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[Deadstar]

We do have those. They are called Legendaries.

I got my first legendary from doing the dlc story missions and I'm level 26. I was thinking something around level 10 to keep you excited while you play.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

"First time Normal Raid! Level 28, Have mic"
"All players welcome, Mic not required, evel 27 or higher and be willing to listen"
"Group of 3 looking for 3 to help with first Hard raid, experienced with Normal"

on the other side of the coin
"Hard Raid quick run, experienced players only"
"Level 31 needed for Crota kill only"

It's the difference between people understanding what they are getting into and choosing to do so, and having no choice.

Yes but sometimes, just sometimes, you want to press a button that says 'Matchmaking for Raid', and get into it without having to talk to anybody. Maybe put up a warning in the front that says 'Raids are hard blah blah blah'.

But there's no reason to NOT have an easy matchmaking button in this day in age.

 

[Dysun]

Will have to be the best god damn DLC ever conceived for me to drop more money on this game

 

[Hawkian]

Yes but sometimes, just sometimes, you want to press a button that says 'Matchmaking for Raid', and get into it without having to talk to anybody. Maybe put up a warning in the front that says 'Raids are hard blah blah blah'.

But there's no reason to NOT have an easy matchmaking button in this day in age.

I'm giving you the reason. It would be bad for the game overall.

The argument you're making here is "sometimes you just want to be lazy." That's the wrong mindset to be in entering a raid in the first place.

 

[ViciousDS]

great, 30 minutes of Sony's conference gone next year due to the new sub class(es)


Wonder what they are going to do during the 6 month gap of no new dlc/content.

 

[CGwizz]

so glad i didnt bought this game, looks like this game was made to milk DLC´s

 

[Kinyou]

Comet seems to be what the $20 DLC packs should have been but I will guess cost at least $40.

Seeing how much they seem to be under delivering on value with Destiny though I can see them going $60 for it

I find it strange how much focus they seem to put on PvP maps. Are many people playing it? Whenever I hear someone praise destiny they usually talk about coop and raids.

 

[BokehKing]

I'll give the haters this

The only TRUE expansion is the comet

Dark below and wolves of the calla should be like $10

But you know Activision..

 

[BreezyLimbo]

I'm giving you the reason. It would be bad for the game overall.

The argument you're making here is "sometimes you just want to be lazy." That's the wrong mindset to be in entering a raid in the first place.

What proof do you have that it would be bad for the game? Other than your assumption?

The fact is, we won't know until they do it. But if WoW can do LFR with raids that are factually harder than Destiny Raids in terms of mechanics, then Destiny can. None of this BS 'Oh no everyone would wipe and then they would insult Bungie and that would be bad for the game'.

 

[Jarmel]

I'm giving you the reason. It would be bad for the game overall.

The argument you're making here is "sometimes you just want to be lazy." That's the wrong mindset to be in entering a raid in the first place.

The original raid isn't hard enough to the put where the couldn't have done matchmaking for the vanilla version.

 

[figadapaura]

If they put matchmaking in the raids, I can't solo Crota anymore. And that would be a travesty.

The original raid isn't hard enough to the put where the couldn't have done matchmaking for the vanilla version.

You're joking, right? It took the first team to beat it fucking ages. Rando's ain't sticking around for that.

 

[LtOrange]

I love Destiny, but that seems like a huge gap in content between House of Wolves and Comet. I really hope this isn't true.

 

[dubq]

I'm giving you the reason. It would be bad for the game overall.

And I say that's horseshit. No one would be forced to use matchmaking. (No one ever is in any MMO if they have the means to put together their own group anyway) Use it at your own risk but at least offer it for those that want to use it.

 

[Jarmel]

You're joking, right? It took the first team to beat it fucking ages. Rando's ain't sticking around for that.

And pretty much everybody can clear it now. It's not that hard.

Oh and they cleared it within a day. That's not ages.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

You're joking, right? It took the first team to beat it fucking ages. Rando's ain't sticking around for that.

Only because nobody knew what to do. But once you know, it's easy mode. And that's the issue with the mechanic design-

Let's take WoW for example. Alot of the dungeons before the Highmaul raid teach you basic mechanics-Either not standing in shit, jumping over shit, getting displaced to a different area, or what not.

And the HM raid takes many of these mechanics so in essence you know what to not stand in. Hell, the last boss of that raid is simply jumping over waves, not standing in mines, dealing with adds, moving away from the tank during certain parts, etc.

The fact that in the Destiny thread they have to 'Spoiler' the mechanics of a fight is...just sad IMO. It's like...once you know the mechanics it becomes easy mode.

