Infernal Monkey
Member
Never thought I'd see Twitter fan-fiction.
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Ryse crunching team served 11,500 dinners by ship date #rysefacts
- Thread starter Wario64
- Start date
Never thought I'd see Twitter fan-fiction.
save us fork parker
oh god, this thread is curing my depression.
It doesn't change the fact that crunching is a bad thing. Short crunching isn't really that bad but working for 14h 6-7 days a week for month or more is devastating to people regardless of job they have.
I heard stuff about Crytek being extremely brutal with crunch. I dunno how founded it is though.
And where did You get this data? We dont know how many people work on Ryse, for how how many of the them crunching, or even for how long they are crunching.
Crysis 2 had 150 devs, Crysis 3 100 and Cevat said that Ryse is biggest investment for their studio
in this thread, people incredibly clueless about the gaming industry and how awful people are treated in it.
The posters who say "omg no big deal its just crunching time" really have NO fucking idea how awful it is, and how detrimental it is to their families. It's people like you that makes the gaming industry such grind and why the average gaming industry career length is like 5 years. It's people like you that would bend over to get a job in the industry because "i want to be the next miyamoto and stuff" and make the situation shittier for anyone serious about it.
The posters who say "omg no big deal its just crunching time" really have NO fucking idea how awful it is, and how detrimental it is to their families. It's people like you that makes the gaming industry such grind and why the average gaming industry career length is like 5 years. It's people like you that would bend over to get a job in the industry because "i want to be the next miyamoto and stuff" and make the situation shittier for anyone serious about it.
VeryGooster
Banned
excellent
M-M-M-MONSTER KILL KILL kill... ...
simplythebest
Banned
Ahh, the things people do for love.
TheCanisDirus
Member
I made the mistake of reading this while taking a sip of my beer...
... i must not waste beer... ... i must not waste beer... ... i must not waste beer... ... i must not waste beer...
I don't think anyone saying "what's the big deal?" has worked 16 hour days on salary.
In California, on contract, that's some mega bank, at least.
Exactly my thought when I read those responses.
EDIT: Wow, this topic has gotten pretty argumentative. I'll explain my reaction. Basically, what struck me is that people are overacting their reactions, as if Ryse having a crunch team was a rare occurrence in the industry. I understand that there are some touchy people here with this subject, but I must say, there are many more jobs that require crunching. Have you ever owned a restaurant? Prepare to spend 20+ extra hours a week working for nothing. Do you code for a company like Amazon? Same deal. It happens in other fields, not just video game development. Basically, people reacting on twitter as if this were a rare occurrence is what struck me as odd.
If people really felt so strongly about it, then I would expect them to join organizations that would work on making this kind of practice transparent, start a union, or something to that effect. But instead, we have people who overreact when something is posted on twitter. That about sums up the faux outrage.
Dunno if they still do it, but Crytek used to avoid hiring Germans at the German studio because they didn't want to have anyone who was knowledgable about local labor laws w/r/t overtime and weekend work.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Someone answer me, please.
Are we saying that the crytek employees are working almost double shifts 24/7 for months with no compensation?
Are we saying that the crytek employees are working almost double shifts 24/7 for months with no compensation?
GhostWriter24
Member
IHaveCandy
Banned
I agree it's kinda dumb to flip out and be upset over this, but why did they think that was something worth sharing? Did they not get that they're implying they're working their employees so much that they have to stay at work past dinner time?
TheCanisDirus
Member
Man, i wish! 10-11 hours... just another day in corporate america. FML
Overtime sucks regardless. Especially when it's overtime due to circumstances out of their control (the people forced to crunch I mean). But the reaction from some to this tweet is a touch dramatic.
LOL I knew someone was going to give me that answer
Yeah I know why some people are outraged, and I actually agree with them(especially when you consider Crytech's history with crunch times), Crunch time is a horrible thing in my opinion, I'm actually looking forward to work in the industry, but things like crunch time put me off greatly as I think that they could damage family relations.
I was actually curious if there is a dev team out there who are anti-crunch time so to speak, and are on the record for not having any.
As a dev (not gaming, thank god), fuck crunch time. It's unavoidable, but well managed teams that do good estimates and limit their scopes appropriately minimize it. The longer it gets, the less benefit you get from it.
A dev working 40 hours a week has better productivity than a dev working 60-80 hours because the dev working 60-80 hrs a week will have tons of bugs in their code that will take many more hours later to find and fix.
A dev working 40 hours a week has better productivity than a dev working 60-80 hours because the dev working 60-80 hrs a week will have tons of bugs in their code that will take many more hours later to find and fix.
