Rocket Number 22
Member
Very cute that you went digging for that but left out all the explanations to me how it was wrong and my explanations that it wasnt meant that way huh?
I was called out via pm several times and made peace via there..
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Why did GAF have such militant sub-communities develop?
- Thread starter MontyBrown
- Start date
I was called out via pm several times and made peace via there..
https://www.neogaf.com/threads/what-are-your-political-leanings.1457755/page-23
As for this, yea, I admit it's a bad assumption to make, just rubs me the wrong way
TheGraykid
Member
Freedom of speech is not freedom from judgement. If you have a stupid or hurtful idea, I will call it out as such. If your opinion is aggressive or hostile, I feel like it's okay to respond back in the same way. I'm not even talking about tone, I'm talking about the concept a person is putting forward.
Yes, in a literal sense.
OrionFalls
Member
Are you suggesting that the trans community aren’t victims?
HoodWinked
Member
it was probably the moderation that contributed to it. if someone ever challenged or gave an opposing opinion they'd be targeted for ban while one group would be able to keep pushing the envelope without any kind of repercussions.
basically a perfect feedback loop.
basically a perfect feedback loop.
SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
it wasn't even the trans community that was the problem.
It was the left wing nut jobs and feminazis who had to be offended on behalf of people who they think should of been offended but weren't.
The amount of times they would randomly pull a racism or sexist card when it had nothing to do with the subject and then get full mod support afterwards was a joke.
Relativ9
Member
"Playing the victim card" doesn't mean that you can't be a legitimate victim, it means that you're exploiting your "victim-hood" to get extra points. So that instead of letting your arguments stand on their own, you're now propping them up by identity politics and playing on the fears and genuine concern people have for your fragility and vulnerability as a victim. Someone is less likely to disagree with you if they think you're in a fragile emotional state from being victimized.
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WinterIsComing
Member
Thanks for the explanation EL.
As for the quoted part, i've followed the debacle at a distance, and it was never about the allegation. It seemed to be a business opportunity, and the allegation was only the catalyst.
Vicetrailia
Member
It was about the allegation (critical event), and the post deletions to control the narrative that pissed everyone off (unsatisfied customers), and then the silence (impatient customers), and the downtime (big opportunity). Things move lightning fast on the internet. Now a lot of that stuff isn't even remembered anymore.
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MontyBrown
Banned
I'm not going to spend the hours finding users being dogpiled on for reasonable opinions and then banned, but a huge amount of people will remember them.
The only other community which comes close to trans-gaf for being militant was the BCT.
I am not scared of my own blood nor do I am scared of gay people. Again I will treat them like everyone else. However I just can not look at it when two men kiss. I do not think they are disgusting or less worth nor would I ever tell them to go elsewhere etc. I just look the other way.
I agree with this part. But what we have these days is not only judgement it is a true lynching of people. Doxing them, trying to contact their workplace because they went on a march you do not agree with, wearing a stupid Trump hat etc. Judgement should always be done on a appropriate level IMO.
RafterXL
Member
He got the terminology right, just aimed it at the wrong group. It was a couple dozen poster and mods, some of which happened to be trans, that basically lived on playing victims, yelling about moral superiority, ban baiting, and basically making OT, and in latwr years gaming, a nightmare to participate in.
Unhinged is putting how these people acted mildly, and they've proven it all over again on the new site. Some of the worst GAF offenders are now some of the worst ERA mods.
TheGraykid
Member
I agree with the idea of appropriate levels of judgement. I just think we may disagree on what "appropriate" means. If you harass people online then I have no problems with you being doxed. If you walk in a march wearing Nazi outfits, I see that as harassment, those clothes are the declaration of an intention to do harm. Therefore, I have no problem with people contacting your workplace for that. I wouldn't see that as a "lynching". I think it's rare that I personally see an overreach in that judgement.
I disagree somewhat, you being a part of a group should count towards your arguments. In the same way, if I'm a marine biologist, that should count towards my arguments about sharks. I can't really say I've ever really seen someone play up their fragility and vulnerability in order to shut down an argument.
I'm new be nice
Member
I actually understand this.
I have a really good friend, we go back about 15 years, I had just come out at that time, and it was very different to come out 15 years ago.
Me and this guy have a very typical male-like friendship, we drink, talk about stuff, play video games. I would describe my friendship with him to be like the kinds of friends I had before I came out.
