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Windows Central: Microsoft exploring bringing back catalog to Nintendo and PlayStation

Reminder that their launch strategy was centered around backcompat, which may be well-liked by us hardcore users, but is something the ordinary consumer simply doesn't care about.

My friend won't care if Lost Odyssey is playable on XSX when he's making the decision to purchase a console for his kids.

That’s what disappointed me greatly in the build up to launch and worse to see it hyped up along with it.

Back compat should be one layer of many, a “it also does this on top of everything else “ kind of thing, not front and centre.

I get it, timed have changed and digital libraries are important but they shouldn’t be a dominant focus of your launch marketing.

I think people forget they had years to prepare for the Series consoles, hardware and games and given how disappointing Xbox One was you would think they would of come out with a more impressive start and keen to impress.

They tried to use Covid for Halo Infinite’s difficulties and unimpressive showing that year, when Covid and lockdowns had only been happening a handful of months and had little else in other titles to compensate for that laughable showing and delay of the game.

It’s bemusing to me as to why , after all the disappointments and underwhelming moments, the management still gets so much praise.
 

Snake29

RSI Employee of the Year
Yep. Instructions were circulated to the discord channel earlier last year. You'll notice that most of their army of super fans active on social, podcasts and YouTube all started playing PC primarily. A few have recently tried to position themselves as neutral and making a point playing PS Studio games and being complementary about them

It certainly seems like the new narrative will be, all games are great, play them where you want.... but they're best on a Windows device.

Add to that, that they will praise MS for making a lot of money while bringing their games to other platforms.

This needs a bingo.
 
Microsoft won't go third party because they get billions from the software sales cut, its just another revenue road.

There wasn't outcry from Sony shills either when they started to port stuff to PC. Loyalty doesn't pay shit if you're not backing that up, Nintendo learned that the hard way during the SNES up to Gamecube early days.

They get billions from royalties, but at what cost.

The writing is on the wall for the xbox hardware brand, and they know it. They are struggling to sell units after just a very short period of time, meanwhile Sony is selling 20+ million units a year.

They might think that they can have their cake and eat it too, but the reality is as soon as real 1st party games release for PS5, it'll be over. Even if they start off with the switch it'll signal to core users that they're going 3rd party.

I'm convinced that they're trying to go through as much inventory as they can before they need to start announcing games for PS5/Switch and that is why they didn't announce certain games as Xbox exclusive, because they don't want people to say they went back on their word on those titles.

That Blade game for example, the costs associated with the licensing probably prohibited it being Xbox exclusive based on what we saw from Insomniac. Why didn't they flat out deny that it would be multiplatform? Because they probably can't.

Unlike when Sega discontinued to the dreamcast, I expect the death of Xbox will be death by a thousand cuts.
 

Tams

Member
I’m talking from a consumer perspective. Why would I buy a future Xbox console if I can play their releases on another console that already has a better regarded portfolio of games ?

We all know Spencer wants multi platform . Just get it over with.
Even one of his co workers stated as much on Major Nelsons podcast over three years ago. “He would put it all on everything if he could” forgive me I forget their name but that remark always stuck with me and thought it was a strange thing to say on a Xbox podcast at the time.

I’m not interested in their profits, they have enough money as it is and in my opinion they are no where meeting Xbox’s potential as a console for all that money and it looks like they never will. That says a lot about the kind of people they have had and have there. It could and should of been a much better competitor to PlayStation and Nintendo.

Instead they stick with more or less the same kind of people who scattergun.

What is 'it' that he wants to put in everything?

Cos if it includes Games Pass, then Nintendo and Sony are just going to laugh the Microsoft execs out.
 

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
I would be interested in your take on things in a sort of retrospect at some point given your posts in the past. I get the impression you share my view Xbox would be doing a lot better if it had better management/culture (I could be way off of course)
I think if Mike would have take over Xbox they could have been trending at least better but he knew who was going to be the next Xbox President because of reasons

Does anyone even like Ybarra?
Mike is a very nice and funny guy when he isn't being a corporate first type of guy
 

H-I-M

Member
Well duh, we've been known that games don't sell on Xbox. Hence all the "Microsoft is going 3rd party" rumors.
 