Meanwhile in a WoW raid, even if you know the mechanics, it doesn't become easy mode after it. Unlike Destiny, you can't mass rez everyone constantly when they die, you have to actually coordinate in order to do certain parts of it, and the hard difficulty of the raid actually add fight-changing mechanics.

If WoW can do an LFR, so can Destiny. Simple as that.

 

[B_Spooky13]

Oh there's the rest of the game.. is there going to be a actual story?

 

[cakely]

The original raid isn't hard enough to the put where the couldn't have done matchmaking for the vanilla version.

The original raid wasn't trivial, and it required coordination.

If every player knew exactly what they were doing you could probably coordinate without voice comm, but there's just no way that would happen with a group of random players.

Heck, right now in Vanguard Roc you still get guys that show up just to AFK.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Heck, right now in Vanguard Roc you still get guys that show up just to AFK.

Because the difference between queueing up for VoG and queuing up for a Strike, is that most likely they've done the strike for the hundredth time. And the strike is so easy mode that 1 person can probably solo it.(Which actually I wish there was an option to just go in and solo a strike. That's how easy they are.)

 

[figadapaura]

And pretty much everybody can clear it now. It's not that hard.

Oh and they cleared it within a day. That's not ages.

Eh, just because it didn't take them a week doesn't mean it didn't take long. Randoms who might not even have mics would have taken even longer.

I know it's not hard. Everyone calls it easy mode now, but that's because they've completed it a bajillion times. A lot of it takes good coordination which a team of people who'd never done it before would struggle to get the hang of without having to resort to yt videos or whatever.

 

[brickwalker0]

I love Destiny, but that seems like a huge gap in content between House of Wolves and Comet. I really hope this isn't true.

It's almost like every Destiny rumor thread even before release shared this sentiment.

And every single time, it's been as we feared.

 

[BokehKing]

What proof do you have that it would be bad for the game? Other than your assumption?

The fact is, we won't know until they do it. But if WoW can do LFR with raids that are factually harder than Destiny Raids in terms of mechanics, then Destiny can. None of this BS 'Oh no everyone would wipe and then they would insult Bungie and that would be bad for the game'.

It's already been mentioned before but those LFR in WoW give out crap gear

You only get good gear from non matchmaking raids

There is not a lot of gear in Destiny due to the way the leveling system works

So if you want the equivalent of WoW LFR in Destiny, the only rewards you would receive is shards/no gear because the content would be dumbed down

 

[xplicitone]

For the love of Guardians, don't have us relevel our exotics again. A 2nd time was enough. I'll be content with it if they add bubbles.

I'll be fairly satisfied with the above and following:

Keep Xur in permanentyly, rotate stock weekly.
Add more vault and inventory space.
Up glimmer cap.
New dailies/events for Radiant mats.
Method of purchasing/exchanging class specific gear mats.
Add more missions like the final Urn mission. Maybe have gunsmith give out fun quests. Basically make the tower more interactive and fun.
Rotate stock of vendor items as well.

 

[Vire]

What the hell, you have an entire universe you can go to and yet we revisit the same 3-4 areas again and again?

Why Bungie?

 

[Hawkian]

What proof do you have that it would be bad for the game? Other than your assumption?

The fact is, we won't know until they do it. But if WoW can do LFR with raids that are factually harder than Destiny Raids in terms of mechanics, then Destiny can. None of this BS 'Oh no everyone would wipe and then they would insult Bungie and that would be bad for the game'.

Well, I don't know what "proof" you are looking for exactly; what would prove it to you? The numbers on completion of the raids playerbase-wide would indicate that it's not content that "just anyone" can complete in the first place...

I have my anecdotal experience of running dozens of raids with different groups including a weekly one for new players, and my experience with blind matching in strikes.

 

[BokehKing]

What the hell, you have an entire universe you can go to and yet we revisit the same 3-4 areas again and again?

Why Bungie?

Because that's all you're getting in Destiny 1, the sooner you understand that the better

 

[figadapaura]

Only because nobody knew what to do. But once you know, it's easy mode. And that's the issue with the mechanic design-

Let's take WoW for example. Alot of the dungeons before the Highmaul raid teach you basic mechanics-Either not standing in shit, jumping over shit, getting displaced to a different area, or what not.

And the HM raid takes many of these mechanics so in essence you know what to not stand in. Hell, the last boss of that raid is simply jumping over waves, not standing in mines, dealing with adds, moving away from the tank during certain parts, etc.

The fact that in the Destiny thread they have to 'Spoiler' the mechanics of a fight is...just sad IMO. It's like...once you know the mechanics it becomes easy mode.

