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Marvel's The Avengers |OT| (Dir. Joss Whedon) [Spoilers unmarked]

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S

sharbhund

Member
Here's the transcript of the Feige and Ruffalo interview where they discuss the possibility of a new Hulk standalone movie:

“In between all the red carpets, me and Mark have been talking about just what is a standalone Hulk movie going to be, and how we take all goodwill and this forward momentum from the Avengers into a Hulk movie. When that’ll be, who knows, but the conversations have definitely started.”

Ruffalo added “’I’m gonna try and get Joss Whedon in a room and work out what could be a Hulk movie, with Kevin’s blessing of course”
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H

Hot Coldman

Banned
Slayven said:
People whine about BW, but she just helped Spiderman take out Sandman who had merged with the Sahara desert.

tumblr_m0q8tlRWgp1qh5euso1_500.jpg
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What good could fucking Black Widow be against Sandman? Actually, I have a lot of problems with Sandman, mainly to do with the fact his powers are like some Omega Level mutant shit. My least favourite Spider-Man villain- I feel like he'd be one of my favourite Marvel characters if he weren't a villain, though.

Is that Silver Sable with Spidey and Widow?
 
O

Omiee

Member
holy holy holy fucking shit. this movie is amaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazing.

i loved every bit of it. My girl who never wants to go to a action movie to me had to be dragged with me to the movie. She ended up thanking me for convincing her to go with me.

she looooooved it.

man do i love the hulk.

im soo going for the 2nd time tomorrow, this movie deserves it.

9.5 out of 10 for me.

i dont want to spoil the movie so i just posted my reaction to just coming back from the movie.
 
S

Speedymanic

Banned
sharbhund said:
Here's the transcript of the Feige and Ruffalo interview where they discuss the possibility of a new Hulk standalone movie:
Click to expand...

Wouldn't work. Haven't seen AA, but Hulk always struck me as a character that works extremely well in small doses, devoting an entire movie to him just won't work as no-one really wants to see Banner fighting the beast within any more, they want to see Hulk wreck shit.

That's probably why he's had such a positive reaction in AA. It'd be a mistake to take that reaction as meaning the gen pop want a solo Hulk movie.

Just my opinion.
 
Nizz

Nizz

Member
Man, it really sounds like the Hulk is running away with this movie. Seems like they nailed the character this time if there's talk of the character getting his own movie again. Which is fine in my book. :)

May 4th seems so far away now.
 
Nizz

Nizz

Member
Speedymanic said:
Wouldn't work. Haven't seen AA, but Hulk always struck me as a character that works extremely well in small doses, devoting an entire movie to him just won't work as no-one really wants to see Banner fighting the beast within any more, they want to see Hulk wreck shit.

That's probably why he's had such a positive reaction in AA. It'd be a mistake to take that reaction as meaning the gen pop want a solo Hulk movie.

Just my opinion.
Click to expand...
Good point. That could be why the character is getting such great feedback from people seeing the movie. Maybe an hour's worth of Hulk onscreen wrecking shit is what most people want. Who knows though, maybe they could come up with a concept good enough for a full length solo Hulk movie?
 
G

G-Fex

Member
Green Scar said:
What good could fucking Black Widow be against Sandman? Actually, I have a lot of problems with Sandman, mainly to do with the fact his powers are like some Omega Level mutant shit. My least favourite Spider-Man villain- I feel like he'd be one of my favourite Marvel characters if he weren't a villain, though.

Is that Silver Sable with Spidey and Widow?
Click to expand...

She probably had some backup with jets and shit to take out Sandman.

Boo Black Widow, boo her hard.
 
J

JJD

Member
Slayven said:
HMm, you are right I thought had been canceled.
Click to expand...

Might as well get cancelled...I don't know what's passing on Fraction's head...the book started good, but it's horrible right now...

I think Coipel art makes everything easier to read.
 
K

Khezu

Member
Speedymanic said:
Wouldn't work. Haven't seen AA, but Hulk always struck me as a character that works extremely well in small doses, devoting an entire movie to him just won't work as no-one really wants to see Banner fighting the beast within any more, they want to see Hulk wreck shit.

