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[Firestorm]

Memory card bullshit is almost single-handedly stopping me from buying one and I already have Uncharted pre-ordered -.- I always assumed it would use Memory Stick Pro Duo. I'm not paying those goddamn prices in 2011. Considering the push for digitially distributed games, the price to storage ratio is ridiculous.

Fuck you Sony. I've dealt with your products using different formats from others for years. Now they use different formats than your own goddamn products?

 

[Pie and Beans]

It´s really astonishing how much hate-posts against a Gaf-member are coming from Sonyfanboys in this thread. If there is anything wrong in his OP just say what is wrong, I think pramath is more than willing to correct it if he made any mistakes. But obviously it´s basically just fanboy rage in this thread.

Atleast I learned in this thread that having no 3D at all is a plus...

I am pleased as punch GAF has its user search functions back that I had only read about in legend. An invaluable tool.

 

[Averon]

This thread was doomed to failure from the very start. And it's no surprise with the thread headline and the way the OP is slanted.

 

[Laguna]

I am pleased as punch GAF has its user search functions back that I had only read about in legend. An invaluable tool.

Then keep the childish hate-rage against Gaf-members on instead to try to have a civiliced discussion. Really this whiney behaviour just because someone is pointing out undeniable flaws is pathetic and tells alot about your own mental constitutions.

You have to understand that some people can prefer another system and in the same time like or looking forward to another system. The obvious reason why neither I nor pramath started a similar thread for 3DS is because this kind of 3DS threads are posted on a regular basis by other members here on GAF.

 

[Paracelsus]

The flaws are legit but only the memory card and region-lock-through-one-account-per-console fiascos are possible dealbreakers, rest is nothing but grasping at straws.

 

[Djin1979]

One big flaw : Lack of support from western studios (so far).

One small flaw : No gorilla glass.


I don't really care about the cited flaws in the op, still a day one purchase.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

The flaws are legit but only the memory card and region-lock-through-one-account-per-console fiascos are possible dealbreakers, rest is nothing but grasping at straws.

Both of those situations suck pretty bad, but if the discounted digital purchases thing is true, I think the higher cost of memory cards is easier to swallow, and the region-locking makes sense. If each region of SCE is free to discount the digital purchase as much as they want, I can understand why they want to lock it up. Still sucks really hard for importers on both sides.

 

[AwRy108]

>Battery Life: I rarely play for longer than 2 or 3 hours with my portable consoles and I very rarely play outside. I also treat my batteries with care so I haven't had one dying on me yet.

>Entry Price: It's a good price for what it is and it will go down, this isn't a flaw.

>No on board memory: I agree on this one, they should have included 512MB or something like that. I don't think it will impact much our daily gaming but it's silly not to have it.

>Memory Cards are a requirement for many games, games won't even start without Memory Cards: Who wasn't going to buy a 4GB card for $25? Who would use their Vita without one? The real flaw is not having on board memory, memory cards themselves are fine.

>No TV output: Not a flaw, just a design choice. I doubt even 2% of users would use it.

>Backwards Compatibiltiy is a mess: No, using UMDs would have been a mess. Ditching UMD and using cartridges is much much much better. I have a PSP for my PSP UMDs. You sometimes gotta choose between BC and a better new machine. It's like if PS4 had PS3 BC at the cost of being 50% slower than other solutions. No thanks.

>Only one account per system: Only one account at the same time. If you need japanese games and use DD so much you'll need more than one memory card anyway, just swap them and bam there you go. You don't even need to have more than one, it's just for the convenience. If changing WiFi, theme and wallpaper settings is so terrible for you then yeah, you're fucked. I guess you prefer not having the option of accessing other regions at all.

>You can't use the browser while playing games: It would be cool to have it but it will eventually come, I'm pretty sure. Almost every time I'd rather use my PC to browse anyway.

>PSOne Classic Games Won't Be Available At Launch: Same as UMDs, I already have 2 consoles where I can play PSOne Classics, if they matter so much to me. I wouldn't buy a $250 machine to play PSOne Classics, too.

