Settings from the tv or the console?
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PS4 PRO: for best IQ (Native 4k + HDR + 60 HZ + 4:4:4) 2160p-YUV420 or 2160p-RGB?
- Thread starter PLASTICA-MAN
- Start date
TV. You said the console settings already. There is no additional settings in terms of motion resolution, etc.
Sorry if this was covered already but at 25+ pages, I can't go read everything.
Here's what I think I know about PS4 Pro on a KS8000(USA) 60"
PS4 Pro settings:
RGB: the best choice, but does not work with HDR 4k due to bandwidth limitation.
4:2:0 will work with HDR, but is lossy.
Auto: PS4 uses 4:2:2(less lossy) for HDR games, RGB for non-HDR.
Auto is best, at least on a KS8000.
Here's what I think I know about PS4 Pro on a KS8000(USA) 60"
PS4 Pro settings:
RGB: the best choice, but does not work with HDR 4k due to bandwidth limitation.
4:2:0 will work with HDR, but is lossy.
Auto: PS4 uses 4:2:2(less lossy) for HDR games, RGB for non-HDR.
Auto is best, at least on a KS8000.
Venuspower
Member
I recently saw a video of a german magazin in which they said that PS4 PRO wasn't able to run 4K+HDR or 4K+RGB.
The problem was not their HDMI cable. Even the ports were fine. The problem was their cable which connected their Samsung TV display with the one connect box.
After contacting Samsung they received a new one (the old cable simply was not able to handle 4K+HDR etc.).
The problem was not their HDMI cable. Even the ports were fine. The problem was their cable which connected their Samsung TV display with the one connect box.
After contacting Samsung they received a new one (the old cable simply was not able to handle 4K+HDR etc.).
Do you have a video link? I would love to see this.
Venuspower
Member
Found the video.
But after rewatching it I found out that I talked bullshit.
Misunderstand a part in the video.
To make it correct:
- They hat a wrong one-connect-box-cable with their TV
- And with that cable they were not able to run HDR in general. Also RGB without HDRwasn't working.
- After they got the new cable they were able to tun 4K HDR with YUV420 or 4K+RGB without HDR.
Sorry for the confusion
€: Fixed my first post. But maybe some other people will have the same problem. Could still help someone ^__^
Audioboxer
Member
Found the video.
But after rewatching it I found out that I talked bullshit.
Misunderstand a part in the video.
To make it correct:
- They hat a wrong one-connect-box-cable in their TV
- And with that cable they were not able to run HDR in general. Also RGB without HDRwasn't working.
- After they got the new cable they were able to tun 4K HDR with YUV420 or 4K+RGB without HDR.
Sorry for the confusion
Ain't no one getting past III-Vs crazy knowledge in this topic
But yeah the new HDMI 2.1 looks like it might bring about 4K HDR RGB. Gotta love technology. Bet all those passthrough sound systems you all have will need upgrading AGAIN
(sound system is what bit me this round, as it does 4K passthrough but not HDR).Most people don't upgrade their TVs every year or two, and I hope we'll never get that bad. All I wanted was cost effective OLED, but I'll probably now also be waiting even longer for the updated HDMI spec AND OLED. Near enough 0 point in getting a new TV till HDMI 2.1.
Found the video.
But after rewatching it I found out that I talked bullshit.
Misunderstand a part in the video.
To make it correct:
- They hat a wrong one-connect-box-cable in their TV
- And with that cable they were not able to run HDR in general. Also RGB without HDRwasn't working.
- After they got the new cable they were able to tun 4K HDR with YUV420 or 4K+RGB without HDR.
Sorry for the confusion
No problem. I think 4K + RGB 444 + HDR is currently over the bw specifications of HDMI 2.0b. Of course, the Pro can theoretically output it, but it won't due to this limitation.
10-bit YUV420 limited is currently the UHDBD specification for SDR, and this is what they use with HDR as well, so it should be compatible with all 4K + HDR sets.
The Pro outputs the RGB 444 at 8-bits, and YUV420 and YUV422 at 12 or 10 bits. Some sets won't dither the +2 bits properly, and some will. It all depends on your set and also the EDID handshake result between your set and the Pro.
Ain't no one getting past III-Vs crazy knowledge in this topic
But yeah the new HDMI 2.1 looks like it might bring about 4K HDR RGB. Gotta love technology. Bet all those passthrough sound systems you all have will need upgrading AGAIN
Most people don't upgrade their TVs every year or two, and I hope we'll never get that bad. All I wanted was cost effective OLED, but I'll probably now also be waiting even longer for the updated HDMI spec AND OLED. Near enough 0 point in getting a new TV till HDMI 2.1.
