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[purseowner]

If all you care about is story, you shouldn't be playing video games. Read a book or watch a movie.

I honestly think this is the worst post I've read on NeoGAF.

Demonstrates a baffling view of both video games as a medium and the other art forms listed. What I care about most in games is narrative for the most part, and I will continue to play them, thanks.

I'd be just as pissed to be spoiled on a game's narrative as I would a book or film. In some cases more so, if the spoiler is of something tens of hours further down the line in the game.

 

[Sgt.Pepper]

Doing one click to spoil tag something make your posting experience worse?

He's obviously not talking about just GAF...

This isn't the only place we post.

 

[kikiribu]

When you start a game that you care about story-wise, stay away from gaming forums, especially Reddit. That place is trash.

 

[MHWilliams]

Is it not assholish behavior to post a spoiler about something solely as a "fuck you" to someone? That seems pretty clearcut "acting like a dick," behavior.

How do you consider "you purposefully spoiling something for someone else makes you look like a dick" to be the equal, yet opposite of the act itself?

Let's see:

That same is true of many of these spoilers casually dropped in this thread. (P.S. While I understand the point, don't do that, it's an unkind move.)

I think not being spoiled about Guardians of the Galaxy 2 in a Wonder Woman thread isn't an outlandish expectation. I'd lean on a spoiler tag in that case. Not being spoiled about Wonder Woman in a Wonder Woman thread is an outlandish expectation.

I'd agree they did you wrong.

Perhaps if you looked at my other posts in the thread, you would have your answer. The post you're replying to remains as stands. And you know Vigiliant's post was about spoilers period, not just ones posted in this thread.

 

[Haly]

Doing one click to spoil tag something make your posting experience worse?

Opening a page and seeing more black bars than an FBI document makes my posting experience worse, yes. I come here to read posts, not to declassify documents.

Like, I don't believe a discussion can be had if you have to go through every line and redact stuff, or redact your post entirely, while labeling things clearly and visibly what it is you're redacting (because sometimes people click a spoiler thinking it's talking about something and get spoiled on some other thing and get upset about it).

When a conversation drags on, and crosses over many aspect of a game, or a story, or multiple stories it can become black bar city.

This is not the optimal form of discourse for me.

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Let's see:


Perhaps if you looked at my other posts in the thread, you would have your answer. The post you're replying to remains as stands.

We must be talking past each other then.

He's obviously not talking about just GAF...

This isn't the only place we post.

Asking "did you finish the latest episode of GoT?" before talking about it is just as easy though. There's no real weight to the argument that it requires walking on eggshells, no more than just generally politeness.

Spoiled someone is not 100% unavoidable, but general consideration is not a hurdle either.

 

[Starlightmuse]

He's obviously not talking about just GAF...

This isn't the only place we post.

In any forum you can spoiler tag anything, in Twitter, Facebook or whatever social network you can just type "Spoiler, season 4 of GoT: ..." or whatever. There it is. It just take five seconds and you don't fuck anyone who's seeing it. But looks like it's too much of a hassle.

I can't buy anyone trying to justify making big spoilers. It just take one click o write 4 words. Just admit that you don't care about fucking other people's experience (I'm not talking specifically about you).

Opening a page and seeing more black bars than an FBI document makes my posting experience worse, yes. I come here to read posts, not to declassify documents.

Like, I don't believe a discussion can be had if you have to go through every line and redact stuff, or redact your post entirely, while labeling things clearly and visibly what it is you're redacting (because sometimes people click a spoiler thinking it's talking about something and get spoiled on some other thing and get upset about it).

When a conversation drags on, and crosses over many aspect of a game, or a story, or multiple stories it can become black bar city.

This is not the optimal form of discourse for me.

What? The hell are you talking about declasifying? it takes one damn click to reveal a black bar. One damn click. Does it takes you a lot of strength to do clicks? How many clicks do you do in an hour navigating the internet?

 

[ScientificPizza]

That dude in metroid in a armor is actually a girl

sry

The worst part about trying to discuss spoilers is the amount of people who need to contribute very very very very funny and not at all tired jokes like these

 

[Double Donut]

This is the kind of stuff I'm really against when I rail on "spoiler culture".

