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[Gucci Messiah]

Iwata testified to that extent at an investors meeting during E3.

LOL

I remember when people tried to say the Wii was in between the xbox and xbox 360 in terms of power and that devs weren't utilizing the system right.

We saw how that turned out.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

Iwata testified to that extent at an investors meeting during E3.

Do you have a link to the text?

I'm not doubting you, I'd just like to see what he said.

 

[sp3000]

Iwata testified to that extent at an investors meeting during E3.

You really think that he is going to say anything bad at an investors meeting

 

[deviljho]

Power goes beyond graphics. Larger, more comelling open world games can be created. Imagine next generation Fallout without the need to break up areas of the world behind loading screen gimmicks like gates and metro tunnels.


The worlds can be filled with more NPC's, enemies, and content. A.I. routines can become more detailed, etc etc etc

I think that all of these points are valid. It's important to keep improving graphical fidelity. Larger worlds, less load time are nice. As are increasing the number of NPC, enemies...

But I don't see how any of that will make playing the tenth 3rd person cover shooter any fresher.

Sure, better AI is nice, but can you explain how AI has been improved from the previous generation vs. the current and also describe what the technical barriers are currently? And adding all this extra content and AI costs money, where is that going to come from?

How have any of the things you mention actually been implemented in any way to make a game fresh? I'm not saying that these things shouldn't be done, but I'm skeptical as to how much new hardware brings to the table beyond prettier games (which I'm trying to dismiss).

 

[SillyEskimo]

There is no doubt in my mind that people don't understand that the Wii U is a new console right now.

I agree.

My wife impulse bought me a WiiU on Xmas eve. I opened it that night at my parent's house. There were 20+ people there and tons of kids/teenagers. Only 1 or 2 kids knew what it was. Everyone else only became interested when I explained to them it was a new Nintendo console, replacing the Wii. I explained so of the unique aspects and people were just dumbfounded they hadn't heard of it. Yes, I had people that simply thought it was another Wii as well...

Also, my wife said that our local Best Buy had a pallet of the deluxe versions on Christmas Eve.

The system has amazing potential IMO. I just hope it gets support. At the very least it will be nice to have just for the exclusives. It was a great gift because it is not something I would have bought for myself at this point in time.

The controller is fucking fantastic!

 

[DjRoomba]

LOL

I remember when people tried to say the Wii was in between the xbox and xbox 360 in terms of power and that devs weren't utilizing the system right.

We saw how that turned out.

Well honestly it is. People love to say wii was just a gamecube with motion control, but it did have a better graphics card and could do things graphically the gamecube couldn't

 

[Plinko]

You really think that he is going to say anything bad at an investors meeting

It is illegal to lie to investors.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

Well honestly it is. People love to say wii was just a gamecube with motion control, but it did have a better graphics card and could do things graphically the gamecube couldn't

No, most Wii games look like they could be done on the Gamecube. Some of the prettier 1st party titles could have probably run on the Xbox.

Edit: Sure the Wii had extra bells and whistles but your average consumer can't tell the difference between Wii and Xbox or GCN games if you show them screenshots.

 

[Visualante2]

People leaning on the price debate this early are precluding the question, do people even want another Wii? Lowering the price doesn't make something more desirable.

 

[Glorified G]

Still $50 too much

 

[Gahiggidy]

Do you have a link to the text?

I'm not doubting you, I'd just like to see what he said.

I'm not sure this is the exact interview I was remembering, don't have time to read the whole thing, but this is at least a similar quote I was referencing:

Q 12 The Wii is the best-selling console and holds the top share among the video game consoles for now, but both in Japan and overseas for about these two years, the Wii has been sometimes excluded from what is called multiplatform software and some games have been released only for the PS3 and the Xbox 360. When the Wii U has entered a mature phase four or five years later, will it be able to compete with a next-generation console by Microsoft or personal computers? I am concerned about a future situation in which a game is available for consoles other than the Wii U due to a lack of power. Please let me know what efforts you have made to avoid it.

A 12 - Iwata:

We have not successfully kept the momentum of the Wii for about the last two years because third-party publishers have released a smaller number of game titles and Nintendo has also decreased new games for the platform in preparation for the launch of the Nintendo 3DS and the Wii U. As the Wii has no such system as the gMiiverseh in the Nintendo Network mentioned earlier today, in which consumers have a chance to encounter new games in communication with others, the momentum temporarily provoked by a new game has easily been diminished.

