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Zen 4 reviews

rnlval

rnlval

Member
Black_Stride said:
What issue am I dodging?

Intel have been a Tick-Tock company since like SandyBridge.
Every 2 or 3 generations leads to a new chipset.
I know this already.
1. If you got LGA1700 with AlderLake, you had an upgrade path with RaptorLake and still have a further upgrade path with RaptorLakeR.
After that we are at ArrowLake which is the disaggregated CPUs.....thats like in 2025 assuming your RaptorLakeR CPU is inexplicably too weak, then you can move to LGA1851 and be ready for LunarLake.

2. I know AMD allows overclocking across the roster.
I listed MSRP prices.....no one bought the 7000 series so they got severe price cuts. (a good thing, punish companies for over charging platform and all)

3. Whats that got to do with the 139K being able to beat the 7950X even with its lower P-core count?
No AVX512 on 139K....who gives a shit, most programs dont use AVX512 so its borderline irrelevant.
You posted that Cinema4D and most renderers dont use AVX512 cuz the clockdown would negate the benefits.......that kinda proves my point.
Who gives a shit about AVX512?
But again, whats that got to do with the 139K being able to beat the 7950X?
Click to expand...

1. Not much different from Devil's Canyon Core i7-4790K refinement from the normal Haswell-based Core i7-4770K or Coffee Lake R-based Core i9-9900K from CoffeeLake-based Core i7-8700K. This is a minor improvement.

AM4 has Zen 1/Zen 1+(4 FPU with 128-bit), Zen 2 (4 FPU with 256-bit improvements), Zen 3 (6 FPU).

2. Your narrative omitted the low-cost multiplier unlocked Ryzen 9 7900.

3. It depends on benchmarks. Intel Gracemont only has 128-bit hardware with 256-bit AVX 2 front-end compatibility!

Blender 3D has a wider audience when compared to paid $3495.00 USD or $719.00 BILLED ANNUALLY Cinema 4D R23.

https://www.phoronix.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/5 Blender 3D benchmarks

https://www.phoronix.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/6 More raytracing renders

https://www.phoronix.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/7 "Intel's Open Image Denoise (OIDN) library with AVX-512 support also meant that even the Ryzen 9 7900X was faster than the Core i9 13900K."

https://www.techspot.com/review/2552-intel-core-i9-13900k/ Chromium Code Compile benchmarks didn't exploit PCIe 5.0 NVMe platform advantage for AM5.

Your narrative is debunked when Intel's Sapphire Rapids (Golden Cove) has AVX-512 enabled.

RPCS3 (PS3 emulator) has AVX-512 support.
 
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Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
rnlval said:
1. Not much different from Devil's Canyon Core i7-4790K refinement from the normal Haswell-based Core i7-4770K or Coffee Lake R-based Core i9-9900K from CoffeeLake-based Core i7-8700K. This is a minor improvement.

AM4 has Zen 1/Zen 1+(4 FPU with 128-bit), Zen 2 (4 FPU with 256-bit improvements), Zen 3 (6 FPU).

2. Your narrative omitted the low-cost multiplier unlocked Ryzen 9 7900.

3. It depends on benchmarks. Intel Gracemont only has 128-bit hardware with 256-bit AVX 2 front-end compatibility!

Blender 3D has a wider audience when compared to paid $3495.00 USD or $719.00 BILLED ANNUALLY Cinema 4D R23.

https://www.phoronix.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/5 Blender 3D benchmarks

https://www.phoronix.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/6 More raytracing renders

https://www.phoronix.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/7 "Intel's Open Image Denoise (OIDN) library with AVX-512 support also meant that even the Ryzen 9 7900X was faster than the Core i9 13900K."

https://www.techspot.com/review/2552-intel-core-i9-13900k/ Chromium Code Compile benchmarks didn't exploit PCIe 5.0 NVMe platform advantage for AM5.

Your narrative is debunked when Intel's Sapphire Rapids (Golden Cove) has AVX-512 enabled.

RPCS3 (PS3 emulator) has AVX-512 support.
Click to expand...
Ill only respond to the bolded.
Then respond one more time after that depending on your response......from that point on....dont @ me.
Cuz you are rambling and are starting to sound unhinged.

1. Minor Improvement or not, LGA1700 from Alderlake had/has an upgrade path.
My point however was anyone who has been building for a while knows Intel doesnt stick to a socket for long, so pointing out to me that LGA1700 will be retired is pointless.

