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[Sesha]

Witcher 3 getting 150+ GOTY awards doesn't mean more open world games because the industry was headed there anyway. The take-away of Witcher 3 winning over Fallout 4 or MGS5 should be that people want well-designed, feature-complete games with a strong story and a rich game world.
The real tragedy is Bloodborne losing to MGS5 and Fallout 4, two games that are either broken or unfinished, with huge empty worlds that favor mileage over good design. Witcher 3 winning still implies a mainstream desire for good design, or at least that good design is held in esteem.

As for Bayonetta 2, comparing it to TWD doesn't make much sense. After all, Shadow of Mordor and Dragon Age: Inquisition won GOTY that year, which the latter did solely on the novelty of the Nemesis system, despite being a rather tepid game overall. Its visual design and it being on the Wii U didn't help Bayonetta 2 garner favor among the press either.

Strong combat will never be the focus of AAA sphere, regardless of what the best-selling or most critically acclaimed games do. Just look at CoD vs. its imitators. CoDs gunplay is stronger than most of its competitors, but that didn't stop the industry from copying CoD at a surface-level as a way of chasing sales.

The industry is driven by public opinion. Sales numbers and open world games being the general GOTY candidates for two years now indicate that people generally desire quantity more than quality. At least Witcher 3 winning is an overall win for good game design and good writing, over Mordor and Inquisition winning last year.

 

[GuardianE]

Are there really no checkpoints in levels in this game? I died in a secret mission...A SECRET MISSION...and hit continue only to be plopped back at the start of the level and have to smack all those stupid spinny things around again. Wtf.

There are checkpoints and autosaves, and they're usually after going through a door (not always). Sounds like you got unlucky.

Also, be sure to manually save if you ever think you're going to die. You'll maintain your red orb/proud orb count.

 

[Fancy Clown]

There are checkpoints and autosaves, and they're usually after going through a door (not always). Sounds like you got unlucky.

Also, be sure to manually save if you ever think you're going to die. You'll maintain your red orb/proud orb count.

I didnt know there was a manual save, that's good to know. Huh, well I'm glad there are checkpoints but I went through a ton of doors but if I ever died and hit continue I would just start at the beginning of the mission.

 

[Dahbomb]

Are there really no checkpoints in levels in this game? I died in a secret mission...A SECRET MISSION...and hit continue only to be plopped back at the start of the level and have to smack all those stupid spinny things around again. Wtf.

It's very rare to actually die in a secret missions. If you think you are about to die in a secret mission then you should try to fail it instead.

Secret missions put you at the previous checkpoint which can mess you up. The game does have very regular checkpoints especially before bosses and stuff but with secret missions it doesn't actually follow the regular checkpoints because in most of them you aren't even supposed to die.

 

[Seyavesh]

I didnt know there was a manual save, that's good to know. Huh, well I'm glad there are checkpoints but I went through a ton of doors but if I ever died and hit continue I would just start at the beginning of the mission.

to note, gold orbs also let you revive on the spot- red orbs are plentiful so investing in one for when things go real south is usually worth it

also i can't make heads or tails of this 3dsmax tool.
i just want to give dante vergil's pants/boots gahh
at least golnei's old advice on normal map stuff still applies

 

[Sesha]

Speaking of checkpoints. Going forward, what would be the optimal balance of accessibility and challenge? Having frequent checkpoints, auto-saves, and the ability to continue from the last checkpoint if you quit to the menu like DmC, but with enemies and bosses being more challenging (faster, more intelligent AI, more aggressive, dealing more damage)? Or, keeping the same system as in DMC4 with infrequent checkpoints with enemies being on a similar line to DMC3 or DMC4 in terms of difficulty?

I choose the first option without hesitation, but I know there's a lot of people that want DMC to be as inaccessible as possible, even if the actual gameplay is less difficult as a result.

 

[GuardianE]

I didnt know there was a manual save, that's good to know. Huh, well I'm glad there are checkpoints but I went through a ton of doors but if I ever died and hit continue I would just start at the beginning of the mission.

