Dude, u can't tell people how to spend their money. Especially when your argument is pretty dumb. Internet service is much more expensive than a console.My Marine buddy was in Iraq for a couple years. They played ancient, shitty PS2 and Gamecube games because that's all they had. He once told me that if he ever sees the Jedi Starfighter game case again, he will get PTSD. He was kidding (I think).
People who live in truly shitty areas of the world also may not have a high degree of personal safety, or they might not have the greatest cars, etc. etc.. I would think Internet and high end gaming systems would be the least of their concerns.
Kuchera also fails to understand that it's certain feasible for someone to pay 500$ for a new console, but stop before paying 80$ a month for internet considering that internet is not uniformly priced even within the United States, let alone the world.
The console is a one time cost, often bought with money saved up for Christmas over the year. Internet is recurring monthly and in some cases will overtake the money spent on the console itself in less than a year.
Is there any reason to assume publishers are lowering their prices?
My cousin shipped out to Afghanistan armed with 2 ps3s, 2 copies of fifa and 12 controllers.My Marine buddy was in Iraq for a couple years. They played ancient, shitty PS2 and Gamecube games because that's all they had. He once told me that if he ever sees the Jedi Starfighter game case again, he will get PTSD. He was kidding (I think).
People who live in truly shitty areas of the world also may not have a high degree of personal safety, or they might not have the greatest cars, etc. etc.. I would think Internet and high end gaming systems would be the least of their concerns.
Microsoft will not revise their used game strategy. This is the same argument that I heard with many people saying, "well if Sony improves their online services, all MS has to do is make Live free and they win!" No, they will never do that. That is leaving money on the table. They spent years developing this change in business model and they're not going to cut it out short of being Wii U levels of disastrous sales.
You're also assuming this change in business model won't seem to have any effect with consumers.
My cousin shipped out to Afghanistan armed with 2 ps3s, 2 copies of fifa and 12 controllers.
There was no internet, no tv, but by god at least there was football.
My Marine buddy was in Iraq for a couple years. They played ancient, shitty PS2 and Gamecube games because that's all they had. He once told me that if he ever sees the Jedi Starfighter game case again, he will get PTSD. He was kidding (I think).
People who live in truly shitty areas of the world also may not have a high degree of personal safety, or they might not have the greatest cars, etc. etc.. I would think Internet and high end gaming systems would be the least of their concerns.
Empathy has nothing to do with it. I come from the real world, where toys cost money. I have a huge degree of empathy for people who don't know where their next meal is coming from, whose children have cancer, a home situation where both parents are unemployed and their kids aren't getting medical care, or any number of awful circumstances.
I do not have a large degree of empathy for entitled shits who think that because they exist, they deserve very expensive toys for minimal amounts of money. So yes. I do lack a lot of empathy for certain types of people.
After all, as you say, the Wii U has no issue playing used games. There are zero restrictions on that system, and it is still tanking. Used games are hardly a deal maker or deal breaker.
Is there any reason to assume publishers are lowering their prices?
Dude, u can't tell people how to spend their money. Especially when your argument is pretty dumb. Internet service is much more expensive than a console.
Glad you're here to decide what people can and can't do with their money.
That's not even...remotely related.
Empathy has nothing to do with it.
I come from the real world, where toys cost money. I have a huge degree of empathy for people
Kuchera also fails to understand that it's certain feasible for someone to pay 500$ for a new console, but stop before paying 80$ a month for internet considering that internet is not uniformly priced even within the United States, let alone the world.
The console is a one time cost, often bought with money saved up for Christmas over the year. Internet is recurring monthly and in some cases will overtake the money spent on the console itself in less than a year.
Sure it is, guy! If restricting used games is as relevant to a console's success as you think, surely the Wii U would be selling gangbusters as it's paradise city over there! Lego City Undercover for $35 used, all day every day! Go get 'em!
But Gamestop would never accept that original trade if person 2 wasn't going to buy the used game. Why shouldn't Gamestop benefit? They are the middleman. You just want them to give people free money and throw the discs away?
No, here's the problem. Tomb Raider sold 3.4m units in the space of a month and it's a "failure" because it will fail to recoup its budget.
THREE POINT FOUR MILLION FUCKING UNITS FOR WHAT IS ESSENTIALLY A B-TIER FRANCHISE AND THAT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH TO MAKE ANY MONEY.
And killing used games would have solved this how? Would it have made the execs at Squenix who thought throwing $100m budget at a franchise that's been irrelevant since the turn of the century suddenly get a clue?
Oh, but no, they argue "GAMERS PUSH FOR HIGHER AND HIGHER BUDGETS AND WE HAVE TO GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT! THEIR ENTITLEMENT COMPLEX CAN'T BE SATIATED! WE HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO LET BUDGETS SPIRAL OUT OF CONTROL!" and that's lovely, but since when did they ever give a fuck about what we actually thought?