That's probably why he's had such a positive reaction in AA. It'd be a mistake to take that reaction as meaning the gen pop want a solo Hulk movie.

Just my opinion.
Click to expand...

I think they just need to give hulk a better supporting cast, betty and ross are terrible and boring. Amadeus cho, she-hulk, and doc samson would be much better.
Hell pair him up with hawkeye, and have a similar dynamic as EMH, make it a buddy cop movie.

I originally wanted a planet hulk movie, a great way to have hulk smash some shit up, but after john carter, I don't think disney would sign off on that.
 
H

Hawkian

The Cryptarch's Bane
What is EMH?
Green Scar said:
What good could fucking Black Widow be against Sandman? Actually, I have a lot of problems with Sandman, mainly to do with the fact his powers are like some Omega Level mutant shit. My least favourite Spider-Man villain- I feel like he'd be one of my favourite Marvel characters if he weren't a villain, though.

Is that Silver Sable with Spidey and Widow?
Click to expand...

Took the words and the exact questions I wanted to ask right out of my mouth again!
 
T

The Boat

Member
Gotta say I was surprised at how much I loved the movie! Top notch! Media blockout is doing wonders for my videogaming and movie watching.
 
S

Slayven

Member
Green Scar said:
What good could fucking Black Widow be against Sandman? Actually, I have a lot of problems with Sandman, mainly to do with the fact his powers are like some Omega Level mutant shit. My least favourite Spider-Man villain- I feel like he'd be one of my favourite Marvel characters if he weren't a villain, though.

Is that Silver Sable with Spidey and Widow?
Click to expand...

She is as good as a pink hippo. Yeah they are the last of the Avengers after Doc's enhanced Sinister Six takes out the team.
 
H

Hawkian

The Cryptarch's Bane
Slayven said:
She is as good as a pink hippo. Yeah they are the last of the Avengers after Doc's enhanced Sinister Six takes out the team.
Click to expand...

She joins them in an attack on a Sahara facility controlled by Doctor Octopus, with the three successfully defeating the Sandman after Spider-Man's allies at Horizon Labs helped him determine a means of identifying the one particle of sand containing Sandman's consciousness.
Click to expand...
Wow- I hope it's better in execution, because that sounds mind-rendingly stupid.
 
T

THE-Pink-Dagger

Member
It was outstanding, like seriously, I'm still picking up my jaw, unbelievable. It takes 20 min to really start and then wow! Great acting, insane action, VFX, Hawkeye awesome, Hulk OMG, Iron Man FTW, Cap BADASS, Thor good looking mofo, smug Loki. And so so funny, great one liners. I'm def going back 4 times at least.

3D conversion is pretty good but dark and unnecessary, OH and the movie was projected in fucking 2:35 on a 16x9 screen, yep you read that right, so picture chunks missing at top and bottom of the screen, heads were chopped off, I told one guy at the movie theater who called the projectionist who told him it was scope.

Scope my ass, I made sure to tell the guy that the clips on the net are 1:85 (or 78, not sure) and that the movie WAS shot in 1:85. Damn!
 
H

Hot Coldman

Banned
That Spidey story actually does sound fun. And, Hawkian, go watch EMH! Same to anyone else who hasn't been watching it. It's unbelievably good.
 
R

Replicant

Member
Cartman86 said:
It could be because the film was shot in 1.85:1 which is closer to the 16:9 ratio of television sets. Here's a quote from the cinematographer on why.
Click to expand...

I didn't know that. Back then I just thought it's weird that there were a lot of black bars on the left and right part of the screen.
 
H

Hot Coldman

Banned
Slayven said:
I was joking. Dan Slott Spidey is as fun as doing lines off stripper asses' with 5 midgets.
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Oh, well, my point about not knowing him all that well was proven then :lol I have a hard time keeping track of which writers GAF recommends/despises, especially with Spider-Man.
 
R

richiek

steals Justin Bieber DVDs
Damn if the film was projected wrong I'd demand a refund. I won't stand for this shit at all especailly paying 12 bucks a ticket.
 
A

Auron_Kale

Member
For those that have seen the film, my original plan was to watch in digital 3D but due to possible problems with the projector, would it be wiser to go with IMAX (we only have the 3D IMAX option for midnight)?