Note that the manual save doesn't save where you are in the level. It only saves your currency. But still, that's one less thing to worry about after a death. You're still making progress.

Speaking of checkpoints. Going forward, what would be the optimal balance of accessibility and challenge? Having frequent checkpoints, auto-saves, and the ability to continue from the last checkpoint if you quit to the mention like DmC, but with enemies and bosses being more challenging (faster, more intelligent AI, more aggressive, dealing more damage)? Or, keeping the same system as in DMC4 with infrequent checkpoints with enemies being on a similar line to DMC3 or DMC4 in terms of difficulty?

I choose the first option without hesitation, but I know there's a lot of people that want DMC to be as inaccessible as possible, even if the actual gameplay is more difficult.

I'd say to give us a gold/yellow orb type of option, with the gold having generous checkpoints. It lets us play how we want to. Give us multiple save slots so we can play it both ways as well.

Enemies and bosses should be more challenging and smarter in general. I don't want the checkpoint system or lack thereof to hold that element back.

 

[Sesha]

Having an option would be ideal they manage to balance the game properly. The way it would function could be, getting an option when you start a new game that you can adjust in the menu, like "casual/modern" being like DmC, "classic" being like DMC3/4 with infrequent checkpoints, and "hardcore" with no checkpoints at all and only gold orbs as a recovery system. Auto-save could also be an option you choose at the beginning and can later adjust.

As for enemies/bosses/difficulty in general, my fear is that they'll hold back on the difficulty in fear of alienating a wider audience. Having at least the option of DmC-like accessibility should ideally mitigate that factor. At any rate they shouldn't be stuck between catering either to hardcore fans or the casual audience.

 

[Dahbomb]

Never cared for the checkpoint system in original DMC3 and DMC1 (that used limited checkpoints). It's an archaic difficulty inflator.

Default option should be unlimited checkpoints that are spread reasonably well in a mission (before every decently challenging encounter) and then players who want that limited checkpoint system should go into a menu and change it themselves.

And they have to crank up the AI a lot no matter what checkpoint system they use.

 

[Fancy Clown]

The secret mission I was on had no timer I don't think (the aerial buster 5 times) so I'm not sure how to fail it without dying.

Really good to hear there are checkpoints in the missions, I guess I just haden't reached one in it yet. I'm making super slow progress in this thanks to the like 5 other games I'm playing right now + discovering Hearthstone. Still, the sweet combat will keep me coming back.

 

[GuardianE]

The secret mission I was on had no timer I don't think (the aerial buster 5 times) so I'm not sure how to fail it without dying.

Really good to hear there are checkpoints in the missions, I guess I just haden't reached one in it yet. I'm making super slow progress in this thanks to the like 5 other games I'm playing right now + discovering Hearthstone. Still, the sweet combat will keep me coming back.

In those instances, you can usually leave the room to fail the mission. It's not always clear.

 

[OniBaka]

They should have boss fights on separate missions like how DmC done it, saves time when you just want to fight the boss on replays.

 

[Seyavesh]

definitely have boss fights as their own missions, but otherwise dmc3/4 style gold orb + checkpoints system is the best
just make the checkpoints more common- like maybe every two fights instead of 3/4

also i updated my judgement cut mod and i think it's more or less at dmc3 status now barring some glitches and stuff- the slashes are less 'modern' and more in line with dmc3's stuff which i think looks cooler.
plus updating the orbs and timing to just generally look better/more accurate

 

[Dahbomb]

They should have boss fights on separate missions like how DmC done it, saves time when you just want to fight the boss on replays.

Yeah that was one of the things that the game did right although sometimes there was still a little bit of hike required to get to the boss in the mission (like the Succubus).

 

[GuardianE]

Donguri's first gameplay and Boss Rush video for 2016
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntfJpVNKQWs

I think he's sporting some version of Seyavesh's judgment cut mod.

They should have boss fights on separate missions like how DmC done it, saves time when you just want to fight the boss on replays.

Boss rush/selection would negate the need for this, and should definitely be a standard by now.