Are Microsoft going to turn around and backtrack on this DRM fiasco because "WE HAVE TO GIVE GAMERS WHAT THEY WANT!"? Are they fuck.
Are EA going to throw all their games up on Steam and patch Sim City to not need the stupid Origin authentication because "THAT'S WHAT THOSE ENTITLED GAMERS ARE SCREAMING FOR!"? Fuck no.
If you couldn't afford to give people what they wanted, then why didn't you just turn around and say no like you do with every other thing we complain about? Here's why; Every publisher big and small decided to get into a dick waving contest and it turns out that not everyone has a big dick. Squenix got its tiny little acorn cock out and went up against Mandingo Activision screaming "LOOK AT MY MASSIVE JUNK! YOU'LL WANT TO CARE FOR IT!" and everyone just turned around and shrugged and bought something else.
Not everyone has a big dick. Acting like you have a big dick when you don't have a big dick is going to make the reveal of your tiny little penis all the more humiliating. And that's what happened here. Squenix acted like Tomb Raider, a franchise that habitually sells less than 3m lifetime per entry was going to suddenly sell COD numbers just because they spent $100m on it and guess what happened? THE FUCKING INEVITABLE.
In terms of the franchise post-Core, the game is going to do really well, probably double what you'd expect from a Tomb Raider game post-PSone but it cost far, far too much.
But no, it's all used games that did this. Used games made Capcom make some horrible design decisions on DmC and piss off the entire fanbase. Used games made Activision and EA flood the market with guitar games and accessories long after people stopped caring. Used games made Microsoft make a fourth Gears of War game that nobody asked for from a developer nobody cares about. Used games made Sony pump out another God of War game after they spent the past few years flooding the market with HD remasters. Used games made Sony make a Smash Bros clone with no appealing characters to help sell it. Used games made Bizarre Creations make James Bond and racing games no-one wanted. Used games make publishers shutter studios the moment the game they were working on goes gold, before they've even had a chance to sell a single new copy, let alone a used one.
I could go on. And on. And on. You could write a book about every single executive level screw-up this gen and yet these same people with their million dollar salaries and their shill puppets still try to insult our intelligence and blame used games and awful, entitled consumers for companies shutting and talented people losing their jobs.
So please forgive our cynicism when we don't want to buy into the bullshit you're spouting.
Yes, this is how all entertainment works.
I pay $60 for a game. That covers the lifetime of said piece of entertainment, regardless of ownership. The game doesn't magically become worth $120 because I let a friend play it.
Is there any reason to assume publishers are lowering their prices?
Ignoring your comments about games being toys (seriously? why are you even on an enthusiast board like this if that's your stance)
I don't believe you know a damn thing what it's like to only have a tiny amount of disposable income to spend on entertainment,
this isn't just about downtrodden folk either, what about kids who get an allowance?
I also don't think you feel empathy at all, you sound like someone who just knows the textbook definition of it.
What's funny about this whole conversation is that I can, quite reasonably, wait 3-6 months after a game launches and buy the thing, NEW, for at least half the price. Sometimes more if it sells particularly bad.
There are very very very few games (mainly Nintendo franchises) that keep their price high for more than 3 months.
So yeah. Whatever. Hooray used games dying. It doesn't matter when I can "lag" three months behind and still get the deals for the games.
What's funny about this whole conversation is that I can, quite reasonably, wait 3-6 months after a game launches and buy the thing, NEW, for at least half the price. Sometimes more if it sells particularly bad.
There are very very very few games (mainly Nintendo franchises) that keep their price high for more than 3 months.
So yeah. Whatever. Hooray used games dying. It doesn't matter when I can "lag" three months behind and still get the deals for the games.
Uhhhh, no. Every console currently on the market can play used games. The Wii U has no upper hand in that respect. Acting like it does, or that it doesn't have other failings, is ludicrous.
This doesn't mean the rest of world works the same way.What's funny about this whole conversation is that I can, quite reasonably, wait 3-6 months after a game launches and buy the thing, NEW, for at least half the price. Sometimes more if it sells particularly bad.
There are very very very few games (mainly Nintendo franchises) that keep their price high for more than 3 months.
So yeah. Whatever. Hooray used games dying. It doesn't matter when I can "lag" three months behind and still get the deals for the games.
That's exactly my point. It is ludicrous to think that placing restrictions on used games will have any kind of major impact on a game console. See my earlier comments regarding Steam, and the numerous articles out there about how Steam essentially saved the concept of the PC as a place that publishers can make money on games.