What is 'it' that he wants to put in everything?

Cos if it includes Games Pass, then Nintendo and Sony are just going to laugh the Microsoft execs out.

The games I guess. I’m only stating what the guy said on Major Horsepiss Nelsons podcast about three years ago.
 
So much for "exclusives bad" :



They’ve all spent too much time baby powdering the executives arses. If any of them where sincere in the first place they would of cast more objective eye years ago.

And what the fuck does he need a Patreon for??
 
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Probably already been said (sorry, I didn't read all 4 pages - kinda pressed for time atm) but:

Microsoft is getting smoked in hardware sales by Sony with the latest reports showing a 3:1 gap despite Microsoft offering a budget version this generation. Xbox bosses obfuscate numbers but it would appear that Game Pass Ultimate subscribers peaked around 25 million. Microsoft just spent a ton of money to buy a multiplatform publisher/studio group.

If they don't begin monetizing their first party IPs on these vastly more popular platforms, they're fucked.

Only thing they can really do to stave off mass layoffs in the not-so-distant future and the key word there is mass layoffs, they're still going to have layoffs.
 
Hmm.

On the one hand, they've never been able to make(enough) headway in the Japanese market and from what I see in various reports, it's basically dead in Europe as a platform.

In the US, they've done fairly well. It didn't help that so many people they've bought out vanished into obscurity or put out subpar titles like Redfall.

Even their Big Three had Halo just..not measuring up to the titles under Bungie. Forza is a winner, and possibly Gears.

Fable has been non-existant for so long now it seems.

It just feels PlayStation is ubiquitous and has capitalized very, very well on their missteps since the Xbox One debacle.

Sony has some strong titles coming just in these first three months(TLOU2R, FF7Rebirth and Ronin). They aren't on Xbox, similar to Spider-Man 2 this past year. It also wasn't a good look that Baldurs Gate 3 was unavailable on Xbox for quite some time, literally because the Series S hamstrung them.

An inadvertent PS exclusive that ended up hurting them once BG3 took the gaming world by storm fast.

Nintendo continues to fire on all cylinders with their first party and a great system and looks to continue, so long as they avoid a Wii U situation with the Switch successor.

Microsoft was never going to be allowed to moneyhat their way to first place. They made bad decisions and that's all there is to it.

I don't see them making any major acquisitions soon, not after the(apparently still being contested) ABK fight went on so long.
 
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SmokedMeat

Gamer™
Absolutely. PC gamers were the first to accept digital only, the first to accept DLC, season passes, etc, the first to accept always-online, etc etc. On top of that, they mostly play online games and don't give a rats ass about ownership.

They will absolutely be the first to accept a streaming only future, because 'at least we don't have to pay for online' or something like that.

PC gaming had expansion packs. All of that stuff you brought up started in tandem with consoles.
The console base accepted paid online and paid cloud saves. Plus we already know the most played games are digital GaaS.

Once the console makers choose to go all streaming - you’ll have no choice but to fall in line.
No one company can decide that for PC.
 
I am actually curious if that OD is multiplat or not. The platforms have never been announced right? Considering that Microsoft does not even own OD IP, I would not be surprised if it is a multiplat at this point.
 
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THE DUCK

voted poster of the decade by bots
Any of you excited about the idea of ms leaving the console space need to give your head a shake. Welcome to a world of $120 controllers, $120 games, and more expensive console hardware from Sony. A world where they spend less on software development.
Competition is good, not bad. Hopefully this is nothing more than secondary titles.
 
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NikuNashi

Member
For megahits going multiplat makes the most money, for mediocre games might as well keep them exclusive.
Gamepass subscribers have been conditioned to enjoy mediocrity so that sounds like a good plan.
Sell the good games multiplat, shovel the mid games on gamepass for free.
 