I was hoping it was real lol.
Yea, I think HDMI 2.1 for certainly has plenty of bandwidth for 4K RGB 444 with HDR! Hoping we see HDMI 2.1 native sets some time in 2018.
Audioboxer
Member
Is that how far out it is looking to be? Man, knowing your tech stuff right now is a blessing. I mean there's much enjoyment to be had in going native 4K right now and enjoying the pro, but this new HDMI spec looks like what is really needed for 4K to be "worth it" overall. Well, maybe slight hyperbole, but when you look at the spec changes over the past years it really has been a WIP.
In saying all of that I really think mass-cost effective OLED is really the next dream to shoot for over a refined HDMI spec. The sooner we can finally move on from LCD the better. I'm thankful more mobile manufacturers are finally doing what Samsung have done for years. LCD on a screen inches from your face is just horrendous. Lightbleed/clouding/etc is the bane of my tech life.
Spending near 1,000 if not more on an LCD TV and having lightbleed is just sad in 2016/2017. Same goes for a PC monitor. Or a tablet, or any reasonably sized LCD screen. Even iPads still suffer from it. It's a blight on the LCD technology.
I don't have any insider knowledge, this is just my guess based on a few things. HDMI 2.1 was just announced, None of the 2107 models showcased at CES2017 were said to be compatible, and no major announcements were made regarding the possibility of a FW upgrade. That being said, I do expect that we will see some limited compatibility to HDMI 2.1 before we see any 'native' HDMI 2.1 spec connectors coming out. We will likely see the 48G cables before we see a native connector on a TV.
There was a time Samsung said that they could FW update to the upcoming HDMI 2.1, but then the talk fell silent. I think they were expecting a small bump (maybe that was planned at the time) and instead we see a huge leap in capabilities.
hehe.. OLEDs, OLEDs everywhere..
I agree its pretty lame, they are recycling some old tech that we have already seen better than, and feeding it back to us with improvements in other areas like HDR - which is still in its infancy, at least until 2018 - maybe 2019.
Audioboxer
Member
I know that is partly to try and always be pretty price aggressive on TVs. It's a tough industry, Sony knows that.
However it is a bit of a shame to see Plasma shunted as badly as it was. Sure your electrical bills were a tiny bit higher, and Plasma didn't get to "omg no borders!", but the PQ was largely superior AND at a very good cost.
Loved my GT50, but I ended up opting to creep up to 55" and finally get 4K. 4K has been a complete waste of time till the Pro came about, and even then it's more of a 2K console from Sony
I gave my GT50 to my parents and I still get a bit envious whenever I see it on lol. RIP Plasma. OLED will be king now, but it's still a tad pricey for me and I really am more of a TV upgrade 4~5+ years kind of guy.But when i change the settings on the ps pro to 1080p the settings on the tv remains the same, or does the tv doesnt apply effects when the pro is doing 4k?
Not necessarily, but its possible, thats why I was asking for all settings.
The reason I say this is because:
1.) that is a native 1080p Game - no pro patch
2.) the upscaler in the Pro is above average
3.) the upscaler in the Samsung is average
so it is not clear why the Samsung would do a better job upscaling the content to 4K.
I have a Sony 55xd930 and I'm trying out a few games like last guardian and the witness. But my tv isn't kicking into HDR video mode even though the PS pro is set for HDR and the witness is set to HDR on so I guess it's detecting HDR compatibility.
I have auto picture mode switched off, because if I switch it on, it just engages game mode with PS4 which I don't particularly want (still doesn't kick in HDR mode anyway)
Edit: just tried with Xbox one S too - both with forza horizon 3 and 4k bluray (the Martian). Even in auto mode it's not kicking into HDR, but if I manually switch to HDR it is fine
I have auto picture mode switched off, because if I switch it on, it just engages game mode with PS4 which I don't particularly want (still doesn't kick in HDR mode anyway)
Edit: just tried with Xbox one S too - both with forza horizon 3 and 4k bluray (the Martian). Even in auto mode it's not kicking into HDR, but if I manually switch to HDR it is fine
That's odd, I thought Highdefjeff said auto/auto worked on the 900 series.
Reset the tv and it seems ok
PLASTICA-MAN
Member
Do you know if this cable can work on PS4 PRO with full 4K + 60 FPS + HDR + Chroma etc?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00JUS6W8W/?tag=neogaf0e-20
It was released in 2015.