That's exactly my point. It is ludicrous to think that placing restrictions on used games will have any kind of major impact on a game console. See my earlier comments regarding Steam, and the numerous articles out there about how Steam essentially saved the concept of the PC as a place that publishers can make money on games.
gaf is always a tear fest with candlelight vigils everytime a studio is closed yet a system that helps the industry stay alive and profitable is being demonized.
But Gamestop would never accept that original trade if person 2 wasn't going to buy the used game. Why shouldn't Gamestop benefit? They are the middleman. You just want them to give people free money and throw the discs away?
No, here's the problem. Tomb Raider sold 3.4m units in the space of a month and it's a "failure" because it will fail to recoup its budget.
THREE POINT FOUR MILLION FUCKING UNITS FOR WHAT IS ESSENTIALLY A B-TIER FRANCHISE AND THAT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH TO MAKE ANY MONEY.
And killing used games would have solved this how? Would it have made the execs at Squenix who thought throwing $100m budget at a franchise that's been irrelevant since the turn of the century suddenly get a clue?
Oh, but no, they argue "GAMERS PUSH FOR HIGHER AND HIGHER BUDGETS AND WE HAVE TO GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT! THEIR ENTITLEMENT COMPLEX CAN'T BE SATIATED! WE HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO LET BUDGETS SPIRAL OUT OF CONTROL!" and that's lovely, but since when did they ever give a fuck about what we actually thought?
Are Microsoft going to turn around and backtrack on this DRM fiasco because "WE HAVE TO GIVE GAMERS WHAT THEY WANT!"? Are they fuck.
Are EA going to throw all their games up on Steam and patch Sim City to not need the stupid Origin authentication because "THAT'S WHAT THOSE ENTITLED GAMERS ARE SCREAMING FOR!"? Fuck no.
If you couldn't afford to give people what they wanted, then why didn't you just turn around and say no like you do with every other thing we complain about? Here's why; Every publisher big and small decided to get into a dick waving contest and it turns out that not everyone has a big dick. Squenix got its tiny little acorn cock out and went up against Mandingo Activision screaming "LOOK AT MY MASSIVE JUNK! YOU'LL WANT TO CARE FOR IT!" and everyone just turned around and shrugged and bought something else.
Not everyone has a big dick. Acting like you have a big dick when you don't have a big dick is going to make the reveal of your tiny little penis all the more humiliating. And that's what happened here. Squenix acted like Tomb Raider, a franchise that habitually sells less than 3m lifetime per entry was going to suddenly sell COD numbers just because they spent $100m on it and guess what happened? THE FUCKING INEVITABLE.
In terms of the franchise post-Core, the game is going to do really well, probably double what you'd expect from a Tomb Raider game post-PSone but it cost far, far too much.
But no, it's all used games that did this. Used games made Capcom make some horrible design decisions on DmC and piss off the entire fanbase. Used games made Activision and EA flood the market with guitar games and accessories long after people stopped caring. Used games made Microsoft make a fourth Gears of War game that nobody asked for from a developer nobody cares about. Used games made Sony pump out another God of War game after they spent the past few years flooding the market with HD remasters. Used games made Sony make a Smash Bros clone with no appealing characters to help sell it. Used games made Bizarre Creations make James Bond and racing games no-one wanted. Used games make publishers shutter studios the moment the game they were working on goes gold, before they've even had a chance to sell a single new copy, let alone a used one.
I could go on. And on. And on. You could write a book about every single executive level screw-up this gen and yet these same people with their million dollar salaries and their shill puppets still try to insult our intelligence and blame used games and awful, entitled consumers for companies shutting and talented people losing their jobs.
So please forgive our cynicism when we don't want to buy into the bullshit you're spouting.
I personally feel that now, before anything is concrete, is the best time to get in an uproar. It's still early enough for them to see how their fan base reacts and hopefully change said policy.
That's exactly my point. It is ludicrous to think that placing restrictions on used games will have any kind of major impact on a game console. See my earlier comments regarding Steam, and the numerous articles out there about how Steam essentially saved the concept of the PC as a place that publishers can make money on games.
But what policy? The one that they haven't given all the details for? That's the problem. No one knows all the details yet. Everyone is getting angry at potentially nothing.
Ugh, I'm done arguing. We'll just have to wait and see I guess. You're taking random facts and fitting them wherever it fits for you.
But Gamestop would never accept that original trade if person 2 wasn't going to buy the used game. Why shouldn't Gamestop benefit? They are the middleman. You just want them to give people free money and throw the discs away?
No, here's the problem. Tomb Raider sold 3.4m units in the space of a month and it's a "failure" because it will fail to recoup its budget.
THREE POINT FOUR MILLION FUCKING UNITS FOR WHAT IS ESSENTIALLY A B-TIER FRANCHISE AND THAT'S STILL NOT ENOUGH TO MAKE ANY MONEY.