2. What narrative and why are we talking about the 7900 non X?
Yes i "omitted" it, because we arent talking about it.

3. This is a gaming forum, so quite clearly I would be talking about gaming benchmarks more so than productivity benchmarks.
But even then 16p cores in the 7950X a 700 dollar MSRP and its a marginal lead even on its best day.
Dont know if I should be impressed or disappointed.

4. What fucking narrative do you keep going on about?

5. Who gives a shit about RPCS3 when the 7950X then goes on to lose (again) in Windows Native titles 9.9 times out of 10?
Im not getting a top of the range CPU to play frikken PS3 games.
But if I heavily into emulation, the CPU I would choose is the 13900K or an early 12900K.
emulation-ps3.png

^The 7950X with AVX512 actually scores ~39fps so about where the 12700K is.

emulation-switch.png




EDIT: RPCS3 staff comments on AVX512 in the 7950X benchmark from Techpowerup:
I contacted the techpowerup reviewer (wizzard) and asked him to retest with AVX512 and he did. But for some reason he didn't update the zen4 fps figures, maybe he just forgot to do so. He did say he got 39.1fps on his 7950X with AVX512 enabled, so when looking at the chart just assume that the 7950X gets 39.1fps.
 
rnlval

rnlval

Member
Black_Stride said:
Ill only respond to the bolded.
Then respond one more time after that depending on your response......from that point on....dont @ me.
Cuz you are rambling and are starting to sound unhinged.

1. Minor Improvement or not, LGA1700 from Alderlake had/has an upgrade path.
My point however was anyone who has been building for a while knows Intel doesnt stick to a socket for long, so pointing out to me that LGA1700 will be retired is pointless.

2. What narrative and why are we talking about the 7900 non X?
Yes i "omitted" it, because we arent talking about it.

3. This is a gaming forum, so quite clearly I would be talking about gaming benchmarks more so than productivity benchmarks.
But even then 16p cores in the 7950X a 700 dollar MSRP and its a marginal lead even on its best day.
Dont know if I should be impressed or disappointed.

4. What fucking narrative do you keep going on about?

5. Who gives a shit about RPCS3 when the 7950X then goes on to lose (again) in Windows Native titles 9.9 times out of 10?
Im not getting a top of the range CPU to play frikken PS3 games.
But if I heavily into emulation, the CPU I would choose is the 13900K or an early 12900K.
emulation-ps3.png

^The 7950X with AVX512 actually scores ~39fps so about where the 12700K is.





EDIT: RPCS3 staff comments on AVX512 in the 7950X benchmark from Techpowerup:
I contacted the techpowerup reviewer (wizzard) and asked him to retest with AVX512 and he did. But for some reason he didn't update the zen4 fps figures, maybe he just forgot to do so. He did say he got 39.1fps on his 7950X with AVX512 enabled, so when looking at the chart just assume that the 7950X gets 39.1fps.
Click to expand...

1. Intel's shorter platform CPU support cycle can be a factor and Intel Raptor Lake is still missing a native nVMe PCIe 5.0 4X lanes from the CPU.

2. 7900 non-X SKU is multiplier unlocked like Intel K SKUs.

3. From https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/intel-core-i9-13900ks-content-creation-review/

cjrCpAL.png

Game Dev/Virtual Production: Unreal Engine.


4. Intel E-Cores-based Gracemont's AVX2 vector hardware is 128-bit wide with 256-bit AVX2 being in software compatibility mode.
6snDhgE.png

This is why I posted 𝐷𝑟. 𝐼𝑎𝑛 𝐶𝑢𝑡𝑟𝑒𝑠𝑠' post about Cinebench R23's AVX issues




5. That's from https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/ Dated Oct 21st, 2022,

Techpowerup is using an old BIOS 0604 for ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero.

For the 21st October 2022 benchmark release, Techpowerup didn't retest ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero with BIOS 0705.

The 1st action when I obtained retail ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero (shipped with 0705 BIOS 11th of Oct 2022) and TUF X670E Plus Wifi is to update the BIOSes.

From https://rog.asus.com/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-x670e-hero-model/helpdesk_bios/
BIOS 0604 is older than 25th Sep 2022.