 

[Seyavesh]

I think he's sporting some version of Seyavesh's judgment cut mod.

yeah, he's using a version edited by a japanese modder named flemia- he/she figured out how to do the JCE with orbs and i based my JCE stuff off his work
the version he used to do his edits/JCE though drives me nuts though 'cuz they're from one of the first revisions of the dmc3 JC mod haha

i really want to get rid of vergil's dumb shoulder straps and thing on his back across his shoulders that dante also has (idk the name) but the 3dsmax script makes no sense to me in terms of output

 

[BumblebeeCody]

They should have boss fights on separate missions like how DmC done it, saves time when you just want to fight the boss on replays.

Yeah there's a few things DmC got right that I think embraced players being able to practice such as no timers, training room and boss missions.
DMC(5) needs to sever it's ties with Resident Evil and just be a DMC game.

 

[Seyavesh]

that max concentration judgement cut ayyy
mostly thinking that dahbomb would like this

(the regular ingame judgement cut is the lvl0 concentration one hahaaaa)

 

[GalacticAE]

SpoilerAL files for SE with DMD and GMD for bloody palace in case anyone else has been looking:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/ciw5t5tzfro6azu/DMC4SE+SpoilerAL.zip

 

[Dahbomb]

Man if DMC5 comes out and it sucks, I don't know what I would do. Probably take up alcoholism and start listening to Linkin' Park.

 

[Mizerman]

Man if DMC5 comes out and it sucks, I don't know what I would do. Probably take up alcoholism and start listening to Linkin' Park.

Damn.

If DMC5 ends up disappointing greatly, there will be no mercy.

 

[direct_quote]

Man if DMC5 comes out and it sucks, I don't know what I would do. Probably take up alcoholism and start listening to Linkin' Park.

You didn't do that when DmC was first revealed?

 

[Dahbomb]

You didn't do that when DmC was first revealed?

It was a gut punch for sure but the DmC remake always felt like a side thing to me. Like if it ended up being awful (which it wasn't, it's now a pretty damn good action game) I could've just said "welp, guess they shouldn't have outsourced it".

With DMC5... if they are making it internally and they get Itsuno to make it plus they make no other glaring mistake in the development (meaning it isn't rushed, has a proper budget)... and it STILL sucks... there would be nothing left to pin the problem on. It's easy to blame DmC's shortcoming on greedy Capcom CEOs but if DMC5 ends up being bad then there is no where to go.

Basically what would end up happening is that the Platinum fanboys will get whipped into a frenzy and a DMC6 without Kamiya/PG would not even be entertained.


I guess this is how Star Wars fan felt going into The Force Awakens.

 

[Seyavesh]

honestly the way i see it is that they can't screw up more than dmc4 which is already clearly the product of very very very tumultuous development- and unlike movies which are a non-interactive experience, the experience of playing 3/4 and getting better at them will always be there. it's one of the strengths of games as a medium (unless obviously it threatens to kill a healthy franchise/game style you enjoy like DmC)

edit:
found something cool with vergil
if you do the lockon teleport near the end/during the end of rapid slash while above the enemy while they're also in a juggle state you do the boost off ledge animation after teleporting (i think or something??) from your teleport with an insane amount of inertia
see:
https://a.pomf.cat/poqkhg.webm

 

[OniBaka]

that max concentration judgement cut ayyy
mostly thinking that dahbomb would like this

(the regular ingame judgement cut is the lvl0 concentration one hahaaaa)

Have you tried using that effect for rapid slash?

 

[ResourcefulStar]

Hello, DMCGAF. Long time lurker, first time poster, etc.

I'd like DMC 5 to borrow the splitting of missions into separately ranked fights, seen in Platinum games, but take it one step further and allow the player to replay any individual fight via the mission select menu. It would remove the need for a separate boss rush mode as well.

The question is whether the player should be allowed to set a new record when replaying a fight this way and improve the overall rank for the mission without replaying the mission as a whole. To compensate, Capcom could simply increase the style point requirements for getting S-ranks and make taking no damage mandatory. Thoughts?