Meanwhile in a WoW raid, even if you know the mechanics, it doesn't become easy mode after it. Unlike Destiny, you can't mass rez everyone constantly when they die, you have to actually coordinate in order to do certain parts of it, and the hard difficulty of the raid actually add fight-changing mechanics.

If WoW can do an LFR, so can Destiny. Simple as that.

We don't spoiler mechanics in the OT. That was just the first week of the dlc because people wanted to go in blind. Plenty of people still struggle with Hard VoG even though they know the mechanics like the back of their hand.

 

[BokehKing]

The original raid isn't hard enough to the put where the couldn't have done matchmaking for the vanilla version.

You say that now after being told what to do and how to fight it, I can see random falling apart stage 3 of the first boss fight, giving up completely at gorgons

Won't even get into randoms dealing with the teleporting with the gate keeper and aetheon later on

 

[BreezyLimbo]

It's already been mentioned before but those LFR in WoW give out crap gear

You only get good gear from non matchmaking raids

There is not a lot of gear in Destiny due to the way the leveling system works

So if you want the equivalent of WoW LFR in Destiny, the only rewards you would receive is shards/no gear because the content would be dumbed down

And? That's Bungies problem. Edit-Nixxed this part, more just personal opinion.

If Blizzard can put in dumbed down gear that atleast gives you a starting point for the raid through LFR...Bungie can too. Seeing as how the armor is already randomized in Destiny(Don't get me started on Armamentarium...Xur managed to sell it 3 weeks in a row, and after I brought it the first week, each one he sold every week after managed to have better Discipline than mine. Successively, so if I brought it the 2nd week, I'd get screwed because the 3rd week one had even better Discipline.).

So it's stupid to say there's not enough gear, when they can easily just rebalance the stats to be lower. And don't start on 'Well you can already grind for gear!'

Well, I don't know what "proof" you are looking for exactly; what would prove it to you? The numbers on completion of the raids playerbase-wide would indicate that it's not content that "just anyone" can complete in the first place...

I have my anecdotal experience of running dozens of raids with different groups including a weekly one for new players, and my experience with blind matching in strikes.

Yeah, and the numbers of the playerbase reflect those that bother to find a group to do it. I'd like Bungie to release how much of the playerbase TRIED to do the Vault with a group and failed. That would be interesting. But both numbers would still be small because the people who would actually try and set up a raid group/join a group are dwarfed magnificently by the playerbase overall.

We don't spoiler mechanics in the OT. That was just the first week of the dlc because people wanted to go in blind. Plenty of people still struggle with Hard VoG even though they know the mechanics like the back of their hand.

Yes, so you did put a spoiler warning for mechanics the first week or so. You shouldn't have to be doing that. Because the raid should be about your skill. I don't think I've ever seen the WoW raid mechanics spoiler marked on any fansite or by Blizzard themselves. I guess because those Raids take actual coordination and skill, that knowing a mechanic doesn't necessarily mean you'll best it. I just found it odd you guys did that.

 

[FyreWulff]

WoW also has/had the benefit of much bigger playerbase, who must pay a monthly fee to play, so they really want to play the game and maximize their subscription dollar.

To put it in perspective in how monsterous World of Warcraft's population is, if you took Destiny's raid trophy/achievement count percentage and applied that to WoW as the part of the WoW population that plays raids, WoW's LFR tool has over a million people using it.

Destiny assuredly has nowhere near WoW's concurrent numbers and it's split across 4 platforms at that. They're going to have to be real careful about how they would do raid game formation.

 

[R_thanatos]

No its not, as I mentioned above, using matchmaking for strikes leads to so many people who go afk or refuse to go into the new mic system during the match.

People from lfg want to complete the match, you know if they have a mic or not, you know the experience they have if they chose to list it...

Random matchmakers who never been in the raid before will cry it's too hard, then it will have to get nerfed and people will get pissed off

Sorry but i don't understand your logic . What would prevent you from playing raid with your close group of friends if you don't like that people can drop in and out ?

You can argue that destiny isn't an MMo but it has mmo mecanics. Matchmaking isn't going to break the game if you play like before . I'm reading your posts and it feels like you're refusing to see what good matchmaking could add when it probably won't bother those who play like usual/before.
if it's a content that require precise party coordination, groups will be formed naturally ( like any event in an online game )

 

[BokehKing]

Only because nobody knew what to do. But once you know, it's easy mode. And that's the issue with the mechanic design-

Let's take WoW for example. Alot of the dungeons before the Highmaul raid teach you basic mechanics-Either not standing in shit, jumping over shit, getting displaced to a different area, or what not.

