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Homeworld Remastered |OT| All of this has happened before and will happen again

I hate how the missions are so trial-and-error. I'm at mission 6 I think. The one where you have to navigate through the astroid belt, by destroying all the debris, and I've tried it like 30 times, and there is just no way to do it. I have 6 assault frigets and 20 heavy corvettes and they just cant destroy the debris in time.

Now I have to load a previous save, do the entire previous mission and get through it somehow differently. This is not very fun.


Besides the archiac mission structure the game is fun, truly unique and special! it feels like an old pc game.
 
Ctrl + drag click incoming asteroids as a group and keep building frigs and harvesting like crazy. Fighters and bombers in the remastered that used to cut through them get blown up easily now. Also, defenders seem to do okay against them now too.
 

DBT85

Member
Just booted for the first time.

Played through all the tutorials and was like "this doesn't look as sharp as I thought it would". Then realised that I don't play at 1080 anymore lol.

Also, my lord do the UI scaling options need a half way house. Option 1 for me is tiny in the corners, and option 2 is like one of those giant calculators. 3 and 4 are just laughable.
 

twobear

sputum-flecked apoplexy
So, there's either a bug or an extremely stupid change to Karos Graveyard

Basically this mission used to have a trick to it, which was that you could build a gravwell generator to destroy the Dawg when it came to steal a ship, because it counted as a corvette and would be disabled.

Only now, when I activated the gravwell and told my capital ships to attack the dawg, their accuracy was abysmal. I mean, broken. Heavy Cruisers were firing their main ion cannons like, 90 degrees in the wrong direction directly into empty space.

I wonder if this is how they 'fixed' this mission, by making your % to hit the Dawg so low rather than making it tougher to destroy. In any case it was beyond stupid watching my Destroyers and Heavy Cruisers discharge their ion cannons in random directions.
 
Ctrl + drag click incoming asteroids as a group and keep building frigs and harvesting like crazy. Fighters and bombers in the remastered that used to cut through them get blown up easily now. Also, defenders seem to do okay against them now too.

I don't have defenders or Ion cannon Frigs, is that a problem?

I just replayed previous mission. build all the assault frigs I could. Support frigs seems to be useless?
the big problem with the frigs is that they move so slow, they get blown up by the astroid almost immediately. I tried the move-and-attack but its not really work?

do you mean harvesting with resource collectors? I only have 3! is that enough? should I have a few salvage corvettes?
 

twobear

sputum-flecked apoplexy
Support frigates are for repairing, not for attacking. Ion cannons are probably your best bet. Aren't there destroyers in the previous mission? You should try and capture them with salvage corvettes.

[edit] Regarding my previous spoiler:

Okay there is no way it's working as intended. It's almost impossible to get capital ships to attack the dawg. Giving them orders to attack it will make them randomly target pieces of junk nearby. This is stupid.

[edit 2]
Okay, so, attacking any enemies in the Graveyard causes all of your ships to lock onto random nearby pieces of debris and fire. C'mon, Gearbox. C'mon.
 
I hate to be that guy, but I can't play the HW1 remaster. Personally, I think it is a bit misleading to call it a remaster, because it is a remake. It was never a secret that they were porting HW1 to the HW2 engine, but I guess I didn't think it would end up being such a different game. As soon as things got rolling on the tutorial I noticed it wasn't the same. I wasn't aware of the ballistics vs. RNG situation between the original HW1 and HW2 until recently, but now that I'm playing the HW1 remaster I realize how much of a difference it makes.

Luckily, before booting up the remaster I decided to play a couple missions of the OG Homeworld for maximum visual appreciation (got damn does the remaster look good), so once I jumped into the remaster I could easily tell it wasn't the same game. My fighters were falling like flies to the Turanic raiders, combat just didn't feel the same, I can't even properly guard a moving salvage corvette with the way formations work now.