BIOS 0611( Update AGESA version to ComboAM5PI 1.0.0.2) includes improved system performance. Dated 26th Sep 2022
BIOS 0705 (Update AGESA version to ComboAM5PI 1.0.0.3 patch A) includes improved system performance. Dated 11th of Oct 2022. My retail ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero is shipped with BIOS 0705.
BIOS 0805 (Update AGESA version to ComboAM5PI 1.0.0.3 patch A + D) includes improved system performance. Dated 15th of Nov 2022




Date: Nov 12th, 2022 with ASRock B650 Livemixer used BIOS version 1.11 AS03 dated 4th November 2022.

Ryzen 9 7900X vs Core i9 13900K running RPCS3's Uncharted Drake's Fortune. Ryzen 9 7900X is faster when compared to Core i9 13900K.

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/B650 LiveMixer/Specification.asp#BIOS
The mentioned ASRock B650 Livemixer used BIOS version 1.11 AS03 dated 4th November 2022.
ASRock's BIOS 1.09 has AGESA version 1.0.0.3 A.

I posted my Techpowerup's ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero's old BIOS issue in Techpowerup's forum.

You're the real "unhinged".
 
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Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
rnlval said:
1. Intel's shorter platform CPU support cycle can be a factor and Intel Raptor Lake is still missing a native nVMe PCIe 5.0 4X lanes from the CPU.

2. 7900 non-X SKU is multiplier unlocked like Intel K SKUs.

3. From https://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/intel-core-i9-13900ks-content-creation-review/

cjrCpAL.png

Game Dev/Virtual Production: Unreal Engine.


4. Intel E-Cores-based Gracemont's AVX2 vector hardware is 128-bit wide with 256-bit AVX2 being in software compatibility mode.
6snDhgE.png

This is why I posted 𝐷𝑟. 𝐼𝑎𝑛 𝐶𝑢𝑡𝑟𝑒𝑠𝑠' post about Cinebench R23's AVX issues




5. That's from https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel-core-i9-13900k/ Dated Oct 21st, 2022,

Techpowerup is using an old BIOS 0604 for ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero.

For the 21st October 2022 benchmark release, Techpowerup didn't retest ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero with BIOS 0705.

The 1st action when I obtained retail ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero (shipped with 0705 BIOS 11th of Oct 2022) and TUF X670E Plus Wifi is to update the BIOSes.

From https://rog.asus.com/motherboards/rog-crosshair/rog-crosshair-x670e-hero-model/helpdesk_bios/
BIOS 0604 is older than 25th Sep 2022.

BIOS 0611( Update AGESA version to ComboAM5PI 1.0.0.2) includes improved system performance. Dated 26th Sep 2022
BIOS 0705 (Update AGESA version to ComboAM5PI 1.0.0.3 patch A) includes improved system performance. Dated 11th of Oct 2022. My retail ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero is shipped with BIOS 0705.
BIOS 0805 (Update AGESA version to ComboAM5PI 1.0.0.3 patch A + D) includes improved system performance. Dated 15th of Nov 2022




Date: Nov 12th, 2022 with ASRock B650 Livemixer used BIOS version 1.11 AS03 dated 4th November 2022.

Ryzen 9 7900X vs Core i9 13900K running RPCS3's Uncharted Drake's Fortune. Ryzen 9 7900X is faster when compared to Core i9 13900K.

https://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/B650 LiveMixer/Specification.asp#BIOS
The mentioned ASRock B650 Livemixer used BIOS version 1.11 AS03 dated 4th November 2022.
ASRock's BIOS 1.09 has AGESA version 1.0.0.3 A.

I posted my Techpowerup's ASUS X670E Crosshair Hero's old BIOS issue in Techpowerup's forum.

You're the real "unhinged".
Click to expand...

6iXSuB5.gif


What has any of this shit you just posted got to do with anything?

Can you make life easy for me and just summarize your point into one sentence.
 
rnlval

rnlval

Member
Black_Stride said:
6iXSuB5.gif


What has any of this shit you just posted got to do with anything?

Can you make life easy for me and just summarize your point into one sentence.
Click to expand...

Again, you posted

And the 7900X is 550 MSRP
The 13900K is 590 MSRP
The 7950X is 700 MSRP.
Direct competitors are
7900X to 13900K.
7950X to 13900KS.

I posted

From https://pcpartpicker.com/products/cpu/#F=99,101&C=8,64&sort=price&page=1 (location USA)

For multiplier-unlocked CPU SKUs with integrated graphics.

