To be honest, I rather have the usual hypocrisy and head in sand attitude than the ConMedia going all NAMBLA on the internet.
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Milo Yiannopoulos, Frequent Defender of Pedophilia
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To be honest, I rather have the usual hypocrisy and head in sand attitude than the ConMedia going all NAMBLA on the internet.
You mean like every fuckin' conservative supporter on GAF has been left in silence when real issues show up, but run in like roaches at smaller things?
I'm not shocked at all that we're seeing it unfold yet again here..
Frozenprince
Banned
They all over gaming side the minute some diversity stuff pops up, make no mistake about that.
PixelatedBookake
Junior Member
"I don't want it to feel forced"
"Only if they're well written"
"I don't want to break my immersion"
Did Adder get banned for that post? Because I was about to make a similar post in this topic.
A lot of people are only getting their knickers in a twist now because they realized they were once children/ had children or knew children. However well all the other nasty stuff was being said? Crickets......
There is a difference between ignoring him and giving him a platform.
I choose not to ignore him and believe in raising my voice in opposition to the horrendous shit he says and does, especially outing trans folk, his plans to maybe out undocumented immigrants, and definitely against this. I also have no problem bringing up his words and using them as examples of the evil he represents and this is the type of people with ties to the White House.
By the same token I feel anyone with a platform who doesn't agree with him that could give him time shouldn't. Whether that is college students protesting or Maher's show no one in their right mind should be giving him more time to spew his vileness. Doesn't mean we can't or shouldn't point out and use what he has already spewed against him, ignoring what's already in the public eye doesn't make it go away.
'Why does this game have X ethnicity as the setting for this fantasy world?" (AKA not classic European fantasy)
Frozenprince
Banned
You can't ignore Milo. Ignoring these idiots is what allows them to fester and grow to begin with. Ignoring him is how we GOT HERE in the first place.
FeenixRising
Banned
Nah... he got banned for another post in there.
That and this man goes out of his way to actively ruin people's lives.
I was content to ignore him until he pulled that shit in Milwaukee
http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/12/milo-yiannopoulos-harassed-a-trans-student-at-uw-milwaukee.html
I hope someone does him like Richard Spencer.
Flying Toaster
Member
Glad I am not the only one that is put off by this shit.
I totally disagree.
If you tweet something inflammatory, and nobody replies, then you aren't heard.
If you tweet out something inflammatory, and 10 people agree with you, then you've been heard a bit.
If you tweet out something inflammatory, and 10 people agree with you, and 1000 people disagree, and reply and retweet to show their disapproval, and write articles about how wrong you are, well, they've just magnified the initial voice far beyond anything it ever would have/should have been. And that's when the real crazies catch wind of it, and others will back it just to contradict people they are used to disagreeing with because they have seen how much it riles them up.
I think there are certain people who should be put under a microscope, and these are people in positions of power who have the legal ability to make decisions about how society runs.
But this guy, he's just an attention whore. The more people talk about him the more his message spreads like an annoying plague.
I think he should be ignored, and I think the world would be a better place if people put half as much energy into spreading the word of well-meaning, educated people, instead of drawing everyone's attention to someone they disagree with. I think the same mentality is what ultimately got Trump elected.
My suggestion (to everyone) is, next time you see someone say something stupid, go find someone who said something smart and give them praise and feedback and retweets and likes and follows. Imagine checking social media and it was filled with quotes from smart people. The stupids should be buried under it, but we fail to allow this to happen.
PixelatedBookake
Junior Member
It's basically saying "I want to live in a world exclusively populated by white people"
Captin Quacker
Member
man that mafia 3 reveal thread was fuckin golden in the worse possible way
This is the crux of it. You can "ignore the troll" all you like but they have a fanbase and will continue to grow without you. It helps to not give them a platform where you act like an adoring fan at that point.
You have to challenge them.
Also, people who expected Maher to stand up to him should really stop ignoring ethnic and religious minorities: we've known forever that Maher cares more about being able to use slurs about us than he does about our plights.
Yeah, the alternate would be pretty horrific.