>You Can't Manage Your Vita With A Mac: I don't have a Mac.


There, not so doomy and gloomy now.

Thread should've been closed after this response. Just having a powerful, dual-analog gaming handheld with incredible PSN intergration for $250 was enough for me; all the other features are just extra bonus toppings on an already delicious ice cream sundae...

I own a 3DS, and, sadly, I can assure you that a list of hardware "cons" for it would be much larger than a list of "pros".

 

[Jinfash]

What's the point of this thread? I could do this for any system out there.

The point is, the PS Vita has a lot of flaws. There are a lot of things it is doing wrong. It is only fair to call it out for doing so, especially when people are so quick to jump on Nintendo for making the same, or similar, mistakes.

So basically: "why no people rage more."

 

[Gustav]

So basically: "why no people rage more."

Ah, I see. OP feels Nintendo was treated unfairly.

 

[Pie and Beans]

Then keep the childish hate-rage against Gaf-members on instead to try to have a civiliced discussion. Really this whiney behaviour just because someone is pointing out undeniable flaws is pathetic and tells alot about your own mental constitutions.

You have to understand that some people can prefer another system and in the same time like or looking forward to another system. The obvious reason why neither I nor pramath started a similar thread for 3DS is because this kind of 3DS threads are posted on a regular basis by other members here on GAF.

I don't hate anyone, buddy. This is a gaming discussion messageboard, it'd be pretty childish to straight up hate someone for their brand loyalty leanings, just as its childish to think Nintendo needs to be given fair representation to balance all those mean anti-3DS topics and grasp at straws to do so.

I'll never ignore anyone on these boards as thats always seemed pointless, but if ever there was another GAF revision or some kind of add-on, it'd be great to be able to plop an company logo icon next to certain posters so one doesn't have to carry it all around in our head and remember who speaks in which uniform.

 

[Plinko]

OP is on some serious preemptive damage control. 3DS' failures must sting bad.

Not sure what you're definition of failure is, but 3DS is already ahead of the pace set by DS. This thing is already a success and the holidays are coming with reports of sellouts.

On topic, I'm puzzled as to why many respond with something like, "well, it's not a problem for ME therefore OP is wrong." It's great that some of you are willing to pay outrageous prices for memory in 2012 but that doesn't mean it's not an issue.

I've still got my preorder in case the PS3 remote play rumors are true.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Memory cards themselves are fine indeed, but the real flaw is using proprietary memory cards and not MicroSD/M2.

I would like for this new memory format to be opened like the Memory Stick format is, but the problem is indeed not having on board high speed flash storage you can install games into.
Memory card are not just going to be used for save data and other less bandwidth sensitive data. You will install full PSN games on it which cannot afford to load slower from memory cards than from retail game cards.

Using regular SD cards for this might not supply, in theory, the necessary data speed and it's up to the user to purchase the right kind of cards for the game not to suddenly have weird streaming or loading issues for example.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Ah, I see. OP feels Nintendo was treated unfairly.

They should have been, and they've managed to make things shape up really nicely for the 3DS. This is why I hate any new hardware launch; people act like there's some expectation for 100% perfection right out the gate. New hardware is never perfect, especially now when there are so many more variables that come and go throughout a console's life cycle.

 

[Plinko]

Thread should've been closed after this response. Just having a powerful, dual-analog gaming handheld with incredible PSN intergration for $250 was enough for me; all the other features are just extra bonus toppings on an already delicious ice cream sundae...

I own a 3DS, and, sadly, I can assure you that a list of hardware "cons" for it would be much larger than a list of "pros".

Again, great that they aren't flaws for YOU but that doesn't mean they aren't flaws for a LOT of others. A thread shouldn't be closed because it tells you what you want to hear.

 

[Midou]

The UMD situation was damned if you do, damned if you don't.

If it used UMD, hahaha sony is so stupid, using a dead format, what a bunch of idiots.

Since it isn't, what the fuck sony, why don't you have any BC.

