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Bojack Horseman Season 4 |OT| Fuck Man, What Else Is There To Say
- Thread starter TheGreatDirector
- Start date
About episode 9:
I saw the twist coming as soon as the coffee was spilled and the girl narrated it was going to be a bad day... and it feels really familiar, like if I had previously seen some other show do literally this: framing an episode with something fake to then deliver a gutpunch. Maybe some -other- episode of Bojack?🤔. Anyway, poor PC, she really deserves better.
Also, Ill miss Judah.
Also, Ill miss Judah.
There was another tv series that did a very similar concept that was even referenced this season, but it's kinda hard to say which show it is without spoilering the specific plotline
How I Met Your Mother
Though obviously BoJack did it much better
There's an album of the music from the series out, available on iTunes and Spotify as well. It includes the duet from this season and the entirety of the score to Horse out of Water as the second half, appropriately ending with 'Sea of Dreams' which is still just as moving as when I first heard it. Would not mind if they had another episode with a score running through it, maybe not necessarily in another silent episode but Jesse Novak clearly is more than capable and I'd like to hear what else is up their sleeve if the opportunity came.
edit: Man, listening to the soundtrack for that episode felt like rewatching the episode. The synths and arpeggiating motif are very evocative, at least for me anyway.
edit: Man, listening to the soundtrack for that episode felt like rewatching the episode. The synths and arpeggiating motif are very evocative, at least for me anyway.
Oh heck yes. I loved it particularly when it really ramped up at the end of the episode, speeding up the cuts while making the frame more chaotic. Overall I'm pretty pleased with how they're flexing different techniques in the visual storytelling toolbox. Another art shift that was rad was the story of Princess Carolyn's family with the cats. I think that was the first time the show featured photographs. I personally would love to see them go all the way with photorealism?/photographs. In hindsight the hallucinations in Season 1 were a solid test run for playing with the visuals.
Ah, thank you! Without a doubt, that was it.
crackhead_bob
Member
How many seasons does this show have left in it -- if it wants to maintain any of its pretense and aspirations of being high art?
And what is the overall group think of the writers and staff? Are they more cut from the cloth of Alan Ball and Vince Gilligan, or are they more in line with Matt Groenig and Seth McFarland?
And what is the overall group think of the writers and staff? Are they more cut from the cloth of Alan Ball and Vince Gilligan, or are they more in line with Matt Groenig and Seth McFarland?
It's not going to drag on. Netflix doesn't need it to the same way networks do. They want the prestige.
I don't know how people think this season is a good ending point. Nothing was resolved and there's plenty left to explore. People taking the first hint of progress for Bojack a little too far.
Dusk Golem
A 21st Century Rockefeller
I think some are just scared since they know Bojack is going to fuck things up again in a major way next season.
crackhead_bob
Member
Who would make the call, Netflix or the creators? Who made the call when it came to the Simpsons to keep that machine going for as long as it has? Simpsons was once prestige, too. I'm not slamming Bojack Horseman, but I don't follow the behind the scenes production aspect of the show, so I don't ever know what the game plan is, such as questions on whether it will be renewed or not.
In terms of ebb and flow, what trajectory should Bojack skate on? The first 3 seasons is him hitting rock bottom, and in this season he has some levity. So, does he continue ascending, or does he eventually take a clusterfuck plunge like most fans assume he'll do at some point?
DongBeetle
Banned
Any rumblings about season 5?
Just finished.. the entire season.
Pretty good. At first I really disliked how the stories are much less grounded than they were in previous seasons but in the end it kinda came back around to normal. (Episode 12 spoilers)
Incidentally, anyone else disliked the fact that [episode 1/2 spoilers]
Pretty good. At first I really disliked how the stories are much less grounded than they were in previous seasons but in the end it kinda came back around to normal. (Episode 12 spoilers)
I loved the ending, it's nice to have a sliver of hope at the end there.
Incidentally, anyone else disliked the fact that [episode 1/2 spoilers]
There wasn't much to the ending besides some possible symbolism anyway. Bojack sees a group of runners, isn't capable of keeping up with them, and then just keeps running to get away from the death of his closest (and at that point, practically only) friend.
It's the exact thing I'd expect Bojack to do.
CornBurrito
Member
Well... I think the show has done that before. Remember how
Jill Pill basically ended up being extremely minor of a character?
Zaraki_Kenpachi
Member
Cool, I'll give it a shot since I haven't heard of it before.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Until the iPod came out would have believed that you could fit hundreds of songs in a little box?
Why not have faith in humanity instead? I mean, isn't that literally the overarching point of this show we're all here talking about?
The irony is giving me a nosebleed.
Show: We as humans have the capacity to do better, to improve, to make the world a little less shitty for everyone else here.