We cannot promise that the Wii U will never be excluded from multiplatform software for eternity, but we can at least assure you that the Wii U will not have such a big difference as the Wii had in comparison to how, on other platforms, developers could expect very different graphic capabilities of generating HD-applicable high-resolution graphics. Other companies might launch a next-generation console with more power, but we donft necessarily think that the difference between the Wii U and such console will be as drastic as what you felt it was between the Wii and the other consoles because there will be fewer and fewer differentiators in graphics. Naturally some consumers are very sensitive about such a small difference in graphics so that we will make efforts to make the most of the performance of the Wii U to keep up with technological innovations and not to make the system out-of-date soon. However, as the structure of the product called the Wii U is as if we are including both a video game console and a handheld device, if we were not careful about how luxurious both of them were, we could end up having to offer the price of the two hardware systems combined, which would not be an acceptable price for the consumers. We had to design it by balancing the performance and the costs.

Source: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/stock/meeting/120628qa/03.html

 

[vctor182]

I don't think bundling their systems with Mario is something Nintendo does anymore until the generation's done. Those long tail full-price Mario sales are their bread & butter.

Well they did bundle 3DLand with the 3DS also this bundle is not made by Nintendo it's by a retailer.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

People leaning on the price debate this early are precluding the question, do people even want another Wii? Lowering the price doesn't make something more desirable.

They don't want another Wii, that's just one reason why naming the console Wii U was incredibly stupid. I'm still annoyed they picked that terrible name.

 

[deviljho]

but we donft necessarily think that the difference between the Wii U and such console will be as drastic as what you felt it was between the Wii and the other consoles because there will be fewer and fewer differentiators in graphics.

the joke being that the Wii U could pass this test while still being pallbark PS360.

 

[outunderthestars]

I think that all of these points are valid. It's important to keep improving graphical fidelity. Larger worlds, less load time are nice. As are increasing the number of NPC, enemies...

But I don't see how any of that will make playing the tenth 3rd person cover shooter any fresher.

Sure, better AI is nice, but can you explain how AI has been improved from the previous generation vs. the current and also describe what the technical barriers are currently? And adding all this extra content and AI costs money, where is that going to come from?

How have any of the things you mention actually been implemented in any way to make a game fresh? I'm not saying that these things shouldn't be done, but I'm skeptical as to how much new hardware brings to the table beyond prettier games (which I'm trying to dismiss).

Skyrim or Fallout New Vegas simply wouldn't have been possible with the ram limitations of the previous generation due to RAM limitations. Expanding that ram again will make even larger, more dynamics worlds possible.

I am not a developer, so I don;t understand A.I. scripting, but I know that they are able to apply more complex A.I. routines to larger numbers of enemies/NPC's this generation than last. An increase in hardware performance will allow for even more of that in the future.

You keep attempting to poison the discussion by creating the strawman argument that current generation games are all 3rd person cover shooters. Skyrim has sold over 10 million units which is more than any 3rd person shooter this generation.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

I'm not sure this is the exact interview I was remembering, don't have time to read the whole thing, but this is at least a similar quote I was referencing:Source: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/stock/meeting/120628qa/03.html

That doesn't really say that the Wii U is much more powerful than the 360/PS3, just that the 720/PS4 won't be huge leaps from their predecessors.

At least that's how I interpret it.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

I'm not sure this is the exact interview I was remembering, don't have time to read the whole thing, but this is at least a similar quote I was referencing:Source: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/stock/meeting/120628qa/03.html

This doesn't further your point one bit. Iwata is just saying he thinks that as tech progresses, graphical differences will be minimal. The Wii is basically an Xbox with a few extra bells and whistles. The same goes for Wii U.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

That doesn't really say that the Wii U is much more powerful than the 360/PS3, just that the 720/PS4 won't be huge leaps from their predecessors.

At least that's how I interpret it.

Yeah, it doesn't clarify anything. It's basically just him stating a vague opinion.

 

[deviljho]

You keep attempting to poison the discussion by creating the strawman argument that current generation games are all 3rd person cover shooters. Skyrim has sold over 10 million units which is more than any 3rd person shooter this generation.

I'm sorry. I don't mean to single out 3rd person cover shooters. But you are missing the point. At what point will making the large open world larger have negligible impact in my game-playing experience? And HD certainly isn't going to change 2D Mario mechanics much either, frankly.

You really can't articulate the value new hardware will bring to these areas outside of saying "larger worlds" "more npcs/enemies" "better AI" - sure, I'll have to load less and maybe I can interact with a certain NPC a certain way, but I'm not sold on how these are new experiences in gaming. And how will they fund all this?

But I guess we can wait until the next gen to see what devs give us. No need to argue back and forth.

 

[Fularu]

I only liked two games in the collection. But if you guys like it, good.