"Wow, game X made me sad."
"Thanks for spoiling that game X has a sad ending/reason to make you sad."

????

Sorry, but I see this as the eventual erosion of any and all discussion about stories. What is there to talk about once we've drawn lines that makes sure everyone gets to maintain their pristine experience? Nothing. There is literally nothing you can say about a game that won't constitute a spoiler from a certain perspective. Like how Vigilant Gambit above distinguishes between "spoilers he cares about" and "spoilers he doesn't care about", but Funyarinpa is in the camp of "not everyone has played every old game, so you're still being a jerk by going "b-but it's been a year!/ several years!".

It sounds arbitrary and I'm not good at explaining but those are completely different.

Knowing that the game contains a sad scene... I mean, I'm sure there are people out there who would consider that a spoiler, but I don't think most would. Odds are if the game has a sad scene, it's a game where you expect sadness anyway.

But a plot twist is waaay more than just an emotion or a scene. You are now aware that at some point, the entire story will turn or re-contextualize itself. That's pretty dang big. You now enter the story just waiting for the twist.

If I ruin someone's experience because I say there is a plot twist and they consider that a spoiler I don't care. At some point people need to get the fuck over themselves. Get off the internet if this is the level of censorship you expect.

...Really that much of a bother to not blurt out "Man the plot twist in [x] was GREAT!", pal? Especially if the game is still recent.

 

[travisbickle]

while i agree with your general sentiment, i don't feel Horizon had any twists that i didn't see coming from a mile away.

Like, Aloy's origins (being

Spoiler

a clone

), the setting (earth

Spoiler

recovering from a man made robot apocalypse

) ...

the only thing i could think of would be the thing where

Spoiler

evil Elon Musk sabotages the Zero Dawn project and kills the surviving scientists

You should still finish the game, imho.

Horizon doesn't have "twists", there's no misdirection to try and hide the true reveal. It's a story in which you know the outline very early on, some of it is even written on the back of the box, and you learn the details as you progress.

 

[Estoc]

Try getting spoiled in threads not about the game or show... I've had numerous GoT spoilers in unrelated threads because let's reply using GIF from the latest episode from one of the more popular show right now!

That "Fuck you, got mine" mentality.

For me, if it's something recent, something still trending right now, unless the thread has "spoiler" in its title, I'll spoiler tag everything that I feel might be spoiler for others.

 

[maxiell]

You went on the internet to discuss the story of Horizon Zero Dawn before you finished it.

I don't know how you can blame anyone other than yourself for what happened. I never found out any story details from HZD or Uncharted 4 before I played them months after release, and I wasn't trying to avoid them — the exact opposite, in fact.

The game has been out for quite awhile now. Talking openly about it is not only fair game, but should be assumed in any discussion about it.

 

[Ascenion]

It's also bullshit that old stuff is OK to spoil- not everyone has played every old game, so you're still being a jerk by going "b-but it's been a year!/ several years!".

It really isn't. I'm of the opinion that if you actually gave a shit about being spoiled you'd do your best to experience it as soon as possible. So people can miss me with that mentality. I'm not watching what I say 6-7 months later much less year(s). That goes for anything. Half a year is ample time to play any game, watch any movie or read any book if being spoiled really matters to you. The impetus to avoid spoilers in on you. It's not my job to not talk about it or watch what I say for your benefit after a certain period.

 

[LotusHD]

The worst part about trying to discuss spoilers is the amount of people who need to contribute very very very very funny and not at all tired jokes like these

Yup...

 

[fester]

"Spoilerphobia", like what's peddled by the OP, assumes that the only value in a story is being surprised at the end. That's an incredibly shallow way of viewing the experience. I'm convinced this is a recent thing (and growing) because for most of history, audiences were already familiar with the story of whatever play/opera/etc they were watching. If I had to guess it's possibly due to the absolutely limitless amount of entertainment we have access to now and an expectation that every piece of media is somehow supposed to be a "new" experience. I think the spoiler mentality degrades the art being expressed in the narrative and really needs to be kicked to the curb.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

...Really that much of a bother to not blurt out "Man the plot twist in [x] was GREAT!", pal? Especially if the game is still recent.