Good point. I think I'm being a little too broad with my charitibility here - yeah, there may be a few people who will still defend Milo having an uncontested platform because the general principle they used to defend him has not actually been contradicted, but the odds are in your favor towards that not being the case if you pick a defender at random. Not going to go as far as to suggest that they have intentionally made their judgments and hold any malice, but if they have flip-flopped on Milo now then they should do a bit of introspection, to say the least.
And it's not like he's said anything new or that this came to light: we of all people really should know how horrible Milo is.
And wait a second, I'm arguing against people who posit that the optimal way to deal with people with whom you disagree is to give them a free platform and not challenge them! It would demonstrate my own points far better if I wasn't charitable towards them at all!
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I'm kind of glad this came out right after the Maher appearance, because now Maher has to really eat shit for having him on.
I like this in his defense he includes his smear campaign against someone that basically did the same thing he is claiming now : Making shitty edgy jokes.
FWIW, I do more or less believe him. It's his shtick. But it's amusing that he's now getting painted with the same brush he attempted to use on others.
FWIW, I do more or less believe him. It's his shtick. But it's amusing that he's now getting painted with the same brush he attempted to use on others.
How do you ignore a man who genuinely wants to ruin your life at every possible turn?
Would you pay me any attention if I went to your boss and lied to them to get you fired from your job and maybe even blacklisted? Because that's the kind of person he is and then some. He is not just some harmless clown or troll or attention whore, he legitimately wants to hurt you and will manipulate people to do it for him.
Without an audience he doesn't have the power to do those things. He's just an asshole.
Also, do you really think his end-goal is to change anything about how the world works? I don't believe that. His end-goal is to rise to fame and make money off it. That's all. The same could be said for Trump, with the difference being that Trump actually got the power he wanted, so we can't afford to ignore him now.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
He had an audience before and they were the ones who helped him harass and dox people.
These things happen even when you don't hear about them
Granted yeah, but any asshole can ruffle feathers online and harass and dox people. I'm arguing that his detractors have pushed him from basement-dwelling twitter troll to the mainstream.
The fact that he was only known via gamergate just a few years ago and now it's entirely possible that my grandmother will come across an article about him in the paper... well, that just depresses me.
I've heard that my apartment complex has a roach problem but it's okay because I don't look for them so I have nothing to worry about.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
His detractors aren't the ones inviting him on national TV or to give speeches at colleges.
come on son
Bobby Roberts
Banned
So why are you arguing for people to pretend that's not happening then?
Nobody should ignore that shit.
Again: You don't have to ignore a troll in order to counter them. You can pay a shitload of attention to bad actors. You just don't have to hand them a microphone and let them speak on their own behalf.
Preventing their self-defense isn't the same as ignoring. You should do the former. You shouldn't do the latter. The latter suggests out of sight, out of mind is a proper solution.
It isn't.
Do you think he would have ever gotten the spot on Maher if he wasn't renowned as controversial? There are plenty of insane conservative pundits who aren't in the left's spotlight; those people aren't getting on Maher.
The fact that he wasn't able to speak at Berkeley was what got him the spot, not the invitation to speak.
Messofanego
Banned
I was wondering where I saw Nyberg before.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
People stopped him from speaking, while denouncing him.
He played victim (illegitimately) and people entertained that bullshit.
Maher saw that circus and invited him on.
Because he was on, someone went back and found the (already reported on) soundclips of him being a real piece of shit.
NONE OF THIS HAPPENS IF YOU "IGNORE" HIM.
Stop advocating that "ignore him" is the proper course of action. It isn't. Pay attention to him. Denounce him. Blow up his spot. Give voice to his victims. But do not let him get equal time. Because he doesn't deserve it.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
You're still trying to absolve the people offering him these platforms of responsibility.
I see what you're saying but I think that even in the actor analogy, you still enable them by bringing their existence to light when they would otherwise have never been heard of.
This happens all the time in pop music too. Someone puts out a song that is terrible and gets loads of attention for being terrible, and suddenly they've inexplicably sold tons of records, because enough people heard about them, and even if only 1% of those people like it, that's enough.
