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[Dreams-Visions]

Desiring Genocide and Ethnic Cleansings isn't a "political belief" - it's being an irredeemable monster.

correct.

these are not "political beliefs" that get to sit at the table with normal political beliefs. they are perversions of civil society that should be offered no quarter from anyone anywhere, lest their cancerous and malicious positions and intents spread to more ignorant and impressionable people.

 

[Ferr986]

I generally think it's a bad idea for us to cultivate the expectation that low-level employees (i.e., people who aren't executives or high-profile public figures) should be fired from jobs they already have because they're "exposed" as holding certain undesirable political beliefs.

Like, at least set the bar at them actually being directly involved in the violent/illegal components of the rallies, or taking on a leadership role in a white supremacist group.

There are some parts of the country that are way too red and way too violently anti-liberal for this to be a precedent I'm comfortable setting, especially with how quickly neo Nazis adapt their rhetoric and tactics in response to criticism from the left. We can find consequences for racism that can't be so easily turned around and used by racists against people racists disagree with.

They're Nazis, their sole presence can develop a toxic relationship inside the workplace.

I mean, if he was an ISIS supporter a lot of people would probably feel to be alll right for him to get kicked out.

 

[UtterlyPerplexed]

Absolutely. It honestly baffles me how widely misunderstood 'freedom of speech' is.

And if employers feel white supremacy and advocating for genocide is bad for business and fire employees who subscribe to that disgusting ideology, all the better, because that's the free market at work. The same free market that I presume these gleeful and virulent Nazi anti-Commies are all for.

 

[smokeandmirrors]

This guy flew all the way from Berkeley to Charlottesville to attend a White Supremacist rally. What the fuck...

Heil of a vacation

 

[C.Mongler]

(while plugging a patreon lmao)

and pimping their patreon every 5 posts.

Yeah that shit has been irking me. Like I would get it if they're actively in need of legal defense or something...but there were literal victims of terror this weekend. Plug their donation links instead maybe? Seems kind of tone deaf/exploitative to sit there with a straight face and say "Man it's hard work calling out racists in my free time, could I get some cash?". Like plenty of people would gladly step up to the plate in your absence; either do it or don't. Hell, activists like Shaun King practically have been and he hasn't been posting a Patreon link for himself every couple posts.

Also I find it ironic that the only Patreon goal they have is 'I will stop posting my Patreon as much', which was met, and they haven't simmered down on it at all as far as I can tell.

 

[Mahonay]

 

[GK86]

The firings are dedicated to Heather.

 

[Quixzlizx]

I'm not worried about Nazis losing their jobs.

I'm worried about this tactic becoming a new normal that all sides use to punish their opponents.

I remember condemning employers who fired people for being gay, for supporting abortion, etc. If that's not okay, this shouldn't be okay, either.

It's bad to fire someone for being gay.

It's good to fire someone for being a Nazi.

There is no moral equivalence.

 

[FreezeSSC]

The google guy must be so pissed all this coverage is detracting from him getting coverage.

 

[HiiiLife]

Hope this gives more incentive to racists on social media who show their face and name to shut the fuck up.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

I like how you've conjured up a false reality where the only people who get to punish people for being irredeemable monsters are people who agree with you about who's an irredeemable monster.

You...you realize we're talking about Nazis right? Not someone who prefers Miracle Whip over mayonnaise.

 

[AuthenticM]

good

 

[droggg]

expose them.

 

[Mahonay]

I like how you've conjured up a false reality where the only people who get to punish people for being irredeemable monsters are people who agree with you about who's an irredeemable monster.

Nazis = bad, is not a very hard concept to grasp.

 

[QuantumZebra]

This guy flew all the way from Berkeley to Charlottesville to attend a White Supremacist rally. What the fuck...

haters gonna hate

Spoiler

no matter how much round trip tickets cost

...


Now that I think about it... I barely had cash for gaming when I worked at Starbucks... how's a guy working at a hot dog joint got money to fly across the country for a fucking rally?

Meh.

I like how you've conjured up a false reality where the only people who get to punish people for being irredeemable monsters are people who agree with you about who's an irredeemable monster.