OmegaSupreme

advanced basic bitch
Any of you excited about the idea of ms leaving the console space need to give your head a shake. Welcome to a world of $120 controllers, $120 games, and more expensive console hardware from Sony. A world where they spend less on software development.
Competition is good, not bad. Hopefully this is nothing more than secondary titles.
Ms is the least important player in the console market. You either lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way. They're failing to grow the platform after 20 years and countless billions. We'll be just fine with Sony, Nintendo,PC.
 
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DaGwaphics

Member
Are they having a competition at MS to see who can come with the worst ideas?

Haven't read this article but from the headline alone there is zero reason to release previously exclusive games on other platforms, and there will be zero positive results from it. Other than some short-term software sales that will represent a much smaller number than the $ they lose once they start to hemorrhage Gold/GP subscribers. It honestly seems too stupid to be real, but then you never know with them. In an environment where your platform is already viewed as less desirable than your rivals, removing what does bring the value to it isn't going to help you out. Doesn't matter how delayed either, because if buyers get the idea in their heads that eventually the software will come over... Even on a limited scale, the possibility alone hurts.

Seems to be a lot of wild speculation going around. Hopefully just some random nonsense.
 
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THE DUCK

voted poster of the decade by bots
Ms is the least important player in the console market. You either lead, follow or get the hell out of the way. They're failing to grow the platform after 20 years and countless billions. We'll be just fine with Sony, Nintendo,PC.

So you are fine with ps5 for 10+ years and no ps5 pro? Fine with underpowered Nintendo hardware? Ok I guess.

Carefull what you wish for.
 
I was listening to the Defining Duke podcast. This week was about the Insomniac leak and how the Sony games are not sustainable. They will have to release their games on PC day and date. Also, it discussed how Xbox is way ahead on Game Pass/Streaming and Mobile. Sony is in serious trouble. Additionally, the rumor of the 2026 Next-Gen Xbox, which has the possibility to replicate Xbox 360's success. Lord Cognito supports exclusives, stating that they give a brand identity to the platform, etc.

Next week's podcast is going to be about Xbox going third party, having no exclusives, and leaving the console business.

This is the Xbox Community; suffering from a massive bipolar disorder.
 

Gavon West

Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads

At this point way too many sources are saying the same thing. I guess it's about to happen.
I will literally drop Microsoft if they do this. Sooooooo fucking stupid. Can't y'all monkey asses wait until you're at least 2nd or 1st in the industry instead of acting like a Top G when......you're not?

They arguably have the largest stable of top developers in the industry, more exclusives than they've EVER had, will soon top Sony in revenue. Jesus Christ! You can almost hear them tripping over their own feet right now.

You weaken your brand with moves like this. Not strengthen it.
 
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Any of you excited about the idea of ms leaving the console space need to give your head a shake. Welcome to a world of $120 controllers, $120 games, and more expensive console hardware from Sony. A world where they spend less on software development.
Competition is good, not bad. Hopefully this is nothing more than secondary titles.
What are you ducking about?

MS just bought two publishers and has spent around 100B Dollars to compete. They have the biggests and most comprehensive cloud infrastructure and infinite money to subsidize Xbox´s faliures forever. Right?.

Is on xbox to compete, not the consumer.

# No More Excuses.
 

THE DUCK

voted poster of the decade by bots
What are you ducking about?

MS just bought two publishers and has spent around 100B Dollars to compete. They have the biggests and most comprehensive cloud infrastructure and infinite money to subsidize Xbox´s faliures forever. Right?.

Is on xbox to compete, not the consumer.

# No More Excuses.

I dont think you even understand my post, perhaps you should re-read it. I'm talking about what happens if ms were to become software only and how that negatively affects everyone.
 
Any of you excited about the idea of ms leaving the console space need to give your head a shake. Welcome to a world of $120 controllers, $120 games, and more expensive console hardware from Sony. A world where they spend less on software development.
Competition is good, not bad. Hopefully this is nothing more than secondary titles.

Stop, I can only get so erect
 
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DaGwaphics

Member
I will literally drop Microsoft if they do this. Sooooooo fucking stupid. Can't y'all monkey asses wait until you're at least 2nd or 1st in the industry instead of acting like a Top G when......you're not?

