Support NeoGAF

[Skilletor]

Bringing back the arcade scene would be pretty great, but I'm with Beef on some of the console advantages. I end up being better at something when I can practice with them. Either way, more offline play anywhere is ideal.

It doesn't have to be either or.

In CO, we play every other thursday at two places (one in CO Springs, one in Denver). We get together to play a bunch of different stuff. All the other time, we play at home. It was the same with arcades until they all closed.

 

[kewlmyc]

Darkstalkers was always a niche series. I doubt that an actual Darkstalkers IV would live up to their "expectations" either.

 

[HardRojo]

Juicebox is much more talented than your average pot monster. He's not a good example. Also, if you have true passion for the game, and I can tell Juicebox does, you'll improve beyond your paygrade.

KOFXIII is much harder than any other KOF to play, with the possible exception of XI.

I had to use him as an example because your average pot monster won't even give the game a chance.

Look at this video

James is a Peruvian player who started practicing KoF not so long ago, XIII is his first KoF and he's doing pretty good.

 

[Jotamide]

I walked into this series for the first time with this game and really liked it. Whoever is saying DS is harder than KOF or AE, hasn't played this game at all. Sure it's faster paced, but that doesn't mean it's a punishing game.

Btw, the game might have been among the top sellers in NA, but on the Euro chart it was nowhere to be found.

Sadly, as long as the "When's Mahvel?" mentality is still alive. No one will pay attention to other fighting games. Capcom saw the success of AE and UMvC as an incentive to put up more digital titles, when in reality most of the FGC is totally fine in playing those 2 games for the next decade as long as the keep them updated.

 

[jmdajr]

Fuck, I didn't even know this game existed!

I really don't have time for games these days

 

[Hyun Sai]

KOF XIII isn't slow, what the fuck.

Yeah, you think you heard it all, and one morning, Bam ! KoF XIII is slow.

Sadly, as long as the "When's Mahvel?" mentality is still alive. No one will pay attention to other fighting games. Capcom saw the success of AE and UMvC as an incentive to put up more digital titles, when in reality most of the FGC is totally fine in playing those 2 games for the next decade as long as the keep them updated.

And even among those who are not into Capcom, the among of quality games around is already pretty good, for all genres. 2D, 3D, Anime, whtever.

 

[Riposte]

Feel bad, because I promised myself I'd only play two fighting games this year and this one wasn't one of them. Last year I just played way too many for my own good.

 

[Marz]

Reasons Marvel and Street Fighter will always be bigger than KoF:

Wolverine
Dante
Magneto
Ryu
Akuma
Chun li

I mean don't get me wrong, I love Terry Bogard as much as the next guy, but seriously in Marvel you can freaking play the Avengers. Also SNK did nothing to further promote their brand or characters outside of their brief stay in the limelight in the 90s and now the company is pretty much dead.

 

[Nyoro SF]

I walked into this series for the first time with this game and really liked it. Whoever is saying DS is harder than KOF or AE, hasn't played this game at all. Sure it's faster paced, but that doesn't mean it's a punishing game.

This I MUST disagree with. Defending your character in Darkstalkers is one of the hardest things I've done in a fighting game in a while. I've never played a game with such intense ground and aerial lockdown from the top tiers.

 

[Atolm]

Market saturation + Niche series = Poor sales.

 

[danmaku]

Yup, I've transitioned to PC given how long this generation has gone on for. I might be in a minority but I'd buy just about any fighter released on PC, as it is I'm stuck only being able to play AE.

I'd do that too, but let's be realistic: the fighting game market on PC is very small. If DS can't sell on consoles, what makes you think is going to sell better on PC? especially when PC users has been playing the game on emulators for years (even online)?

 

[Dice]

People who love the franchise and want to play existing games in it will play on platforms that have it. These are not the kind of gamers who are helpless just because something is on older hardware.

PEOPLE WANT NEW ENTRIES NOT WHAT THEY HAVE BEEN PLAYING FOR 15 YEARS

CAPCOM WHY ARE YOU SO STUPID THAT YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THIS

 

[Onemic]

I walked into this series for the first time with this game and really liked it. Whoever is saying DS is harder than KOF or AE, hasn't played this game at all. Sure it's faster paced, but that doesn't mean it's a punishing game.

Btw, the game might have been among the top sellers in NA, but on the Euro chart it was nowhere to be found.

Sadly, as long as the "When's Mahvel?" mentality is still alive. No one will pay attention to other fighting games. Capcom saw the success of AE and UMvC as an incentive to put up more digital titles, when in reality most of the FGC is totally fine in playing those 2 games for the next decade as long as the keep them updated.

