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[ram]

One less idiot getting in my way in my 12 player Live games of PG3.

Couldn't give a toss about 30/60 as long as it plays and looks good. I'm long past the point of fussing over trivial things.

And for all the people going 'Oh no! I'm not buying an Xbox360 now". Fuck off. You were never going to buy one to begin with, who the fuck do you think your kidding.

xbot damage control!!!

there is a huge difference between 30fps and 60fps, but then again xbotx will not see that. *roflmao*

 

[dark10x]

I'm just letting my anti-PS2 bias show.

Nothing more to see here

What? A port of a Cube game didn't turn out well on PS2? There are plenty of counter examples, you know...

 

[Trojan X]

The room goes quiet for a second. Some cynical git (yours truly) decides to ask about the frame rate. Design manager Gareth Wilson takes the question. "This version's running at 30 frames per second. We're aiming for 60." Does he think they'll hit it? "We'll see how we go. It's all about timings. If we had four months we could get it running at 60. It's whether we've got the time." With precious time to reflect even on that, the conversation lurches in another direction.

Just delay the game then. If all it takes is 4 more months then its worth it. RR6 should fill the void till PGR3 is set in all its glory. If it stays at 30 then whatever,I will live. PGR2 was on of the best racers this gen. 30 frames didn't do sqaut to alter that. But it really would be a good idea to delay it if they really are a few months away from hitting 60 frames though. If anything it'll give GAF time to start searching for something else thats wrong with the game.

Ignoring the last sentence I thought that's what BC decided to do. I mean, wasn't there an rumour or article saying that PGR3 will miss launch? I thought that RR6 might fill the gap nicely - as you said - until PGR3 comes. Afterall, Namco always been a company that you can safely bet that they would produce a good looking and playable game until something truly ground breaking comes along. Hmm...

 

[Shompola]

xbot damage control!!!

there is a huge difference between 30fps and 60fps, but then again xbotx will not see that. *roflmao*

To most people it is trivial. Believe what you will but it is true. Now if you boycott a game completely with out atleast trying it out first is what I would call quite weird or you didnt really care about the game in the first place.

 

[HokieJoe]

xbot damage control!!!

there is a huge difference between 30fps and 60fps, but then again xbotx will not see that. *roflmao*

60fps isn't a big deal to everyone.

 

[dorio]

You guys are still discussing this.

 

[Helznicht]

"or you didnt really care about the game in the first place"

Ok, I didnt really care about it. Im hoping Forza will be BC'd. But to be honest, im not going to care about any racer that isnt 60 FPS this gen... :-/

 

[xexex]

To most people it is trivial. Believe what you will but it is true. Now if you boycott a game completely with out atleast trying it out first is what I would call quite weird or you didnt really care about the game in the first place.

it's trival to most people because they're used to 30 fps or sub-30fps racers on consoles and PCs. being breast fed on 60fps arcade racers from Namco, Sega.... *I* demand better. So in that, you are right, most gamers don't mind being bottle fed substandard racers :lol

 

[gtmax]

What an incredible waste of the Ferrari, Porsche and lambo licenses. The cars will look real, have real cockpit and the cities will look realer than ever, but everything will be shit once the agme is moving.

I fear Forza will go inthe same direction. PGR3's graphics dont' justify 30fps.

 

[Warm Machine]

If you can't play a racing game because it is 30fps instead of 60fps it isn't the game that sucks. Forza is easily the best console sim racer to date and it is 30fps. PGR 3 at 30fps won't bother me one bit.

 

[Shompola]

it's trival to most people because they're used to 30 fps or sub-30fps racers on consoles and PCs. being breast fed on 60fps arcade racers from Namco, Sega.... *I* demand better. So in that, you are right, most gamers don't mind being bottle fed substandard racers :lol

But you arent really a fan of racing games though if what you say describes your preference for a deal breaker or not. Sound, graphics, handling, AI, physics etc. is moot if the game is not atleast rock solid 60fps in your case, true or not? I personally try out the game first and see if it suits me. 60fps will enhance the experience but there are more important things to nitpick, as for example handling of the cars and so forth.