Satch Fuji
Neo Member
Double true. The few game devs that have adopted Lean methodologies like Scrum or Kanban have drastically reduced so-called mandatory crunch and employees are much happier and more satisfied for it.
Dictator93
Member
The immediate outrage is hilarious without knowing the facts of the situation.
Twitter should not exist.
Twitter should not exist.
Is this the time to point out companies routinely make jobs exempt that the Department of Labor would determine non-exempt to avoid paying overtime?
My last employer got in serious trouble for that.
And Crytek has an immediate solution in providing facts of the situation, disproving the outrage. In a format as quick as started it. I'm working off the information available, being a tweet that implies a gigantic amount of overtime, and that they are proud of that, given that they tweeted it casually.
My last employer got in serious trouble for that.
Dictator93 said:
And Crytek has an immediate solution in providing facts of the situation, disproving the outrage. In a format as quick as started it. I'm working off the information available, being a tweet that implies a gigantic amount of overtime, and that they are proud of that, given that they tweeted it casually.
3rdamention
Member
I agree with you, it is amazing. Hell, the Minute an Xbox One video hits YouTube, Boom 600 dislikes...
I think this is quite telling, and we will see how this "hate" affects the console sales in just a few months. Talk about a huge 180 in their public perception.
Mega bank or not, the constant crunching is why the industry is unable to keep talent for long periods of time or why people just leave the industry once they start having families. Crunch times are signs of a failure when it comes to project management and its not normal that a project is in crunch time for a frigging year.
I don't want to imagine the mental state or even the quality of work being done when the team is in crunch mode for so long.
and it's all the same variety of shithead that throws around "lazy devs," too.
Crunch times and job insecurity. (Hello layoffs after a project ships!)
Don't forget that with the same skillset working in other software industries, you generally make way more money.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Can't be any worse than the reported crunching at R*.
One game every five years sounds good.
Bravo
Could you explain in detail the problems so that people can understand the issues that are hurting the games industry?
Why is unionization always considered off-limits and something that isn't done in gaming? Creating games requires specialized skills. Wouldn't stronger labor parties within gaming help mitigate this problem?
How is that the fault of the ignorant consumer? There is very little context being provided by those that do create games.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Your imagination seems to be having absolutely no trouble whipping up whatever situation you've decided is the case, given that you have almost no info to go on regarding actual context.
people > products
samueljustice00
Member
No disgonbegood gif yet?
We have to remember that the outrage here is over a tweet about dinner being served to developers working crunch on a next-gen console launch game. We have literally no other information.
If some Crytek dev wants to speak up, then we have something here. Until then, just ignore the tweet and move on.
I just think perhaps people should pick their battles more carefully.
Miles Quaritch
Member
Like Foxconn factories...
People getting upset over common work practice baffles me. It's not pretty, but it sure as hell isn't the worst thing in the world.
As long as the devs get paid, I could care less.
How do you spin a tweet with little to no information into something judging the industry as a whole???????
As long as the devs get paid, I could care less.
How do you spin a tweet with little to no information into something judging the industry as a whole???????
Crunch is bad for:
- the game, these things, they take time
- the company who has to pay expensive extra hours
- the studio, it creates tension and talents burned out
- developers health
Yes, if you have a deadline it could be useful for a short period of times. But if it lasts months is because there is serious mismanagement which is harming, the product and the developer.
The cause should be removed from their positions. It doesn't seem to happen so often.
I don't know anything about crytek, but judging from ryse's development history it doesn't seem to have had a smooth one at all.
Find the cause and fix it.
- the game, these things, they take time
- the company who has to pay expensive extra hours
- the studio, it creates tension and talents burned out
- developers health
Yes, if you have a deadline it could be useful for a short period of times. But if it lasts months is because there is serious mismanagement which is harming, the product and the developer.
The cause should be removed from their positions. It doesn't seem to happen so often.
I don't know anything about crytek, but judging from ryse's development history it doesn't seem to have had a smooth one at all.
Find the cause and fix it.
Zindalgi, Relentless Software, and I've heard Avalanche Studios is trying to stamp it out.
This posts warrants a promotion to Member status.
I dont think I've ever seen someone mention crunch time a positive way. It usually bad for everyone involved.
Reading through this thread, it appears that you are sadly wasting your time with this post unfortunately. It is kind of interesting how it seems like large portions of GAF get extremely upset about corporate apologists/defenders, when that's a lot of what's going on in this thread.
The photoshops coming out of this are already pretty great though.
I have the info and been in the context.
Crunching is BAD in any job and any industry. It doesn't matter if you're compensated, people should not be overworked even if they want to. That's why we hire managers to prevent this shit.