He's always been extremely supportive to me, in ways that kind of bring a tear to my eye, and it makes me appreciate him all the more when I think about it from his perspective, because I know and can tell that there are aspects of it that are a little hard for him. I try to be conscious of that, and I think he too appreciates that in the same way.
Not everybody is like that, some people can stomach it more than others, but I've always had a double sense of pride towards the ones who can get past their uneasiness towards it and make it work for all of us together.
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Caipirinha
Member
It wasn't that any one particular group of people were militant it's that GAF represented more or less middle class, fairly well educated 18-35 year olds in western countries, mostly America.
Middle class, fairly well educated 18-35 year olds in western countries, especially Americans, are a group of people with generally a well meaning outlook on the world and how society should be but very little understanding of where the flaws in society originate and absolutely no desire to challenge the one crucial flaw that gives rise to the things they hate most, economics, because economics is the one area in which they're doing more or less fine thank you very much.
The people recruited to the alt (far) right and Trump support are for the most part working class Americans who have been totally left behind economically and the media and establishment has 1) done everything in their power to prevent them from targeting the actual cause for their misery, the economic system of the developed world and 2) instead tried to deflect all anger towards what the establishment considers soft issues like identity politics.
The alt right and Trump are morally abhorrent but the middle class centre-left types that are common on GAF react by labelling their supporters as subhumans that were born without the mental capacity to not be racist and transphobic only pushes more and more people into the hands of the alt right, and furthermore seem to imagine that if only the world adhered perfectly to their indentity politics damands all the problems of the world will just disappear, as if the recessions and job insecurity and collapsing infrastructure are all because we don't have genderless pronouns on passports etc.
Don't get me wrong, I am all for most of their demands, I have zero issue with genderless pronouns on passports, but these people are playing perfectly into the hands of the far right by patronising working class Americans and expecting them to believe that identity politics is going to stop both parents having to work 2 jobs to put food on the table whilst their kids go to failing schools.
Economic decline puts rage into a society, and that rage has been successfully channeled into a war between two halves of the 99% whilst the 1% carry on happy as ever - that plays out online constantly and can be used to fairly easily understand a lot of current internet culture. The danger is in the long run, the failure of the centre-left to understand the plight of the working class and their pig headed arrogance in labelling them as inherently evil will push them in sufficient numbers to the far right to cause a collapse in the status quo and a return to fascism. Remember, fascism has never needed a political majority to become dominant.
I don't have much hope tbh. This is all happening in the context of about 30 years of depoliticising the population to the point where most people have more or less zero understanding of economics and class relations and the history of class struggle etc. Everything is viewed within a 2-3 month window of scandals and moral outrage whilst the establishment desperately try to keep the neoliberal party going behind the scenes. That will fail before long and the public are totally unprepared for that outcome and will probably make even bigger mistakes than were made in reaction to the Great Depression - which was a time when people were relatively far more economically aware than they are now.
If you are a member of the alt right you have every reason to be pretty cheerful right now. All it takes is one more recession and most the developed world comes off it's economic stabilisers and all of a sudden you have masses of unemployed working and middle class people struggling to make ends meet let alone buy the latest iPhone, and they are going to want someone to blame and they are unlikely to have the patience to listen to anyone explaining that the decline in rate of profit led to the deindustrialization of the west and the financialisation of capitalism blah blah blah when it's much easier to just blame black people and muslims and go postal. All that explaining is what should be happening now, before the fact, when people actually have a chance to develop some kind of understanding of what is going on, but instead we are obsessed with identity politics and royal weddings.
Here's a good example. Here you have an individual with probably more or less zero understanding of what being "left wing" actually entails, paroting alt right nonsense phrases like "feminazi".
It's very easy to point the finger and laugh/condemn, but ask yourself, why does he/she have no understanding of left wing ideology? Why does he seem to primarily associate being left wing with being militant about identity politics?
You have to answer that question if you actually want to have any success in preventing people like him/her from drifting further and further to the right. The answer is that the middle class centre-left have for 30 years abandoned left wing ideology in favour of broadly accepting neoliberal capitalism but attempting to maintain moral superiority over the right through sprinkling identity politics on top and acting like it is the one great social injustice left in the world.
It isn't, exploitation of the poor by the rich DEFINES society and racism/homophobia/transphobia are all secondary symptoms of that. If you don't understand that, you're not left wing, so do us on the left a favour and just admit that you're a "neoliberal capitalist with a passion for identity politics" because that's all you are, and dragging the name of the left through the mud just creates more and more SatansReverences and when society consists of enough SatansReverences then society breaks.