 

[----]

What's particularly interesting, though, is that you won't have to wait for downloadable content in order to race around new tracks - thanks to the addition of Route Creator. Load this up and you're given a top-down overview of one of the game's cities. You pick a starting point, and then just connect the dots to form point-to-point or circuit races using areas of the game the team's already mapped. There are thousands upon thousands of possible permutations, and you can share them with your friends - playing them with any game modes you like. Want to race the entirety of London in one big snaky rush? Then you can.

Sounds really cool. Thank god this game will only be $50. I refuse to buy $60 games.

 

[gtmax]

your a better man than me.

yes i mean 'your'.

 

[Korranator]

60fps or bust.

That is all.....

 

[Future]

--------------------
but everything will be shit once the agme is moving
--------------------

Wasn't Project Gotham 2 30 fps? Quick glance at gamerankings shows that this game was received very well. So am I missing something, or should someone be busting out the crybaby pics right about now.

Are people more pissed about actual differences between 30 and 60 fps (smoother visuals, tighter control) or just the fact that the Xbox 360 is a next gen system so "obviously" the devs are lazy if they can't make 60 fps. Because no matter how powerful a system, if there is a choice is between 60 fps and more effects, 60 fps is going to lose the majority of the time

 

[dark10x]

Are people more pissed about actual differences between 30 and 60 fps

I'm pissed about the actual difference...

However, it also makes it seem as if 60 fps just isn't important to developers...

I can't think of any major 360 titles that are set to run at 60 fps thus far. That doesn't mean that it couldn't do it, but it DOES mean that the focus is shifting...and PGR3 (being a big title) is another one to add to that list. It also sends out messages to developers that working for 60 fps doesn't matter. When the "big boys" aren't concerned about it, perhaps it becomes more acceptable to others...

PGR3 is a BIG game and it is setting a bad example IMO. This is not the direction I want others to go...

My expectations are to expect 30 fps or less from major X360 titles. There was a comment made earlier this year that most next-gen devs were only going for 30 fps...and it seems like it might be panning out. :\

 

[PanopticBlue]

I'm pissed about the actual difference...

However, it also makes it seem as if 60 fps just isn't important to developers...

I can't think of any major 360 titles that are set to run at 60 fps thus far. That doesn't mean that it couldn't do it, but it DOES mean that the focus is shifting...and PGR3 (being a big title) is another one to add to that list. It also sends out messages to developers that working for 60 fps doesn't matter. When the "big boys" aren't concerned about it, perhaps it becomes more acceptable to others...

PGR3 is a BIG game and it is setting a bad example IMO. This is not the direction I want others to go...

My expectations are to expect 30 fps or less from major X360 titles. There was a comment made earlier this year that most next-gen devs were only going for 30 fps...and it seems like it might be panning out. :\

Some devs simply know better, and PLAN AHEAD for the game to be 60fps instead of taking the PGR2 train. I would be shocked to find out that RR6 is anything less than 60fps and while it most certainly won't look as good as PGR3, it will most certainly move much better.

Similarly, I would be shocked to see Polyphony release a game ever again at anything less than 60 fps. They simply have their priorities straight, and will always deliver. It all boils down to laziness, and apparently, Bizarre is content to release a subpar product. I agree with you though, I really, REALLY hope devs don't just settle for 30fps just cause they can get away with it. Fuck, take some pride in your game.

Can you imagine how diluted the Burnout: Revenge experience would be at 30fps?

 

[dark10x]

You're right, I wouldn't expect less than 60 fps from a lot of teams (mostly Eastern, where they seem to shoot for high framerates far more often).

People shouldn't really blame the 360 hardware, that's for sure. Last gen, the system with the greatest number of 60 fps titles was actually the PS2...and that was certainly not the most capable hardware.

Can you imagine how diluted the Burnout: Revenge experience would be at 30fps?

Yeah, Burnout Legends and Revenge Crash mode gave me a taste.