I'm glad they included the original versions of the games. But honestly, I am very disappointed that they didn't just uprez the original HW, maybe add some new effects and such, and release it as it was. I'm pretty confident that patches won't fix this to my satisfaction, as the game is just not on the engine it should be. Here's hoping Gearbox may hear my cries and just release the OG version of Homeworld with higher resolution visuals and audio or something.
 

Lime

Member
Thinking back, I easily recall how my initial experience with Homeworld 1 was. It was a rainy, grey day and I was looking for a game to play back in 1999 so I looked up on Gamespot on my 56k modem and saw they had rated this game called “Homeworld” a 9.0. I figured the game must be really great to get such a high score, so I took the money that I had scrapped together and got a ride to the store to get that nice, big box they used to do for PC games at the time. I remember waiting in the car for my brother while the box in my hand and reading the manual while the rain was splashing on the car windows. I think I spend my time reading the entire manual before even installing the game while I immersed myself in the lore, reading up on the different Kiiths, the story of Kharak, and the different ship categories, Karen S’jet, and them finding the Guide Stone. So when I finally installed and booted up Homeworld and saw that intro cinematic and the mothership launch I felt like I was coming from the same point of reference as the civilization’s exodus to their homeworld (I had (thankfully) never seen Platoon at the time so it was also the first time I heard Agnus Dei). Since then I’ve always been about the Homeworld series, with Cataclysm and Homeworld 2. Cataclysm felt different and fresh (I remember people talking about whether it should count as a standalone title or an expansion, because the latter was much more prevalent than the former), while Homeworld 2 had a more streamlined design that unfortunately suffered from publisher meddling with Relic, so the experience ended up feeling more disjointed, calculated and rushed (it’s still a great game, it just isn’t as cohesive as the first one).

Since the rise of digital distribution around 2005 or 6, I've been clamoring for a digital release of Homeworld 1 and 2 (and Cataclysm) for what feels like forever. With Sierra going down many years ago and the games industry contracting by dumping the RTS genre and moving to console development, as well as Relic becoming a Games Workshop studio, I was seriously beyond despair in terms of thinking the series would be lost to time through lack of both exposure and availability.

When some inklings of THQ secretly acquiring the Homeworld license surfaced, my heart skipped a beat. But after much silence and little to no action in regards to doing anything with the license besides sitting on it, I felt once more that Homeworld would fade into obscurity (these were the hardest times, knowing that Relic and THQ did absolutely nothing with the old games). Then THQ went down under and I remember being excited about anyone acquiring the HW license (even some amateur programmer wanted to buy it with crowdfunded money). Then Gearbox bought it and I figured I might as well kick back and wait to see what they did with the license - I was already accustomed to the series being left alone and even forgotten by its original developers, so my expectations were already low.

But looking at this whole process, Gearbox really did an admirable job with respecting the series and its legacy, although with their own design flaws here and there as it stands right now (it’ll hopefully get patched a lot). They paid a lot of money just to get the license, then they got in touch with ex-Relic members who worked on Relic, then they decided to overhaul the engine, repaint the textures faithful to the art style, re-do the multiplayer section of both games, redo all the cinematics, help Rob Cunningham’s (Blackbird Interactive) Shipbreakers, release a large collector’s edition for long-time fans, get Paul Ruskay on board to remaster the entire audio side of both games (and holy shit what a great job he’s done), help publish a hardcover artbook, and even hand out extra keys to people who had to wait for their collector’s edition to arrive. I think this Remastered collection is a really great one all things considered. It could have been a lot worse and consider the things that were actually improved.
 

twobear

sputum-flecked apoplexy
I'm not having any problems guarding salvage corvettes, I've managed to at least start dragging everything back to the mothership; the issue I have is that because ships that are being dragged still count as enemies, my fleet has blown half of them up before I can get them back to the mothership.
 

Tenrius

Member
So, any widescreen/UI scaling mods for Homeworld Classic? I seem to remember setting it up somehow on my old computer, but can't find anything on it now (because the Google search results are cluttered with the remaster lol).
 