Intel Core i9-13900K = $594.99
Intel Core i7-13700K = $421.96

VS

AMD Ryzen 9 7950X = $574.00
AMD Ryzen 9 7900X = $419.99
AMD Ryzen 9 7900 = $429.00

AMD does NOT directly follow Intel's CPU multiplier unlocked K vs multiplier locked non-K product segmentation.

Do NOT impose Intel's K vs non-K product segmentation on AMD's X vs non-X product segmentation.

Your narrative is shit.

----

https://www.techpowerup.com/cpu-specs/ryzen-9-7900.c2961#:~:text=You may freely adjust the,with a dual-channel interface.
You may freely adjust the unlocked multiplier on Ryzen 9 7900, which simplifies overclocking greatly, as you can easily dial in any overclocking frequency.


https://www.pcworld.com/article/705...verclock-amds-next-gen-b650-motherboards.html

"You can overclock on AMD’s next-gen B650 motherboards."​


Intel B760 and H770 lack AC_LL / DC_LL overclock adjustments. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGA_1700

SbLt2KY.png



All AMD Zen 4 and X670/X670E chipsets include at least separate PCIe 5.0 4X NVMe from graphics PCIe 5.0 16X lanes. Intel Raptor Lake is missing this feature.

Unlike Intel desktop motherboards, some AMD X670E motherboards support UDIMM ECC e.g. ASUS X670E SKUs.

Intel's UDIMM ECC support is on low-end Xeon W680 platforms e.g. "12th Generation Core processors support ECC when paired with W680 platforms. "In fact, even enthusiast-grade Core i9-12900K gains ECC support when paired with W680." - Intel spokesperson. Speaking of Intel’s W680, it is necessary to note that this chipset has essentially the same features as Z690, but given its workstation nature, it lacks support for overclocking.

AMD does NOT directly follow Intel chipset Z790 overclock capable vs B760/H770 chipset product segmentation. AMD's B650/B650E and X670/X670E are equivalent to Intel Z790 overclock-capable chipsets.

Intel LGA 1700 is a dead-end platform i.e. Intel made sure the PCI-E 5.0 upgrade is stretched across multiple chipset generations with trickle update tactics e.g. missing CPU's PCIe 5.0 4X lanes for M.2 on the Raptor Lake.

Stop dodging the issue.
 
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Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
rnlval said:
Again, you posted

And the 7900X is 550 MSRP
The 13900K is 590 MSRP
The 7950X is 700 MSRP.
Direct competitors are
7900X to 13900K.
7950X to 13900KS.

I posted

From https://pcpartpicker.com/products/cpu/#F=99,101&C=8,64&sort=price&page=1 (location USA)

For multiplier-unlocked CPU SKUs with integrated graphics.

Intel Core i9-13900K = $594.99
Intel Core i7-13700K = $421.96

VS

AMD Ryzen 9 7950X = $574.00
AMD Ryzen 9 7900X = $419.99
AMD Ryzen 9 7900 = $429.00

AMD does NOT directly follow Intel's CPU multiplier unlocked K vs multiplier locked non-K product segmentation.

Do NOT impose Intel's K vs non-K product segmentation on AMD's X vs non-X product segmentation.

Your narrative is shit.

----

https://www.techpowerup.com/cpu-specs/ryzen-9-7900.c2961#:~:text=You may freely adjust the,with a dual-channel interface.
You may freely adjust the unlocked multiplier on Ryzen 9 7900, which simplifies overclocking greatly, as you can easily dial in any overclocking frequency.


https://www.pcworld.com/article/705...verclock-amds-next-gen-b650-motherboards.html

"You can overclock on AMD’s next-gen B650 motherboards."​


Intel B760 and H770 lack AC_LL / DC_LL overclock adjustments. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGA_1700

SbLt2KY.png



All AMD Zen 4 and X670/X670E chipsets include at least separate PCIe 5.0 4X NVMe from graphics PCIe 5.0 16X lanes. Intel Raptor Lake is missing this feature.

Unlike Intel desktop motherboards, some AMD X670E motherboards support UDIMM ECC e.g. ASUS X670E SKUs.

Intel's UDIMM ECC support is on low-end Xeon W680 platforms e.g. "12th Generation Core processors support ECC when paired with W680 platforms. "In fact, even enthusiast-grade Core i9-12900K gains ECC support when paired with W680." - Intel spokesperson. Speaking of Intel’s W680, it is necessary to note that this chipset has essentially the same features as Z690, but given its workstation nature, it lacks support for overclocking.