Not to mention they already talked about a plan for getting digital copies of legit UMDs, though it sounded like they were charging too much for it.

 

[IonicSnake]

Only flaw for me is the expensive mem-cards and the battery life. Oh, and no gorilla glass. Wtf Sony...

I'm still hyped as ever for the Vita, it's still a day one.

 

[Jinfash]

For what it's worth, I think it is necessary to discuss, dissect, and air our grievances about any negative or positive news. I also think most of the "flaws" in the OP are not only fair, but thread worthy, which is exactly why almost each one of them had a dedicated thread that spanned for pages (three which are still on the first page), where everyone contributed, myself included.

But I have to say that a "Consolidated List Of All [Something] Flaw" is such an unusual thread/title, it may be setting a precedent.

All hope for a worthwhile discussion is lost when you pick the wrong words, and have a questionable post history.

 

[DCharlie]

the arguments that not all SD cards are the same is true in that people probably aren't going to look at what class storage they are etc. I'm pretty sure most people think "16 gig memory card" = "another 16 gig memory card"

there -may- be actual implications if you have to store and run patched game code from those locations.

However, that doesn't stop the prices of the memory cards looking batshit insane to most people regardless of what the technical ability in terms of data transfer is.

That said - it would be just like sony for the card specs to come out and it be bog standard. :/

But I have to say that a "Consolidated List Of All [Something] Flaw" is such an unusual thread/title, it may be setting a precedent.

I would advocate a one-stop "moaning" thread for every piece of hardware as long as there was a broad agreement across all GAFers that THAT is where generic moaning happens so i don't have to go into EVERY F*CKING THREAD and wade through "RROD FNUR FNUR", "YELLOW SCREEN OF DEATH", "<machine> has no games! gnuk gnuk" or whatever the latest anti-<subjectmatter> meme or bullshit is.

 

[Hex]

The point is, the PS Vita has a lot of flaws. There are a lot of things it is doing wrong. It is only fair to call it out for doing so, especially when people are so quick to jump on Nintendo for making the same, or similar, mistakes.

So basically: "why no people rage more."

I for one am shocked.

 

[mrklaw]

I would like for this new memory format to be opened like the Memory Stick format is, but the problem is indeed not having on board high speed flash storage you can install games into.
Memory card are not just going to be used for save data and other less bandwidth sensitive data. You will install full PSN games on it which cannot afford to load slower from memory cards than from retail game cards.

Using regular SD cards for this might not supply, in theory, the necessary data speed and it's up to the user to purchase the right kind of cards for the game not to suddenly have weird streaming or loading issues for example.

what was wrong with M2? I have a 16GB one sitting on a shelf gathering dust. Small, presumably provides some level of DRM/protection as its the follow up to memory stick with magicgate.

whats so magical about this new format other than 'its a new format'?

 

[Laguna]

I´m surprised that some don´t mind having such a low battery-lifetime (and that they are unchangeable). I guess they will have a slightly different opinion when they start playing online-multiplayer games.

The UMD situation was damned if you do, damned if you don't.

If it used UMD, hahaha sony is so stupid, using a dead format, what a bunch of idiots.

Since it isn't, what the fuck sony, why don't you have any BC.

Not to mention they already talked about a plan for getting digital copies of legit UMDs, though it sounded like they were charging too much for it.

They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

No. I don't want a fucking massive, obselete UMD drive bulking up the Vita even more. That would have been even more idiodic than keeping Vita games themselves on UMD format.

 

[Dragon]

So basically: "why no people rage more."

If Vita has a design flaw at launch which scratches the screen then I think the rage is warranted. The battery life is definitely a concern though, most of these other things aren't huge deals.

They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

They're offering a way in Japan to get your UMD-only games on Vita. It's not a very consumer-friendly way, but it is a way. They've been upfront about this from the beginning, this isn't a PS3 thing where they've removed it after launch. You have your PSP, if you don't want to pay to play them on the Vita then don't. You still have a way to play them, it's totally your choice.