You: If we give them long enough, the creators of this show will expose their lack of creativity and opportunity to disappoint us.
Atraveller
Banned
God, episode 9 was really something!
I'm taking a little break.
Until tomorrow.
I'm taking a little break.
Until tomorrow.
Chiaroscuro
Member
Man, that ep. 11.
Knowing the series, I was prepared for anything.
I was not prepared for that.
Knowing the series, I was prepared for anything.
I was not prepared for that.
My take on it is that
instead of running free and cutting ties to his past,
Bojack misses his one opportunity to be truly free by running wild. Diane anchors him to his previous life which he eventually goes back to. Remember that the only person in the series that actually seems happy has been Cuddlywhiskers, but he basically cut himself off from the rest of the world and his previous life.
The way I see it, he either follows the path of Cuddlywhiskers or Sarah Lynn and he's made his choice.
Bojack misses his one opportunity to be truly free by running wild. Diane anchors him to his previous life which he eventually goes back to. Remember that the only person in the series that actually seems happy has been Cuddlywhiskers, but he basically cut himself off from the rest of the world and his previous life.
The way I see it, he either follows the path of Cuddlywhiskers or Sarah Lynn and he's made his choice.
NealMcCauley
Member
In hindsight rewatching some early episodes of the season Bojack and Hollyhock's interactions definitely
.
make more sense as a brother/sister dynamic, not a father/daughter
How did it do it's twist
Murder. She Wrote
Member
Finished the season, absolutely loved it. Living in LA and working in the business feels like the show caters to me. The writing is just too good.
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Luckily no one will ever know lol who watches that
TurnipFritters
Member
Yeah that show didn't do that twist unless it was some one off joke buried in the series
Watch HIMYM "Symphony of Illumination".
A lot of people watched that show.
Too bad the ending destroyed its reputation.
CornBurrito
Member
Eh... I think that's only true because Bojack doesn't know how to be a parent. And Hollyhock already has eight dads, as she says constantly.
Chezzymann
Member
Just finished it. Thought it was pretty good,
Would be cool for the ending to be bojack finally running with those horses.
there wasnt any hard hitting terrible stuff that happened, but the revelation about bojacks sister had a similar impact. Only thing Im not a fan of is Todd. He seems redundant since Mr Peanutbutter already has wacky antics. And his arc was pretty weak. Not living with bojack sucked all the interesting drama out of his character. I kind of like the more optimistic tone this season had, and Bojack is finally making some progress. Hope season 5 is the end. Dont want the show to stick around too long.
Chiaroscuro
Member
plus all the background about his mother story gives us a lot of perspective, on how we are kind of fucked from our parents sins but we have to break from them to grow up. Bojack is still in this loop, hasn't break free but maybe by looking at his sister kind of feeling the same things will help him realize this. He still left his mother at that crappy care house, didn't he? He almost read her memories book which was at his house, maybe that is something for next season too.
Agree with Todd. He lost his appeal but it just serving as a represent of minorities right now.
The final scene with Diane and Mr. Peanutbutter had a lot of impact too, when she realizes that she cannot be squeezing her eyes all the time to see the little good thing when everything around is not satisfying.
Princess Caroline had a lot of development too, her arc was quite good.
But I don't feel like running with the horses would be a good end. It is liberty, yes, but also an escape. He needs to be connected with people for a good ending.
Agree with Todd. He lost his appeal but it just serving as a represent of minorities right now.
The final scene with Diane and Mr. Peanutbutter had a lot of impact too, when she realizes that she cannot be squeezing her eyes all the time to see the little good thing when everything around is not satisfying.
Princess Caroline had a lot of development too, her arc was quite good.
But I don't feel like running with the horses would be a good end. It is liberty, yes, but also an escape. He needs to be connected with people for a good ending.
Loved absolutely everything about this season. Well except the absence of
.
Episodes 2, 9, 10 and especially, 11 wrecked me. That episode 9
. Husband prefered ep.9 because he
Amazing season.
beloved character actress Margo Martindale, my favourite character in the show
Episodes 2, 9, 10 and especially, 11 wrecked me. That episode 9
plot twist
hates Beatrice, who I ended up empathizing with. And Princess Carolyn doesn't deserve the shit she went through. I kind of agree... I don't know. Beatrice's flashbacks and the images they used were very impactful to me.
I still really like Todd, but his arc with the
was the worst part of the season. At least the running gag of
was really funny
But everything else about the season was really great. Not so amazing as season 2-3, but still is the best show of the year again for me
Clown dentists
his clothes showing up everywhere after the fashion show
But everything else about the season was really great. Not so amazing as season 2-3, but still is the best show of the year again for me
Psychoward
Banned
Is there a written recap for seasons 1-3? I'm on the second episode of s4 rn and forgot a few things.