Middle class, fairly well educated 18-35 year olds in western countries, especially Americans, are a group of people with generally a well meaning outlook on the world and how society should be but very little understanding of where the flaws in society originate and absolutely no desire to challenge the one crucial flaw that gives rise to the things they hate most, economics, because economics is the one area in which they're doing more or less fine thank you very much.
The people recruited to the alt (far) right and Trump support are for the most part working class Americans who have been totally left behind economically and the media and establishment has 1) done everything in their power to prevent them from targeting the actual cause for their misery, the economic system of the developed world and 2) instead tried to deflect all anger towards what the establishment considers soft issues like identity politics.
The alt right and Trump are morally abhorrent but the middle class centre-left types that are common on GAF react by labelling their supporters as subhumans that were born without the mental capacity to not be racist and transphobic only pushes more and more people into the hands of the alt right, and furthermore seem to imagine that if only the world adhered perfectly to their indentity politics damands all the problems of the world will just disappear, as if the recessions and job insecurity and collapsing infrastructure are all because we don't have genderless pronouns on passports etc.
Don't get me wrong, I am all for most of their demands, I have zero issue with genderless pronouns on passports, but these people are playing perfectly into the hands of the far right by patronising working class Americans and expecting them to believe that identity politics is going to stop both parents having to work 2 jobs to put food on the table whilst their kids go to failing schools.
Economic decline puts rage into a society, and that rage has been successfully channeled into a war between two halves of the 99% whilst the 1% carry on happy as ever - that plays out online constantly and can be used to fairly easily understand a lot of current internet culture. The danger is in the long run, the failure of the centre-left to understand the plight of the working class and their pig headed arrogance in labelling them as inherently evil will push them in sufficient numbers to the far right to cause a collapse in the status quo and a return to fascism. Remember, fascism has never needed a political majority to become dominant.
I don't have much hope tbh. This is all happening in the context of about 30 years of depoliticising the population to the point where most people have more or less zero understanding of economics and class relations and the history of class struggle etc. Everything is viewed within a 2-3 month window of scandals and moral outrage whilst the establishment desperately try to keep the neoliberal party going behind the scenes. That will fail before long and the public are totally unprepared for that outcome and will probably make even bigger mistakes than were made in reaction to the Great Depression - which was a time when people were relatively far more economically aware than they are now.
If you are a member of the alt right you have every reason to be pretty cheerful right now. All it takes is one more recession and most the developed world comes off it's economic stabilisers and all of a sudden you have masses of unemployed working and middle class people struggling to make ends meet let alone buy the latest iPhone, and they are going to want someone to blame and they are unlikely to have the patience to listen to anyone explaining that the decline in rate of profit led to the deindustrialization of the west and the financialisation of capitalism blah blah blah when it's much easier to just blame black people and muslims and go postal. All that explaining is what should be happening now, before the fact, when people actually have a chance to develop some kind of understanding of what is going on, but instead we are obsessed with identity politics and royal weddings.
Here's a good example. Here you have an individual with probably more or less zero understanding of what being "left wing" actually entails, paroting alt right nonsense phrases like "feminazi".
It's very easy to point the finger and laugh/condemn, but ask yourself, why does he/she have no understanding of left wing ideology? Why does he seem to primarily associate being left wing with being militant about identity politics?
You have to answer that question if you actually want to have any success in preventing people like him/her from drifting further and further to the right. The answer is that the middle class centre-left have for 30 years abandoned left wing ideology in favour of broadly accepting neoliberal capitalism but attempting to maintain moral superiority over the right through sprinkling identity politics on top and acting like it is the one great social injustice left in the world.
It isn't, exploitation of the poor by the rich DEFINES society and racism/homophobia/transphobia are all secondary symptoms of that. If you don't understand that, you're not left wing, so do us on the left a favour and just admit that you're a "neoliberal capitalist with a passion for identity politics" because that's all you are, and dragging the name of the left through the mud just creates more and more SatansReverences and when society consists of enough SatansReverences then society breaks.
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Nintendo Switch
Banned
If liberalism is to thrive again, real liberals that are open to discussion need to dissassociate from the fascist left that thought police people, like many of the old mods on this site did. Liberals need to switch back to when they embraced freedom of expression and freedom of thought. Those values are fundamental to being a liberal. The fascist left is pushing people away from liberalism and is likely the biggest reason for the backlash against PCisms that led to Trumps win.