"Both sides" or nah?

 

[Krappadizzle]

Good. I think exposure and accountability is a good move. I was glad when Google made YouTube use real people's names as it makes you responsible for what you say and do online too, though that got rolled back.

Though it does kind of make you wonder what steps are taken to ensure it's not mistaken association? Like if you were a dude their to counter protest and a picture was taken of you and mislabeled. Though, in this instance that isn't the case, but that would suck if it did happen.

 

[hydruxo]

Maybe they'll think twice next time when they realize their freedom of speech still has consequences.

 

[TheOfficeMut]

I like how you've conjured up a false reality where the only people who get to punish people for being irredeemable monsters are people who agree with you about who's an irredeemable monster.

Are you suggesting that we - people who want equality and peace and will not concede to Nazi mother fuckers - are somehow possibly wrong? Are you saying that these beliefs are somehow NOT correct or morally sound?

 

[SeanTSC]

I like how you've conjured up a false reality where the only people who get to punish people for being irredeemable monsters are people who agree with you about who's an irredeemable monster.

You're kidding, right? There's absolutely no reality in which being a White Supremacist isn't being a monster. The fuck is wrong with you? You really think that thinking the Holocaust was a good thing to do is just a "different opinion"?

 

[theWB27]

I generally think it's a bad idea for us to cultivate the expectation that low-level employees (i.e., people who aren't executives or high-profile public figures) should be fired from jobs they already have because they're "exposed" as holding certain undesirable political beliefs.

Like, at least set the bar at them actually being directly involved in the violent/illegal components of the rallies, or taking on a leadership role in a white supremacist group.

There are some parts of the country that are way too red and way too violently anti-liberal for this to be a precedent I'm comfortable setting, especially with how quickly neo Nazis adapt their rhetoric and tactics in response to criticism from the left. We can find consequences for racism that can't be so easily turned around and used by racists against people racists disagree with.

I'm starting to think that there are some who will have a problem with whatever avenue is taken to get this ish sorted out.

 

[Relix]

You guys do know some sympathizer will just hire him back and probably give him a better paying job just for spite right?

 

[Chmpocalypse]

Truth.

White hoods make it far easier to punch them.

Though I worry that white hoods (and the anonymity that comes with them) will make them bolder and more likely to hurt someone.

We don't have a president that will brand them as terrorist organizations in office anymore. We aren't far from more black folk being dragged behind vehicles again with "both sides" as the narrative.

They just murdered a woman by running her over.

They're already emboldened by the racist-in-chief.

And some buckets (or supersoakers) of urine should ensure those hoods come off real fast.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

Though it does kind of make you wonder what steps are taken to ensure it's not mistaken association? Like if you were a dude their to counter protest and a picture was taken of you and mislabeled. Though, in this instance that isn't the case, but that would suck if it did happen.

That person would sue their employer into oblivion.

 

[Seik]

Thank god there are some repercussions.

Hopefully more of these people will get exposed and face the consequences.

These people are a disgrace for the human race and deserve everything that will come at them for pushing these shit values.

 

[Tagyhag]

It's bad to fire someone for being gay.

It's good to fire someone for being a Nazi.

There is no moral equivalence.

Being gay is a choice.

Some people are just born as Nazis.

This is a moral outrage.

Spoiler

/s because even in GAF there's a Nazi defense force.

 

[ronaldthump]

You guys do know some sympathizer will just hire him back and probably give him a better paying job just for spite right?

a big what if. Anyhow, he's marked now for life. Everyone can do a search and this will show up.

 

[Shadybiz]

Good. Zero sympathy.

 

[OG Shaka Zulu]

This guy flew all the way from Berkeley to Charlottesville to attend a White Supremacist rally. What the fuck...

Lmao I couldn't wrap my head around it either.

 

[LegendofLex]

If you are drawing parallels between the above and being a Nazis, then at best you are being disingenuous or ignorant. I'm not here for this.

I'm not?

I don't like saying "it's okay to fire people if you violently disagree with their beliefs."

I don't like saying it because anti-Nazis aren't the only people who violently disagree with people's beliefs. I don't like saying it because lots of people have been fired for beliefs I agree with, and I already thought that wasn't okay.