Yes. I'm not filtering discussion of a game so down to having to spoiler that there is some sort of plot twist. That's dumb, I give 0 shits if the existance of a plot twist in a character driven game (which all have plot twists) ruins it for someone. If that is the extent that they need things filtered down enjoy lots of ruined games. The world doesn't revolve around that level of asinine.

 

[Starlightmuse]

It's not my job to not talk about it or watch what I say for your benefit after a certain period.

There's a lot of people that don't buy games at release because they're waiting for them to get cheaper. There's a lot of people that haven't seen a movie because they didn't have time to go to the cinema. There's a lot of reasons for people to not see/play things after some time after they release. You are just searching for excuses to legitimize not give a shit about the rest of the people because you've already seen or played whatever game or movie and can't take the hassle to spend five second in not fucking with people who can still be waiting to see/play it.

"Spoilerphobia", like what's peddled by the OP, assumes that the only value in a story is being surprised at the end. That's an incredibly shallow way of viewing the experience. I'm convinced this is a recent thing (and growing) because for most of history, audiences were already familiar with the story of whatever play/opera/etc they were watching. If I had to guess it's possibly due to the absolutely limitless amount of entertainment we have access to now and an expectation that every piece of media is somehow supposed to be a "new" experience. I think the spoiler mentality degrades the art being expressed in the narrative and really needs to be kicked to the curb.

No, the OP doesn't like people without consideration telling him key plot points of the game that he's playing right now, which is a very reasonable sentiment. And 20 years ago people would get mad as well if you tell them the ending of a book that they were reading, I don't know where the hell this stupid trend about saying that only now people care about spoilers come from. Most of the people don't like to have stories where they are invested spoiled, it was always like that and it is a reasonable thing to be mad at.

 

[Haly]

In any forum you can spoiler tag anything, in Twitter, Facebook or whatever social network you can just type "Spoiler, season 4 of GoT: ..." or whatever. There it is. It just take five seconds and you don't fuck anyone who's seeing it. But looks like it's too much of a hassle.

I can't buy anyone trying to justify making big spoilers. It just take one click o write 4 words. Just admit that you don't care about fucking other people's experience (I'm not talking specifically about you).

What about this?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=243632308#post243632308

Someone was upset someone else made a thread for the announcement of Jodi Whittaker as the new Doctor. What do you think they could've done to avoid it?

Actress announced as the 13th Doctor!

Yeah, I guess that would work. But then this also spoils that the next Doctor is female.

Actor/Actress announced as the 13th Doctor!

Although this one spoils that there's going to be a 13th Doctor, no can do.

Actor/Actress announced for Doctor Who!

Maybe it's too much of a give away considering new actor announcements are usually Doctors or Companions, one more fix.

Something announced for Doctor Who!

There, the perfect, spoiler free thread title.

(Do you think all that effort was worth it, or reasonable?)

What? The hell are you talking about declasifying? it takes one damn click to reveal a black bar. One damn click. Does it takes you a lot of strength to do clicks? How many clicks do you do in an hour navigating the internet?

How many clicks do you need to declassify this, go on, count it for me.

How about this one?

This?

One more?

I can keep going, but the unfortunate truth is I don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of all that times that black bars are being spammed on GAF. My broader point is I'd rather not discuss content this way, and you can say "well if you don't want to do it you can go somewhere else", but I can turn that around. If you don't want to be spoiled, you can bugger off in kind.

 

[LotusHD]

What, why are you using manga threads for your examples lol

 

[Haly]

What, why are you using manga threads for your examples lol

What? The hell are you talking about declasifying? it takes one damn click to reveal a black bar. One damn click. Does it takes you a lot of strength to do clicks? How many clicks do you do in an hour navigating the internet?

He asked, I answered. I did a search for "black bars", and started going through hits.

 

[Spring-Loaded]

It's not my job to not talk about it or watch what I say for your benefit after a certain period.