 

[Lionheart]

what was wrong with M2? I have a 16GB one sitting on a shelf gathering dust. Small, presumably provides some level of DRM/protection as its the follow up to memory stick with magicgate.

whats so magical about this new format other than 'its a new format'?

I'm interested in this as well. Has Sony ever said how fast this new format is for instance?

Because I do agree with Panajev that if it is much faster than the slowest budget microSD / microSD HC / M2 cards (it should be), then this can be a big argument FOR using a proprietary format imo. For games that stream a lot, this can be very important.

The prices are another story, but using a proprietary format for cards which run the games too is very acceptable imo.

 

[Pie and Beans]

I´m surprised that some don´t mind having such a low battery-lifetime (and that they are unchangeable). I guess they will have a slightly different opinion when they start playing online-multiplayer games.



They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

So you'd twin the 'low battery lifetime' with a moving mechanical optical disc drive for backwards compatibility would you? Its as simple as designing a handheld console and reaching compromises in the real world.

 

[Spiegel]

I´m surprised that some don´t mind having such a low battery-lifetime (and that they are unchangeable). I guess they will have a slightly different opinion when they start playing online-multiplayer games.



They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

Putting an UMD drive only for BC? Worst idea ever.

 

[Jinfash]

They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

There's an issue of space. throwing a UMD drive in may compromise other parts, such as the battery size for instance.

 

[Basch]

The memory card, internal memory, and account-locked system is concerning. Everything else is negligible. At this point, I'm honestly thinking of picking up a 3DS instead. I still might get Vita at launch, but I'm not going to pay $100+ for a 32gig stick. That's ridiculous. I'll pick up a 4, the Wifi model, and Uncharted: Golden Abyss. Oh, and Gravity Daze. But that's it.

 

[gofreak]

They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

I think there might be more design considerations than the cost of the drive itself. A UMD drive would likely have had implications either a) for the thickness of the device or b) the battery. It definitely wouldn't have been worth compromising the battery size and alternatively I'm not sure it would have been worth adding x mm of mostly empty thickness just for the drive.*

* I am assuming here that the back-center of the device is pretty much 'packed' with battery and that when the thing is opened up it'll become obvious there wouldn't have been room for a umd drive in the design as it is now, without pushing the back panel out and making the thing thicker.

 

[Chittagong]

One of Vita's key problems is that it's almost too good.

 

[TGMIII]

Insane. Sounds really bad.

Creating a list of cons will make anything sound bad. Vita has issues for sure, as did the PSP and DS before it, but I'm drawn in by the hardware. Hopefully the software follows suit.

 

[Akkad]

I found another flaw, they are not pricing it according to E3 hype. They should do that then reduce the price and give out a bunch of crap games, then they will be forgiven like nothing happened.

 

[DCharlie]

They could have solved this problem the same way DS and DSlite solved the GBA compatibility (they had an extra GBAmodul-slot). Sony did what they did to cheap out on an extra UMDdrive and to cash in on those memcards. It´s as simple as that.

err yeah, i don't think throwing a UMD in there just so you can play the games that aren't available digitally is a great idea.

Creating a list of cons will make anything sound bad. Vita has issues for sure, as did the PSP and DS before it, but I'm drawn in by the hardware. Hopefully the software follows suit.

interestingly the 3DS shares a fair few of the complaints, but has the massive advantage of being significantly cheaper. I'm starting to shift to the position that the 3DS is good enough technically to beat out the Vita again as per the DS. The price differential and the software momentum is key - Sony need to move fast in 2012.

 

[Fafalada]

if it is much faster than the slowest budget microSD / microSD HC / M2 cards (it should be), then this can be a big argument FOR using a proprietary format imo.

Slowest SDs are pretty DAMN slow by standards of a this-gen console (which Vita is hyped up to be). Not to mention - quite a bit slower then PSPGo memory was - and Vita could certainly use something faster then that was too.

 

[Oppo]

There will never, ever be Mac support. They made the same promise about PSP.

You will have to buy some 3rd party unofficial Mac support thing to transfer media to Vita from a Mac system.