And the HM raid takes many of these mechanics so in essence you know what to not stand in. Hell, the last boss of that raid is simply jumping over waves, not standing in mines, dealing with adds, moving away from the tank during certain parts, etc.

The fact that in the Destiny thread they have to 'Spoiler' the mechanics of a fight is...just sad IMO. It's like...once you know the mechanics it becomes easy mode.

Meanwhile in a WoW raid, even if you know the mechanics, it doesn't become easy mode after it. Unlike Destiny, you can't mass rez everyone constantly when they die, you have to actually coordinate in order to do certain parts of it, and the hard difficulty of the raid actually add fight-changing mechanics.

If WoW can do an LFR, so can Destiny. Simple as that.

All very true, but are you really counting on the average fps / dudebro this gamed was advertised to, to come from a Warcraft background. I seen people stupidity stand in the shit, even though to me it's common sense from playing years of WoW

 

[BreezyLimbo]

All very true, but are you really counting on the average fps / dudebro this gamed was advertised to, to come from a Warcraft background. I seen people stupidity stand in the shit, even though to me it's common sense from playing years of WoW

And they'll naturally be filtered out by not trying to do the Raid anymore. Or they'll realize by the time they're on the 5th hour of the door boss, that maybe they should look up a guide. You're giving the Destiny raid alot more credit than it deserves in terms of difficulty.

But then again you're just implying that these dudebros are just morons who don't have smartphones or computers. Shame on you.

 

[BokehKing]

Listen to this podcast when you get the chance

It's Deej and the guy who created the raid talking to the group of guys that got to run VoG before the game released.

They go into why matchmaking is bad

TTL Party Chat Episode 8
http://media.blubrry.com/guardianra.../uploads/2014/12/TTL-Party-Chat-Episode-8.mp3

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Yes, so you did put a spoiler warning for mechanics the first week or so. You shouldn't have to be doing that. Because the raid should be about your skill. I don't think I've ever seen the WoW raid mechanics spoiler marked on any fansite or by Blizzard themselves. I guess because those Raids take actual coordination and skill, that knowing a mechanic doesn't necessarily mean you'll best it. I just found it odd you guys did that.

Some people like to go to raids unspoiled.

That has nothing to do with wether raids are demanding or not. Which I don't think Destiny raids are.

 

[Victory Red]

I love Destiny as much as the next guy and Bungie has done a great job of keeping me playing as I approach 400 hours.

But that gap between House of Wolves and Comet is worrysome.

Crota DLC hasn't been out a month and I'm already at the level cap again, have all the DLC Exotics and Raid weapons, and the raid is a joke.

 

[BokehKing]

And they'll naturally be filtered out by not trying to do the Raid anymore. Or they'll realize by the time they're on the 5th hour of the door boss, that maybe they should look up a guide. You're giving the Destiny raid alot more credit than it deserves in terms of difficulty.

But then again you're just implying that these dudebros are just morons who don't have smartphones or computers. Shame on you.

The people I played COD with don't go on YouTube or the Web for help

 

[BokehKing]

First things first

People stop expecting major changes in Destiny 1

Second.... Stop comparing destiny to WoW, it's not Warcraft, nor should it have to mimic everything WoW does to make you happy.


Probably why countless other MMO'S died... Too many people want WoW, yet won't play WoW because random reasons

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Listen to this podcast when you get the chance

It's Deej and the guy who created the raid talking to the group of guys that got to run VoG before the game released.

They go into why matchmaking is bad

TTL Party Chat Episode 8
http://media.blubrry.com/guardianra.../uploads/2014/12/TTL-Party-Chat-Episode-8.mp3

But...matchmaking isn't inherently bad. League of Legends, DotA 2, CS:Go, WoW, all manage to be more mechanically dense than Destiny, and they all have matchmaking.

What IS bad, is Destiny teaching mechanics to the player. Only 2 missions in the Vanilla show you something different-The Sword mission, and the mission where you stand on the plate to summon the Gate lord.

They repeat these 2 mechanics over and over and over in the VoG raid-Standing on plates, equipping a sword/'relic'. I guess that was Bungies half-assed attempt at teaching a mechanic, but alot of players didn't realize it until after doing the raid. Some probably didn't realize it now.

It's squarely Bungies fault for not teaching mechanics. Each Strike is bullet sponge after bullet sponge, and you're surprised that people had trouble the first day the Raid came out? That's because Bungie didn't use the Strikes or Story missions to teach mechanics to the player. Of course the Raids going to be difficult when Bungie just sucks at teaching the player some mechanics.