AMD does NOT directly follow Intel chipset Z790 overclock capable vs B760/H770 chipset product segmentation. AMD's B650/B650E and X670/X670E are equivalent to Intel Z790 overclock-capable chipsets.

Intel LGA 1700 is a dead-end platform i.e. Intel made sure the PCI-E 5.0 upgrade is stretched across multiple chipset generations with trickle update tactics e.g. missing CPU's PCIe 5.0 4X lanes for M.2 on the Raptor Lake.

Stop dodging the issue.
Click to expand...
anime-ok-menhera-chan.gif
 
Raphael

Raphael

Member
Guys i have been looking at 7600 and 7600x and over here it's basically the same price. 7600 has almost the same performance as 7600x as i understand but lower TDP and packed in cooler. Is 7600X worth it over 7600 or not under those conditions ? Difference will work out to around 50e i guess or whatever a decent enough cooler costs.
 
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winjer

winjer

Gold Member
Raphael said:
Guys i have been looking at 7600 and 7600x and over here it's basically the same price. 7600 has almost the same performance as 7600x as i understand but lower power and packed in cooler. Is 7600X worth it over 7600 or not under those conditions ?
Click to expand...

I would recommend the 7600. It brings a box cooler, so you don't need to buy one. It runs cooler and uses less power.
It runs a bit slower, but you won't noticed it, because it's a small diference.
 
Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Raphael said:
Guys i have been looking at 7600 and 7600x and over here it's basically the same price. 7600 has almost the same performance as 7600x as i understand but lower TDP and packed in cooler. Is 7600X worth it over 7600 or not under those conditions ? Difference will work out to around 50e i guess or whatever a decent enough cooler costs.
Click to expand...
The non-X chips perform exactly the same as the X chips.

And with the recent price cuts you could probably actually find the 7700X going for the price of a 7600(X).
Unless you arent in the US and importing would end up costing you more.
kanzRN3.png

^At these prices the 7700X finally actually looks like a worthwhile chip
 
Raphael

Raphael

Member
Black_Stride said:
The non-X chips perform exactly the same as the X chips.

And with the recent price cuts you could probably actually find the 7700X going for the price of a 7600(X).
Unless you arent in the US and importing would end up costing you more.
kanzRN3.png

^At these prices the 7700X finally actually looks like a worthwhile chip
Click to expand...
Thanks mate.

Im in Poland, so the 7600 and 7600X are for 282 USD (at current x-rate) and 7700 and X around 416 USD so we might not have had that price cut yet. If we will get a similar cut over here for 770 as well and it's jsut 50 usd difference then it's a no brainer and I will probably go for 7700.

Is the situation with 7700 & 7700X similar to the 7600s? Where the non-X part is actually the better deal?
 
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Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
Raphael said:
Thanks mate.

Im in Poland, so the 7600 and 7600X are for 282 USD (at current x-rate) and 7700 and X around 416 USD so we might not have had that price cut yet. If we will get a similar cut over here for 770 as well and it's jsut 50 usd difference then it's a no brainer and I will probably go for 7700.

Is the situation with 7700 & 7700X similar to the 7600s? Where the non-X part is actually the better deal?
Click to expand...
Yeah non-X is always the better deal.
All the non-X chips boost to effectively the same level as the X chips and AMD doesnt lock overclocking on non-X parts.
There is literally no reason to own an X AMD chip when you can get a non-X for less and have the exact same performance.

I feels the same way about Intel K and non-K.
The 12th gen non-K chips get 99.9% of the performance for less money.
 
Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
nightmare-slain said:
So are the 7900/7950X3D coming out this month or not?

I'm tempted to just grab a 13900K and call it a day.
Click to expand...
For gaming?

Literally anything from the 5600 and up will be perfectly fine.
These CPUs are currently so powerful with so few games actually stressing them out its almost academic comparing which CPU hits 6000000fps and which one hits 10fps less.

Youll be on a new motherboard in 5 years anyway, so even the whole LGA1700 being a dead end platform is practically moot.
 
winjer

winjer

Gold Member
nightmare-slain said:
So are the 7900/7950X3D coming out this month or not?