It doesn't have PREMIUM written on the box but does say: http://imgur.com/a/UBiaV
- Color depth : 48 bit
- 4k@50/60Hz
- Transfer rate : 18 Gbps
Does it meet the standards to allow full PS4 PRO experience with everything from native 4K + 60 FPS + HDr for games like NBA 2K17 for example?
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00JUS6W8W/?tag=neogaf0e-20
It was released in 2015.
It doesn't have PREMIUM written on the box but does say: http://imgur.com/a/UBiaV
- Color depth : 48 bit
- 4k@50/60Hz
- Transfer rate : 18 Gbps
Does it meet the standards to allow full PS4 PRO experience with everything from native 4K + 60 FPS + HDr for games like NBA 2K17 for example?
Boss Man
Member
I use YUV because auto or RGB will always eventually cause my screen to randomly flash black. Apparently it's a pretty common problem and I'm really turned off of Sony at this point because of how long it's gone unfixed. I have a KS8000 and including the cable the PS4 Pro shipped with I have tried three (premium).
Kawika
Member
At this point it is Sony's fault. The fact that they are saying nothing is really, really annoying.
Anyone able to help me as I am pulling my hair out trying to figure this out.
So I have a Samsung JU6740 UK model.
My pro is connected to it and every setting is on auto, including the black level on tv.
I have just started playing last guardian in 4K HDR and the game is incredibly dull looking on HDR mode and I also have colour banding.
I have tried everything and makes no difference. If I turn off HDR I get no banding and colour back to normal.
Thanks in advance
So I have a Samsung JU6740 UK model.
My pro is connected to it and every setting is on auto, including the black level on tv.
I have just started playing last guardian in 4K HDR and the game is incredibly dull looking on HDR mode and I also have colour banding.
I have tried everything and makes no difference. If I turn off HDR I get no banding and colour back to normal.
Thanks in advance
I posted this in the Horizon Zero Dawn OT, but those people are more interested in talking about the game!
"I have a question about the video output settings for this game. I have a Pro, am using the 'favor resolution' graphics mode with a LG B6. All the video output settings on the Pro are set to automatic. So, there is often banding in the sky or by light sources -- it's not super noticeable, but does anyone else see this? When I set the Pro's video output mode to '2160p - YUV420', the banding is gone. Is the Pro's automatic setting not working correctly? HDR game mode is working just fine."
So from what I've read in this thread and elsewhere, the Pro doesn't always do the right thing on automatic, and that's likely causing the banding? So, I should set it to YUV420 and limited color? And leave it like that all the time? Or just for HDR games? I haven't noticed any banding when watching HDR shows on Amazon or Netflix.
It's annoying how picky and complicated this stuff is and how much conflicting information is out there.
"I have a question about the video output settings for this game. I have a Pro, am using the 'favor resolution' graphics mode with a LG B6. All the video output settings on the Pro are set to automatic. So, there is often banding in the sky or by light sources -- it's not super noticeable, but does anyone else see this? When I set the Pro's video output mode to '2160p - YUV420', the banding is gone. Is the Pro's automatic setting not working correctly? HDR game mode is working just fine."
So from what I've read in this thread and elsewhere, the Pro doesn't always do the right thing on automatic, and that's likely causing the banding? So, I should set it to YUV420 and limited color? And leave it like that all the time? Or just for HDR games? I haven't noticed any banding when watching HDR shows on Amazon or Netflix.
It's annoying how picky and complicated this stuff is and how much conflicting information is out there.
holygeesus
Banned
How does it look when you set it to 2160p RGB instead of Auto? As far as I'm aware, RGB is the correct setting for the B6.
Edit - the last post on this thread sums it up as well as any
http://community.eu.playstation.com...0p-yuv420/td-p/24681433/page/2#thread-replies
So with it set to RGB you are getting 4:2:2 in HDR mode as opposed to 4:2:0 if you set it to YUV420
You shouldn't be seeing banding in SDR with RGB so I suspect the auto setting is borked for the B6.
Switching from auto to 2160 RGB has no effect, so I think that's the mode that auto is using. Switching to YUV420 makes the picture blink off and then when it's back, no banding. I forgot to mention that the PS4 home screen also bands along the color gradient while Horizon is running and the TV is in HDR game mode. But after I quit the game or switch to YUV420 while the TV is in HDR game mode, no banding anywhere.
The picture looks similar to me in RGB vs YUV420, just that RGB/auto has banding. It's very mild tbh. Black level is correct in both.