Thanks.
 
P

petethepanda

Member
If I had checked my email five hours ago I would have seen that I got into a screening tonight. But I didn't check until right now, and at this point I'd only get there 30min early, which would give me about a -150% chance of getting in. FFFUUUUU and such.

Guess I'd rather see it in 2D anyway. Should probably get on buying opening night tickets.
 
D

Duki

Banned
watched the midnight showing in nz, really enjoyable movie

its the first comic book movie ive seen that like... i dont know how to describe it, watching it actually felt like reading a super hero comic book. it didnt have any pretension to being something it wasnt, and it was the first comic book movie with a gigantic budget ive seen which not even once apologised for its obviously whack and silly science fiction elements. shit like loki's costume, and the power ranger designs of the bad guys was all hokey as fuck, but clearly intentionally and lovingly hokey because it was obvious how much money and work was put into making it look as it did.

hulk was blatantly the best and strongest character too, and the movie totally recognised this blatant fact

a lot better than the shitty iron man 2 and captain america movies
 
H

Hot Coldman

Banned
Duki said:
watched the midnight showing in nz, really enjoyable movie

its the first comic book movie ive seen that like... i dont know how to describe it, watching it actually felt like reading a super hero comic book. it didnt have any pretension to being something it wasnt, and it was the first comic book movie with a gigantic budget ive seen which not even once apologised for its obviously whack and silly science fiction elements. shit like loki's costume, and the power ranger designs of the bad guys was all hokey as fuck, but clearly intentionally and lovingly hokey because it was obvious how much money and work was put into making it look as it did.

hulk was blatantly the best and strongest character too, and the movie totally recognised this blatant fact

a lot better than the shitty iron man 2 and captain america movies
Click to expand...

Yep, just as I thought- it's a fucking live-action EMH movie. Holy shit. :D
 
J

Jasoneyu

Member
Duki said:
watched the midnight showing in nz, really enjoyable movie

its the first comic book movie ive seen that like... i dont know how to describe it, watching it actually felt like reading a super hero comic book. it didnt have any pretension to being something it wasnt, and it was the first comic book movie with a gigantic budget ive seen which not even once apologised for its obviously whack and silly science fiction elements. shit like loki's costume, and the power ranger designs of the bad guys was all hokey as fuck, but clearly intentionally and lovingly hokey because it was obvious how much money and work was put into making it look as it did.

hulk was blatantly the best and strongest character too, and the movie totally recognised this blatant fact

a lot better than the shitty iron man 2 and captain america movies
Click to expand...

Was it better than Ironman 1? Just getting a gauge on how I will like this movie since Ironman was bar non my favourate marvel film thus far.
 
D

Duki

Banned
Jasoneyu said:
Was it better than Ironman 1? Just getting a gauge on how I will like this movie since Ironman was bar non my favourate marvel film thus far.
Click to expand...

nah, iron man was better again imo. they jump around characters so often, dont develop them at all, and try and force in scenes just to find them something to do. can't match how fresh and engaging and well thought out the original iron man felt.

tonally, though, it felt closer to the movies after iron man than to iron man itself. iron man felt like they were making a comic book character into something resembling real life and making a good movie out of it. here it feels like they were making an actual comic book movie, realism be damned, and fuk yo derision of cheesy space clowns, like in the movies which followed the original iron man. it was just a much better version of those movies, because it wasnt a two hour ad for another movie and also because holy shit you get to watch thor and the hulk beat the shit out of dudes together fuck yeah

so its something like iron man >> avengers >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> captain america >>>>>>>>>>>> iron man 2

i dont know how the fuck they expect people to give a shit about any more stand alone movies they make based off these guys tho

like why would i go back to watching shitty captain america carry a whole movie after seeing the hulk working with dudes and beating the shit out of literally everyone
 
Z

Zzoram

Member
Every Marvel movie has suffered from a lacklusting "final battle" which ends up being not very epic. They were all better movies in the first act establishing who they are as people.
 