They arguably have the largest stable of top developers in the industry, more exclusives than they've EVER had, will soon top Sony in revenue. Jesus Christ! You can almost hear them tripping over their own feet right now.

You weaken your brand with moves like this. Not strengthen it.

It would really be a headscratcher moment wouldn't it. Even with this generation not being as strong as they would have hoped, potentially making them a bit of a secondary option, they would finally have what they need to build a platform that could stand on its own. Largely driven off of in-house content (like Nintendo does for the most part). It's like they don't realize that even making statements that elude to this type of thing is enough to stall their brand. They certainly make it hard to root for them at times, LOL.
 
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azertydu91

Hard to Kill
It would really be a headscratcher moment wouldn't it. Even with this generation not being as strong as they would have hoped, potentially making them a bit of a secondary option, they would finally have what they need to build a platform that could stand on its own. Largely driven off of in-house content (like Nintendo does for the most part). It's like they don't realize that even making statements that elude to this type of thing is enough to stall their brand.
Yep a real headscratcher...Or maybe the situation isn't as good as you two think it is, but ...nah it is probably every other analysts that paint a darker picture that is wrong and the sales collapsing have no effects on this.
 

baphomet

Member
Honestly they're going to have a hard time selling multiple year old games for full price since they've successfully devalued their games with Game Pass.

I wouldn't buy any of them when I could just sign up for Game Pass for a single month and play as much of the game as I ever would. There probably exists a couple of outliers I'd buy, but the only one I can think of off the top of my head is Hades (which isn't the exact same thing as a MS first party game.)
 
It would really be a headscratcher moment wouldn't it. Even with this generation not being as strong as they would have hoped, potentially making them a bit of secondary option, they would finally have what they need to build a platform that could stand on its own. Largely driven off of in-house content (like Nintendo does for the most part).

They finally have what they need to build a platform that could stand on its own?

What are you even talking about? Their hardware sales have evaporated, they're nonexistent on at least two continents. Every quarter that goes by this is getting worse for them and 2024 is slated to be a bloodbath with Switch 2 and PS5 Pro. 2025 will be even worse with GTA6 on PS5 Pro.

There is a reason why every publisher doesn't release their own hardware just to avoid paying royalties and to collect 3rd party royalties. It isn't that easy. Hell, they can't even do it on PC where people already own the hardware.

I wouldn't be surprised if GTA6 is initially exclusive to a rockstar launcher on PC rather than coming straight to Steam, but its one of the few titles that could probably get away with that.
 
I dont think you even understand my post, perhaps you should re-read it. I'm talking about what happens if ms were to become software only and how that negatively affects everyone.
Why would they become software only in the first place?

a) Xbox Tax?
b) Sony big evil growing while keeping xbox small?
c) Xbox incompetence/lack of resources to gain market share?
d) their own faliures cathing up with them?
d) is the console industry just not having the market capacity to sustain both consoles?


What if Xbox leaving the hardware makes the indutry better for devs and consumers?. The competition is strong coming from all sides anyway.
 

Jimmy_liv

Member
I really do think Microsoft is going to redefine what it means to be a platform holder moving forward.

They aren't abandoning their platform/hardware but they also aren't going to be afraid to publish games on rival platforms.
The minute they start publishing current games on playstation I no longer need two consoles.

Seems a crazy decision to me unless, as some suspect, they are exiting the hardware business.
 
Honestly they're going to have a hard time selling multiple year old games for full price since they've successfully devalued their games with Game Pass.

I wouldn't buy any of them when I could just sign up for Game Pass for a single month and play as much of the game as I ever would. There probably exists a couple of outliers I'd buy, but the only one I can think of off the top of my head is Hades (which isn't the exact same thing as a MS first party game.)

Yeah, it's not a brilliant plan. Look at Sony's limited success on PC so far, and I'd say they've done pretty decently given their games haven't really been heavily discounted yet, but no one wants to pay full price for old games, even if they're remastered.