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Relativ9
Member
So if I (not a marine biologist) were to say that whales are mammals, is that less true that if a marine biologist says the same thing? Of course not, instead what we'd probably agree on is that more authority is leant to the marina biologists argument because he has years of study and presumably professional work to indicate that he'd know what he's talking about, but even then it isn't foolproof and if someone without a doctorate in marine biology could still defeat his argument and we should be open to that.
But there's nothing about a transgendered person that suggests he/she has years of study and experience in sociology, psychology, politics, law, ethics or several other fields that are far more relevant when arguing these things then what is or isn't between someone's legs or what any one individual identifies as.
Caipirinha
Member
First of all, "fascist left" is a total oxymoron, but I take it you mean something like authoritarian left?
The authoritarian left are absolutely nothing like the people you are trying to describe. The authoritarian left would be eg. Stalinists, and would be more liable to summarily execute you than argue with you on a message board, but who would very much have a strong understanding of left wing economics.
You're describing a group of people who are not left at all, they just wear the colours of the left for historical reasons they probably don't even understand themselves. The crux of their belief system is one of ignorance towards economics and obsession with identity politics - that's a worldview completely incompatible with the term "left wing".
Also don't forget that it's not just the middle class liberals who are obsessed with identity politics, identity politics is literally the sole policy of the alt right; it's just different identities they are obsessed with. For a group of people that supposedly despise moral outrage, they seem to be in a perpetual state of moral outrage and "triggered"-ness themselves.
But just as "liberals" need to understand people who drift towards Trump/the alt right, so do people like you need to understand them. They are well meaning people, they are just fully ignorant of why society is disintegrating. It's not that they want the working class to be poor and miserable, it's that they have no answers for the working class as to why that is happening to them because of the same 30 years of media misinformation that you have been subjected to.
At the end of the day, they work for a living and you work for a living, so you're on the same side. The only people that truly profit from the status quo are the ultra rich.
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shpankey
not an idiot
I love hearing stories like this, it gives me such hope for humanity and I love how we can all be human still and understanding and patient for others that are not %100 in their comfort zone on all things all the time.
Ps this last page of discussion is phenomenal.
Blam
Member
I guess I also forgot to mention I mean not even to the same level but I also got slandered/harassed more then I've ever been during that time it was insane the absolute rage some people felt against me. It was really like nothing that had ever happened to me before it was worse then anything I had ever experienced in school so it was a serious eyeopener. Put me in some not so good times. I mean hey if anyone saw the absolute mental breakdown I had around that time then you know what I'm talking about.
I'm just glad it's all behind me, and I guess the same for you as well.
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TheGraykid
Member
Kinda. I feel like your analogy is a bit off. I feel like there is a difference between talking about independently verified and established facts, and theories and/or experiences people may have. Also, I think it's important for the sake of clear and concise conversation and basic sanity that not everyone believes that they should have a seat at the debate table. I should not be debating Astrophysics with Neil deGrasse Tyson (or any other person who is knowledgeable on Astrophysics), that is a waste of time. People with less than basic understandings about what being Trans is, and/or the cultural issues therein shouldn't really be even speaking about this.
This is us questioning how we should treat a group of people. It's more of a cultural issue. Therefore, I think being a trans person gives you firsthand experience on how a group of people are treated, and how that treatment might be better. Also a trans person likely has had an infinite more conversations of trans-related issues than I. Those disciplines you quoted are huge areas, and this is an issue that touches on little bits of every discipline, therefore, unless a person is an expert in transgender-focused law/ethics/politics/etc it's hard for me to believe that they have a better handle on this conversation than a trans person.
Cybrwzrd
Banned
I think many of us have disassociated ourselves with the authoritarian left. The thing is questioning the dogma of identity politics will quickly brand you with a scarlet letter of racism/homophobia/transphobia in some circles. Look at what happened to Brett Weinstein.
Edit: And I will add this, being labeled as a racist/homophobe/transphobe is markedly worse than being an actual racist/homophobe/transphobe currently. You can hold the most vile of beliefs, but if you play nice and don't show your true colors, you can get away with it. Once someone calls you a racist/homophobe/transphobe, you will get a mob of people picking apart every thing you have ever done or written to find "evidence", and it is very hard to defend yourself from those accusations since everyone can be guilty of showing bias at some point in their life.