DBT85

Member
I hate to be that guy, but I can't play the HW1 remaster. Personally, I think it is a bit misleading to call it a remaster, because it is a remake. It was never a secret that they were porting HW1 to the HW2 engine, but I guess I didn't think it would end up being such a different game. As soon as things got rolling on the tutorial I noticed it wasn't the same. I wasn't aware of the ballistics vs. RNG situation between the original HW1 and HW2 until recently, but now that I'm playing the HW1 remaster I realize how much of a difference it makes.

Luckily, before booting up the remaster I decided to play a couple missions of the OG Homeworld for maximum visual appreciation (got damn does the remaster look good), so once I jumped into the remaster I could easily tell it wasn't the same game. My fighters were falling like flies to the Turanic raiders, combat just didn't feel the same, I can't even properly guard a moving salvage corvette with the way formations work now.

I'm glad they included the original versions of the games. But honestly, I am very disappointed that they didn't just uprez the original HW, maybe add some new effects and such, and release it as it was. I'm pretty confident that patches won't fix this to my satisfaction, as the game is just not on the engine it should be. Here's hoping Gearbox may hear my cries and just release the OG version of Homeworld with higher resolution visuals and audio or something.

The whole point of the port to the HW2 engine was because the HW1 engine is antiquated. the HW2 engine despite being over 12 years old still has the basics of a modern engine so they could do all the stuff they did visually with it.

The question remains as to whether they'll stick by the product and work to fix things or not.
 
I hate how the missions are so trial-and-error. I'm at mission 6 I think. The one where you have to navigate through the astroid belt,

Can you see the asteroids from the tactical map? I might be getting mixed up with HW: Cataclysm but I remember using the map to dodge incoming asteroid streams.
 

Falk

that puzzling face
So, there's either a bug or an extremely stupid change to Karos Graveyard

Basically this mission used to have a trick to it, which was that you could build a gravwell generator to destroy the Dawg when it came to steal a ship, because it counted as a corvette and would be disabled.

Only now, when I activated the gravwell and told my capital ships to attack the dawg, their accuracy was abysmal. I mean, broken. Heavy Cruisers were firing their main ion cannons like, 90 degrees in the wrong direction directly into empty space.

I wonder if this is how they 'fixed' this mission, by making your % to hit the Dawg so low rather than making it tougher to destroy. In any case it was beyond stupid watching my Destroyers and Heavy Cruisers discharge their ion cannons in random directions.

This sounds hilarious.

"What the heck are you doing?"

"sry wrong button captain"
 
The whole point of the port to the HW2 engine was because the HW1 engine is antiquated. the HW2 engine despite being over 12 years old still has the basics of a modern engine so they could do all the stuff they did visually with it.

The question remains as to whether they'll stick by the product and work to fix things or not.

That makes sense. But like I said, it was an excellent choice to include the original games for anyone who'd rather just play them as they were. Much respect for that.
 

mantidor

Member
oh the karos graveyard... can't wait to try my cheating mechanics that I used back then.


So the first time I enter dwag takes my freaking carrier, pissed I restart the mission, deploy cloacked fighters, and no way, the place is filled with proximity sensors... so I take my cloaked fighters and make them surround the entire graveyard, just outside, then enter where that thing was, at the end of graveyard.
 
So, any widescreen/UI scaling mods for Homeworld Classic? I seem to remember setting it up somehow on my old computer, but can't find anything on it now (because the Google search results are cluttered with the remaster lol).
I asked the same question, along with any texture packs or graphics mods. Inquiring minds want to know!

Edit: Joined the Steam group as well now that it's public.
 
oh the karos graveyard... can't wait to try my cheating mechanics that I used back then.


So the first time I enter dwag takes my freaking carrier, pissed I restart the mission, deploy cloacked fighters, and no way, the place is filled with proximity sensors... so I take my cloaked fighters and make them surround the entire graveyard, just outside, then enter where that thing was, at the end of graveyard.

