dongasaurus
Neo Member
How will that solve project managers being bad at their job?
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Ryse crunching team served 11,500 dinners by ship date #rysefacts
- Thread starter Wario64
- Start date
How will that solve project managers being bad at their job?
"Let them eat cake" fits in a tweet too. I'm not sure why the medium matters when the communication is tone-deaf and oblivious regardless.
And when crunch ends there is usually time after that when ton of people are laid off. Same people who spent in company their last 3-4 months 13 hours a day 7 days a week.
A very fair point, but we are talking about businesses here. And one way to effect them is bad press. Not that I think this will suddenly sink the game, but changing the social acceptance of the practice of crunching is another way of affecting it.
I mean look at this thread. Even with many who recognize the concept of crunching accept it as a necessary evil. There's no reason to accept that.
How so? It's pretty simple
Because people continue to miss the point over and over here: regardless of the reality of crunch time existing, there's a big difference between that and essentially bragging about it, which I think is the issue most people are having here. In the real world we live in crunch time is going to exist to some extent, but bragging about it on social media is probably not the best idea.
As a side note: I think crunch time is unavoidable as long as consoles get rushed to market ASAP. There's so many things you don't know about a new console that your real development starts later, ends earlier and might change drastically in the middle of everything.
Crunch time is directly linked to poor management. They're literally bragging about how bad their management is.
Crunch time is directly linked to poor management. They're literally bragging about how bad their management is.
Impeccable
Member
Hilarious thread with some great photoshops. Nice light way to end the day!
Darko
Member
ruthless.
I wonder how many dinners got served to the XBone crunch team.
I don't know how many people are involved. That's why I said 'equivalent' to 50 people.
11,500 days / 50 people / 5 day week = 46 working weeks = equivalent of 1 working year for 50 people.
Going by their recent games and industry norms, to me the numbers suggest they have been overworking a large proportion of their workforce for a very long period of time.
If it's 50 people non-stop crunch for a year, 100 for 6 months or something similar isn't really important. I believe it's still a hell of a lot of crunch by any rational standard.
haha yeah I mean what if their phones were on silent!?
Yep. I mean if they said something like all meals presented to workers during their time working on this game were classing Roman cuisine or something it would have been more amusing.
but yeah I don't see why this raises 'serious' questions about working conditions lol
Just One.
Gentleman Jack
Member
Crysis 2 & 3 were ~250 man teams according to this interview. 200 on Ryse is not a terrible estimate.
"What if its five?" c'mon guy you're still talking about people who aren't allowed to go home for weeks on end.
180, sorry.
2 Slice Toaster
Member
What if they are coming in late to adjust their schedule, so not necessarily working a ton of extra hours, but are being provided meals simply for being there at a later hour?
Gentleman Jack
Member
The definition of crunch is working a ton of extra hours.
2 Slice Toaster
Member
How many extra hours?
Woo-Fu
Banned
Then don't set a release date for your game before you know wtf you're doing. Seems pretty simple. Struggling to launch alongside a new platform is one thing, but you never hear that crunch time only happens for that sort of launch, usually you hear a studio goes through crunch for every game they make.
"Hello yes, I would like to order 10 pizza."
"Hello yes, I just called for the Pizza... we will take Chinese food instead"
"Hello, Me again, guess the Chinese food is a no, so let's go for Mexican...Canadian food? "
Quadraphonic
Member
This isn't complaining about the existence of crunch. This is complaining how a dumb AP is marginalizing it into a 'fun fact'. It's a god damn insult.
There would be no launch titles in that case.
CambriaRising
Member
Crytek isn't new to allegations of workplace abuse and unbearable crunch times.
Usually, you finish at 5, well you end up finishing at 7 or 9 or 11 pm. Depend on your boss.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
The subject of the tweet was about a number of meals served to the crunch team.
Until you know what the size of that team is and what their workload, hourly rate/ot pay situation is, you have no context for your argument. Especially when attempting to base your argument on working conditions. Anecdotes aren't facts.
If we knew what the conditions were, then we could agree/disagree and at least have some kind of rational discussion, but nobody knows and so far there have been at least four different people being outraged about different conditions based on the information that they made up in their head.
I don't see the point.
Source?
No matter the business practice of the company, I agree that crunch is probably very hard to avoid if you want to put out a game for the console launch. You're basically stabbing in the dark in terms of development.
Perhaps when the time is necessary, companies should provide extra benefits for those who work during a crunch.
Honestly if there are so many people that feel so strongly about it, why don't you guys(and girls) get together and try to effect public awareness on the topic? Reacting on twitter and then forgetting about it and going about your life only has a limited effect. Gotta stand up for what you believe in, not just arguing on a message board.
In last art presentation they've said it was 150 for C2 and 100 for C3. But peak could be higher and it could not count Q&A.
http://crytek.com/download/fmx2013_c3_art_tech_donzallaz_sousa.pdf
Slide 7
I think this is the right response to this issue
Perfect.
They should.
2 Slice Toaster
Member
I guess my confusion just lies in what the range of hours and dates constitutes acceptable crunchtime versus unbearable.
My understanding of English is so bad that doesn't make me understand what is going on... let me see if i actually understood or not.
Crytek is bragging about the fact that they offered lots of dinners to "crunch teams" which are (that's the part i'm not sure) teams that work over the normal workhours. They are essentially bragging about exploitation.
Am I right?
Crytek is bragging about the fact that they offered lots of dinners to "crunch teams" which are (that's the part i'm not sure) teams that work over the normal workhours. They are essentially bragging about exploitation.
Am I right?
They have to if they want to be treated more fairly. The fact that they haven't yet boggles my mind. There are unions where unions aren't needed (like grocery stores) and yet the places that need them most don't have them (video game development).
People might be too afraid to lose their jobs if they stand up. But they have to start organizing if they want it to be affected.
You are 100% correct, and you missed the bit where a ton of Gaffers celebrate that fact and mock those who don't think it's great.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Depends on your imagination.
On one end of the scale, they've been crunching 10-14 hour shifts 24/7 for a year.
On the other end, its 1-3 months for 10 hours, 6 days a week.
You can decide in your head whether they're being paid OT or not, how many if at all are subcontractors and whether they get to go home in the evening.
Are they on rotation? Who knows. It doesn't matter. Assume either or.
Just pick what feels "right" to you and go with it..
Gouda Jouji
Member
Oh man, i've laughed at that more than i should
----
You guys remember Polyphony? :>
Polyphony Digital employees seem to get paid very well, though. Whenever they hold studio tours people always mention the all the Ferraris and Porsches in their parking lot.
DrGonzo615
Banned
The twitter backlash to this is friggin insane. It makes the entire gaming community look like douchebags..
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Congratulations on being a doormat.
Funchameleon
Banned
holy shit all you spergs screaming "faux-outrage" over people laughing at them being proud of forced crunch periods. work-life balance is ridiculously important and these guys have the axe over their heads if they don't comply. it doesn't fucking matter if it's an industry reality, it shouldn't be, and it's certainly not a gloating point.
Really?