Aceofspades
Banned
Well, Im not the person to answer that , but I will trust Cerny word on it.
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Well, Im not the person to answer that , but I will trust Cerny word on it.
Fake
Member
Hard to know. Increase the gpu clock for not admit the 9TF don't give us that ideia.
Cerny vs Raindeer.....Fight
Cerny clearly stated that achieving 4TFs by less CUs high clock is better than more CUs low clock
Its hilarious because Microsofts comment last generation that they chose higher clocks over CUs because it was faster.
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Of course he did. He had to come up with an excuse why PS5 has the same number of CU as PS4 Pro. Probably the first time in history a generational leap in console had the same number of CU as the previous console.Cerny vs Raindeer.....Fight
Cerny clearly stated that achieving 4TFs by less CUs high clock is better than more CUs low clock
Now when PS5 Pro comes out in 3 years with 64 CU at 16tf, suddenly CU and TF will matter again,
Now if PS5 was properly designed, you'd have the gpu running at 2.23 ghz at all times like how every other gadget works. Not a gpu running at undisclosed ghz for x amount of time when the cpu is maxing out, and flip flopping with gpu boost mode when the cpu downclocks.
Just have the cpu at 3.5 ghz and gpu at 2.23 ghz at all times like normal.
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TheAmazingSpiderMan
Member
What I read online was it is 1TB but the consumer will only see 825GB of it, I have a 512GB SSD but I don't get that full 512GB space, I only have about 480GBs to play with. I think Sony just stated what will actually be available to consumers. I could be wrong but then again if we do get 825GB as advertised then we would really get much less then that to play with maybe even 650GB.
Hopefully this is cleared in their next presentation.
Aceofspades
Banned
The have that patented double sided cooling. I think they will use that.
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
Still, this is not X tf vs X tf achieved differently, is X vs Y (10 vs 12).Cerny vs Raindeer.....Fight
Cerny clearly stated that achieving 4TFs by less CUs high clock is better than more CUs low clock
For what I understand I don't expect PS5 to be equal, maybe closer than first numbers suggests and better at some things. Really, it comes down to prices and games, at least if they don't change the way they communicate. If Cerny believe this is ok show games performance and call it a day, otherwise in terms of numbers they are clearly beaten, if PS5 has substantial advantages they need to show them.
Otherwise, as I said: price lower and push games.
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Fake
Member
You know mix a quiet, but efficient cooling system for a console is not a easy feet? I expect to be $499, but after those SSD/serious Cooling I'm concerd about the price and could match with seX.
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VanSiriusGabriel
Member
I can't recall an instance where storage space is already subtracted for OS. This is probably the full SSD and according to Cerny it is ideal to the communication with others components.
TheAmazingSpiderMan
Member
If I've learned anything from these spec threads for the last year or so, both here and ResetEra, is that 90% of the people spewing stuff don't know shit about how tech works.
People seem to use PC logic for everything, because this happens on the PC or if u do this on the PC then the results are the same, consoles are a closed system (which all armchair devs should know) and have custom tech/silicon build for each company's needs, the moment some information comes out that defies this PC logic it boggles their mind.
Developers, the ones making the games are saying good things but somehow forum 'armchair devs' know more than them?
Fake
Member
I can't believe I doing this, but I higly recommend you guys to watch the beyond video from yesterday. They're really doing an amazing conversation and strike key points of what go wrong in this presentation.
I still watching, but I'll put a quick summary when I done.
I still watching, but I'll put a quick summary when I done.
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VanSiriusGabriel
Member
It would still be a GPU difference of about 30\40%.
xool
Member
Not sure yet - there's no such thing as a 825GB chip . so that figure will be after the fragmentation structures have used up some memory, just like a 16GB USB drive only has 13GB or whatever .. so it's probably 1TB.
idk about 12 channels but I'd assume it's similar to RAM where 1 channel (or 32bit of bus width) = 1 chip .. so that would be 12 chips/dies . 2019/20 Samsung flash dies are currently around 512Gb = 64GB so 12 of those would be 768GB .. numbers don't quite line up .. so not sure .. we'll know when we see the first board teardowns.