Revenge looks stunning in motion and, quite frankly, it impresses me more than any X360 racer shown to date. PGR3 was ahead, of course, but my love of fancy effects and 60 fps places Revenge ahead of it. It just looks really really cool in motion...

 

[Rabid Wolverine]

With Xbox 360's raw power i expected this to be 60 frames.

Fuck 30 frames.

Bring on Grand Turismo PS3 60 Frames Goodness.

 

[Korranator]

Obviously highly rated developers that take pride in their work make 60fps racers, while the others simply rush the games out at 30fps thinking people won't notice the differrence. Quality vs quanity.

 

[Gek54]

If you can't play a racing game because it is 30fps instead of 60fps it isn't the game that sucks. Forza is easily the best console sim racer to date and it is 30fps. PGR 3 at 30fps won't bother me one bit.

I might have agreed with you about a month ago but after sitting down all the top PC racing sims(rFactor,RBR,LFS, GTR), I would have to say, physics overall, GT4>=Enthusia>>Forza. It seems the tire physics most of all are off in Forza. No denying that being able to play Forza online is amazingly fun though.

 

[Shompola]

Obviously highly rated developers that take pride in their work make 60fps racers, while the others simply rush the games out at 30fps thinking people won't notice the differrence. Quality vs quanity.

No.. A highly rated developer creates a racer that is fun to play.... 60fps does not automatically equal fun. And what does quality vs quantity have to do with it?

 

[isamu]

well, that saves me $50 + tax

ditto

 

[Pimpbaa]

60fps looks very nice, but pgr2 being only 30fps certainly didn't hamper my enjoyment of the game. Those who are not buying it now simply because it's 30fps need to find another hobby. A real gamer will enjoy the game regardless of any technical difficulties (if the gameplay is great).

 

[isamu]

Higher framerate = more accurate and more responsive handling. Fact.

Pointless details and screwed up priorities. 40k polygon dashboards? Audiences? Whoop-de-fucking-do...that adds precisely ZERO to the gameplay of the game.

couldn't have said it better.

 

[KingJ2002]

Delay PGR 3.... there is no need for it to be at launch.

Ridge Racer 6 will take PGR 3's spot.

delay it a month to get 60fps and then release it.

 

[Wunderchu]

I'd happily wait until Q1 for 60fps. There's plenty of games at launch.

I agree ... MS has stated that it is important for them that with their launch titles they have major genres coverd (fighting, racing, FPS, etc.)... & NFSMW will already almost certainly be out on Nov. 22 , so racing is already covered.. so PGR3 is not needed so much at launch......

 

[aaaaa0]

Holy resurrection of month old threads.

 

[GhaleonEB]

Holy resurrection of month old threads.

Seriously, where the fuck did this come from? :lol

 

[_Angelus_]

Listen to them bitch folks. But if their favorite racing series ever dropped to 30 frames you'd see one hell of a double standard.

PGR3 could jump to 60 frames,I still wouldn't care.:lol That's not makes the foundation of a racing game,shit some of you should know that by now. Online play,driver a.i.,car damage,the games control,car and course designs,thats what counts in the end.

 

[Merlin]

Unacceptable. They're putting graphics above gameplay and control. What's Perfect Dark Zero's framerate?

 

[Jerkface]

:lol

I bet Bizarre are REALLY going to feel the pinch when framerate Nazi's refuse to buy their game (some of you will buy it anyway.)

 

[Merlin]

PGR3 could jump to 60 frames,I still wouldn't care.:lol That's not makes the foundation of a racing game,shit some of you should know that by now. Online play,driver a.i.,car damage,the games control,car and course designs,thats what counts in the end.

Frame rate directly effects control though. I will NEVER forgive Bizarre Creations if this comes out at 30fps. It's meant to be next generation. RR6 for me.

 

[DCharlie]

"xbot damage control!!!

there is a huge difference between 30fps and 60fps, but then again xbotx will not see that. *roflmao*"

there's nothing to damage control - some people enjoyed PGR2 at 30fps.
Damage control posts are a pain in the fucking arse. they add NOTHING

This damage control bullshit is just because some people can't accept that others don't care about frame rate (or just have a contrary opinion)

OH NO DAMAGE CONTROL HA HA POINT AT THE XBOT ETC ETC...