That's the thing: it's almost never anyone's job to be courteous or considerate. I don't have to do shit for anyone else outside of helping coworkers and clients at work.

I hold the door for people behind me because it's no effort and it's more likely to be helpful/nicer for others than me letting it slam in their faces. It's not my job to share stuff me food with some me one down on their luck when I'm eating out for lunch, but I'd rather live in a world where people do that occasionally when they can afford to rather than talk about how it's not their job to do so.

If you can't shake the feeling of "you can't tell me what to do!" when it comes to stuff like this, by all means, lean into it. People will probably think you're dick, but if it's that important to you, go for it.

But if you can get past that, it's really not hard to generally strive to avoid spoiling others, a thread least for me. I also don't often get people jumping down my throat over spoilers, and I don't get into long arguments about spoilers outside of threads like this (even in the instances I've done so because I just consider whether it could be considered a spoiler, and consider what I could do differently next time rather than fire back).

That's really all there is to it. You're right that you don't have to make any effort to avoid spoiling people, but nothing is gained or bettered taking that path. A right to apathy just isn't worth fighting for.

 

[Haly]

Long ago, in days of yore, there was a giant catch all manga thread. That thread had one spoiler policy outlined in the OP

In bold, put the name of the series. Then you can go ahead and discuss whatever is on your mind without tags, okay? Make sure there is a space between the bolded name of the series and your text. Here's an example:

Hunter X Hunter

It rules and I don't know why!

Okay. Again, another warning. We will discuss all the mangas in one topic with no tags. If you don't want to be spoiled by the chapter as soon as the translation is out, do not come in here. Also, since we are not talking about the anime, you can mention new episodes without tags either since they are always behind or are filler. You should know well enough not to come in here not wanting to be spoiled but bolding the header should help out even more.

Again, No Spoiler marks needed, that is the benefit of coming here.

But everything changed when the spoilerphobes attacked. Now every manga thread, tv thread, film thread and comic thread, is filled to the brim with black bars.

 

[Jangowuzhere]

While I agree that if someone cares only about the story of a game and nothing else, they shouldn't bother with an interactive medium. Lets Plays may be more suitable for those types. However I don't think that gives anyone the right to spoil a story of a game just because "lol video games stories are shit anyways go read a book".

Spoiler Culture™ is stupid as it consists of two extremes: those who are upset by literally anything being revealed and those who reveal everything just because. People should use common sense and be less self-centered, as well as be cautious if they're sensitive to non-story spoilers such as an area/weapons/enemy type.

Don't get me wrong, I think spoilers suck as much as the next person. However, for me, my reactions to getting spoiled is more "oh, that sucks that I got spoiled" instead of something like "FUCK, what's the point of even playing this game now!?"

The latter just strikes me as a lame overreaction.

I honestly think this is the worst post I've read on NeoGAF.

Demonstrates a baffling view of both video games as a medium and the other art forms listed. What I care about most in games is narrative for the most part, and I will continue to play them, thanks.

I'd be just as pissed to be spoiled on a game's narrative as I would a book or film. In some cases more so, if the spoiler is of something tens of hours further down the line in the game.

It's really not baffling at all.

Anyone who plays video games strictly for the narrative must be having a bad time. Like 95% of video game stories are complete throw away. Yes, there are rare exceptions, but the most common game stories are far below the standards set by good books and movies.

 

[LotusHD]

He asked, I answered. I did a search for "black bars", and started going through hits.

Okay, it's just... it seems like a poor example, since they only last until the chapter's out, then no one gives a damn about continuing to use spoiler tags, they just talk about said chapter freely, at least for those 2 examples you posted.

 

[KHlover]

What, why are you using manga threads for your examples lol

Why wouldn't he? MangaGAF and AnimeGAF are like the only communities here to *actually* take the whole spoiler thing serious. That's how it looks like when you tag all spoilers. Doesn't make for a good reading experience, but at least it's only for a few hours (in case of DBS the time between japanese airing and Crunchyroll airing) to a day (time between release of manga spoilers and chapters). Then you have episode spoilers for leaked episode titles and descriptions, those are more annoying because they hang around longer. And even in these threads anything that's already released doesn't get tagged, including major plot points.

