DontBeThatGuy
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CNN, please fuck off with these Trump supporters.
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Hillary Clinton Selects Tim Kaine As VP
- Thread starter giga
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And what about Republicans or those that lean Republican that end up voting for Hillary/Kaine? Or the people who will abstain from voting?
"with that as their platform"
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
Exactly.Boy, I'm watching his speech now and he is way more conversational than anyone else in the limelight. Not that it's the thing I judge politicians on, but Kaine is the prime "I'd like to have a beer with" candidate, right? Dude seems like a friendly neighbour.
univariate
Banned
This VP pick has brought out a pretty disgustingly prejudiced side of the left.
huh? people like him after his speech
Lord Frieza
Member
PBS
NYT
NPR
ABC/CBS/NBC news
Washington Post
That's it.
NPR and the Post I will actually agree with. PBS I don't really follow. Good reporting? The rest, though, eh. NY Times has some good articles, but I don't think I've ever been hugely impressed with their reporting. Then again, once I've started with Jazeera, I've not followed much else. I should branch out.
Aaronology
Member
They are not the majority, now are they? Hurt feelings don't change reality and the reality is that the GOP has won the white vote for generations on platforms that actively disenfranchise and antagonize people of color in America.And what about Republicans or those that lean Republican that end up voting for Hillary/Kaine? Or the people who will abstain from voting?
Good thing my exact words were "most white males vote Republican" and "If you vote for a party with that platform" then, isn't it?
Mind, not voting for Trump doesn't mean they're not voting for Republican Governors and Congressmen who support the same platform.
To me, and perhaps I'm wrong, but "most" suggests a gap that is much larger than what it actually is. Not a slight majority.
They are not the majority, now are they? Hurt feelings don't change reality and the reality is that the GOP has won the white vote for generations on platforms that actively disenfranchise and antagonize people of color in America.
I totally agree.
I actually didn't realize that the majority of white men vote Republican. I should have realized it but never gave it much thought. And yes, that upsets me quite a bit. But nevertheless, from the data I was just looking at, the difference isn't so great that people should be saying "most white men". Majority is fine, but most seems superfluous.
A Link to the Past
Banned
And what about Republicans or those that lean Republican that end up voting for Clinton/Kaine? Or the people who will abstain from voting because for whatever reason they don't want Clinton/Kaine elected?
People voting in Republicans has brought onto a lot of people a lot of suffering, harm, and death. So yes, people ARE going to hold you responsible for that. Just because you're a single-issue voter doesn't change the fact that your vote lead to a president who institutes discriminatory programs. Politeness hasn't exactly worked to get Republicans to knock that off - in fact, Republicans are voting for people who are further right than they were 10 years ago with the Tea Party.
eyeball_kid
Member
I can understand some of the sentiment. In the year 2016, we have 4 White people on the ticket. This country is moving away from the White majority so it is frustrating that minorities aren't better represented here.
I heard some analysis yesterday that Kaine was primarily picked because his open Senate seat would mean the Democratic governor of Virginia could fill Kaine's seat with another Democrat. With any potential Senator VP pick, a Republican would have filled the seat.
Kaine feels like an actor playing a VP on television. Very generic and forgettable. He's to the right of Clinton, which is basically a middle finger to all of us who voted Bernie in the primary. But I'm sure it's all very calculated by Clinton's team to bring over GOP voters who don't like the stench of Trump.
excelsiorlef
Member
A lot of good people are Republicans too. Don't make the mistake of thinking every Republican is now supporting Trump. To even suggest that every single white Republican is not empathetic to minorities is disgusting.
Ok fine.
Reagan, Nixon, GW Bush....
They are not the majority, now are they? Hurt feelings don't change reality and the reality is that the GOP has won the white vote for generations on platforms that actively disenfranchise and antagonize people of color in America.
I totally agree.
I actually didn't realize that the majority of white men in the nation vote Republican. Obviously I knew that Republicans are made up of mostly white people but the word "majority" never really came to mind. I just never gave it much thought on a national level. And yes, that upsets me quite a bit. But nevertheless, from the data I was just looking at, the difference isn't so great that people should be saying "most white men". Majority is fine, but "most" seems superfluous or hyperbolic to the point that it risks coming across as racist.
I totally agree.
I actually didn't realize that the majority of white men vote Republican. I should have realized it but never gave it much thought. And yes, that upsets me quite a bit. But nevertheless, from the data I was just looking at, the difference isn't so great that people should be saying "most white men". Majority is fine, but most seems superfluous.
It's the only reason general elections are remotely close.
To me, and perhaps I'm wrong, but "most" suggests a gap that is much larger than what it actually is. Not a slight majority.
Average suggests a mean or median number.
If only 51% of white males voted Republican (and it is a great deal more than that) and Republican voters are unsympathetic (based on the platform, they are) then the average white male is still a Republican voter and still unsympathetic.
I'm sorry, but those are the facts.
It's a bitch growing up black and knowing most white folks couldn't give a shit about you.
Dash_Riprock
Member
A lot of good people are Republicans too.