If it's solid and stable, it'll be fine.

as for PR disaster... as if any of the casuals are going to give a flying fuck!

Personally, i'd prefer 60fps - but it wont kill me at 30fps either. I just want to play it.
i'd be interested to see how 30fps with the effect does actually compare to 60fps.

 

[Gek54]

GTA had blur and that nausiating shit got switched off quicky fast.

 

[Shompola]

GTA 3 used the same kind of motion blur used in PGR3?

 

[Jerkface]

GTA 3 used the same kind of motion blur used in PGR3?

Nope, that just used basic "trails" which doesn't involve any calculations based on speed and position in relation to the view.

 

[Bebpo]

I'd be interested to see how 30fps with the effect does actually compare to 60fps.

When you play Wanda next week you'll see how motion blur kind helps with framerate but not really.

 

[dark10x]

Trackmania Sunrise used the kind of blur we're seeing PGR3 (possibly even more insane). The thing was, it had a MASSIVE impact on the framerate. It looked incredible, though...

 

[mrklaw]

I liked PGR2 a lot. Didn't care what framerate it was, as it was nice and stable.

I'm sure I'll like PGR3 as well.



As for control - just because its running at 30 doesn't mean everything else is. They can (and I hope do) calculate their physics at a higher framerate, and also accept input at a higher framerate too.

And to those saying just delay it until its 60 - Can I please have one game to play on my machine at launch?!

If there is one genre that Xbox won't lack its racing games (and FPSes). So theres plenty of time next year for lovely 60fps games. Hopefully a Rallisport 3 will deliver, and I bet there's a burnout on the way.

just bloody relax people.

 

[Bebpo]

And to those saying just delay it until its 60 - Can I please have one game to play on my machine at launch?!.

While I agree with the rest of what you said, I can't agree with this. Was it Miyamoto who said something about a bad game is bad forever, but a delayed good game will always be remembered as good.

Like you said there's a ton of racers on the system, so if they really thought they could get to 60fps with 3-6 month delay, you'd think it would be better to just delay it. I mean you spend several YEARS working on a game...a few extra months to make it a much better game doesn't seem like a horribly bad idea.

 

[shpankey]

I can't think of any major 360 titles that are set to run at 60 fps thus far.

COD2 I know is... not sure but isn't Condemed also 60? Dunno about any others. Hopefully the EA games get 60 though.

 

[Gek54]

Hopefully a Rallisport 3 will deliver

RSC3???!?!?!?!?

 

[DenogginizerOS]

Did I miss something? Did one of you actually play the final version recently and that's why you resurrected this old thread? If so, please tell me how 30fps just ruins this game.

 

[Xellotah]

While I agree with the rest of what you said, I can't agree with this. Was it Miyamoto who said something about a bad game is bad forever, but a delayed good game will always be remembered as good.

... Or you could wait for the next iteration of the franchise... Unlike maybe other genres i.e. Platformers & RPG where you need to heavily update the gaming experience (or story) with each iteration. Sports and Racers are generally speaking only making incremental updates to the gameplay with every release.

 

[Fallout-NL]

.

So what do you guys want? A 30FPS launch title or a Q1 release at 60fps?

The latter.

 

[DCharlie]

"While I agree with the rest of what you said, I can't agree with this. Was it Miyamoto who said something about a bad game is bad forever, but a delayed good game will always be remembered as good."

But you are assuming here that a 30fps is going to be a bad game. It's not going to be bad at 30fps.

 

[DenogginizerOS]

But you are assuming here that a 30fps is going to be a bad game. It's not going to be bad at 30fps.

IAWTP (see my above post)

 

[Shompola]

But you are assuming here that a 30fps is going to be a bad game. It's not going to be bad at 30fps.

Unfortunately some people do think that. Hilarious, very hilarious. Maybe they should find another hobby.

 

[Gek54]

Right on! Becuase 30fps is the future and there are no better alternatives. Stutter 4 life.