 

[ScientificPizza]

This is the first time i've ever seen people use the term spoilerphobe and it makes me want to kill myself

It is the easiest thing in the world to spoiler tag something, it costs you absolutely nothing and, if anything, it allows you to speak on a topic more freely

No one is stopping you from saying anything, this isn't an attack on the potential discussion of a game, it's just very basic common courtesy

There is never a reason to use unmarked spoilers unless you are in a specific spoiler thread

It's really not baffling at all.

Anyone who plays video games strictly for the narrative must be having a bad time. Like 95% of video game stories are complete throw away. Yes, there are rare exceptions, but the most common game stories are far below the standards set by good books and movies.

This is complete bullshit and is missing the point entirely

 

[fester]

No, the OP doesn't like people without consideration telling him key plot points of the game that he's playing right now, which is a very reasonable sentiment. And 20 years ago people would get mad as well if you tell them the ending of a book that they were reading, I don't know where the hell this stupid trend about saying that only now people care about spoilers come from. Most of the people don't like to have stories where they are invested spoiled, it was always like that and it is a reasonable thing to be mad at.

20 years? I'm talking 200+. It's not reasonable. Get some fucking perspective.

 

[Starlightmuse]

What about this?

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=243632308#post243632308

Someone was upset someone else made a thread for the announcement of Jodi Whittaker as the new Doctor. What do you think they could've done to avoid it?


Yeah, I guess that would work. But then this also spoils that the next Doctor is female.

Although this one spoils that there's going to be a 13th Doctor, no can do.

Maybe it's too much of a give away considering new actor announcements are usually Doctors or Companions, one more fix.

There, the perfect, spoiler free thread title.

(Do you think all that effort was worth it, or reasonable?)
How many clicks do you need to declassify this, go on, count it for me.

How about this one?

This one?

This?

One more?

I can keep going, but the unfortunate truth is I don't have an encyclopedic knowledge of all that times that black bars are being spammed on GAF. My broader point is I'd rather not discuss content this way, and you can say "well if you don't want to do it you can go somewhere else", but I can turn that around. If you don't want to be spoiled, you can bugger off in kind.

As I said before, I see no point in complaining about these kinds of things, or like the raichu, weapons names or whatever.
I'm talking about spoiling major plot points like character deaths and endings. Everybody know what they're doing when they spoil these kind of things, there's no scuse other than not give a shit.

As for the clicks, I've seen like 15 tags? without counting quotes of posts in the same page (I didn't count them exactly) in the first link. Is it hard for you to do 15 clicks? Is not hard at all I think, you probably do hundreds of clicks every day in the internet.
Also, you are showing me a OT of a manga, where it wouldn't be rare to see spoilers about that manga, and I find it more or less reasonable (though, I repeat, I don't see the hasasle in doing clicks), what I'm seeing here in this thread is people telling me that they don't give a shit about spoiling Guardians of the galaxy 2 in the Wonder Woman thread because reasons, or spoiling anything in any thread if it's 6 months old because they don't give a shit.

20 years? I'm talking 200+. It's not reasonable. Get some fucking perspective.

What? Are you an historian? What the hell do you even know if people cared about being spoiled 200 fucking years ago?

 

[Gotdatmoney]

My rule for spoilers is simple. Whatever is being talked about has to tangibly effect how the player will react to the event. And it is bound by time and popularity. No hookshot in Breath of the Wild is not a spoiler. You are not entitled to have the fact that Sephiroth is the last boss in FF7 kept a secret. No fuck off. The game is almost 20 years old and has about a million pieces of media present. It's past the statue of limitations. You are not entitled to have it kept a secret that there is a plot twist in a game. Knowing something happens doesn't mean anything, you'll know it when you get there regardless.

But for instance I am not going to say major points of climax is Last of Us without spoilers. I am not going to tell you what the actual twist is in Xenoblade. I am not going to say X thing was obvious in Horizon. If you are enthusiastic enough to get on a discussion board about a game then you take full responsibility for your enjoyment. If this stuff worries you that much come back when you finish the game. Everyone isnt out here trying to preserve your perfect first run.