And killing used games would have solved this how? Would it have made the execs at Squenix who thought throwing $100m budget at a franchise that's been irrelevant since the turn of the century suddenly get a clue?
Oh, but no, they argue "GAMERS PUSH FOR HIGHER AND HIGHER BUDGETS AND WE HAVE TO GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT! THEIR ENTITLEMENT COMPLEX CAN'T BE SATIATED! WE HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO LET BUDGETS SPIRAL OUT OF CONTROL!" and that's lovely, but since when did they ever give a fuck about what we actually thought?
Are Microsoft going to turn around and backtrack on this DRM fiasco because "WE HAVE TO GIVE GAMERS WHAT THEY WANT!"? Are they fuck.
Are EA going to throw all their games up on Steam and patch Sim City to not need the stupid Origin authentication because "THAT'S WHAT THOSE ENTITLED GAMERS ARE SCREAMING FOR!"? Fuck no.
If you couldn't afford to give people what they wanted, then why didn't you just turn around and say no like you do with every other thing we complain about? Here's why; Every publisher big and small decided to get into a dick waving contest and it turns out that not everyone has a big dick. Squenix got its tiny little acorn cock out and went up against Mandingo Activision screaming "LOOK AT MY MASSIVE JUNK! YOU'LL WANT TO CARE FOR IT!" and everyone just turned around and shrugged and bought something else.
Not everyone has a big dick. Acting like you have a big dick when you don't have a big dick is going to make the reveal of your tiny little penis all the more humiliating. And that's what happened here. Squenix acted like Tomb Raider, a franchise that habitually sells less than 3m lifetime per entry was going to suddenly sell COD numbers just because they spent $100m on it and guess what happened? THE FUCKING INEVITABLE.
In terms of the franchise post-Core, the game is going to do really well, probably double what you'd expect from a Tomb Raider game post-PSone but it cost far, far too much.
But no, it's all used games that did this. Used games made Capcom make some horrible design decisions on DmC and piss off the entire fanbase. Used games made Activision and EA flood the market with guitar games and accessories long after people stopped caring. Used games made Microsoft make a fourth Gears of War game that nobody asked for from a developer nobody cares about. Used games made Sony pump out another God of War game after they spent the past few years flooding the market with HD remasters. Used games made Sony make a Smash Bros clone with no appealing characters to help sell it. Used games made Bizarre Creations make James Bond and racing games no-one wanted. Used games make publishers shutter studios the moment the game they were working on goes gold, before they've even had a chance to sell a single new copy, let alone a used one.
I could go on. And on. And on. You could write a book about every single executive level screw-up this gen and yet these same people with their million dollar salaries and their shill puppets still try to insult our intelligence and blame used games and awful, entitled consumers for companies shutting and talented people losing their jobs.
So please forgive our cynicism when we don't want to buy into the bullshit you're spouting.
But what policy? The one that they haven't given all the details for? That's the problem. No one knows all the details yet. Everyone is getting angry at potentially nothing.
If you whine about how it's not fair that you can't afford a new game console, I will laugh in your face.
Don't even bother. Dude accused everyone who was against always-online back in the original Adam Orth thread of being pirates.It sounds like you have the empathy level of an Adam Orth or Ben Kuchera.
I really do agree that there are some positive aspects to the used game policy. This being the main one. Buh bye gamestop, you can keep your $6 for the preowned copy of a recent release for which you will charge $54.99.
That's exactly my point. It is ludicrous to think that placing restrictions on used games will have any kind of major impact on a game console. See my earlier comments regarding Steam, and the numerous articles out there about how Steam essentially saved the concept of the PC as a place that publishers can make money on games.
People just seem to look at this as "a traded in game enables a first hand purchase". But it also enables a second hand purchase for someone else that takes away a new sale and benefits no one but GameStop.
Whether or not you think that's a problem is a personal decision, but people ignore the fact the 3 games you trade in to buy GTA5 are 3 lost new sales for those games.
Games are toys BY DEFINITION. Anything bought for recreation is a toy, really. Snowmobiles can be toys.
Without going into detail, I do. That's why I went to school, got a usable degree, and now make enough money to have enough to spend on toys.
They buy what they can afford. I have two kids of my own, and I'm not going to just buy them expensive shit just because they want it - that would breed entitlement. It would go very quickly from "Daddy bought me this Xbox", to ten years later when they call me crying because their TV broke and they can't afford a new one due to not working hard enough to make money. Too fucking bad. Come over and I'll teach you how to set up a budget.
Anyone who thinks empathy has anything to do with toys or material goods doesn't live in the real world. There is human suffering everywhere, and not just on the other side of the world. If you get hurt and break your back, I will break mine to help you out. If you whine about how it's not fair that you can't afford a new game console, I will laugh in your face.