Holy shit this is exactly what I did. How do I remember that?!
 

Lime

Member
So, any widescreen/UI scaling mods for Homeworld Classic? I seem to remember setting it up somehow on my old computer, but can't find anything on it now (because the Google search results are cluttered with the remaster lol).

I asked the same question, along with any texture packs or graphics mods. Inquiring minds want to know!

Except for the REGEDIT to get custom resolutions (widescreen even), then no. No mods.
 

Lime

Member
Strange. They form it right on mine....and it also says the name of each formation when I click/command it.

I need to quote this again, because this still isn't true for me. The pilots do not say the name of the formations that they're forming. Anyone else experiencing the same or am I just going crazy?
 

mantidor

Member
I need to quote this again, because this still isn't true for me. The pilots do not say the name of the formations that they're forming. Anyone else experiencing the same or am I just going crazy?

You are going crazy heh

It's important to remember this only happens when the ships are doing nothing, in the middle of battle changing formations does nothing.
 

Elandyll

Banned
After a very scary BSOD during the update of my Laptop's graphic drivers, the operation ended at 10pm last night with a surprising success (I was already picturing myself going all the way back to the Manufacturer drivers)...

And the Game is now working without problems (so far)... :)

It's good to be back ... (only had the time for the first 2 missions before having to hit the sack).
 

Portman

Member
After hearing about the issues with the first game in remastered form I am tempted to suggest to my friend that he switch over to classic. He got to the asteroids last night and seemed to be having issues so I'm hoping I can get to him before he puts a lot of time into it.

I was wondering what the Karos Graveyard was going to be like in the remaster after hearing about the other oddities in the game. After reading all of the reports I'm going to keep playing through the 2nd game for now both to finish it again (haven't recently) and to give Gearbox a chance to acknowledge or work on some of the issues. Then I'll try the remaster out but can always switch over to classic (or dig out my discs if that version has issues too).
 

red731

Member
Finished tutorial and first mission ;_;
That was beautiful.

Can't wait to play more tomorrow.

Like the younger times. Fuckin. Homeworld.
 

Lime

Member
Seriously. I'm in awe. I've already spent two hours just screenshotting the first one and a half mission. It's so pretty. They did a bang-up job with the presentation, that's for sure.

244160_2015-02-27_005ryu39.png
244160_2015-02-27_0052ou6e.png
244160_2015-02-27_005lgudj.png
244160_2015-02-27_005i5u0h.png
 

twobear

sputum-flecked apoplexy
After hearing about the issues with the first game in remastered form I am tempted to suggest to my friend that he switch over to classic. He got to the asteroids last night and seemed to be having issues so I'm hoping I can get to him before he puts a lot of time into it.

I was wondering what the Karos Graveyard was going to be like in the remaster after hearing about the other oddities in the game. After reading all of the reports I'm going to keep playing through the 2nd game for now both to finish it again (haven't recently) and to give Gearbox a chance to acknowledge or work on some of the issues. Then I'll try the remaster out but can always switch over to classic (or dig out my discs if that version has issues too).

To be fair the asteroids mission is a kick in the teeth for new players anyway. I think I had to go back two entire missions to be ready to face that level when I got to it the first time I played through Homeworld.

It's the mission that 'sets you up' for the rest of the game and gives you an idea of how you have to manage your force from mission to mission.
 
This is not how you do a sphere formation, Gearbox:
244160_2015-02-27_000emu3n.png


This is:
homeworld_2015_02_27_xfug2.png


It seemed like they've either had problems with implementing the same features in Homeworld 2's engine or they simply released the product because they wanted to get it out the door.

Having the audio for the formations is missing as well (Pilots saying "Claw formation" and so on).

I hope it gets fixed in the patch.

... How are you guys getting these widescreen shots of OG Homeworld?
 

Lime

Member
... How are you guys getting these widescreen shots of OG Homeworld?

