..... you have to buy the ability to hide head slot items? lol? wtf

Seems like almost all the visual styles currently in the game are now available in an adaptive social form
 
H

HBroward

Member
My favorites from the notes:

-The cost to remove mods from items has been reduced for subscribers.

-The Collector’s Edition vehicle and all vehicles available in the Cartel Market can now be used with the lowest level license. Their speed now scales based on the license unlocked by characters.

-The deposit for items placed on the GTN is now a percentage of the item’s value (instead of being based on the player’s set price).
Click to expand...
 
B

BattleMonkey

Member
The weekly pass prices for access to ops/wzs/fps and such all seem to be cheap, but we of course have no idea how many coins translate into real world dollars.

Subscribers will be getting 500 cartel coins a month it seems, and they mention increased xp gains? Wondering if this means we get xp at normal rate for being a subber or they are just imposing limits on f2p xp gains. Would be nice to get overall extra xp, would make playing through the class stories easier.

UltraMav said:
Haha oh man.
Click to expand...

Yea nickle and dime. F2P players have to buy the ability to unify colors and all kinds of little features are disabled. This isn't going to go over well with folks who were considering coming in for free.

It also seems that they are doing the mass effect system of buying booster packs that get you random assortment of rare items. These items you can get from boosters are not available to buy separate it seems so far.... yea that is awful
 
S

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
Looking over the shop. The prices are not that bad considering we get at least 500 coins a month. Although the wording of "at least" is interesting. How do you get more?

Some of the new armour is pretty sweet looking.

EDIT - Ah good, they were smart enough to allow you to preview the armor, doesn't look like it's there yet though.
 
C

Cystm

Member
I cringe at the thought of those F2play meetings with an EA head just saying "we're going to need to charge for that." Over and over.
 
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