Sure, show me your statistics with you spending more than 60 minutes in the game (you know, enough time to try each game exactly once).

 

[Coolwhip]

Aaaaaand we're at the 7 year old hardware posts. Do some research on what the angle of Wii U is and what the costly parts are before posting bs like that.

 

[sp3000]

I'm sorry. I don't mean to single out 3rd person cover shooters. But you are missing the point. At what point will making the large open world larger have negligible impact in my game-playing experience?

You really can't articulate the value new hardware will bring to these areas outside of saying "larger worlds" "more npcs/enemies" "better AI" - sure, I'll have to load less and maybe I can interact with a certain NPC a certain way, but I'm not sold on how these are new experiences in gaming.

Have you played Planetside 2, because if you did I don't think you would be asking this

 

[Gahiggidy]

This doesn't further your point one bit. Iwata is just saying he thinks that as tech progresses, graphical differences will be minimal. The Wii is basically an Xbox with a few extra bells and whistles. The same goes for Wii U.

Then why does it cost so much to make?

 

[outunderthestars]

I'm sorry. I don't mean to single out 3rd person cover shooters. But you are missing the point. At what point will making the large open world larger have negligible impact in my game-playing experience?

You really can't articulate the value new hardware will bring to these areas outside of saying "larger worlds" "more npcs/enemies" "better AI" - sure, I'll have to load less and maybe I can interact with a certain NPC a certain way, but I'm not sold on how these are new experiences in gaming.

But I guess we can wait until the next gen to see what devs give us. No need to argue back and forth.

Exactly, seeing as though we haven't seen the next gen offerings yet, it is kind of silly to argue this.

What we are seeing is that demand for the Wii U is not as strong as Nintendo imagined it would be.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

Aaaaaand we're at the 7 year old hardware posts. Do some research on what the angle of Wii U is and what the costly parts are before posting bs like that.

LOL it is 7 year old hardware, the cost is driven up by the gamepad. I'm sure you have no bias.

 

[netBuff]

Aaaaaand we're at the 7 year old hardware posts. Do some research on what the angle of Wii U is and what the costly parts are before posting bs like that.

Who cares about what is inside the thing? What I see is what the Wii U outputs to the screen: Nothing that is in any way a significant improvement over 360/PS3.

 

[UncleSporky]

We already have enough specs of the system to know it's not graphically "roughly equivalent" to 360 and PS3. It has a modern GPU with a modern feature set the other systems lack.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

Aaaaaand we're at the 7 year old hardware posts. Do some research on what the angle of Wii U is and what the costly parts are before posting bs like that.

Pretty sure most people are talking about the console...not the controller.

 

[Fularu]

That doesn't really say that the Wii U is much more powerful than the 360/PS3, just that the 720/PS4 won't be huge leaps from their predecessors.

At least that's how I interpret it.

WiiU's GPU is far beyond anything in the PS3 or the 360.

That's not even up for debate. The only things people can (and will) mock are the ram speed (but it has a lot more) and the CPU (because most devs aren't used to its structure, which is prety different from Cell/Xenon)

 

[Gucci Messiah]

Than why does it cost so much to make?

The gamepad, duh. That thing is half the cost of the system.

 

[Kadey]

Nobody from work bought one and we had well over three dozen people buying the original Wii at release or near. With some of them, it seems their kids grew up a little and became part of the COD/Halo 4 crowd so they care not for Nintendo games any longer.

I think it boils down to advertisement and ignorance of what the product really is. Some people think it's a wii attachment or a new model of the wii with an added peripheral, not necessarily a totally new console.

 

[AndrewDean84xX]

Is this that much of a shocker? People spent less this year at retail, so it makes sense that shelves have a lot of stock to move, and want to move it fast.

 

[2MF]

I have also gotten this question

WiiU is a terrible name, just like 3ds. People think it is some kind of minor upgrade, not a new console

The logo doesn't help either. Today I saw a demo unit at a store and from a distance you'd think it was a Wii with some accessory.

 

[deviljho]

Have you played Planetside 2, because if you did I don't think you would be asking this

Well, if the nextgen brings Planetside 2 type persistent multiplayer gaming and world maps, then I'll eat my hat...

I'm not against an increase in graphical fidelity or better specs. I just don't want publishers to continue to consolidate products and release the same old games over and over. Which I think is a plausible reality, at least for some pubs/franchises.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

WiiU's GPU is far beyond anything in the PS3 or the 360.

That's not even up for debate. The only things people can (and will) mock are the ram speed (but it has a lot more) and the CPU (because most devs aren't used to its structure, which is prety different from Cell/Xenon)

Who cares what's inside, the thing produces games that can be done on the 360 in terms of graphics. We saw this same bs argument when the Wii launched but nobody bothered to take advantage of all that supposed extra horsepower.