 

[Seyavesh]

edit: made a vid about the tech mentioned above
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYXIjOlkQW0

The question is whether the player should be allowed to set a new record when replaying a fight this way and improve the overall rank for the mission without replaying the mission as a whole. To compensate, Capcom could simply increase the style point requirements for getting S-ranks and make taking no damage mandatory. Thoughts?

this system would be good. in regards to ranking: also don't let the player set any ranking with it. giving the player the ability to fight whatever section they want immediately with whatever setup they want is good enough imo- ranking and judgement for sections is very much ultimately a full mission run kinda deal.

Have you tried using that effect for rapid slash?

i haven't, but i just tried and the result was pretty messy and bad lookin'- the way rapid slash spawns effects is pretty nutty as it spawns a massive amount of 'em. even replacing the effect with a regular slash results in stuff like this:

 

[OniBaka]

Some good tips for Vergil combos, english translation is in the description.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmoYV5BKzcU

 

[AgentLampshade]

Haha, I remember reading the headline from Kotaku I think it was: Devil May Cry 5 unveiled and it's not what you expected. I was like "yeah, how bad can it be? As long as Dante is in, it'll be alright." Then later on that day I saw that monumentally awful reveal trailer. I bought a bottle of rum and got wrecked that night.

 

[darkslayer101]

Haha, I remember reading the headline from Kotaku I think it was: Devil May Cry 5 unveiled and it's not what you expected. I was like "yeah, how bad can it be? As long as Dante is in, it'll be alright." Then later on that day I saw that monumentally awful reveal trailer. I bought a bottle of rum and got wrecked that night.

I remember that day too... it was awful and i was depressed on the prospect of a proper devil may cry. At least we got through the rough parts and onto to greener pastures.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

I wish there was at least a leak or even rumor about DMC5. Someone who worked on the game and put it on his/her resume, or a leaked picture, or even a logo.

Just something, anything, to give us a little reassurance. (And direction about what it could be)

 

[Sesha]

I wish there was at least a leak or even rumor about DMC5. Someone who worked on the game and put it on his/her resume, or a leaked picture, or even a logo.

Just something, anything, to give us a little reassurance. (And direction about what it could be)

There was Reuben Langdon claiming that he heard on the grapevine that DMC5 is happening, Verendus disclosing to us after the DmCE/DMC4SE announcement that a new DMC was coming, and the again his E3 "wish list" which mentioned DMC5, and finally the "Devil May Cry series" mention on Capcom's integrated report in October last year.

It's not much, but Capcom's games usually don't leak months beforehand. The ones that do leak are usually their fighting games, and it's usually character stuff, as we can remember from SF4, (U)MvC3 and SF5.

 

[GuardianE]

Hello, DMCGAF. Long time lurker, first time poster, etc.

I'd like DMC 5 to borrow the splitting of missions into separately ranked fights, seen in Platinum games, but take it one step further and allow the player to replay any individual fight via the mission select menu. It would remove the need for a separate boss rush mode as well.

The question is whether the player should be allowed to set a new record when replaying a fight this way and improve the overall rank for the mission without replaying the mission as a whole. To compensate, Capcom could simply increase the style point requirements for getting S-ranks and make taking no damage mandatory. Thoughts?

Welcome! I still like the idea of boss rush for score or time attack purposes. They can even have challenges with multiple bosses at the same time, or DLC legacy bosses. But more options are good, so I'd like to be able to select any particular "ranked" fight throughout the game to practice on. I think they should rank the fights only if you're playing through the actual Mission from start to finish.

There was Reuben Langdon claiming that he heard on the grapevine that DMC5 is happening, Verendus disclosing to us after the DmCE/DMC4SE announcement that a new DMC was coming, and the again his E3 "wish list" which mentioned DMC5, and finally the "Devil May Cry series" mention on Capcom's integrated report in October last year.

It's not much, but Capcom's games usually don't leak months beforehand. The ones that do leak are usually their fighting games, and it's usually character stuff, as we can remember from SF4, (U)MvC3 and SF5.

