RocknRola
Member
No, that's what I meant. These are also great players... who never won a title.
gotta lead a team to the world cup title to become the goat
Ah, got it. Misread that then My bad hehe
No, that's what I meant. These are also great players... who never won a title.
gotta lead a team to the world cup title to become the goat
Dude has achieved nothing with his national team which disqualifies him from the goat discussion.
What did he do in the finals against germany again? Somebody remind me please...
To be fair, Argentina had the bad luck to always get matched up against a certain team...Dude has achieved nothing with his national team which disqualifies him from the goat discussion.
There can't be a GOAT in a teamsport. Or would've Messi won the game on his own?
There can be a GOAT team. But it surely isn't Argentina.
GOAT discussions are impossible in sport anyway due to advancing sports technology, medicine, and rule changes.
You need to go by era, and this is the era of Messi/Ronaldo
Mario Götze must be the greatest German player to walk the earth then.What did he do in the finals against germany again? Somebody remind me please...
http://www.skysports.com/football/n...zil-or-have-we-just-become-numb-to-his-geniusWhat did he do in the finals against germany again? Somebody remind me please...
He missed a free kick at the last minute of extra times of a long World Cup. Still he made Argentina reach finals. Germany was just a better team.its worth remembering that Messi was statistically superb at this World Cup. An Adidas award is one thing but the WhoScored rankings which he topped are no popularity contest, they merely reflect the fact that this is a player who does more of the difficult stuff than anyone else.
Messi created more chances than anybody at the 2014 World Cup and only Andrea Pirlo played as many through-balls. He gave us more a lot more completed dribbles than any other player with his tally of 46 taking him well clear of Robbens 29.
GOAT team would have to be either Brasil or Germany. IMO at least. I'd be happy with either taking the crown, per say.
Completely subjectivity is one way to engage in these discussions sureIt really isn't that hard to have discussions on who is the greatest footballer fo time.
It only becomes hard when people try to limit it to numbers.
It is why you have debates like Messi vs Ronaldo. You take away the numbers and it is clear who is the better player.
People think greatness comes down to numbers. Shit like Linekar and Inzaghi have 100s of goals to their names.
Greatness transcends numbers. It comes down to making those around you better than they are, changing the way the game is played, doing the impossible, and not just for years, but for decades.
It is why Totti is simply the greatest of all time. He took an irrelevant team and kept them near the top of Italian football for 25 years, all the while counting on one hand the amount of top players he had with him during his career. Totti changed the way the modern game is played. Fergie, Pep, and Spain all copied what he showed could be done in the strikerless formation. The guy is the most complete passer the game has seen. He was at the top of the game during the 90s, the 00s, and the 10s, singhandedly helping his team qualify for a CL(playoff) spot at the age of 39 when he had the best goal to minute ratio in the top leagues(They then fucked the playoffs because they didn't play him, ha)
Plus the guy helped win the World Cup when he risked his career to play at half fitness after coming back from a serious injury in only a few months.
It really isn't that hard to have discussions on who is the greatest footballer fo time.
It only becomes hard when people try to limit it to numbers.
It is why you have debates like Messi vs Ronaldo. You take away the numbers and it is clear who is the better player.
People think greatness comes down to numbers. Shit like Linekar and Inzaghi have 100s of goals to their names.
Greatness transcends numbers. It comes down to making those around you better than they are, changing the way the game is played, doing the impossible, and not just for years, but for decades.
It is why Totti is simply the greatest of all time. He took an irrelevant team and kept them near the top of Italian football for 25 years, all the while counting on one hand the amount of top players he had with him during his career. Totti changed the way the modern game is played. Fergie, Pep, and Spain all copied what he showed could be done in the strikerless formation. The guy is the most complete passer the game has seen. He was at the top of the game during the 90s, the 00s, and the 10s, singhandedly helping his team qualify for a CL(playoff) spot at the age of 39 when he had the best goal to minute ratio in the top leagues(They then fucked the playoffs because they didn't play him, ha)
Plus the guy helped win the World Cup when he risked his career to play at half fitness after coming back from a serious injury in only a few months.
But put prime Maradona in that position and the results could have been the same or better no? Or Pele, etc.Hmmm, thinking Shanks might be onto something here.
Totti top of this era no question.
But put prime Maradona in that position and the results could have been the same or better no? Or Pele, etc.
To be fair, Argentina had the bad luck to always get matched up against a certain team...
2006: Germany (QF)
2010: Germany (QF)
2014: Germany (F)
*Sometimes*
Yes.
*Sometimes*
>.>
It's almost like they're two insanely consistent and good players that get numbers any other player would kill for. Almost.
But put prime Maradona in that position and the results could have been the same or better no? Or Pele, etc.
Is there documented evidence of this, it's interesting and not something I've seen (my knowledge of Italian football is limited and I don't confess to being all that up on my old interviews etc)Maradona and Pele could never agree on anything, except when it came to Totti. Both acknowledged him as the best in the world.
True, Maradona could well take Roma to titles etc..
But like I said, this era. I don't know if prime Pele would be the same in the current football landscape as in his time.