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SatansReverence
Hipster Princess
I actually couldn't give the slightest of fucks about being "left" or "right" politically. Doesn't change the fact that 99.9% of precious snowflakes who have a meltdown on behalf of people who don't actually care are alt left feminazis with a hilariously warped world view.
Unfortunately now these kind of people can't handle the fact that neogaf is no longer their personal echo chamber or safe place and have to undergo the horrifying experience of interacting with people that can manage to rub more than 2 braincells together, and who are actually capable of thinking for themselves.
You can see for yourself who I'm talking about by looking into the recent swatting death thread and aziz ansari thread
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Relativ9
Member
Everyone should be able to debate anything, good points and valuable input don't come only from those with diplomas. Of course, we're much more likely to pay attention to someone who's proven knowledgeable about any specific subject. But I think that the idea that people with "less than basic understanding" of what being trans or what the cultural issues related to being trans are, shouldn't be participating in the social dialogue; is incredibly dangerous. Not only because the "right" basic understanding can be completely subjective. But also because we know from history (even recent) what happens when people feel like they aren't being heard, and like they're being pushed aside and forgotten. At best they become anti-social, unpredictable and individually dangerous, or they elect someone like Trump. At worst they start the Bolshevik Revolution that leads to the death of millions.
Yeah we're debating what to do about the mistreatment of trans people, sure. But the logic you use means you'd give more "worth" to their words, making them more "true" and therefore protected from critique by anyone not from within their group. So you've got a group of people fighting for their own interests, and only people from within their group are allowed to disagree (though sometimes as we saw on Old Gaf, not even them), but the people within that group now have a vested interest in tacitly agreeing to anything the group-think decides because to go against it risks compromising the group goals. Even though those goals are good, the road to reach them is ripe with problems, and those problems affect everyone in society. But only a small subset of that society are allowed to have an opinion about it? Now that's a privileged class.
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I'd agree with OP. I got the same sense of the old gaf. I had to refrain from saying how ridiculous it was that people under the age of 18 shouldn't be pushed to "choose" their gender when people that young don't have a damn clue on what they really want. I have no problem with trans people but if they try to push that stuff on young people then I have an issue with it.
OrionFalls
Member
There’s children under thirteen who choose to be the opposite gender as to what they were born. They have a clue. You clearly don’t.
Blam
Member
I'm really happy the majority of the toxic of GAF is gone, since now we can have civil conversations and debates, without dumb things either interrupting it or bashing on one side or another. Another thing I'm happy for is that we hopefully will never do what we did pre split, and that was banish discussion of a certain person because people didn't like what they did in the past.
The past few pages of this thread have certainly shown this to be true as before this thread would have been locked way sooner.
The past few pages of this thread have certainly shown this to be true as before this thread would have been locked way sooner.
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AgentP
Thinks mods influence posters politics. Promoted to QAnon Editor.
I think he is concerned about the adults in this case. Let children be children and don't push your politics onto them. The same things that goes for the religious right goes for the liberal left. Don't treat children as blank slates to be programmed based on your beliefs.
TheGraykid
Member
Everyone should be able to discuss anything, however, no one is entitled to be listened to. I think that's the point I'm getting at. It's not just about people wanting to discuss things, it's demanding that other people recognise those discussions as valid. Me reading and discussing Steinbeck for the first time in English Class should not be represented at a high-level academic literature level. You can have whatever conversations you like, however, insisting that those early, barely thought out insights are definitely the truth, instead of realising that this is a deep, complex topic that needs more thought, that's what shits up the conversation. I think it is on a person to examine their arguments substantially before presenting them as truth. I think this, even more, when the conversation is about people's identities, a space where ignorance can be really hurtful. The prize for accepting ignorance at the social conversation table is worse than Trump or the Bolshevik Revolution. In the USA it could be global catastrophe, given the current state of the climate change debate.
I think most complaints trans people would have could boil down to a single sentence. Please stop treating us with open contempt or lesser human beings. I don't know if that issue is one ripe with greater societal problems. Anyone is allowed to have an opinion (and everyone does). However, your identity can be evidence if you are talking about an issue, and I don't think that's elevating a specific group to a privileged class status. You're allowed to think whatever you want, but as I said earlier you also have to be able to convince people to listen, maybe that's via research, or deep intellectual thought or personal experience, those all play into validating someone's argument.
dolabla
Member
Dr
No doubt. This thread would have been axed and OP probably permabanned for this thread if this were several months ago. I'm glad threads like this can exist now even though I disagree (we can all share our disagreement/agreement with the OP) with the OP about it being about one specific community.