I'm tempted to just grab a 13900K and call it a day.
Click to expand...

videocardz.com

AMD Ryzen 9 7950X3D launches February 28th, costs $699 - VideoCardz.com

First AMD Ryzen 7000X3D CPUs to launch on February 28th AMD has confirmed the launch date and pricing for its Ryzen 7000X3D series. AMD Ryzen 7000X3D Pricing, Source: AMD The company reveals that its flagship 16-core Ryzen 9 7950X3D will cost just as much as the ‘original’ Ryzen 9 7950X 16-core...
videocardz.com videocardz.com

The company reveals that its flagship 16-core Ryzen 9 7950X3D will cost just as much as the ‘original’ Ryzen 9 7950X 16-core Zen4 at launch, which is $699. This processor will launch alongside Ryzen 9 7900X3D, which is a 12-core version on February 28th. AMD has priced this model at $599, which is $50 more than what 7900X was at launch.

These Ryzen 9 X3D CPUs are to be followed by 8-core Ryzen 7 7800X3D model on April 6th. According to AMD, this CPU will cost $449, which is actually more than recently announced Ryzen 9 7900 non-X ($429).
Click to expand...
 
Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
HeisenbergFX4

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
Zen 5 coming yet this year?

https://videocardz.com/newz/gigabyt...n-am5-desktop-cpus-are-coming-later-this-year

It looks like the 7000 and 7000X3D series may not be a final word from AMD for 2023 Ryzen desktop CPU plans. Gigabyte is now claiming that there is a next-generation upgrade for desktop platform is to be unveiled later this year.

This was stated in a press release for workstation E133-C10 and R133-C10 servers which are designed to support AMD Ryzen 7000 “Zen 4” series processor. Whether Gigabyte here refers to workstation or gaming AMD AM5 CPU series, it is simply too early to tell.




Next-Gen Ryzen CPU series this year, Source: Gigabyte

One could argue that the series update could launch in a form of a Zen4 refresh, but the press release clearly states ‘next-generation’, strongly implying Zen5 architecture. Moreover, the same text refers to this upgrade as ‘Ryzen 7000 successor’, which is typically not a word to be used for series refresh.


Although Intel made no comments on the LGA1700 platform future, it is now expected that the company will refresh its Raptor Lake-S series in a third quarter of this year. Those series would have to compete with the Ryzen 7000X3D series and, if Gigabyte’s press release is to be believed, a possible next-gen upgrade.
 
Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
winjer

winjer

Gold Member
Black_Stride said:
AM5 is starting to look really really attractive with an A620 board.
Click to expand...

It looks a bit better, but it has several cutbacks.
For example, AMD promised that AM5 will last at least 5 years. Like AM4 did.
But this chipset only supports PCIe gen4. Today it's not that important. But a few years from now all GPUs will use it.
And with AMD and NVidia cutting down PCIe lanes of some of their GPUs, this will become important.

Another thing that irks me is that they removed Curve Optimizer. This is very important to make Zen4 more power efficient.
I can understand removing overclock and PBO on low end chipsets. But removing Curve Optimizer is an error.
I can only hope AMD fixes this on a future AGESA.
 
Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
winjer said:
It looks a bit better, but it has several cutbacks.
For example, AMD promised that AM5 will last at least 5 years. Like AM4 did.
But this chipset only supports PCIe gen4. Today it's not that important. But a few years from now all GPUs will use it.
And with AMD and NVidia cutting down PCIe lanes of some of their GPUs, this will become important.

Another thing that irks me is that they removed Curve Optimizer. This is very important to make Zen4 more power efficient.
I can understand removing overclock and PBO on low end chipsets. But removing Curve Optimizer is an error.
I can only hope AMD fixes this on a future AGESA.
Click to expand...
Agreed.

But realistically if you are buying a super low end motherboard (cant believe starting price for "super" low end is still ~100 dollars) you arent also buying a GPU thats ever going to saturate PCIe Gen4 before you actually upgrade the whole chipset.
5 years starting in 2022 would be 2027?

So lets say:
2025 - Budget Cards match a 4080
2027 - Budget Cards match a "5080"

You are already EoL with AM5 and are unlikely to have saturated PCIe Gen4.
A 4090 locked to PCIe Gen2 still gets about 90% of its performances.....Gen3 98%.
 
winjer

winjer

Gold Member
Black_Stride said:
Agreed.