The people I played COD with don't go on YouTube or the Web for help

Because a CoD match is just like a Raid, right? Here you are saying to not compare it to WoW, and yet you freely compare it to CoD which is even further from being like a Destiny Raid? Hell, Bungie hired a Scarab Lord(From WoW) to help design the raids. You just can't say 'It's not like WoW!', when all of these things add up to being alot like it.

 

[border]

Crota DLC hasn't been out a month and I'm already at the level cap again, have all the DLC Exotics and Raid weapons, and the raid is a joke.

In 4 raids you've managed to get every single exotic, every single raid weapon, and at least 3 pieces of raid armor?

 

[dubq]

The people I played COD with don't go on YouTube or the Web for help

I've played with people who do and people who don't. This is besides the point and has nothing to do with whether or not raid matchmaking would benefit or hurt the game. Again, no one would be forcing you to use matchmaking. What would stop you from playing the game the same way you always played it?

 

[border]

The fact that in the Destiny thread they have to 'Spoiler' the mechanics of a fight is...just sad IMO. It's like...once you know the mechanics it becomes easy mode.

Meanwhile in a WoW raid, even if you know the mechanics, it doesn't become easy mode after it. Unlike Destiny, you can't mass rez everyone constantly when they die, .

Your comments indicate that you have not spent much time in Destiny's raids. You should probably do that before you speculate about the necessities of matchmaking.

 

[theblackjasper]

im getting exhausted just looking at all this......

 

[Junior Mint]

Random matchmakers who never been in the raid before will cry it's too hard, then it will have to get nerfed and people will get pissed off

So we're just going to use made up hypothetical as arguments now?

I think he means Lvl 7-18 legendary weapons so people can justify playing the game, palette swap some of the Blues to purples and people would be like

'I totally change my mind, I love this look at all the purples I got'

Destiny must be the first loot game you've ever played if you think that.

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Your comments indicate that you have not spent much time in Destiny's raids. You should probably do that before you speculate about the necessities of matchmaking.

I spent time in Destinys raids. I had fun cheesing the Templar with grenades. I also set up a group on /v/ on release day of the raid, where we got to the last boss before we called it a morning-About 6 hours into the raid.

But of course you can just make a drive by comment and say 'You haven't spent time on raids!' without actually discussing anything.

 

[figadapaura]

In 4 raids you've managed to get every single exotic, every single raid weapon, and at least 3 pieces of raid armor?

All the raid weapons aren't even available yet.

 

[Gurrry]

No its not, as I mentioned above, using matchmaking for strikes leads to so many people who go afk or refuse to go into the new mic system during the match.

People from lfg want to complete the match, you know if they have a mic or not, you know the experience they have if they chose to list it...

Random matchmakers who never been in the raid before will cry it's too hard, then it will have to get nerfed and people will get pissed off

Well if Bungie would allow you to kick people who are AFK, then this wouldnt even be an issue. They shouldnt punish the player by removing basic functionality because they were too incompetent to realize they needed a kick player option for strikes.

Also - people who dont use the new mic system probably dont even know how to use it. When they released that update, it took me a while to figure it out. Then when I realized it doesnt work in the tower or in patrols, it quickly dawned on me that its basically fucking useless.

Regardless, if they implemented matchmaking, it wouldnt be any skin off your back since you will still use LFG anyway. So why punish others because you want to do it one archaic way and we dont?

 

[Canucked]

The development history (and future) is fascinating.


I hope someone writes a tell-all one day.

 

[Junior Mint]

I spent time in Destinys raids. I had fun cheesing the Templar with grenades. I also set up a group on /v/ on release day of the raid, where we got to the last boss before we called it a morning-About 6 hours into the raid.

But of course you can just make a drive by comment and say 'You haven't spent time on raids!' without actually discussing anything.

Half the arguments from Destiny players are "you probably never even played the game" when most of the complaints are from people who have put in 50+ hours and have given this game WAY more of a chance than it deserves

 

[Trickster]

First things first

People stop expecting major changes in Destiny 1

Second.... Stop comparing destiny to WoW, it's not Warcraft, nor should it have to mimic everything WoW does to make you happy.


Probably why countless other MMO'S died... Too many people want WoW, yet won't play WoW because random reasons

You could compare Destiny to any of the WoW copycats and Destiny would still fall short.

The issue is simply that whenever you compare Destiny to any relatively well known mmo, it falls short in so many ways. Basically everything that reminds you of an mmo in Destiny is shit compared to actual mmo's. Which is the majority of the game.

 

[BokehKing]

I've played with people who do and people who don't. This is besides the point and has nothing to do with whether or not raid matchmaking would benefit or hurt the game. Again, no one would be forcing you to use matchmaking. What would stop you from playing the game the same way you always played it?

Yes but what if people call for a nerf, it's too hard, then it affects me