There's no way I would touch Era with a 10 foot pole considering the poison of the board all migrated over there. GAF is where it's at now. We'll eventually get there building the community back up.
No doubt. This thread would have been axed and OP probably permabanned for this thread if this were several months ago. I'm glad threads like this can exist now even though I disagree (we can all share our disagreement/agreement with the OP) with the OP about it being about one specific community.
There's no way I would touch Era with a 10 foot pole considering the poison of the board all migrated over there. GAF is where it's at now. We'll eventually get there building the community back up.
See this is were we always will disagree. To me this would be a case for the law not selfjustice and as terrible I think it is when somone marches in these protests. It is still his goddamn right to do so. I can call or better think he is an asshole for this but to actually find out the adress of this person, his/her workplace etc is the ecxtremism I will never understand. Selfjustice is not the way.
Also to be ok with doxxing people jsut because you disagree with his opinions is honestly disgusting. THERE is no good or bad doxxing. Doxxing is doxxing and should be ALWAYS punished by law.
Thanks for this post. I would also totally have a male like friendship with someone who is gay. My old friend back than maybe was gay but never came out but I always supported him and also did not change any way how to interact when I became awre that this maybe was the case. I can not even describe why I cant watch it I just turn away and this only goes for long passionate kisses which in general a kind of arkward in public to me.
Blam
Member
Not just the OP Permabanned, but most if not the majority of the first page would have been temp banned. The community will come with due time.
dolabla
Member
Oh, definitely! As old GAF would say, a graveyard. Lol.
TheGraykid
Member
Actions have consequences. It is your right to march if you would like. However, if you're marching as an excuse to hurl abuse at people and call for a rise of a group of race purists that would like to murder everyone else, then I don't think mentioning that to your employer is that far of a reach. I wouldn't do that, because I'm lazy, but if you would like to do that, it's okay to me.
I never said I was okay with doxxing in the case of disagreeing with someone's opinion. I said it was okay if someone harassed you.
No it is not. We have laws for this. And seljstice is never an answer. Also As I said before. You are not doing anything that is against the law. Therefore you have no actual ground to justify such an action. Infact if you would not do it in anon mode you also could be sued and brought to court for this.
Democracy and freedom of speech also means to hear words you do not agree with. Why can people not act like actual adults in these cases. But instead they are reacting like vile crazy people who want to bring people down you are not agree with....
I will even go further. The ONLY reason to do this is the attempt to destroy this persons life and by doing so all you will get back is even more hostility because now their hate is justified. Silencing people through fear will never work. AGain you could draw comparisions with old gaf in which people were afraid to state their opinion.
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MDSLKTR
Member
Noo the hivemind would say the "hill to die on"
TheGraykid
Member
I think you're underselling what people are doing. This isn't a simple difference of opinion. This is people verbally berating people and threatening to bring back a group that hunted and killed large amounts of people. This isn't a disagreement, it's an attack.
If you're wearing a nazi uniform at a march, then you've already committed to trying to ruin other people's lives. Therefore, if in the end your life gets's ruined that's not a big deal. To me, that's like attempting to punch a person and getting knocked out. This isn't just revenge, this is people protecting themselves.
Consequences for speech makes the world go round. It's the reason that real life conversation isn't a public youtube comment section.
No its more like someone saying Ill punch you but you punch fisrt, knocking out the person before they attempt a punch. which is assault and against the law. Punching after an attempt is self defense and not against the law.
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Nintendo Switch
Banned
I am wondering if perhaps all bans of Gaf users prior to 2018 should be reversed, or at least those that were banned for non hateful posts should be reversed. Far too many posters that wanted to contribute to the conversation were banned unfairly by power hungry mods.
The switch over to a new style of modding is a big step in the right direction but Reversing the bans should also help bring this community back to life.
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TheGraykid
Member
1. Nothing I've said is about the law, I'm simply talking about personal morality. If someone makes it completely clear that they intend to harm you and then begins to do so, then I see no issue with you defending yourself by striking.
No Real life conversation are not a fucking mess because it still has some sanity left. Social media however has mostly loss any form of reasonal debate.