DS is harder only in execution, based on the stricter inputs for moves and lack of plinking. Even then it really only applies to heavy link based characters in the game of which there arent that many. It's far more straightforward in terms of approach and gameplan than Marvel of SF.

 

[BronsonLee]

Probably an example of way higher sales expectations than were reasonable.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

What were they expecting? DS has never been as popular as their mainline series, like Street Fighter or the Marvel titles. Seems dumb to have expected so much when the series was always niche by comparison to those blockbusters. I hope that this doesn't affect the chances of more arcade BEU releases.

 

[zeelman]

Probably an example of way higher sales expectations than were reasonable.

Pretty typical of Japanese game companies these days.

 

[Dr. Zoidberg]

I wanted Darkstalkers Resurrection but I just feel that $15 is too much for these old game ports so I passed. I was the same way with Marvel vs. Capcom: Origins. They should be $10 max.

I finally picked up MvC:O this week because it was on sale for 600MSP on XBL.

 

[Village]

Reasons Marvel,Street Fighter,Tekken and Mortal Kombat will always be bigger than KoF:

Wolverine
IronMan
Dante
Virgil
Zero
Magneto
Kazuya
Ryu
Akuma
Chun li
Jin ( sasuke uchiha)
Scorpion
And a boxing kangaroo and a effing bear

I mean don't get me wrong, I love Terry Bogard as much as the next guy, but seriously in Marvel you can freaking play the Avengers. Also SNK did nothing to further promote their brand or characters outside of their brief stay in the limelight in the 90s and now the company is pretty much dead.

I dunno about that last part about their company being dead, but this is kinda on the money.

I made some edits though

 

[vocab]

Kof13 slow haha.

 

[Tizoc]

That doesn't matter. There was no extra work involved in EITHER of the games being included in those packages to warrant a $5 price-hike.

Using your example of MvC2, it was only 1 game for $10, but This is a compilation of 2 games, so each would be 7.50, I don't see no price spike here...

In fact I'd go so far as to say I'd buy MvC1 stand-alone for $5, ignore MSH (since I'm more a MvC fan than the Marvel stand-alone titles) and possibly buy one of the Darkstalkers titles (or just get Jojo if it wasn't dildos priced). Alas, Capcom is stupid at pricing things at a impulse buy level.

I find SNK's Neo Geo Classics to be more stupidly priced. $15 is a-OK IMO.
That reminds me that GGXX is $15 on PSN.

As for KoF'13: It doesn't help that the execution is strict (like stricter than SF3 and older titles) the game is slow (not as slow as Blazblue but still pretty slow), even slower than KoF'98/'02 which were pretty decent paced and has been "niche" outside of Spanish speaking countries for ages that's why it isn't as popular as people want it to be.

Heh, 3S' input is much stricter to me than KoF XIII lol.

No. Us Kids have too many options.

There are something in the region of 30 fighters out now on the HD twins, each with a level of depth that could take years of practise to unlock.

Its too easy to get your ass handed to you online one too many times in one game, shrug and pick another to play. Not every game clicks immediately and these re-releases in general are much harder because the quality of the opposition (which on week one you cant even avoid because everyone is about the same rank at first). At least with games like Marvel 3 and SFIV people started on a somewhat equal foot. Its pointless to pick up Guilty gear, third strike, Darkstalkers or MVC2 because you just know you are going to be raped unless you invest a significantly higher amount of time than you would a fighter released this generation.

Guess I'm unique in this case as I could play any 2D fighting game without any hassle. Granted I ain't a pro, and you're right in that one may need to spend a long time to get really good in a game, but I personally utilize and understand the basics of the game and work with it.
...but you kids're still quittin and chickening out.

You can't seriously compare guard rolls and guard blows to Ultra and X-Factor lol.

Sorry what I meant was the fast meter gain in KoF XIII is its comeback mechanic.
KFC for one feels overpowered, and more shifts the playing field than give an advantage to the disadvantaged player.

 

[thesolidshark]

As for KoF'13: It doesn't help that the execution is strict (like stricter than SF3 and older titles) the game is slow (not as slow as Blazblue but still pretty slow), even slower than KoF'98/'02 which were pretty decent paced and has been "niche" outside of Spanish speaking countries for ages that's why it isn't as popular as people want it to be.

Maybe this is cause I've been practicing KOF for a while, but slower compared to what?

KOF XIII isn't slow, what the fuck.

I'd say he puts in more effort than most. Talking about "talent" in his case would almost be an insult to him.

And I'd argue 02UM is harder. As a rule of thumb, XIII also gives you one more light attack to confirm off/do blockstrings than the older games before you're in far detection range. Something like cr.Bx2 st.B to Mu Shiki is much easier in XIII than it is in 98.