I've yet to meet any this election cycle.
Already Torn
Banned
Some of my "would be #BernieOrBust but have a conscience" friends on Facebook keep posting the "wow this is a boring ticket" stuff on Facebook. I really don't get it. What does an exciting ticket look like? Trump? An 80 year old white guy? Kanye?
Won't somebody think of the White people, that have served as President and VP for the last two centuries with one recent exception.This VP pick has brought out a pretty disgustingly prejudiced side of the left.
I mean that's what the sentiment is about. It's not racism against Whites.
Some of my "would be #BernieOrBust but have a conscience" friends on Facebook keep posting the "wow this is a boring ticket" stuff on Facebook. I really don't get it. What does an exciting ticket look like? Trump? An 80 year old white guy? Kanye?
Well he didn't hold a lighter up to the US constitution, so yeah, boring.
Won't somebody think of the White people, that have served as President and VP for the last two centuries with one recent exception.
I mean that's what the sentiment is about. It's not racism against Whites.
You're actually arguing in favor of prejudice. Amazing.
Already Torn
Banned
It's just kind of super weird to me. LikeWell he didn't hold a lighter up to the US constitution, so yeah, boring.
"We need to defeat Trump. He can't win. The Democrats can't afford to make even the slightest mistake, which they may have already done by selecting an untrustworthy candidate like Hillary."
"Oh, of course they picked the safe, smart, moderate choice for VP. Meeeehhhhhhhhhh."
???
I wouldn't call it predjudice so much as fatigue, but I don't know what specific statements you two are talking about.You're actually arguing in favor of prejudice. Amazing.
Ok fine.
Reagan, Nixon, GW Bush....
Reagan supported amnesty for illegal immigrants, Bush campaigned hard for Hispanics, Nixon... yeah.
But I certainly didn't agree with the people, that doesn't mean I couldn't respect those who voted for them, as long as it was for the right reason.
You're actually arguing in favor of prejudice. Amazing.
Sure, that's what I'm doing. i suppose that's what affirmative action is too.
It's just kind of super weird to me. Like
"We need to defeat Trump. He can't win. The Democrats can't afford to make even the slightest mistake, which they may have already done by selecting an untrustworthy candidate like Hillary."
"Oh, of course they picked the safe, smart, moderate choice for VP. Meeeehhhhhhhhhh."
???
Yeah, it's weird. You know who was an exciting VP pick? Sarah Palin.
Exciting to one person is young, juvenile and inexperienced to another. I don't think there's any merit in going for excitement when choosing a VP.
Lord Frieza
Member
I heard some analysis yesterday that Kaine was primarily picked because his open Senate seat would mean the Democratic governor of Virginia could fill Kaine's seat with another Democrat. With any potential Senator VP pick, a Republican would have filled the seat.
Kaine feels like an actor playing a VP on television. Very generic and forgettable. He's to the right of Clinton, which is basically a middle finger to all of us who voted Bernie in the primary. But I'm sure it's all very calculated by Clinton's team to bring over GOP voters who don't like the stench of Trump.
What the hell is this supposed to mean? No one was expecting Bernie to be her VP, surely. Endorsement, sure, but they were way too far apart for that to be a realistic possibility.
A Link to the Past
Banned
You're actually arguing in favor of prejudice. Amazing.
Figured I'd borrow this line from that other thread, because it fits so well with your post.
"When you’re accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression."
People don't dislike Tim Kaine for being white, people dislike that we couldn't get a non-white VP.
TheGreatMightyPoo
Banned
You're acting like Hillary's the underdog.The guy made a great entrance imo
Really well spoken and is going to be an asset.
If she can get Bill, Bernie, Obama and Warren on the trail for her we have a chance
Oh wait, right mindset to have.
You're acting like Hillary's the underdog.
Oh wait, right mindset to have.
Yep, complacency and Bernie voters shrugging their shoulders and staying home is a recipe for a Trump dystopia coming true.
We have to win those swing states
eyeball_kid
Member
What the hell is this supposed to mean? No one was expecting Bernie to be her VP, surely. Endorsement, sure, but they were way too far apart for that to be a realistic possibility.
Most Bernie supporters wanted Warren as the VP, as they are fairly ideologically aligned.
Figured I'd borrow this line from that other thread, because it fits so well with your post.
"When youre accustomed to privilege, equality feels like oppression."
That's a great quote. Thanks.
Enter the Dragon Punch
Banned
I'm assuming old but in the event it isn't
Kaine praised TPP as recently as Thursday
Kaine praised TPP as recently as Thursday
Sen. Tim Kaine (D-Va.) reportedly told Hillary Clinton he would oppose the Trans-Pacific Partnership before she selected him as her running mate but as recently as Thursday, the Virginia senator was praising the massive trade deal.
The Huffington Post reported Friday night that Kaine told Clinton he would oppose the trade deal between the United States and 11 other Pacific Rim nations. According to the report, Kaine said he agreed with Clinton who had helped negotiate the trade deal as secretary of state but now opposes as the Democratic presidential nominee that the TPP did not meet certain standards on wages and national security.