 

[Haly]

Okay, it's just... it seems like a poor example, since they only last until the chapter's out, then no one gives a damn about continuing to use spoiler tags, they just talk about said chapter freely, at least for those 2 examples you posted.

Sigh.

This is.

Not.

The point.

It doesn't have to be a manga thread. It can be the Nier Automata thread and I'm pretty sure you were in that one. The point is what spoilerphobia is doing to fiction discussion, making it a minefield and putting everyone on high alert. That kind of tension isn't a good thing, to me. Like, I actually think we're worse off as a culture for it.

As I said before, I see no point in complaining about these kinds of things, or like the raichu, weapons names or whatever.

Me neither.

I'm talking about spoiling major plot points like character deaths and endings. Everybody know what they're doing when they spoil these kind of things, there's no scuse other than not give a shit.

We're going around in circles but I just want to say again that you're drawing a line here where some spoilerphobia is "unreasonable" and some spoilerphobia is "reasonable", and I'm saying almost all of it is unreasonable and a weird quirk in our experience-obsessed culture that I hope disappears.

 

[Starfish Hero]

Not gaming but someone spoiled the Red Wedding for me before the third season premiered and I'd be lying if that didn't derail my interest in GoT. So I get where OP is coming from.

But some people get really bent out of shape over things most people consider fairly benign. People shouldn't have to tip toe around discussion just because a couple people want to simultaneously go into media blackout while posting in every relevant thread. If you don't like even small spoilers, you have to take it upon yourself to avoid forums. It's not that hard.

 

[ScientificPizza]

Sigh.

This is.

Not.

The point.

It doesn't have to be a manga thread. It can be the Nier Automata thread and I'm pretty sure you were in that one. The point is what spoilerphobia is doing to fiction discussion, making it a minefield and putting everyone on high alert. That kind of tension isn't a good thing, to me. Like, I actually think we're worse off as a culture for it.

This is impossibly over dramatic. No one needs to be on high alert. We have spoiler tags for a reason. Our culture is not worse for not wanting stories people are actively engaged in spoiled for them. That's ridiculous

 

[Bobby Roberts]

This is the first time i've ever seen people use the term spoilerphobe and it makes me want to kill myself

Yikes.

I appreciate the propagation of the term for its accuracy regarding this phenomenon, myself.

Haly's doing good work up in here.

Our culture is not worse for not wanting stories people are actively engaged in spoiled for them. That's ridiculous

Interesting tidbit: The presence of "spoilers" as a concern in our culture is a relatively new and very, very quickly adopted form of grievance. It's about 20 years old at best.

Basically, before 1996 or so, this sort of thing wasn't really a problem. Like, at all. Sure, in rare circumstances, it took on some level of importance, but for the most part, "Culture" as we known it has only recently become this aware of (and sensitive to) the sanctity of hypothetical experiences being ruined/robbed from others.

 

[metalslimer]

At a certain point things just get ridiculous though. For example when an entire page is whited out in spoilers what is the point of discussing it like that.

And not even talking about threads but I have multiple friends who will start asking questions about a piece of media they haven't finished and proposing theories and then get mad when I hint they are on the completely wrong track.

 

[ScientificPizza]

At a certain point things just get ridiculous though. For example when an entire page is whited out in spoilers what is the point of discussing it like that.

You're willing to read an entire page of a discussion but unwilling to click on a spoiler tag?

 

[fester]

This is the first time i've ever seen people use the term spoilerphobe and it makes me want to kill myself

It is the easiest thing in the world to spoiler tag something, it costs you absolutely nothing and, if anything, it allows you to speak on a topic more freely

No one is stopping you from saying anything, this isn't an attack on the potential discussion of a game, it's just very basic common courtesy

There is never a reason to use unmarked spoilers unless you are in a specific spoiler thread

This is a discussion board and I'm here to read comments and have conversations, not play "hide and seek" or click countless black bars just to understand what's being said. If you don't want to know what's being said about a given topic, don't enter the thread. It's up to you to protect your delicate spoiler sensibilities, not me, especially since what's considered a "spoiler" seems to change every day.