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I've seen many devs act as fanbois. And if not as blantant, at least politically correct as to not upset anyone that feeds them.This is not us "Sony fanboys" it's actual developers.
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Aceofspades
Banned
Cmon man, Its not like Yakuzas had guns on his head if he exceed 36CUs. He had a vision and executed that perfectly. He knew in 2016 that MS will go more than 40 CUs ( Xbox one X had 40CUs! So he simply set a priority based on his budget allocation and ended up with marvelous kit with state of the art SSD and Audio capabilities and only 15% deficiency on GPU on a silicon thats vastly cheaper than XsX. Its a marvelous engineering achievement tbh.
People trying to paint this as Xbox one vs PS4 don't have the slightest idea. Xbox One was simply a system that's badly engineered with way worse GPU , Ram , Rops..etc it didn't have anything for it except a 6% panic overclock for CPU
PS5 vs XsX is nothing like that and you know it. Just look at the numbers and you will realize that.
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M-V2
Member
Fanboys
Media bias
Sony paid for media
Damage control
Devs acting like fanboys...
I mean this is embarrassing of some people to say...
MarkMe2525
Member
Sony themselves said that soon you will be able to buy one from Best Buy and slap it in. How is that disingenuous?
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
He explained that 825 TB are possible because this is a console and they are not selling only the SSD, which in this case would be a strange cut to sell. That, to me, doesn't sound like "it's 1TB" because otherwise there would be nothing different from anything else. This is likely a unique solution from Sony.
MarkMe2525
Member
Didn't Microsoft also add an high speed ssd?
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
I don't believe it's 1TB but promoted as an 825gb (remaining space) SSD.
It's 825gb to begin with so the remaining space is probably going to be 700 gb or so.
Nobody promotes their storage space as as a number of what's leftover after mandatory allotments are used up.
Fake
Member
Petition?
You could put Microsoft and Nintendo in that meme as well, but... somehow...
xool
Member
Sony doesn't make SSD chips - there are limited suppliers and they only make certain sizes - like 512Gb - 12 channels means 12 chips (though they could be different sizes) - nevertheless there is something odd about the maths = you can't get 825GB using obvious arrangements
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
Did you actually saw the conference? Honest question.
devilNprada
Member
No but i was expecting my digital library available day 1
xool
Member
Just can't buy chips that size though. Dunno what the actual answer is..
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
I really, really don't see any point in confusing everyone stating a different number from SeX while the number is actually the same, because it should be 1TB.
Evidently they know better than us what they can do, surprise. Those 825 is probably the full space.
saintjules
Member
Edit: comment didn't come up properly.
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StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Ya. But MS's SSD is only half the speed. PS5 is 5.5gb/s or 8-9 gb/s, SeX is 2.4gb/s or 4.8 gb/s.
So assuming everything else is apples to apples, a PS5 game should load things faster by double.
So in MS's example a few day ago, State of Decay 2 loaded on their new system in about 8 seconds, while Xbox One X was 50 seconds, so a PS5 of similar comparison should be 4 seconds.
The whole issue about streaming game data as you go (like open world textures and such) remains to be seen how much better PS5 can do it vs. SeX even though MS's system is better overall for everything else.
So right now, all we have are loading time comparisons.
Going strictly on that canned State of Decay demo, Series X was faster by about 6x. So despite SeX's SSD being probably 20x+ faster than a normal HDD in Xbox One X, the real speed factor loading it up was really 6x.
It'll be interesting to see what the real world results are when the systems come out because based solely on the claimed SSD speeds, they are probably 20-40x faster than the stock HDDs.
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Mid range SSD which is the correct design choice it allowed them budget left over for 60mm on the apu and 2tf without extreme overclocking.