I've never seen any indication of this YUV-422 mode the post you linked to talks about. It must only be enabled for certain content? Or not exposed to the end user?
holygeesus
Banned
If you try a game with HDR mode, press the PS button on the controller, go to video settings, then video output. You will see it says 4:2:2 when the resolution is set to 2160p RGB. If you set it to 2160p YUV420 and do the same, it will say 4:2:0. You would always choose RGB for non-HDR material as it is uncompressed, so I have no idea why you are seeing banding with it selected.
Nikana
Go Go Neo Rangers!
I too noticed the banding on Horizon on my B6
After many attempts to correct it the only thing I've been able to figure out is that my receiver is somehow causing an issue if 2160p RGB is selected. ( I ran a cable straight from the PS4 Pro to the TV in an attempt to rule out the receiver, but the image does not have banding if I run straight to the TV in RGB 2160p mode.)
If I select yuv 2160p then the banding definitely goes away it's a night-and-day difference in terms of banding.
On my Yamaha receiver it didn't support 10bit out of the box I had to enable it in the receivers advanced settings or 8 bit was the only setting available.
@holygeesus -- yep, I see 4:2:2 when it's in RGB mode, but there's banding. It says 4:2:0 for YUV420, and there is no banding.
Interesting comments about the receivers -- I'm using a Denon. The PS4 is connected to that, and the Denon outputs the video signal to the TV. It's info says the PS4's signal is 4K:60Hz, Bt.2020 YCbCr, and 12 bit color depth when the PS4 is set to YUV420. When the PS4 is on auto/RGB, the Denon says the same stuff except there's no information for pixel depth.
Is that normal, or is it possibly a cause of the color banding when using RGB mode on the PS4??
Interesting comments about the receivers -- I'm using a Denon. The PS4 is connected to that, and the Denon outputs the video signal to the TV. It's info says the PS4's signal is 4K:60Hz, Bt.2020 YCbCr, and 12 bit color depth when the PS4 is set to YUV420. When the PS4 is on auto/RGB, the Denon says the same stuff except there's no information for pixel depth.
Is that normal, or is it possibly a cause of the color banding when using RGB mode on the PS4??
holygeesus
Banned
Very strange. It does seem like your amp is playing some part here though. I just connect my PS4 Pro direct to the TV and use the optical out of the B6 as I don't have an amp with fancy audio yet. Have you tried connecting direct to see if the banding goes? If you are happy enough with 4:2:0 though it's not that big a deal, but I'd actually expect less banding on 4:2:2 which is why it is such a mystery.
mitchman
Gold Member
Probably bs, you need 10-bit as a minimum for HDR.
dr_rus
Member
BS. HDR10 is 10 bit hence it's HDR10. Anything less (or more) would be out of spec.
In my tests, where I use my AVR to determine bit depth and chroma:
There is not a difference between the pro and standard PS4 HDR implementation.
Oddly enough, the PS4 or Pro will output HDR in 10, or 12 bit depending upon your settings and EDID settings. Additionally, the chroma may vary between 422, and 420, depending on game and EDID handshake results.
HDR, by itself, is not a specification. HDR10 is a loose spec.
Contrary to popular wisdom, you can force 8-bit with HDR, it does not occur with auto, but it can be implemented with certain settings (force 1080p & Full RGB - it will be 8 bit.).
LyleLanley
Banned
Just got my pro, if I have a 4K HDR TV should I set it to YUV420 or Automatic?
DJ Lushious
Member
Different GAFfers will tell you different things, but I say "Automatic." Let the handshake between your Pro and your HDTV dictate the setting.
Audioboxer
Member
Automatic, no need to force settings unless for troubleshooting. If you have your TV settings setup correctly, automatic on the Pro will do whatever your TV is capable of.
OmegaNemesis28
Neo Member
I have a KS8000. Im using the included HDMI with the Pro connected directly to my one connect box.
I have RGB Full selected in output. I follow the settings from Rtings.com except I'm in Game mode.
I have this Resident Evil 7 theme that has a bright red background. With the backlight cranked to 20, this menu blows your eyes out with red. It's so bright and cool looking.
When you launch an HDR game like Horizon, the output switches to YUV22. TV says it's running HDR video. When I minimize the game with the home button. The same background is washed out and fill looking. The red doesn't pop. Maybe it's because the background isn't HDR? But it's just not bright even though my settings are all the same on the TV. I feel like the game suffers from the same issue. I can't figure it out. Turning HDR off ingame, then going into the home menu, makes the issue go away and it says it's in RGB again. RGB in game makes it look kind of over Saturated but nice and bright. HDR YUV22 looks kind of greyish and less bright. I thought it's supposed to be the opposite.