 

[Haly]

This is the first time i've ever seen people use the term spoilerphobe and it makes me want to kill myself

This is impossibly over dramatic. No one needs to kill themselves. We have discussions on GAF for a reason. Spoilerphobia has been a topic in the pop culture blogosphere/twittersphere for a while now. That's ridiculous

 

[ScientificPizza]

This is a discussion board and I'm here to read comments and have conversations, not play "hide and seek" or click countless black bars just to understand what's being said. If you don't want to know what's being said about a given topic, don't enter the thread. It's up to you to protect your delicate spoiler sensibilities, not me, especially after what's considered a "spoiler" seems to change every day.

No, that's not how threads or discussions work. If you want to explicitly discuss spoilers start a spoiler thread, no one should be afraid of entering an OT in fear of having the game theyre playing blatantly spoiled.

Clicking spoiler tags is not a difficult thing to do and it eliminates this problem entirely. The two extremes are someone having a game they're playing ruined for them to someone having to make a mouse click to read something. It's stupid to say that the use of spoiler tags is the problem.

This is impossibly over dramatic. No one needs to kill themselves. We have discussions on GAF for a reason. Spoilerphobia has been a topic in the pop culture blogosphere/twittersphere for a while now. That's ridiculous

What is hyperbole

Nice deflection tho

It's really not, don't be crazy.

Yes it is and it's still missing the point

 

[Jangowuzhere]

This is complete bullshit

It's really not, don't be crazy.

 

[LotusHD]

Why wouldn't he? MangaGAF and AnimeGAF are like the only communities here to *actually* take the whole spoiler thing serious. That's how it looks like when you tag all spoilers. Doesn't make for a good reading experience, but at least it's only for a few hours (in case of DBS the time between japanese airing and Crunchyroll airing) to a day (time between release of manga spoilers and chapters). Then you have episode spoilers for leaked episode titles and descriptions, those are more annoying because they hang around longer. And even in these threads anything that's already released doesn't get tagged, including major plot points.

I'm not in every single thread, all I know is for those two examples at least, people are courteous enough to spoiler tag stuff until it's out, because there are people that want to experience it alongside the panels. Once it's out, no fucks are given. So putting spoiler tags on stuff for like a day is pretty reasonable imo... Like if something is actually complaining about that, then that's news to me.

As for anime threads, well, it depends on the anime? Certain anime like Attack on Titan for example have manga adaptations, thus no one really likes manga readers openly going around talking about what's going to happen next for obvious reasons. And then you have people who apparently try to be slick about it, so if they're a bit more strict about things, I'm not really surprised?

As for OT threads for games, I mean, that's what a spoiler thread is for if you want to talk about the game completely freely. But yea, there are times when some of the things people spoiler tag are pretty silly.

 

[MHWilliams]

That's the thing: it's almost never anyone's job to be courteous or considerate. I don't have to do shit for anyone else outside of helping coworkers and clients at work.

I hold the door for people behind me because it's no effort and it's more likely to be helpful/nicer for others than me letting it slam in their faces. It's not my job to share stuff me food with some me one down on their luck when I'm eating out for lunch, but I'd rather live in a world where people do that occasionally when they can afford to rather than talk about how it's not their job to do so.

Courtesy and consideration have limits, hence to point of this discussion. At what point do you have a responsibility to protect yourself from information you do not want to see?

There is never a reason to use unmarked spoilers unless you are in a specific spoiler thread

And these are the hardline stances that I'm talking about. They do not help and folks will absolutely not follow them.

I'm not in every single thread, all I know is for those two examples at least, people are courteous enough to spoiler tag stuff until it's out, because there are people that want to experience it alongside the panels. Once it's out, no fucks are given. So putting spoiler tags on stuff for like a day is pretty reasonable imo... Like if something is actually complaining about that, then that's news to me.

We have people who are against the bolded in this very thread, at least in the case of games. And many have stated there's no difference between games, movie, TV, etc.

 

[ozfunghi]

Luckily my memory is rather bad, so two or three weeks after reading a spoiler, i don't even remember ever reading a spoiler to begin with.