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
If you mean PS4, me too, kind of. They said months ago that there is a process to go through, so I wasn't expect everything but 100 games top...
Oof.
whoever81
Member
Well I thought about that but I got it from r/PS5. Yup. No reason to hide it anymore. I am a very PS5-oriented individual.
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MarkMe2525
Member
Twice. He believes you will soon be able to go to best buy and buy an SDD that you can insert into your ps5. They will be internally testing them as they release and flagging the ones that meet the requirements.
Fake
Member
Thats why Nintendo ask so much money for absolute no online quality service. People make seletive memes, but all companies are greed. No exceptions.
xool
Member
Either way the numbers don't add up in an obvious way - 12 channels means 12 chips, usually all the same - (you can even see 12 chips in the diagram in the talk) .. 825/12 = 68.75MB - that's not a chip that exists afaik. The same calculation with a 1TB total also doesn't work..
It's a mystery right now.
Right back at ya, I can provide examples if you'd like....about my comment of fanboy devs and or devs sugarcoating things too. I didn't make the other comments but they are pretty accurate if you change "Sony paid for media" to Sony, or Xbox, fanboys in the media. My experience is there are very few .... whoever we are talking about...without a bias for one or the other, though some stronger than others. For example I'm bias obviously towards Microsoft and you, obviously towards Sony. Nothing wrong with that if you can still be objective and truthful. I bought a PS4 years before Xbox one while I was a big halo fan. Initially, Sony had the better hardware and treated customers better this gen at the start. Saying that you don't see bias for both sides...makes me question your truthfulness though. We can still be friends.
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LittleBigGamer
Banned
It was.
This time development is easy.
Ptarmiganx2
Member
I think we are looking at $449 for the PS5 and $479-499 for the xbox.
VanSiriusGabriel
Member
Right.
Yet, they will not be 825 GB SSDs which he considers of the ideal cut for efficiency reasons, and they will not have six canals of priorities but two. How much of a difference is yet to be seen, but saying is the exact same thing seems structurally incorrect to me as to say that a bike and a motorbike are the same thing.
MarkMe2525
Member
I mean yeah Sony has a really fast ssd. That doesn't mean MS ssd is not really fast. Do you believe that sony went to the devs and they said we need 5.5gbs? Devs had very limited transfer rates last gen and said they wanted faster. Both consoles are delivering that in spades. Sony is just going alot further with it.
Do you think it's a good idea to base what xbox is capable of completely off of one "canned state of decay demo". One demo that what was described as a completely unmodified version of the game. Are you sure that's the hill you want to die on?
Burrito Bandito
Banned
This is not us "Sony fanboys" it's actual developers.
you fail to realize that developers are also fanboys, they are humans.
no one, not even MS, was coming up with a million different reasons as to why the xb1 was in fact equal to ps4 in power.
yall sound like misterxmedia
MarkMe2525
Member
There is literally going to be a port to install an ssd that you will be able to buy at best buy. I'm not the one trying to twist things here.
Stuart360
Member
There are probably hundeds of devs drooling over XSX online. Its so silly to hand pick ones. Devs are fanboys too, they are gamers too, why would they not have a favorite side?
Ptarmiganx2
Member
By the time developers get to making games that RT intensive the mid-gen refresh will be out at 18 tf.
Kazekage1981
Member
i get it now.
XsX: Lion
PS5: Cheetah
Both are wild cats
XsX: Lion
PS5: Cheetah
Both are wild cats
MarkMe2525
Member
2.4gbs "sustained" puts you in the top 4 of pc gamers top ssd's that was posted 8 hours ago. That mid range ssd sure does stack up well. They both have fast ssd's. Sony's is even faster. Those statements are not mutually exclusive.
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VanSiriusGabriel
Member
Look, I don't deny that.
Just saying it won't be as effective, it is possible to discuss without this shit accusations if twisting, fanboys and whatnot?
Jesus.
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