I can't take pictures either because it doesn't show a difference, but that maybe makes me think HDR is actually working. But I can't tell if I like it dull like that.
Oh and I can't tell if Netflix is doing HDR right either. Like the TV never says HDR video is playing like when it goes in game. It does say UHD on the input selection though. I do have Netflix 4k and it does stream it but I can't tell about HDR
I have RGB Full selected in output. I follow the settings from Rtings.com except I'm in Game mode.
I have this Resident Evil 7 theme that has a bright red background. With the backlight cranked to 20, this menu blows your eyes out with red. It's so bright and cool looking.
When you launch an HDR game like Horizon, the output switches to YUV22. TV says it's running HDR video. When I minimize the game with the home button. The same background is washed out and fill looking. The red doesn't pop. Maybe it's because the background isn't HDR? But it's just not bright even though my settings are all the same on the TV. I feel like the game suffers from the same issue. I can't figure it out. Turning HDR off ingame, then going into the home menu, makes the issue go away and it says it's in RGB again. RGB in game makes it look kind of over Saturated but nice and bright. HDR YUV22 looks kind of greyish and less bright. I thought it's supposed to be the opposite.
I can't take pictures either because it doesn't show a difference, but that maybe makes me think HDR is actually working. But I can't tell if I like it dull like that.
Oh and I can't tell if Netflix is doing HDR right either. Like the TV never says HDR video is playing like when it goes in game. It does say UHD on the input selection though. I do have Netflix 4k and it does stream it but I can't tell about HDR
Thats right, your PS4 back ground and home screen are not in HDR, they are SDR only, however the TV is still receiving HDR metadata telling it otherwise. It is kind of a bug/oversight.
Use HDR in-game only and adjust the provided sliders as it is directed. It should not look washed out if properly set up.
Netflix app on the Pro does not have HDR. Neither does the Youtube app.
Use the apps on your TV operating system.
OmegaNemesis28
Neo Member
That's what I thought. But even if I use the included PS4 backgrounds like the bubbles/sparkles, I thought those were HDR. Is that not true?
If I turn dynamic contrast to high, it gets the color looking closer to non HDR mode in the menu. But it's really hard to tell if that's not correct or oversaturation.
That I just discovered and have been trying to compare. I just can't quite make out differences. I can never tell what's HDR or not.
None of the PS4 back grounds are HDR, as everything would need to be, or you get incorrect colors and white balance. A few months ago, I asked M0dus if it was even something they could submit as a custom wallpaper. The answer was no.
In terms of getting the correct color, white balance and sharpness, I would use a set-up disc, with all 'dynamic' features turned off.
HDR should add brightness to specular highlights - the sun, the glint of light off of metal, the color of a sequined dress. Everyday scenes, looking at a piece of toast on a white plate, should basically look identical in HDR or SDR.
The average picture level (scene brightness) should be the same.
sorry for the bump but I'm just curious about something.
is the difference between YUV and RGB noticeable? my TV only supports YUV420 at 4K and it's definitely a noticeable upgrade in clarity but compressing color information at such a high res maybe seems less than ideal?
idk, if it's not a huge deal I'll just stop worrying about it I guess.
is the difference between YUV and RGB noticeable? my TV only supports YUV420 at 4K and it's definitely a noticeable upgrade in clarity but compressing color information at such a high res maybe seems less than ideal?
idk, if it's not a huge deal I'll just stop worrying about it I guess.
Piku_Ringo
Banned
So is the video settings info supposed to say 2k/4k supported on a Vizio M50-D1
Not a huge deal. RGB is most important for text on computer monitors and content. Some sources, like movies, you would never know the difference anyway. Games may take advantage of RGB, but for colors and images it is not noticeable unless you are pixel counting.
Duchess O'Death
Member
My friend has the Samsung F9000 but the Pro doesn't give 2160p options. Isn't that a 4K TV?
Make sure UHD color is enabled, and you are using the correct HDMI input. They may not all support 4k/60 Hz is the issue.
The F9000 also didnt come with HDMI 2.0 ports out of the gate, and there's a lot of stuff around the One Connect / Evolution boxes that may help.
Duchess O'Death
Member
I guess it needs the upgrade to support 4k/60. Thank you. PS4 Pro only sends a 60hz signal even for 30fps games.
DJ Lushious
Member
Youre likely to get two different answers
P), but I am firmly in the Automatic camp. The reasoning is let the TV tell the connected device what its capable of during the HDMI handshake.It depends. If you have a Sony, you should be ok with other auto. If you have a Samsung, the video level always gets borked. Not sure about other sets. On my Sony 43X800D all auto gets me the best result every time.