But realistically if you are buying a super low end motherboard (cant believe starting price for "super" low end is still ~100 dollars) you arent also buying a GPU thats ever going to saturate PCIe Gen4 before you actually upgrade the whole chipset.
5 years starting in 2022 would be 2027?

So lets say:
2025 - Budget Cards match a 4080
2027 - Budget Cards match a "5080"

You are already EoL with AM5 and are unlikely to have saturated PCIe Gen4.
A 4090 locked to PCIe Gen2 still gets about 90% of its performances.....Gen3 98%.
Click to expand...

But budget cards are where NVidia and AMD are more likely to cut PCIe lanes.
Just look at the RX 6400 with only 4 lanes. At PCie Gen4 it's not so bad. But on an older CPU/Motherboard with only Gen3, it becomes a big bottleneck.
 
Black_Stride

Black_Stride

do not tempt fate do not contrain Wonder Woman's thighs do not do not
winjer said:
But budget cards are where NVidia and AMD are more likely to cut PCIe lanes.
Just look at the RX 6400 with only 4 lanes. At PCie Gen4 it's not so bad. But on an older CPU/Motherboard with only Gen3, it becomes a big bottleneck.
Click to expand...
hmmm.
Thats a good point.
It might actually matter in that final year of support.....which is the most important year to actually drag out your system cuz thats when something magical like the 5800X3D comes out.

Thats the gamble.
I dunno, ill have to think about whether or not I start recommending A620 boards.

Im already "stuck" on LGA 1700 till 2026+ anyway not planning on upgrading till NovaLake......unless LunarLake really is a generational shift then I might upgrade a bit earlier (2025).
 
winjer

winjer

Gold Member
Black_Stride said:
hmmm.
Thats a good point.
It might actually matter in that final year of support.....which is the most important year to actually drag out your system cuz thats when something magical like the 5800X3D comes out.

Thats the gamble.
I dunno, ill have to think about whether or not I start recommending A620 boards.

Im already "stuck" on LGA 1700 till 2026+ anyway not planning on upgrading till NovaLake......unless LunarLake really is a generational shift then I might upgrade a bit earlier (2025).
Click to expand...

For gamers, especially those that want to keep AM5 for several years, this is an important consideration.
But for office use it won't matter. So for that market, this chipset is ok.
 
Mercador

Mercador

Member
I'm currently building a new PC 7600 with a 4070 and I kept reading that I won't be able to use all 4 DDR5 slots, someone got an ELI5 explanation ? Thanks!
 
nightmare-slain

nightmare-slain

Member
Mercador said:
I'm currently building a new PC 7600 with a 4070 and I kept reading that I won't be able to use all 4 DDR5 slots, someone got an ELI5 explanation ? Thanks!
Click to expand...
why do you want to use 4 slots?

i'm no expert and don't really know what i'm talking about but i've always read that dual channel ram is more stable than quad channel. i think if you're going to use 4 sticks you need to make sure they are the exact same brand/models. it could also be that AM5 and DDR5 is still new so some bugs need to be worked out or we need better RAM kits.

there isn't really a need for 4 sticks unless you're trying to get something like 128GB RAM. As far as I'm aware there are no 128GB (2x64GB) ddr5 kits out so you'd need to buy 2x 64GB (2x 32GB) kits. If you want 32GB RAM then just buy a 2x16GB pack. If it's 64GB you want then get 2x32GB.

i know it seems silly to have 4 RAM slots on your board and only use 2 but the vast majority of PC builds i've saw (and all the ones I've done myself) have been dual channel.

was discussing this the other day with OverHeat OverHeat when i said i would've got 128GB if i could find any and they suggested buying two packs of 64GB ram to populate all 4 slots. He said he runs 4x32GB sticks. Maybe he can offer better insight.
 
OverHeat

OverHeat

« generous god »
nightmare-slain said:
why do you want to use 4 slots?

i'm no expert and don't really know what i'm talking about but i've always read that dual channel ram is more stable than quad channel. i think if you're going to use 4 sticks you need to make sure they are the exact same brand/models. it could also be that AM5 and DDR5 is still new so some bugs need to be worked out or we need better RAM kits.

there isn't really a need for 4 sticks unless you're trying to get something like 128GB RAM. As far as I'm aware there are no 128GB (2x64GB) ddr5 kits out so you'd need to buy 2x 64GB (2x 32GB) kits. If you want 32GB RAM then just buy a 2x16GB pack. If it's 64GB you want then get 2x32GB.