A handful of games would have success on PS5 and it isn't games like Pentiment.
 

DaGwaphics

Member
@ Mibu no ookami Mibu no ookami I was referring to the strength of the first-party software catalog they could provide. If you have enough value there and give players that like to play on console enough reasons to get your box as a me too, you can build on that.
 
Why would they become software only in the first place?

a) Xbox Tax?
b) Sony big evil growing while keeping xbox small?
c) Xbox incompetence/lack of resources to gain market share?
d) their own faliures cathing up with them?
d) is the console industry just not having the market capacity to sustain both consoles?


What if Xbox leaving the hardware makes the indutry better for devs and consumers?. The competition is strong coming from all sides anyway.

I think the only way that this could be true is if another competitor enters the same space, whether that be Nintendo, Apple, Amazon, e.t.c.

I think Microsoft's failures here could really hurt consumers, as Sony would have no choice but to try and leverage their newfound market dominance.

I've speculated that if Microsoft exits the console space, Sony will leverage their platform into the PC space, which I guess could benefit PC gamers with potentially cheaper games for a period, but without additional competition, I think you ultimately see an increase in prices, even if innovation continues, and maybe even increases.

I think risks ultimately are reduced and the quality of sony first party games would probably see a further decrease.
 
@ Mibu no ookami Mibu no ookami I was referring to the strength of the first-party software catalog they could provide. If you have enough value there and give players that like to play on console enough reasons to get your box as a me too, you can build on that.

They don't have that value.

Nothing they've done with ABK or Bethesda or their other studio acquisitions have moved the needle in the console space.

CoD is the only major piece they have in the console space and they can't do much with it for 10 years. Bethesda and Blizzard have always been stronger in the PC space.

Despite spending close to 100 billion dollars they don't have a single killer app console seller... that's stunning.
 

Agent X

Member
Any of you excited about the idea of ms leaving the console space need to give your head a shake. Welcome to a world of $120 controllers, $120 games, and more expensive console hardware from Sony. A world where they spend less on software development.
Competition is good, not bad. Hopefully this is nothing more than secondary titles.

It's not a matter of being "excited". But maybe the following two quotes can put it into perspective:

You either lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way.

Is on xbox to compete, not the consumer.

Microsoft is a big company. They're not financially on the ropes like Sega in 2001, or Atari and 3DO in 1996. They can tough it out for a good while longer.

If they want to bow out of the hardware biz, then that is totally their choice. Nobody's twisting their arm.

At the same time, if they want to remain a hardware manufacturer, then they need to compete on a higher level. If their market share continues to dwindle, and they fail to bring compelling products to market, then for all intents and purposes they might as well not be there at all.
 

Stuart360

Member
I do think people are jumping the gun as usual with this HiFi Rush news, especially all the clickbait Youtubers and Twitter users.
MS have already released games on Switch before, even on Playstation with stuff like the Quake remasters etc. If they start announcing the likes of Halo or Forza Horizon etc to Playstation, thats when serious discussion should be made imo, not when a older game that would suit the Switch playerbase is announced (and its still a rumour at the moment).

We see this all the time with 'MS want Gamepass on everything, then Phil comes and says he doesnt. Gamepass is all MS cares abut, then Phil says he expects Gamepass to only make up about 15% of their revenue. MS going third party even though Phil confirmed a while ago that new Xbox consoles were in development, etc.

Being on PC, Xbox is already thrid party so it doesnt really change anyhting for me, but i'll be surprised if they done have a console next gen, and possibly the gen after, then i expect full streaming after that.

With all the studios they have bought in recent year, they surely have to start releasing stuff in the second half of the gen. And i feel MS themselves would wait to see what kind of effect those releases have on sales before they set in stone any long term strategy in terms of the console going forward. Although an Xbox console next gen is a given imo.
 