Frozenprince
Banned
The woman Milo doxxed had to change her name and quit her college.
You don't ignore that.
You don't ignore that.
Not sure what I posted that made you think that but please understand I'm 100% not trying to absolve those people. I think those people are also assholes (arguably bigger assholes). They are all assholes.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
It's not an analogy.
"ignoring" is enabling in this case. Leaving them alone and uninhibited is enabling. You don't stamp out Milo by letting him retreat to some corner and consolidate support. You stamp him out by making sure people know what he says, preventing him from providing a mealy-mouthed defense, and hammering the living fuck out of his reprehensible ass as loudly as you can while amplifying any voices directly affected by his bullshit so people know where to place their empathy.
What you're advocating is a pie-in-the-sky scenario where the path of least resistance is the morally correct and most successful route.
It isn't.
So painfully true. Now that the target of the damage this guy talks up could be children, suddenly no one wants to step up and shout us down while saying he should be allowed to bellow his pedophile supporting bullshit over the airwaves anymore. But when it was transgender people it was fine and we all needed to stop suppressing other views and be totally okay with someone giving his horrible views a platform.
Goddamn that makes my blood boil.
RedAssedApe
Banned
All I see is people bringing up pizza gate as a "defense". 🙄
And from another victim https://twitter.com/srhbutts/status/833553108995301377
Milo is monster. He's left a lot of destruction in his wake.
crackhead_bob
Member
I'm reading this thread and I see the term "doxxed". It sounds like a medical vaccine, or intentionally spreading an STD. A clarification would be appreciated.
Wait, so Milo is holding this up a something good he's done?
https://mobile.twitter.com/srhbutts/status/833553108995301377
And yes Milo, lets educate the general public on Gamergate, that should go swimmingly for you. Would be a good time for the Colbert segment to get replayed on Twitter.
https://mobile.twitter.com/srhbutts/status/833553108995301377
And yes Milo, lets educate the general public on Gamergate, that should go swimmingly for you. Would be a good time for the Colbert segment to get replayed on Twitter.
Releasing personal identification (documents) on people so they can be harassed.
It's when your personal information is given out online maliciously.
Stumpokapow
listen to the mad man
Here's his rather weak defensive of his comments;
The GOP spent the last year going ballistic about selectively edited videos of Planned Parenthood, yelled about fetal sanctity and the moral outrage of fetal body part trafficking, called abortion doctors murderers, and publicly shamed Planned Parenthood and all of its executives...
James O'Keefe, Social Justice Warrior
Wait... what?
crackhead_bob
Member
And how is that achieved? How does sensitive information get obtained by a third party, in this case being Milo? Is it based on what the victim freely and innocently assumes is harmless disclosure of information, or is hacking involved?
brianjones
Member
i would never have heard of this cumstain if not for gaf
Okay, that's clearly my bad for not getting what you were saying there re: bad actors. Sorry about that one.
And honestly, I don't totally disagree with you about protesting the shitheads and calling them out when they say dumb shit. But I still hold strong that we have a big picture problem where we are so much better at making celebrities out of people we hate than people we like.
Maybe we can still do what you propose but I think our energy should be 90% focused on championing the people we admire.
We all use the internet; how often have you seen someone's opinion become changed because a bunch of people told them they're wrong? Even if the face of glaringly obvious facts to the contrary, people will hold onto their positions. It's almost impossible to argue someone out of their opinion.
However, it's so much easier to inspire people by just being smart and demonstrating what good values can do for the world. People love Bill Nye, because when they were kids he showed them how cool science can be. But remember a few years back when he participated in a debate about creation vs evolution? I personally believe that debate did nothing for evolutionary biology, because it did nothing to inspire people one way or the other, it just made people think the two arguments had equal footing.
So yeah, I guess the crux of my position here is, we as humans have a natural "Seek & Destroy" tendency that is especially amplified on social media, and I think that's dangerous. I think we need to consciously control how much attention we give to people we dislike, and we should force ourselves to champion people who do great things. That's all.
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