i know it seems silly to have 4 RAM slots on your board and only use 2 but the vast majority of PC builds i've saw (and all the ones I've done myself) have been dual channel.

was discussing this the other day with OverHeat OverHeat when i said i would've got 128GB if i could find any and they suggested buying two packs of 64GB ram to populate all 4 slots. He said he runs 4x32GB sticks. Maybe he can offer better insight.
Click to expand...
4x16GB at 6000mhz 😉
aUSd5Dd.jpg
 
Mercador

Mercador

Member
nightmare-slain said:
why do you want to use 4 slots?

i'm no expert and don't really know what i'm talking about but i've always read that dual channel ram is more stable than quad channel. i think if you're going to use 4 sticks you need to make sure they are the exact same brand/models. it could also be that AM5 and DDR5 is still new so some bugs need to be worked out or we need better RAM kits.

there isn't really a need for 4 sticks unless you're trying to get something like 128GB RAM. As far as I'm aware there are no 128GB (2x64GB) ddr5 kits out so you'd need to buy 2x 64GB (2x 32GB) kits. If you want 32GB RAM then just buy a 2x16GB pack. If it's 64GB you want then get 2x32GB.

i know it seems silly to have 4 RAM slots on your board and only use 2 but the vast majority of PC builds i've saw (and all the ones I've done myself) have been dual channel.

was discussing this the other day with OverHeat OverHeat when i said i would've got 128GB if i could find any and they suggested buying two packs of 64GB ram to populate all 4 slots. He said he runs 4x32GB sticks. Maybe he can offer better insight.
Click to expand...
I would take a 2 slots motherboard instead if there's no way to upgrade to 64gb later on. I'm going 2x32 right now, 5600.
 
nightmare-slain

nightmare-slain

Member
OverHeat said:
4x16GB at 6000mhz 😉
aUSd5Dd.jpg
Click to expand...
awesome!

what CPU do you have now? i can't wait to see my 7950X3D running above 5.0GHz even if it's only for a second. and also all the cores in task manager lol. my 9900K doesn't go above 4.7GHz. Well it's "overclocked" to 4.9GHz on all cores but it runs hot so I do an AVX offset. It's at -2. I could do -1 but doesn't really make a difference I suppose. It can do 5.1GHz but it was not stable. Even 5.0GHz all cores was not stable and it was getting HOT. It's crazy that we have CPUs that can hit close to 6GHz. I know the Intel 13900KS can boost to 6.0GHz.

and why are two GPUs showing up? i know that AMD one is the integrated but i thought it'd be disabled if you have an Nvidia card. my intel gpu doesn't show up in task manager
 
Last edited:
OverHeat

OverHeat

« generous god »
nightmare-slain said:
awesome!

what CPU do you have now? i can't wait to see my 7950X3D running above 5.0GHz even if it's only for a second. and also all the cores in task manager lol. my 9900K doesn't go above 4.7GHz. Well it's "overclocked" to 4.9GHz on all cores but it runs hot so I do an AVX offset. It's at -2. I could do -1 but doesn't really make a difference I suppose. It can do 5.1GHz but it was not stable. Even 5.0GHz all cores was not stable and it was getting HOT. It's crazy that we have CPUs that can hit close to 6GHz. I know the Intel 13900KS can boost to 6.0GHz.

and why are two GPUs showing up? i know that AMD one is the integrated but i thought it'd be disabled if you have an Nvidia card. my intel gpu doesn't show up in task manager
Click to expand...
7950X3D , for the iGPU I don’t know but it’s as not giving me any trouble so I let it be lol
 
Last edited:
winjer

winjer

Gold Member
OverHeat

OverHeat

« generous god »
winjer said:
videocardz.com

AMD AGESA 1007B update improves high-speed DDR5 memory support for AM5 platform, 8000 MT/s teased on $223 B650 board - VideoCardz.com

AMD AM5 motherboard enables fast DDR5 support From 6000 MT/s sweet spot to enabling high-speed DDR5 memory with the latest BIOS. AMD AM5 platform development has come a long way, and it appears that the latest AGESA 1.0.0.7 update, which is now available for some motherboards, and it is...
videocardz.com videocardz.com

4IQQ5EC.jpg


Click to expand...

Will buy as soon as officially rated EXPO sticks are release and my Asus x670-e-e firmware is available
 
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