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Elios83

Member
As others have already pointed out it's the only sustainable strategy given that their Xbox console business is quickly declining and Gamepass hasn't achieved the growth they were expecting a few years ago.
All the acquisitions they have made can quickly become a heavy financial burden if there isn't a return on the investement. And they won't get that by restricting their audience.
Trying to become a gaming software giant/publisher is the best shot they have at being successful in gaming.
 
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The minute they start publishing current games on playstation I no longer need two consoles.

Seems a crazy decision to me unless, as some suspect, they are exiting the hardware business.

I think we have to be cautious about the timing of this.

Phil Spencer walked back Tim Stuart's comments as they probably feared an impact to holiday sales.

Even if they're looking to liquidate stock, which I think they probably aren't at this point. It would probably take 6-12 months to get rid of what they have out there based on how slow they're selling.

I think it could be as much as 2 years before the XBS is actually officially discontinued.

I think Microsoft will try to have their cake and eat it too for as long as possible while limiting new supply of XBS.
 

Darsxx82

Member
That's PC.
PC is not a platform for people who prefer consoles. It's funny how this works on one hand but is denied when it's on the other hand...😏

Only applies to people already entrenched.

Those can add up to between 40-50 million users in the worst case during this generation.... I don't know if you know how much that user base can generate in times of subscriptions, microtransactions, digital, DLCs, GTA VI...

PC again.

Again, console users want to play on consoles....


A premium console would only make matters worse for them. There's nothing their hardware offers that's unique, even down to the controllers.

Nothing more than your assumption.....

A console with premium hardware can attract many hardcore users. Among other things, it would serve to ensure the permanence of your loyal core users. Having a premium console does not mean not accompanying it with another more affordable one...

They've failed to innovate and the response by the market has been the response.
Again your own assumption...

Firstly, the hardware is the last problem for XBOX in this generation when it comes to capturing the attention of users. There are many others, starting with the lack of marketing, delays in production and laziness in making an effort to achieve users beyond the USA and UK. Every first party Game day one on PC (XBO went 4 years without sharing games with PC)

Second. When it comes to innovation, you never know what the future holds. You talk as if MS had no potential to innovate or as if SONY were the example of continuous innovation and incapable of disappointing in that regard...🙃

That said, we're talking about "reasons" for people to continue buying Xbox consoles if their first party games end up being released sooner or later on competing consoles....
As I said, the first thing would be to know what minimum number of users MS would understand enough to understand it was necessary to bet on its console business..... 30-40-50-60-70 million?? That's where the question is.

My personal opinion is that what generates a loyal user base of (in the worst case) 40 million when it is today irrejectable for MS. It is by far the main source of income for MS's gaming business and the main source of long-term Gamepass subscriptions. They compensate with the PC user base... Xbox consoles are today the basis of their ecosystem, where they have control.

MS seeks to create an ecosystem where it decides and controls, not depending on the ecosystem of others And PC is a market controled by Valve .

It's funny because that's what some of you defended 2 months ago in the ABK acquisition thread..... As always, it is the narrative that rules.

There is a lot of confusion and ambiguity on the part of MS, we all agree on that..... But if we think slowly and see the reality.... That reality says that MS is going to continue launching console hardware, it has a roadmap. We Will see a new XBOX console. Sara Bond was not given the specific task of head of XBOX hardware if there was no plan to continue releasing hardware.

What type of product/console is MS going to launch? One with the goal of selling 35-40 million? If that is the goal then releasing games on PS and Switch is an understandable strategy.
One with the goal of selling 60+ million? Then the strategy of making as many exclusives as possible will be necessary.
 
I

They arguably have the largest stable of top developers in the industry,


With a huge emphasis on "arguably". Most of those developers are in a steep decline, their brightest days long past gone. Remove COD from the equation and they are left with a bunch of question marks.

MS have tried to force people into mediocrity with the excuse of "games for free" and now they are realizing that there is a very low ceiling for a videogames service and they need to expand their horizons.

That strategy is as wrong as Sony's with their PC ports. It's quality, not quantity, what makes a brand powerful. No matter how many studios MS buy, if they don't change their philosophy fiascos like Starfield or Halo Infinite will keep repeating over and over.
 
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