 

[UncleSporky]

Honestly I just think this is the beginnings of diminishing returns becoming more obvious. The new MS and Sony platforms will have much more modern GPUs as well and I'm not certain we're going to see a massively noticeable improvement there either.

People already point at certain games as if they're amazing harbingers of the future but I'm not seeing much better than what we've got.

Who cares what's inside, the thing produces games that can be done on the 360 in terms of graphics. We saw this same bs argument when the Wii launched but nobody bothered to take advantage of all that supposed extra horsepower.

Along those lines, this is something to dig up next gen - who cares what's inside them, they won't be looking head and shoulders above what we have already.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Is this that much of a shocker? People spent less this year at retail, so it makes sense that shelves have a lot of stock to move, and want to move it fast.

I don't think that's true. I know that sales were up far less than expected, but I don't think there was an actual decline in shopping this year.

 

[BlackJace]

Who cares what's inside, the thing produces games that can be done on the 360 in terms of graphics. We saw this same bs argument when the Wii launched but nobody bothered to take advantage of all that supposed extra horsepower.

No one has taken advantage of the console's horsepower yet either.

 

[Steve Youngblood]

WiiU's GPU is far beyond anything in the PS3 or the 360.

That's not even up for debate.

Really? Far beyond? How far? I know it's better, but what evidence is there that the GPU is a massive leap?

 

[Gucci Messiah]

No one has taken advantage of the console's horsepower yet either.

I can't tell if you're trolling or dumb

 

[Y2Kev]

The PS3s were likely put out alot earlier as the probably restock in alphabetical order:

...Kindles, Lionel Richie CDs, Norton Anti-Virus Software, Macs, Olympus Cameras, PlayStations, Quickbooks, Roombas, Sennheiser Headphones, Thermador Refridgerators, Ultrabooks, VTech V.Readers, Wii Us, XM Car Radios, Zune MP3 Players.

genius

 

[velvet_nitemare]

Along those lines, this is something to dig up next gen - who cares what's inside them, they won't be looking head and shoulders above what we have already.

Maybe for the first year, sure. But when the 2nd year of PS720 rolls around, games will start popping up that are clearly a generation ahead of anything found on PS360 and WiiU.

 

[sp3000]

Along those lines, this is something to dig up next gen - who cares what's inside them, they won't be looking head and shoulders above what we have already.

Stuff like Agni's Philosophy pretty much is head and shoulders above what we currently have

 

[UncleSporky]

I can't tell if you're trolling or dumb

Alright, who has taken advantage of the console's horsepower? You think Batman Armored Edition uses the improved GPU at all, or is it a port based on the 360 version? You think they took the time to modify the game that ran on 512 meg of ram to use a full gig?

 

[BlackJace]

I can't tell if you're trolling or dumb

Very pleasant. All we have to go on as of now are launch ports. Did anything of the caliber of Uncharted 2 or 3, Killzone 2 or 3, Gears, or Halo 4 show up on the platforms this early?

 

[UncleSporky]

Maybe for the first year, sure. But when the 2nd year of PS720 rolls around, games will start popping up that are clearly a generation ahead of anything found on PS360 and WiiU.

Unless it turns out that developers are already at the limit of what they can spend on games and it turns out to feel basically the same as this gen with slightly higher res textures.

 

[Gucci Messiah]

Maybe for the first year, sure. But when the 2nd year of PS720 rolls around, games will start popping up that are clearly a generation ahead of anything found on PS360 and WiiU.

Pretty much.

I don't see Wii U games looking much better when devs can reuse assets and save money.

 

[UncleSporky]

Pretty much.

I don't see Wii U games looking much better when devs can reuse assets and save money.

So now you agree with the people who are "trolling or dumb" who say that nobody has pushed the system yet, since cost-conscious devs are just reusing assets in their ports thus far?

 

[Steve Youngblood]

Alright, who has taken advantage of the console's horsepower? You think Batman Armored Edition uses the improved GPU at all, or is it a port based on the 360 version? You think they took the time to modify the game that ran on 512 meg of ram to use a full gig?

I'm growing increasingly puzzled at these types of responses given that the system is launched. We have first and third party games released. We know of the games about to come out. Now, I don't doubt that we'll see stuff on the Wii U that looks better than what came out at launch. But there is this sentiment out there that I keep seeing that seems to think that the Wii U just has tons of completely untapped potential that we are bound to see, and I don't know why.

 

[BrokenEchelon]

Nintendo Land is a SIXTY DOLLAR GAME?