And I will say it again: In a democracy and a free country you have to accept these opinions. The moment they act they are a case for lawinforcement. When you act first in such a vile way you are a case for this lawinforcment. Again I also do not like radical feminists because they are dangerous for our society but I firstly do not attack them, I do not dox them and I do not try to ruin their lifes because I live in a democracy and have to deal with supid opinions and view in an more adult way.
Again as long they do not shout kill all muslims, trans, gays etc. They have the right to do so. Otherwise its hate speach. Being on a Trump march is not such a case. Going against Feminsm and calling it cancer is not such a reason. Calling BLM matter terrorists is not such a reason. And the list goes on and on....
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It's an undertaking, but going back and reviewing bishoptl and besada's bans particularly are on the agenda. We also have 1000 accounts in the approval queue; we're just taking things slow and trying to shape things in a positive direction on a smaller scale first before we bring a lot more folks in. We'll also look into initiatives like giving members in good standing an invite for instant access for a friend etc., lots of other stuff. We have so many options now on the new platform and we will utilize them as best we can.
Thats where your logic doesn't make sense. Marching and talking aren't beginning to do so. actually doing harm or attempting harm would be doing so.
Astral Dog
Member
WOW that was, like incredibly offensive, this whole post , they 'shrug it off 'because they are used to those kind of words, doesn't make it right.
Like, to be a transwoman or men eventually you need to develop a hard shield for these kind of attacks that most straight white men would end up devastated and crying like little children.
Musky_Cheese
Banned
That sounds awesome. Perhaps that should be announced (if it hasn’t already been) in a separate thread and pinned.It's an undertaking, but going back and reviewing bishoptl and besada's bans particularly are on the agenda. We also have 1000 accounts in the approval queue; we're just taking things slow and trying to shape things in a positive direction on a smaller scale first before we bring a lot more folks in. We'll also look into initiatives like giving members in good standing an invite for instant access for a friend etc., lots of other stuff. We have so many options now on the new platform and we will utilize them as best we can.
TheGraykid
Member
None of the groups you mentioned have a historic lineage of raping, murdering and enslaving people. The groups I'm talking about literally have only existed to do those things. If you listen to them when they speak they say in pretty plainspeak that this is what they are trying to achieve, just within todays modern context. Just to make it clear I'm not talking about standard conservatives when I say this.
That depends on your opinion of harm is. As I said verbally berating and intimidating people is harm to me.
First of all I would look up muslims, and the words of rape or enslaving you will find ALOT. Secondly Past should again not matter at least it does not to me. I do not judge people based on their ancenstor. Hey I am German we had a fucking terrible past. And Again I will argue with you over hours with sources, statstics sources how modern feminism is a real danger to our society. same with Islam Also when you go against groups or better criticize groups its fine. The moment you go against indiviual people you will lose any agreement with me.
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Blam
Member
It's an undertaking, but going back and reviewing bishoptl and besada's bans particularly are on the agenda. We also have 1000 accounts in the approval queue; we're just taking things slow and trying to shape things in a positive direction on a smaller scale first before we bring a lot more folks in. We'll also look into initiatives like giving members in good standing an invite for instant access for a friend etc., lots of other stuff. We have so many options now on the new platform and we will utilize them as best we can.
That sounds absolutely awesome.
MilkyJoe
Member
I've been following the subject this week after my missus showed me a tweet where a woman, a lesbian, was hounded and abused and called a terf, a new word to me, because she didn't want to date a trans female with a penis. Her reasoning was that as a lesbian she is only attracted to female genitals. The response was that it's a "female penis", one person even suggested that she's probably using a plastic penis during sex anyway, so it's an added bonus of sorts.
Now to be clear I'm pretty much not interested in current affairs and I hold a strong dislike for social media, so until Monday I had no idea what is going on.
But after reading into it and seeing a man with stubble, wearing a dress, sporting a penis, leading a witch-hunt against a lesbian girl, because she won't let him date her and presumably have sex with her, I'm absolutely shocked and the more shocking element being females joining in the bullying, siding with the woman with the penis against a lesbian girl.
I've quoted you because you have said what these "terfs" are trying to say, putting a dress on does not make you a woman, and most definitely does not give you a right to demand a lesbian sleep with you.
What are your thoughts on this as you seem to be exactly what I presumed a fully transitioned female would be like. I'm not understanding the trans women that are not wanting to change their genitalia, that think a dress and lipstick makes a woman and they can infiltrate female sexuality and demand inclusion.
I'm confused, angered, saddened and perplexed at the same time. And I agree with you, it really does appear to be a phase for many of these people.
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