I stand by the fact that that's not okay, and I don't make exceptions for the beliefs I disagree with, no matter how abhorrent I think those beliefs are.

 

[Massicot]

Good. I think exposure and accountability is a good move. I was glad when Google made YouTube use real people's names as it makes you responsible for what you say and do online too, though that got rolled back.

Though it does kind of make you wonder what steps are taken to ensure it's not mistaken association? Like if you were a white dude their to counter protest and a picture was taken of you and mislabeled. Though, in this instance that isn't the case, but that would suck if it did happen.

Reminds me of the Dallas (I think it was Dallas, some texas city) shooting where internet armchair detectives almost got an innocent man arrested just because there was a picture of him holding a gun (he was practicing his open carry right afaik). And he ended up being in custody for far longer than should have ever been needed.

I am in full support of naming and shaming all these fuckers, but I just hope all steps are taken to ensure the correct people are identified.

 

[entremet]

If you're an employee and decide to endorse some vile views, don't be surprised if you lose your job if you're found out.

Freedom of Speech doesn't protect you from that.

 

[autumnleaf]

 

[commedieu]

You guys do know some sympathizer will just hire him back and probably give him a better paying job just for spite right?

I'm sure some white supremacists will give him work that sympathize with fascism and nazis.

Let's see that company announce it.

 

[C.Mongler]

I'm not worried about Nazis losing their jobs.

I'm worried about this tactic becoming a new normal that all sides use to punish their opponents.

I remember condemning employers who fired people for being gay, for supporting abortion, etc. If that's not okay, this shouldn't be okay, either.

"One side" would cheer and/or participate in a state sanctioned genocide of minorities. "One side" wants to happily and openly be in a relationship with someone with the same ding-dongs as them.

Simplifying it a bit, but I fail to see the equivalence here.

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

You guys do know some sympathizer will just hire him back and probably give him a better paying job just for spite right?

Aside from the police force, I can't think of any jobs that regularly employ white supremacists.

edit: Oops, and the NRA.

 

[Somnid]

It's bad to fire someone for being gay.

It's good to fire someone for being a Nazi.

There is no moral equivalence.

Right but that person who outs someone for being gay thinks they did something morally good and you've said as long as it's moral it's okay. What you should see is that you actually disagree on what is moral, so you need to have a means to rectify that. Note that depending on where you are you may or may not have a public majority.

 

[Mahonay]

I'm not?

I don't like saying "it's okay to fire people if you violently disagree with their beliefs."

I don't like saying it because anti-Nazis aren't the only people who violently disagree with people's beliefs. I don't like saying it because lots of people have been fired for beliefs I agree with, and I already thought that wasn't okay.

I stand by the fact that that's not okay, and I don't make exceptions for the beliefs I disagree with, no matter how abhorrent I think those beliefs are.

Please explain what beliefs you're talking about. You're being vague as fuck.

 

[studyguy]

This guy flew all the way from Berkeley to Charlottesville to attend a White Supremacist rally. What the fuck...

Really tells you how involved into the whole deal some of these people are.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

They just murdered a woman by running her over.

They're already emboldened by the racist-in-chief.

And some buckets (or supersoakers) of urine should ensure those hoods come off real fast.

there's levels to this shit fam. running over people is a helluval level to be sure, but then there's blowing up buildings (churches, homes, urban centers), terrorizing families of color for living in neighborhoods, dragging people to death like they did James Byrd just 20 years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_James_Byrd_Jr.

They strung this man to a truck and dragged him for 3 miles until there was nothing left but his torso.

So yea, it can get much, much worse. Hell, it's been a good while since I saw a noose on a tree outside an elementary school. This can get much, much darker.

 

[Doominated]

It is free speech. It's also consequences of free speech, and one of the benefits of at-will employment that business can drop these tools for no other reason but that they find their employees outside acts unacceptable.

I never said it wasn't free speech, just that we probably won't see public figures and major outlets "defending" it because of that. The acceptance and false equivalence out there just kind of adds fuel to the fire for these scumbags. The less people telling them it's okay to be like this or that there are people just as bad out there, the less we'll see them outwardly act like this.