Just finished the whole season. Surprised at how solid it was. That was probably the only season finale I really liked, as most other BoJack finales feel like they're way too focused on setting up the next season.
Couple of thoughts on each of the main characters' storylines:
Bojack -
Mr. PB -
Diane -
Princess Caroline -
Todd -
Couple of thoughts on each of the main characters' storylines:
Bojack -
More Hollyhock. I loved their relationship, and I felt such a wave of relief when I realized BoJack actually did something right for once, that he actually was enough for somebody. Also, looking forward to that True Detective Parody he's gonna be in.
Mr. PB -
It always hits hard when he gets real. I hope he gets into wacky hijinks to dull his pain next season, but then it comes out in a big way. Honestly, Diane and him are better off divorced, they were fun as a couple but never made sense together (come to think of it, PB never made sense with ANYONE he's ever been with). We know PB will land on his feet in the end, and that'll undoubtedly be a fun ride. I don't have as high hopes for Diane.
Diane -
Looking forward to her despair next season. I think she's like BoJack, someone that isn't really capable of truly being happy for a long period of time. I really wish they didn't show off her family in season 1. It was boring and unfunny, and they were dumb and paper thin as characters. There was a lot they could have done with that, but it's ruined. Maybe she'll explore her relationship with BoJack and end up even more depressed by the end of it. Either way, Diane's path will definitely be interesting.
Still a great character who could probably be the star of a spin-off if someone really wanted it. Just, more of what she's doing, trying to "have it all", and how hard that is.
Todd -
Just... get rid of him. No more Todd please. He's this ineffable loser who shows up everywhere to pump dumb random humour everywhere, and then they try to inject serious discussion with his character and it becomes jarring. He is the most ungrateful dick on the show. He's an annoying sponge that lives off his friends and then repays them by constantly screwing up when they ask him to do something, or talking down to them in BoJack's case. Why do they rely on him so much? He's terrible.
And his asexuality plotline basically sucks. He has zero interest in sex and he's looking for companionship with other people with zero interest in sex. Who gives a shit. We have a bad character who'll get into a relationship with another character who isn't into having sex, and then what? They'll just be in a relationship except with no sex, and I assume they'll talk about how much they don't want to have sex with each other or anyone. That obviously isn't how real Aces act in relationships, but you know that's what the show's gonna do. There's no way to write that in an interesting way, not with Todd.
And his asexuality plotline basically sucks. He has zero interest in sex and he's looking for companionship with other people with zero interest in sex. Who gives a shit. We have a bad character who'll get into a relationship with another character who isn't into having sex, and then what? They'll just be in a relationship except with no sex, and I assume they'll talk about how much they don't want to have sex with each other or anyone. That obviously isn't how real Aces act in relationships, but you know that's what the show's gonna do. There's no way to write that in an interesting way, not with Todd.
FlowersisBritish
fleurs n'est pas britannique
I am always shocked at all the hate Todd gets :< I like him, I think his antics are funny and he works best with Mr. Penutbutter. His entire clown dentist business plan had me in stitches.
Nocturnowl
Member
Finished the season, another strong run of episodes.
I feel like I should go back and rewatch the first three seasons since I've never given them a second run, I need to fill this empty hole in my life with a show about the eternal empty hole in a horse's life.
I feel like I should go back and rewatch the first three seasons since I've never given them a second run, I need to fill this empty hole in my life with a show about the eternal empty hole in a horse's life.
EchoChamber
Member
I like todd 
Really enjoyed this season, but as usual Episodes 11 and 12 stole the show for me. Episode 11 in truth was really hard to watch because:
I've never had issues with my mom like that but despite it all, Bojack's mom is still family, and I could never, ever, in a million years do what he did to her, no matter what my mom did to me. Maybe that's the Asian heritage speaking to me in some form though, I can understand why he hated her for what she did to him
It may (may) not be the worst thing he's ever done, but I'd say it's still the most malicious and spiteful thing we've seen him do.
That episode was a little tough for me because
I realized that I could probably do what Bojack did but with my father.
Gentleman Jack
Member
Finally done with the season. Stray takes:
Todd untethered from Bojack is the funniest he has ever been in the entire series. He's really the tonic the show needs to not be overbearing with the frequent personal tragedies of the rest of the cast.
I fully expected the season to end with Beatrice dying. What I did not expect was for the sympathy for her upbringing to thematically tie together the season about the many ways people have at their disposal to hurt and permanently scar each other, from her disintegrating family to the crushing disappointment of what happens when she tries to do better than a broken home only to land in one of her own. Her desperate plea to Beatrice just ended me.