Agree with pretty much all this, especially the bolded. I partially hope 2K2UM and XIII are released on Steam so people can compare first hand the difference between the old and new.

 

[thesolidshark]

It doesn't have to be either or.

In CO, we play every other thursday at two places (one in CO Springs, one in Denver). We get together to play a bunch of different stuff. All the other time, we play at home. It was the same with arcades until they all closed.

You were lucky. My area in Michigan, by the time I was willing to get into fighters (pre-teen), most accessible arcades near me were gone. I can only think of one substancial arcade left now, an hour away from where I was.

 

[Zukuu]

Just re-releasing them is enough. It barely costs Capcom a dime and fans of that specific game are pleased. Maybe throw in online support, but leave it at that. The HD remakes are too expensive and the market isn't willing to play the same game again for a longer period of time. Nostalgia can only go so far.

I'm a huge FG enthusiast, but I'm not interested in old games, otherwise I'd frigging still play them. >_>
I want a Street Fighter 5 / Alpha 4 from them, and not the same game I played years ago.

 

[Hyun Sai]

Maybe this is cause I've been practicing KOF for a while, but slower compared to what?

Compared to this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_VbjOxsA0g

 

[Skilletor]

It is absolutely hilarious to me to see people say SF3 has strict execution when, growing up, SF3 was given shit for how easy it is to play.

 

[Vanille]

I blame the stupid as shit achievement/trophy list.

 

[Tizoc]

I blame the stupid as shit achievement/trophy list.

Ooof don't get me started on this, the XBL list is enough to have a Platinum equivalent, and yet $ony plays favourites instead when it comes to PSN titles.

 

[Wolfgunblood Garopa]

The new art is blasphemous compared to the original art and removing the attract mode isn't cool. The interface for this and Third Strike are weird. The Saturn release is far more legit, not to mention it's just better (all the characters in one game). DS is already a niche audience, you have to do better than Resurrection to even get that whole fanbase to buy.

 

[BuckRobotron]

Considered it but ultimately passed as I have PSP Darkstalkers and DS3 (PS1) readily available. Not tossing more $ at something I essentially already have as some kind of proof that I would like an honest new entry in the series. I'll be enthused about said new entry in the DS series when there actually is one.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

It is absolutely hilarious to me to see people say SF3 has strict execution when, growing up, SF3 was given shit for how easy it is to play.

Hell, among the players I know, that's the reason why KOF XIII gets shit when it does. They still play it though.

 

[GorillaJu]

Eh. I want a new Dark Stalkers game. I've bought these old games like 100 times over the years. PSP ver. PS1 ver. PS2 ver. just give me a new DS.

 

[Spirit of Jazz]

I'd do that too, but let's be realistic: the fighting game market on PC is very small. If DS can't sell on consoles, what makes you think is going to sell better on PC? especially when PC users has been playing the game on emulators for years (even online)?

Have you got any sales data on if SF4 has sold well on Steam over the years? I think I'd be surprised if a game like Injustice didn't sell well on PC over the long term or at least enough to make up the relatively small costs it would take to port and publish onto the format. Also I might be wrong here but wasn't 3S taking off of GGPO when the online edition was release? Even then I'd wager a few people would just like to legally own the game and play online and that a lot of folks would buy it during sales due to nostalgia.

Realistically would Iron Galaxy be releasing Dive Kick on PC if they didn't think that it would be fiscally successful on the format?

 

[thesolidshark]

Compared to this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_VbjOxsA0g

...sure. Would say there might be a NeoMax or HD combo that's faster, but too tired to look now.

 

[synce]

What were they expecting? They didn't even try. I love the series but I'm not about to buy a shoddy port just because I get to play against some foul mouthed kids online. If they were going to bring Darkstalkers back they should've committed a little more.

 

[Cat]

I would be interested in a Darkstalkers game done like Marvel vs. Capcom 3, but from what I understand if there were a new one, it'd be more like Street Fighter 4 in terms of aesthetics and no thank you.

That said, an older re-release is indeed not enough for my interest nor money. I like some of the character designs, but it's not a series I've played a lot.

 

[EarlyEarly]

Unpopular game doesn't sell. Who would have guessed.

 

[grumble]

Too bad. Capcom was rightly using the rerelease as a barometer of interest in the series, and clearly there wasn't enough to continue it. It's probably gone for good now.

Shows how a very vocal but small number of people can give executives the impression that a series is more desired than it actually is. I wonder if the internet could abuse this demand distortion by getting a bunch of hardcore fans together and flooding a publisher with request emails for a game.

 

[vocab]

It is absolutely hilarious to me to see people say SF3 has strict execution when, growing up, SF3 was given shit for how easy it is to play.