At least, theoretically. Lol

 

[TheRagnCajun]

Pretty much. The employer is well within their right. And describing white supremacy as an 'undesirable political belief' has to be the mischaracterization of the century. Liberal/conservative, social/capitalsm, democrat/republican are political ideals that arguably should not exclude someone from a job. White supremacy does not fit into that basket.

 

[LegendofLex]

"One side" would cheer and/or participate in a state sanctioned genocide of minorities. "One side" wants to happily and openly be in a relationship with someone with the same ding-dongs as them.

Simplifying it a bit, but I fail to see the equivalence here.

You're arguing about the moral equivalence between the beliefs.

I'm arguing about whether we can control who draws the line about what beliefs are acceptable enough for someone to be employable if we decide it's okay in any circumstance.

Please explain what beliefs you're talking about. You're being vague as fuck.

To grab something from exactly opposite to my political leanings:

I don't think it's ever okay to fire someone who supports abortion, regardless of how wrong you think abortion is. Some people literally see abortion as murder and don't think it's ever acceptable. I don't agree, but I can see how someone who has arrived at their set of conclusions would see it as a really horrible human rights tragedy that shouldn't be tolerated.

Nevertheless, I don't think someone should be fired who supports abortion, no matter how strongly their employer disapproves of that support.

 

[Snkfanatic]

Perfect

 

[SeanTSC]

I'm not?

I don't like saying "it's okay to fire people if you violently disagree with their beliefs."

I don't like saying it because anti-Nazis aren't the only people who violently disagree with people's beliefs. I don't like saying it because lots of people have been fired for beliefs I agree with, and I already thought that wasn't okay.

I stand by the fact that that's not okay, and I don't make exceptions for the beliefs I disagree with, no matter how abhorrent I think those beliefs are.

Standing up for someone's "right" to believe that Killing All The Jews and Minorities is what everyone should be doing with their lives is fucked up no matter how you want to spin it. Don't.

 

[Marvel]

 

[AkumaNiko]

I'v never been a fan of doxxing, but in this case, if these people are 1000% sure they are the same as the ones at the march, fuck em.

 

[Quixzlizx]

I'm not?

I don't like saying "it's okay to fire people if you violently disagree with their beliefs."

I don't like saying it because anti-Nazis aren't the only people who violently disagree with people's beliefs. I don't like saying it because lots of people have been fired for beliefs I agree with, and I already thought that wasn't okay.

I stand by the fact that that's not okay, and I don't make exceptions for the beliefs I disagree with, no matter how abhorrent I think those beliefs are.

It's really obnoxious how many "liberals" are clueless about liberal values and think being a liberal is just about being open-minded without context.

When keeping it postmodern goes wrong.

Right but that person who outs someone for being gay thinks they did something morally good and you've said as long as it's moral it's okay. What you should see is that you actually disagree on what is moral, so you need to have a means to rectify that. Note that depending on where you are you may or may not have a public majority.

Damn, I didn't realize that. Thanks for enlightening me.

 

[ronaldthump]

there's levels to this shit fam. running over people is a helluval level to be sure, but then there's blowing up buildings, terrorizing families of color for living in neighborhoods, dragging people to death like they did James Byrd just 20 years ago.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_James_Byrd_Jr.

They strung this man to a truck and dragged him for 3 miles until there was nothing left but his torso.

So yea, it can get much, much worse. Hell, it's been a good while since I saw a noose on a tree outside an elementary school. This can get much, much darker.

Trump has emboldened this. I mean when he got elected some gay guy got based in Santa Monica (I think) and that's just day one. This is now and I don't see things changing unless Trump gets the boot. I can't imagine if America keeps Trump as president in 4 years. That would be insane.

 

[Darryl M R]

You're arguing about the moral equivalence between the beliefs.

I'm arguing about whether we can control who draws the line about what beliefs are acceptable enough for someone to be employable if we decide it's okay in any circumstance.

Nazism is the line.

History drew this line.

 

[Felix Lighter]

Good. Society needs to remind these piles of human waste that they are outcasts.