T

Tralfamadore64

Banned
Sam Strange of Badass Digest just posted his review:
http://badassdigest.com/2012/04/25/movie-review-the-avengers-is-everything-wrong-with-hollywood-done-wonderful/

About as positive as you can get. I've bolded key points and spoiler tagged anything that I didn't recognize from the trailers, just in case.

Given Hollywood's hunger for comic book films and the name recognition behind Marvel's characters, it's perhaps over complimentary to call Marvel's multiple-movie lead up to The Avengers a gamble. But their grand experiment does take the idea of a vast shared movie universe to unprecedented levels. While not necessarily brave, it's all been very exciting and fun to watch, even when the individual films have not actually been as exciting or fun to watch as they could be.

The Marvel movies thus far (Iron Man 1 & 2, Thor, and Captain America -- I don't recall any Hulk movie) have shared the same primary strength and weakness. They all absolutely nail their characters only to put them in middling conflicts resolved through bad-to-mediocre action scenes. Captain America, the best of the bunch, represents the widest span of this quality dichotomy by following up one of the best origins of recent memory with a series of action montages I've seen twice now and still can't remember.

But they did nail the characters. And they made money, giving The Avengers all it needed to be great, except precedent. So they got the next best thing: pedigree.

Maybe The Avengers' biggest surprise is what a Joss Whedon movie it is. You walk out of it wondering who else could have done an equal job showcasing these characters to the fullest potential just over two hours of screen time will allow. This isn't a movie where everyone gets their big moment; the whole movie is their big moment. If a scene features a character, they're likely having a big moment, and it tends to be a better moment than we've seen them have yet. If the coolest part of the Iron Man movies was Tony's suitcase armor in Iron Man 2, Whedon's version completely trumps that, and yet doesn't even stand out.

These characters, iconic as they are and as well-transitioned into film as they have been thus far, may have lacked the size to provide their own giant films, but together--under the pen of a writer who really understands them--they have vast entertainment potential due to the various contrasts and similarities made possible by what their own films got right. Take Captain America, for instance. Whedon sees and utilizes his ability to both bring out the rebel in Tony Stark and complement the nobility of Thor. Agent Coulson explains Hulk's origin to him in terms directly related to his own story, giving his and Banner's first meeting an important extra sliver of foundation. Similar favors are done in turn for his character.

Despite the fact that they're both genius scientists, I never even considered what a fun bromance might develop between Tony Stark and Bruce Banner, one made even a little poignant by the way Stark's selfishness ameliorates Banner's self-doubt and vice-versa. Whedon offers a lot more of these knowing touches than I'd even thought to expect. I guess I should have, but it's been a long time since I approached movies like this with that kind of optimism.

And that's just the character stuff. The action is the real surprise. Joss Whedon has a pretty good track record of making conflicts matter regardless of spectacle, but here he gets the spectacle too. He knows what we came for action-wise and delivers.

The film's trailers raised a lot of questions about scope, inspiring jokes about The Avengers assembling just to save a New York City block. Oddly enough, the big end fight actually does take place on one New York City block, and it's kind of a masterstroke. By minimizing the battle area, Whedon concentrates activity and maximizes potential for casually great action beats. It never gets old because there are six different badasses moving all over the place in tons of various mini team-ups.
The camera can go basically anywhere and find something great. It's a conceptually ideal way to deliver a seemingly endless series of "fuck, that was awesome" moments.

As for the villains,
it's pretty much all Loki. Yes, an alien horde invades, but all that's treated with as much time and attention as it deserves (not much). Whatever Marvel aliens they are, they function solely as a vague voluminous threat and consequence of Loki's insecurity. I'm not the biggest Thor fan, but Tom Hiddelston was brilliantly cast. Regardless of his actions, you can always see the pathetic fear in his eyes that specifically makes him a more interesting threat than most typical sneering villains. Add his personal connection to Thor, and you've got an Avengers-worthy bad guy.

But it's not even about
Loki
, really. It's all about the team. Whedon wisely eschews typical Hollywood formula and divides the film between two acts instead of three. For the first half,
The Avengers basically fight each other, which is a great way to introduce them, establish their splinter relationships and vulnerabilities, and give the film a good amount of action scenes (Holy shit, one team member vs. team member fight in particular gave me my money's worth all by itself). In fact, the film's true climax isn't the big fight, but when everyone decides to finally work together. After that's it's just falling action... that also happens to have a lot of action and people falling off things.