 

[fester]

What? Are you an historian? What the hell do you even know if people cared about being spoiled 200 fucking years ago?

Are you just intentionally flaunting your ignorance?

 

[Starlightmuse]

If you don't want to know what's being said about a given topic, don't enter the thread

Perhaps people enter in a thread of Wonder Woman to speak about wonder woman and not about the ending of guardians of the galaxy 2. Perhaps people enter in this thread to speak about spoilers and not to speak about the ending of shadow of the colossus.

It's up to you to protect your delicate spoiler sensibilities, not me

So, basically you don't give a shit about the others. Cool.

Are you just intentionally flaunting your ignorance?

No, I'm just not making up things out of my ass. Show me the receipts about people not caring about spoiling them books 200 years ago and perhaps you'll be able to call me an ignorant then.

 

[Haly]

This is impossibly over dramatic. No one needs to be on high alert.

What is hyperbole

 

[ScientificPizza]

What is hyperbole

You seem like a cool person

 

[Haly]

You seem like a cool person

 

[fester]

Clicking spoiler tags is not a difficult thing to do and it eliminates this problem entirely.

The "problem" is entirely self-generated. I didn't create your fear of spoilers, nor do I have the faintest idea what counts as a spoiler for you. I don't have the time or interest in trying to cater to any of that. If I'm in the middle of a game and I want to experience it alone, I do the work to avoid any OTs or other threads that might discuss things before I'm ready.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

No, that's not how threads or discussions work. If you want to explicitly discuss spoilers start a spoiler thread, no one should be afraid of entering an OT in fear of having the game theyre playing blatantly spoiled.

Here's the problem with that (and it's a problem that's been sorting itself out on the Off-Topic side pretty elegantly, or rather, as elegant as OT can get)

What's the point of having an "official" discussion thread if people can't freely discuss the thing everyone's there to talk about?

The notion of an OT being spoiler free is kinda fundamentally broken. If it's supposed to be the place for conversation on the story, gameplay, narrative, experience, tips 'n' trix whatever-the-hell, asking people to go there and then immediately telling them that 2/3rds of all possible topics of convo now have to be placed behind black bars (as low-effort as that might be, it's still intended to be constricting/restrictive) or everything is going to get derailed and there are guaranteed to be fights? That really doesn't make much sense.

I know that it's the habit here. It's the tradition maybe, more like, but it's also backwards. It makes no real sense.

What happened on Off-Topic is that review/preview threads would pop up, and since those threads are where everyone is on the same common ground (nobody's played it/watched it, they're all just waiting for reviews to drop) that is where spoiler free conversation goes. And what's more, the conversations tend to stay spoiler-free naturally with no constant reminders or pleading, because everyone's more or less on the same level playing field there, with the same intentions within the conversation.

The Official Threads are just naturally considered spoiler threads now, because if you've just seen something, or read something, or experienced something, it makes sense you're gonna want to talk about it openly with other people who have seen it. That's what a fuckin' official thread is for, right?

That's kinda the problem in a nutshell. Since spoilers as a concern is a relative new thing, and the internet has a memory all of 5 minutes long in terms of social mores, instead of stopping to think about the best way to implement discussion without making things janky for everyone, someone set up the consideration protocols fucking backward, and the rest of us just kinda... went along with it.

The whole thing is often approached completely backwards, and while yes, being inconsiderate is a dick move, and people could stand to have a lot more consideration when dealing with each other and their differing opinions, suggesting that people who have seen, read, experienced, or played a thing are now the ones that have to automatically assume the defensive and be extra careful not to talk with others about what they've experienced—in a thread dedicated to that experience—for the sake of people who basically are just wandering into conversations they're not even ready to have yet?

Doesn't make any fuckin' sense.

 

[Sgt.Pepper]

Honestly, at what point should be getting spoiled the responsability of the reader? Because I swear I've seen people getting pissed AT PUBLICY AVAILABLE INFORMATION by official sources in this very forum.

You can talk about courtesy and whatever, but at some point it has to be your own damn fault.