Arguably it would have been easier for him and he would have been more protected. On the other hand he may have not handled the media/fame side of it as well. It's why it's a very difficult conversation to haveTrue, Maradona could well take Roma to titles etc..
But like I said, this era. I don't know if prime Pele would be the same in the current football landscape as in his time.
Is there documented evidence of this, it's interesting and not something I've seen (my knowledge of Italian football is limited and I don't confess to being all that up on my old interviews etc)
Impressive, though Maradona wouldn't call himself the best would heMaradona: http://www.espnfc.com/as-roma/story...francesco-totti-is-the-best-player-i-ever-saw
As for Pele, he said it back in 06 and I don't have a source that is worth posting.
To be fair, Argentina had the bad luck to always get matched up against a certain team...
2006: Germany (QF)
2010: Germany (QF)
2014: Germany (F)
Impressive, though Maradona wouldn't call himself the best would he
Like I said I haven't followed Italian football so that's my loss.
Well said.No one that knows about football doubts that.
That is fair enough. Maradona played in Serie A during the 80s, when Serie A was maybe at its second hardest. World class players on several teams. Totti grew up playing in Serie A in the 90s when it was at its hardest ever, dominating Europe, and with world class players on half the teams in the league. Both won the league during their respective era, but Totti kept up the performances for nearly 25 years, while Maradona only did it for around a dozen before he started having issues.
Speaking of Serie A football. Javier Zanetti bascially was the prototype for the modern full back. Yet nobody ever mentions defensive players in these conversations. It's why the whole GOAT discussion is quite silly.
Let's cut the crap and end this discussion.
Speaking of Serie A football. Javier Zanetti bascially was the prototype for the modern full back. Yet nobody ever mentions defensive players in these conversations. It's why the whole GOAT discussion is quite silly.
Legit can't tell if it's satire, but this turned in a Shyamalan twist at the last 2 paragraphsIt really isn't that hard to have discussions on who is the greatest footballer fo time.
It only becomes hard when people try to limit it to numbers.
It is why you have debates like Messi vs Ronaldo. You take away the numbers and it is clear who is the better player.
People think greatness comes down to numbers. Shit like Linekar and Inzaghi have 100s of goals to their names.
Greatness transcends numbers. It comes down to making those around you better than they are, changing the way the game is played, doing the impossible, and not just for years, but for decades.
It is why Totti is simply the greatest of all time. He took an irrelevant team and kept them near the top of Italian football for 25 years, all the while counting on one hand the amount of top players he had with him during his career. Totti changed the way the modern game is played. Fergie, Pep, and Spain all copied what he showed could be done in the strikerless formation. The guy is the most complete passer the game has seen. He was at the top of the game during the 90s, the 00s, and the 10s, singhandedly helping his team qualify for a CL(playoff) spot at the age of 39 when he had the best goal to minute ratio in the top leagues(They then fucked the playoffs because they didn't play him, ha)
Plus the guy helped win the World Cup when he risked his career to play at half fitness after coming back from a serious injury in only a few months.
A guy was arguing how incredible Messi was at the footy board because of how good he was in the group stages in 2014. You can't make this shit up vs the stans lolWow Messi managed to get by in Argentina with a team of scrubs featuring Di Maria, Higuain, Icardi, Dybala, Aguero, Mascherano, Rojo and Otamendi against the mighty Ecuador.
GOAT
This.Messi fans are worse than Rick and Morty fans.
Wow Messi managed to get by in Argentina with a team of scrubs featuring Di Maria, Higuain, Icardi, Dybala, Aguero, Mascherano, Rojo and Otamendi against the mighty Ecuador.
GOAT
A hat trick to save Argentina's WC qualifying hopes. Really the greatest to ever play.
Meanwhile Ronaldo today tripping over himself and trying too hard to score. Amazing what happens when the entire squad isn't set up for him to score tap-ins vs. heavyweights like Getafe.
They really are scrubs without Messi.Wow Messi managed to get by in Argentina with a team of scrubs featuring Di Maria, Higuain, Icardi, Dybala, Aguero, Mascherano, Rojo and Otamendi against the mighty Ecuador.
GOAT
Had Ronaldinho laid off the booze, drugs and hookers he absolutely would be considered the best of all time. There is no doubt in my mind about that.
Ronaldinho could single handedly destroy teams. Yes Messi has that amazing games too but Ronaldinho was pretty much every match. He could dribble, pass, score, had speed, strength.
If Ronaldinho isn't in top 3 discussion you're mad or delusional.
Legit can't tell if it's satire, but this turned in a Shyamalan twist at the last 2 paragraphs
What scrubs? Do you realize these are the same qualifiers that eliminated the team that trashed Mexico 7-0.This was his first hatrick in WC qualifiers after a decade of playing against scrubs.
Goat I think not.
You realize Messi has failed to do that for exactly the entirety of the Qualifiers and that's why Argentina evento got to this point, right?
Just checking.
Had Ronaldinho laid off the booze, drugs and hookers he absolutely would be considered the best of all time. There is no doubt in my mind about that.
Ronaldinho could single handedly destroy teams. Yes Messi has that amazing games too but Ronaldinho was pretty much every match. He could dribble, pass, score, had speed, strength.
If Ronaldinho isn't in top 3 discussion you're mad or delusional.