 

[Kyoufu]

Remote Play isn't listed? I'm looking forward to playing Skyrim on Vita in 2 weeks.

 

[Lionheart]

Slowest SDs are pretty DAMN slow by standards of a this-gen console (which Vita is hyped up to be). Not to mention - quite a bit slower then PSPGo memory was - and Vita could certainly use something faster then that was too.

Yeah I assumed that already, should have excluded microSD. I'm guessing (hoping) the slowest M2 / MicroSDHC cards will be much slower than the Vita format as well, which is only great news imo. (seeing as I won't buy many games in store if any)

 

[Lostconfused]

One of Vita's key problems is that it's almost too good.

Yeah and you might even consider buying one if it wasn't for all those problems that ruin it.

 

[diffusionx]

None of these alone is a dealbreaker, and many of them are silly (there was no way that Sony was going to put the horrible and failed UMD drive on the Vita, come on people). But I have canceled my preorder. It is amazing hardware but in the end I am looking at $400+ to play Hot Shots Golf (which I own on PSP and PS3), SFxT (which I will own on PS3/360), and my PSP backlog. That is just lunacy. I'll wait for distinct games and maybe some third party memory cards to induce some sanity in the pricing.

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Remote Play isn't listed? I'm looking forward to playing Skyrim on Vita in 2 weeks.

I wonder what less than 0 frames per second must look like.

 

[Plinko]

Remote Play isn't listed? I'm looking forward to playing Skyrim on Vita in 2 weeks.

That was actually denied by Sony so far. Still waiting on confirmation.

 

[Xiaoki]

If Vita has a design flaw at launch which scratches the screen then I think the rage is warranted. The battery life is definitely a concern though, most of these other things aren't huge deals.

But if forum zombies didnt blow industry norms(battery life) and small issues(one PSN account) completely out of proportion then what they have to endlessly argue about for the next 2 months?

 

[Kyoufu]

That was actually denied by Sony so far. Still waiting on confirmation.

I thought they developed a tool that allows you to play every PS3 game on launch?

 

[Pandaman]

funnily enough, this thread has made me want to buy a vita by getting me interested enough to check out its games.

 

[Plinko]

I think my main problem with the Vita is simply this: Why not include a miniscule amount of flash memory on the system to allow saves? Maybe even enough for 5 game saves. It would be incredibly cheap.

Because they didn't, it's obvious they're gouging the consumer on the memory card prices to make a profit. That's what is so irritating about the whole thing.

 

[DCharlie]

ne of these alone is a dealbreaker, but I have canceled my preorder. It is amazing hardware but in the end I am looking at $400+ to play Hot Shots Golf (which I own on PSP and PS3), SFxT (which I will own on PS3/360), and my PSP backlog. That is just lunacy. I'll wait for distinct games

this is pretty much the real issue right there. Wife cancelled her preorder for the same reason : as nice as everything is, there's nothing that she's not played before that attracts her enough to drop the cash on the machine which , lets face it, from a Japanese buy in perspective (well, wife perspective i guess)

29800 - 3g model
11000 - 32gig card
5000 x (??) - games : let's say she'd go with Musou, Mingol and Disgaea at least
3000 x (??) - games : Ridge is mandatory (only time she ever plays it), Dark Quest

so that's.... (in head)

around 62,000 yen or so. To play a bunch of games she can play elsewhere.

Now, for me - i'm stoked for the Vita. But i'm not stupid enough to see that Sony have got a REAL fight on their hands to get things moving.

Meanwhile over at 3DS land it's 15,000 yen party time and there's a new Mario and a new Mario Kart, and a new MH (which is going to bomb anyways (see other threads )

New experiences are the key here and whilst Nintendo/Capcom are pushing out two games (Mario Kart and MH) that are iterative releases, they've got a big hitter that's -completely- new. Sony needs them - and fast.

 

[AbsoluteZero]

Well that tears it.

Waiting on the revision.

 

[jetsetfluken]

edit: reposting on new page

 

[Razorskin]

Pro: You will actually be able to send a message to someone on your friends list.