I'm not into Princess Carolyn's arc this season. I saw the markers for her relationship getting rocky, but the
payoff and her turning into a mini-Bojack for a while was a bit too straightforward. I expected more swerves, particularly from Judah or Rabbitowitz or Stilton. I'm not sure I really enjoyed the relatively conventional payoff to Carolyn's fall into despair and I hope the next season makes more with her life of clinging on while clawing back up from every downturn.
I'm very relieved that the Peanutbutter/Diane dynamic got to play out with zero interference from Bojack this season, it makes the hits more raw and less the result of misunderstanding. Diane's pain is more real when it has more to do with how much she finally accepts her understanding of her situation than being misled into worse behavior by a bad influence. When Mr. Peanutbutter finally speaks his mind instead of being an aloof catchphrase, the realest of shit goes down.
I thought episode 6 is where I'd get my soul torn out because things felt like they were winding down from there, but 11&12 just ripped me apart. Instead of living in Bojack's mind for 24 minutes we live inside Beatrice, and how her story connects to Hollyhock's gives that final line
got me all
Season 3 felt like a lot of catharsis, between Todd finally shedding the iron weight of Bojack's sins on his life and the restaurant fight between Princess Carolyn and Bojack. Season 4 was far more introspective, as the cast assesses their own personal damage and tries to answer where happiness is actually going to come from, even if there's no direct replies for most of them. Todd's message is a truly affirmative one, even if it's as hilarious as everyone in a restaurant wearing his clothes or as true to life as him connecting with and learning about his sexuality. I don't feel like I'm being conned into cheering for him, Forrest Gump style. I genuinely want his character to develop into the one example of carefree joy this show has.
Todd untethered from Bojack is the funniest he has ever been in the entire series. He's really the tonic the show needs to not be overbearing with the frequent personal tragedies of the rest of the cast.
I fully expected the season to end with Beatrice dying. What I did not expect was for the sympathy for her upbringing to thematically tie together the season about the many ways people have at their disposal to hurt and permanently scar each other, from her disintegrating family to the crushing disappointment of what happens when she tries to do better than a broken home only to land in one of her own. Her desperate plea to Beatrice just ended me.
I'm not into Princess Carolyn's arc this season. I saw the markers for her relationship getting rocky, but the
miscarriage
I'm very relieved that the Peanutbutter/Diane dynamic got to play out with zero interference from Bojack this season, it makes the hits more raw and less the result of misunderstanding. Diane's pain is more real when it has more to do with how much she finally accepts her understanding of her situation than being misled into worse behavior by a bad influence. When Mr. Peanutbutter finally speaks his mind instead of being an aloof catchphrase, the realest of shit goes down.
I thought episode 6 is where I'd get my soul torn out because things felt like they were winding down from there, but 11&12 just ripped me apart. Instead of living in Bojack's mind for 24 minutes we live inside Beatrice, and how her story connects to Hollyhock's gives that final line
I've never had a brother
Season 3 felt like a lot of catharsis, between Todd finally shedding the iron weight of Bojack's sins on his life and the restaurant fight between Princess Carolyn and Bojack. Season 4 was far more introspective, as the cast assesses their own personal damage and tries to answer where happiness is actually going to come from, even if there's no direct replies for most of them. Todd's message is a truly affirmative one, even if it's as hilarious as everyone in a restaurant wearing his clothes or as true to life as him connecting with and learning about his sexuality. I don't feel like I'm being conned into cheering for him, Forrest Gump style. I genuinely want his character to develop into the one example of carefree joy this show has.
blame space
Banned
FML episode 9.
princess Carolyn 😫
princess Carolyn 😫
Just finished the season.
I really liked it. In the season 3 thread I said I wasn't sure if I wanted to keep watching it because Bojack seemed irredeemable but I think I've changed my mind about that for now.
Episode 11-
Episode 12-
I agree with others that Todd has become kind of pointless now that he's out of Bojack's house. I like the character just fine though but yeah his high jinks really doesn't add much to Bojack's story anymore.
I really liked it. In the season 3 thread I said I wasn't sure if I wanted to keep watching it because Bojack seemed irredeemable but I think I've changed my mind about that for now.
Episode 11-
Yeah this was pretty shitty on his part, hopefully he'll come around. But she was a horrible person and Bojack didn't get to see in her mind and all of her history like us viewers did. I mean no I would never do that to a family member especially if I was capable of taking care of them, but I mean she did almost kill his "daughter".
Episode 12-
Nice to see the season end on a high note for Bojack for a change, he hardly ever seems to smile.
I agree with others that Todd has become kind of pointless now that he's out of Bojack's house. I like the character just fine though but yeah his high jinks really doesn't add much to Bojack's story anymore.
blame space
Banned
the thing about people you think are irredeemable is, if you give it enough time and keep them in your life, they become redeemable again. it's basically a tolerance that eventually feels like it did to begin with.
Todd is fine I like his ace plotline.
Todd is fine I like his ace plotline.
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