Parry inputs are strict. Cr.forward into super is not.

 

[Holy Order Sol]

Too bad. Capcom was rightly using the rerelease as a barometer of interest in the series, and clearly there wasn't enough to continue it. It's probably gone for good now.

Capcom tests are just a disingenuous practice though. While I don't doubt that DS is a niche series, these numbers aren't evidence of that.

 

[Kai Dracon]

I have to wonder at some of the reactions here though.

The general vibe for Capcom among enthusiast gamers these days is "Capcom, you're so shitty you just make sell-out western games and shit on your classics". But when Capcom shows some respect for their back catalog and "does what the fans want" by updating the games with netplay, etc, they get scorn and a large number of people tell them they shouldn't have bothered.

I'm not sure what Capcom should have expected for sales of these collections outside 3rd Strike. Half-tempted to think Capcom was tricked by typically vocal fans online. Everybody's saying "Duh, Darkstalkers is unpopular" now, but over the last five years since SFIV came out it's easy to find lots of people yelling for "better games" like Darkstalkers.

 

[Omegasquash]

Unpopular game doesn't sell. Who would have guessed.

At a price point that usually doesn't work, to boot. I don't see a problem in $15 for a few games, and I see the value in it because DS is kinda fun. But if you expect sales of a game that's niche at a price that's perceived as high then well...wtf are you doing projecting sales?

 

[ShockingAlberto]

Too bad. Capcom was rightly using the rerelease as a barometer of interest in the series, and clearly there wasn't enough to continue it. It's probably gone for good now.

Shows how a very vocal but small number of people can give executives the impression that a series is more desired than it actually is. I wonder if the internet could abuse this demand distortion by getting a bunch of hardcore fans together and flooding a publisher with request emails for a game.

If high production values and new content are not enough to convince people to buy a game, then why would developers make new games at all?

 

[Stumpokapow]

Darkstalkers Collection
JoJo's
MvC 1 / Marvel Super Heroes
MvC 2
MvC 3
Street Fighter II
Super Street Fighter II Turbo HDR
Street Fighter III
Street Fighter 4
Street Fighter vs Tekken

All these fighters are from Capcom and concurrently available on digital platforms.

And that's without being aware of the fact that plenty of non-Capcom fighting games are also available on those platforms, including some like Skullgirls that are actually sucking up some oxygen.

Plus general end-of-gen platform decline + the fact that Darkstalkers is selling for $15 in an effort to double down on the FGC.

 

[Skilletor]

You were lucky. My area in Michigan, by the time I was willing to get into fighters (pre-teen), most accessible arcades near me were gone. I can only think of one substancial arcade left now, an hour away from where I was.

Oh yeah, I'm definitely aware of how fortunate I am. It's awesome to have people to play. In Denver, we even have a small, but VERY dedicated, KoF scene. We've got people streaming every Thursday (a few other members on Gaf are part of it).

I have to wonder at some of the reactions here though.

The general vibe for Capcom among enthusiast gamers these days is "Capcom, you're so shitty you just make sell-out western games and shit on your classics". But when Capcom shows some respect for their back catalog and "does what the fans want" by updating the games with netplay, etc, they get scorn and a large number of people tell them they shouldn't have bothered.

I'm not sure what Capcom should have expected for sales of these collections outside 3rd Strike. Half-tempted to think Capcom was tricked by typically vocal fans online. Everybody's saying "Duh, Darkstalkers is unpopular" now, but over the last five years since SFIV came out it's easy to find lots of people yelling for "better games" like Darkstalkers.

I would be one of those people. I don't like SF4 much. But I'm also a person who grew up with Capcom fighters and I'm perfectly aware that VS was never popular, not even during the 2D heyday. I was looking for an arcade perfect console port. Something I've never had easily accessible.

 

[Pikawil]

Looks like it's time for Capcom to reboot Darkstalkers into a gritty FPS or an almost Shakespearean action game.

 

[Whompa]

Probably because I bought the game 3 times already?

Maybe make a new game?

 

[JrBaconCheeseburger]

When i first saw the trailer i thought it was a brand new game but then i come to learn it was some shit for PSN/ Xbox live that was being re-released.


Lost all interest at that point.

 

[vocab]

Capcom, like the rest of the game industry has unrealistic expectations on their games sale forecast.
Too many fighters on the market. Next gen is gonna be rough.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

I hope this doesn't kill the possibility of an Alpha Collection on XBLA/PSN/eShop. :[

 

[vocab]

I hope this doesn't kill the possibility of an Alpha Collection on XBLA/PSN/eShop. :[

They will slow it down. I played some alpha 2 last night on ggpo for two hours. Good times.