This. There's writing on the wall, and has been. We in this thread are aware of these things better than most. I'm not sweating.

 

[ShinMaruku]

What tools do you guys use on Trish? I am trying to nail her down but she's kinda mixeed up with me since I love her Chun Li style more than using Sparda am I using her wrong?

 

[Akiller]

.

 

[GuardianE]

.

Goddamn those are expensive. I'd love a PVC scale. Those are more reasonably priced.

Looks sick so far though.

 

[Dahbomb]

.

When's Vergil though?

 

[GuardianE]

When's Vergil though?

They're making both Dante and Vergil. And they're supposed to fit together to make a scene.

 

[Seyavesh]

i wonder if they're gonna base it off his really weird lookin' dmc4se face since dante seems to be based off his dmc4 iteration

 

[Sesha]

Won't be the same without an adult Vergil. Capcom pls.

 

[.....]

Some good tips for Vergil combos, english translation is in the description.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmoYV5BKzcU

Nice find! Some interesting stuff here.

 

[Golnei]

Looking at them side-by-side, it's weird that the Devil Trigger makes Dante's lips thicker.

Spoiler

Kaneko's impact.

 

[direct_quote]

When's Vergil though?

Probably saving it for when DMC5 older Vergil is revealed. Vergil confirmed in DMC5 baby!

 

[Son Of Sparda]

There was Reuben Langdon claiming that he heard on the grapevine that DMC5 is happening, Verendus disclosing to us after the DmCE/DMC4SE announcement that a new DMC was coming, and the again his E3 "wish list" which mentioned DMC5, and finally the "Devil May Cry series" mention on Capcom's integrated report in October last year.

It's not much, but Capcom's games usually don't leak months beforehand. The ones that do leak are usually their fighting games, and it's usually character stuff, as we can remember from SF4, (U)MvC3 and SF5.

I know. But still, I would love to have something a little more substantive. Something to give us a little hint about what directions they would be taking with the next game, like the current AC:Empires rumor that's floating around. (Kotaku one, not the 4chan stuff)

It's the same with RE7. It's been rumored for ages, yet we practically know nothing about it. Come on Capcom, just show something already!

 

[Dahbomb]

The leakers that work on SFV need to take a stroll through Itsuno's office and see what's up.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

For real, lol.

BTW, how big of leak was the SFV's anyway? I think I remember the trailer being leaked a couple days before the actual announcement. Was there anything else?

 

[Dahbomb]

For real, lol.

BTW, how big of leak was the SFV's anyway? I think I remember the trailer being leaked a couple days before the actual announcement. Was there anything else?

Ken Bogard leaked the mechanics, model and characters way in advance. Even leaked the name of the new characters. He did say they would include Zen but I think internally they changed that character's name to FANG (he called Laura and Rashid).

Roster lists were kinda sorta leaked before as well and then the DLC characters were data mined after the game's beta.


There has a never been a DMC leak before. DMC3 we knew about the existence of because the mo-cap for Lady said she was working on a new DMC game but aside from that we didn't know anything about the game until it was unveiled in PSM and then again at E3 with the trailer.

DMC3SE came from left field at TGS just like DmC DE and DMC4SE. No one saw it coming. DMC4 announcement also came from left field at E3.

DmC was hinted by Inafune a lot. He kept saying the next DMC game would be westernized. Then we kept hearing rumors about NT making the next DMC game. Nothing was exactly leaked about it, we got some fake story leaks about T-Rex Vergil and shit.

Historically DMC has been kept under wraps quite well although we have more rumors about DMC5 than we did for 3 and 4. Seems like Itsuno's dev team is pretty good at keeping things under wraps.

 

[Seyavesh]

t-rex vergil leak is fucking legendary
multiverse dantes teaming up to fight t-rex vergil
unfortunately this wasn't one of the cases where reality was stranger than fiction
man i can't find the original post for that geez it was way too good

 

[AgentLampshade]

Turns out the T-Rex thing was semi-true, just for another Capcom game.

 

[Mizerman]

If only that T-Rex Vergil thing was real. I would play it just for the sheer hilarity.