But one day prior, the pro-trade senator still had warm words for the Pacific trade pact.
"I am having discussions with a lot of groups around Virginia about the treaty itself. I see much in it to like, Kaine said Thursday during a series of roundtable events in suburban northern Virginia. I think it's an upgrade of labor standards, I think it's an upgrade of environmental standards. I think it's an upgrade of intellectual property protections".
Lord Frieza
Member
Most Bernie supporters wanted Warren as the VP, as they are fairly ideologically aligned.
Still, calling it a middle finger to Bernie supporters is a bit much
You Are Viewtiful
Member
Won't somebody think of the White people, that have served as President and VP for the last two centuries with one recent exception.
I mean that's what the sentiment is about. It's not racism against Whites.
It's still egregious to say that about Tim Kaine of all people. Even from a racial issues perspective, he is a terrific pick. This man is a true ally, from the work he did in Honduras and the work he did as a lawyer. He is the real deal.
Judge a person by the content of their character, not the colour of their skin.
(This post is directed towards those who think Kaine is a disappointing pick e.g calling it "disgusting").
Most Bernie supporters wanted Warren as the VP, as they are fairly ideologically aligned.
That would mean allowing a Republican governor to appoint her Senate replacement. She was never really in the running.
People need to accept the reality that Obama will most likely get TPP past in the lame duck. It's his primary foreign policy in his second term after the Iran deal and he will do what it takes to get it done.
Lord Frieza
Member
I'm with him. I enjoyed The Phantom Pain, too, I don't care what anyone says.
I'm sorry
That would mean allowing a Republican governor to appoint her Senate replacement. She was never really in the running.
Neither was Booker, for the same reason. When it comes down to it, boring pick or not, old white dude or not, he was the right choice. The most experienced, likable, in the position to be replaced by a democrat, and more. There was really no other option.
metalslimer
Member
People need to accept the reality that Obama will most likely get TPP past in the lame duck. It's his primary foreign policy in his second term after the Iran deal and he will do what it takes to get it done.
Yep, Hilary has a few problems with it, but if it came down to voting for or against she would vote for it.
Kaine is a demographic trifecta: white working-class background, fluency in Spanish that allows him to speak directly to Hispanic voters, and positive history of working African-American communities.
Booker was one of the last finalists. Replacing his Senate seat was probably a big consideration, but at the end of the day, he just didn't have nearly as much experience as Kaine.
Neither was Booker, for the same reason. When it comes down to it, boring pick or not, old white dude or not, he was the right choice. The most experienced, likable, in the position to be replaced by a democrat, and more. There was really no other option.
Booker was one of the last finalists. Replacing his Senate seat was probably a big consideration, but at the end of the day, he just didn't have nearly as much experience as Kaine.
Yep, Hilary has a few problems with it, but if it came down to voting for or against she would vote for it.
I say this as someone who has supported Hillary from the start: I don't see how anyone can't see that she's completely lying about being against the TPP. She's saying it because it was necessary against Bernie, and continues to say it to keep him in line and because she knows it doesn't need her support to pass in the lame duck. She'll get into office, make a brief showing of being very upset that it was passed before she could get there to stop it, and then get to work negotiating her own trade deals which she promises will be totally different and not at all like that awful evil TPP!
Tallshortman
Member
Ok fine.
Reagan, Nixon, GW Bush....
One of Bush's best initiatives was his anti-AIDS programs in Africa. He was many things, to say he had no empathy for non-whites is wrong.
One of Bush's best initiatives was his anti-AIDS programs in Africa. He was many things, to say he had no empathy for non-whites is wrong.
Bush also fought against anti-muslim rhetoric. Dude had some big faults, but he was still a statesman.
I say this as someone who has supported Hillary from the start: I don't see how anyone can't see that she's completely lying about being against the TPP. She's saying it because it was necessary against Bernie, and continues to say it to keep him in line and because she knows it doesn't need her support to pass in the lame duck. She'll get into office, make a brief showing of being very upset that it was passed before she could get there to stop it, and then get to work negotiating her own trade deals which she promises will be totally different and not at all like that awful evil TPP!
Indeed. Obama did the exact same thing
eyeball_kid
Member
Still, calling it a middle finger to Bernie supporters is a bit much
I don't think so. Kaine is not the person I want running as the Democratic nom in eight years. As someone who is to the right of Clinton, he's the wrong direction for the party from my perspective (and probably to many progressives).
It's still egregious to say that about Tim Kaine of all people. Even from a racial issues perspective, he is a terrific pick. This man is a true ally, from the work he did in Honduras and the work he did as a lawyer. He is the real deal.
Judge a person by the content of their character, not the colour of their skin.
(This post is directed towards those who think Kaine is a disappointing pick e.g calling it "disgusting").
This is true enough. And again, I don't even disagree with the pick. I just am saying I can understand the disappointment by some at seeing yet another White Male on the ticket when there are capable minority picks.
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