Such a structure makes character arcs difficult, and this isn't really that kind of movie anyway. Neither Captain America nor Thor really grow as characters, which is especially strange in Thor's case given his special relationship with
Loki and the fact that The Avengers works much more as a direct sequel to his film than any of the others. He and Loki's brotherly bickering sounds exactly the same; it features a lot of Stellan Skarsgard, and both have superfluous Hawkeye appearances.
But while Thor lacks an arc, he has the film's funniest line, best entrance and seems to be a big part of all the film's best fights. He's a badass here in ways Kenneth Branagh never dreamed of.

Captain America's better as a character than a superhero, which is part of why it doesn't really matter what his costume looks like. The best compliment I can offer him is that he nears Christopher Reeve's magical ability to make being a virtuous nerd look appealing. The Avengers uses and honors the groundwork laid by his film but offers the character little forward progression. Physically, he's still the bland puncher we remember but much cooler since the action scenes are better executed. Plus, he uses the shit out of his shield.

Some may retain especially fond feelings for the first Iron Man, but this strikes me as the very best Iron Man film. In fact, I wonder if there's not an equal or even greater amount of Iron Man action in this as in his own films. I never understood why we only ever saw him fight other Iron Mans. I understand it a lot less now that I've seen him deal with a variety of enemies. He has an arc, but except for his relationship with Bruce Banner (probably the film's greatest single element) it just amounts to his learning to be altruistic for the third movie in a row (he's like Marvel's Jeff Winger).

Black Widow and Hawkeye don't halt the film in their scenes like I feared, but I'm not yet ready to watch them in films of their own. They're good enough, however, that an all S.H.E.I.L.D. film doesn't sound like a bad idea, though Samuel L. Jackson continues to play Nick Fury with the false bravado of being Samuel L. Jackson combined with the unearned iconography of a character who has yet to convincingly define himself.

But let's not fuck around. This is The Hulk's movie. Even if the rest of the film were mediocre, it would still be special for its Hulk. His moments aren't just great; they're absolutely rousing. That bit in the trailer where he saves Iron Man is nothing. The Hulk is why you need to see this movie as soon as you possibly can before people spoil all his big moments. He also may be the key element that keeps The Avengers from ephemera. I want to watch this movie again as soon as I possibly can, and all I'm thinking about in the meantime is The Hulk.

It make sense that Hulk would only achieve his full potential in a team film. As a mindless force of nature, he's interesting but only for a while. Plots focused on capturing him can sustain a Hulk movie, but not one that gets the most out of the monster because his beating the hell out of everyone quickly grows repetitious and loses effectiveness. With just a little agency, however, Hulk becomes a superhero, and Hulk as a superhero is a whole different beast. Watching him use his strength in ways that require not only thought but limited emotion on this level pretty much negates even Ang Lee's film (much as I like it) because why would you ever want to go back? Bane will probably prove plenty interesting later this summer, but I'm putting The Hulk down now as mainstream character of the year.

I'm gushing because The Avengers supplies ample doses of the two ingredients that always negate the critical side of my brain: big, bright, earnest fun and a good supply of awesome surprises--not plot surprises but moments that work best when you don't see them coming, exactly the kind of thing that actually can be spoiled and yet become the benchmarks you look forward to on repeat viewings. This is about a fun a movie as I can imagine. I watched it with a massive smile on my face, not all the time but most of the time, and I certainly don't have a great amount of love for these characters. It's just that we've arrived at a time where the "why don't they do this?" movie questions from my childhood have become reality, and in this case at least, it works just as well as eight-year-old me always assumed it would. I can nitpick The Avengers, but I honestly don't have an imagination capable of hypothetically improving the film. Last year, we got Fast Five, another team film combining the strengths of preceding films. This year the idea grows in scale significantly while delivering an exponentially better film. As the trend continues, I doubt the quality will follow suit, but I count myself lucky that I was around to catch this one, and I can't wait to catch it again.
Click to expand...
 
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