Same procedure as the original release:

Classic Homeworld 1 wasn't working out of the box, at least for me.
Laggy mouse and messed up resolution.

Some fixes that get it working in widescreen mode:

Fixing mouse lag:
1. Navigate to Program Files (x86)\Steam\SteamApps\common\Homeworld\Homeworld1Classic\exe
2. Right click Homeworld.exe
3. Click the Compatibility tab
4. Set compatibility mode on Windows 98
5. Launch game directly

Fixing the resolution and bit depth for widescreen:
1. Open Regedit.exe
2. Navigate to HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Sierra On-Line\Homeworld
3. Edit screenWidth and screenHeight to your desired resolution (edit them in Decimal format)
4. Edit screenDepth to 32 (once again, Decimal format)
Launch the game.

Unfortunately this seems to break Classic's ability to launch from the launcher application, but it works fine launched directly.

AA override also works.
 
Same procedure as the original release:



AA override also works.

Cool! I'll give that a shot this weekend. My monitor is 1650x1080, is it known to work at that ratio?

And I assume you mean anti-aliasing override. How does that work? Thanks for the help!
 

Lime

Member
Cool! I'll give that a shot this weekend. My monitor is 1650x1080, is it known to work at that ratio?

And I assume you mean anti-aliasing override. How does that work? Thanks for the help!

Yeah it automatically scales to whatever aspect ratio you are using with your desired resolution.

Yeah, I meant anti-aliasing override. I use AMD and SSAA override works fine for me. Not sure about Nvidia, but I would definitely guess it also worked (the game can either be in Direct3D or OpenGL depending on which device you choose for rendering in the options menu or the regedit).
 

buffelo

Neo Member
Man, as much as I love the look of HW Remastered I can't help but feel pretty disappointed. I heard that they were porting HW 1 in the HW 2 engine for the "remaster" about a week ago and I immediately felt a sense of dread. I probably should have trusted my gut but I went ahead and bought it anyway after most reviewers praised the new game. I guess I'll just play classic for now, and hopefully Gearbox will patch some of this formation stuff that isn't working and some of the balancing issues. I really want to believe that this whole project wasn't a cynical cash-grab by Gearbox due to the care put into the visuals but it's like the game was never play-tested before launch.
 

Lime

Member
I really want to believe that this whole project wasn't a cynical cash-grab by Gearbox due to the care put into the visuals but it's like the game was never play-tested before launch.

I think we have plenty of evidence that this isn't simply a cash grab. Much care has put been put into the remaster on the presentation side. I definitely agree that the bugs and warts are cause for worry and criticism, but hopefully they'll patch it later (they pretty much have to fix the multiplayer beta, so people are definitely allocated to the project). It's good that people speak up about the design deficiencies and bugs of this remaster, hopefully Gearbox will do something about it (I just wouldn't call it a cash grab judging from all the things they've done).

On a sidenote, the two frigates in mission 3 didn't even attack my salvage corvettes. That was an underwhelming rescue compared to the original one where they are really aggressive against any salvage operation.
 

Avalt

Member
Mission 14 in HW1Remaster has a serious bug. Destroying your main objective(s) does not give you your mission credit. No way of getting to mission 15. (I even destroyed the 50 frigates that are in the sphere formation, I feel like I wasted half a day on this crap...)

You would think they would at least test the main objectives in the campaign. I don't care for small bugs/inconveniences in games, but when you literally can't progress... that just pisses me off.

Good thing I saved right before attacking the objective, will wait for the patch.
 

Giolon

Member
I think we have plenty of evidence that this isn't simply a cash grab. Much care has put been put into the remaster on the presentation side. I definitely agree that the bugs and warts are cause for worry and criticism, but hopefully they'll patch it later (they pretty much have to fix the multiplayer beta, so people are definitely allocated to the project). It's good that people speak up about the design deficiencies and bugs of this remaster, hopefully Gearbox will do something about it (I just wouldn't call it a cash grab judging from all the things they've done).

On a sidenote, the two frigates in mission 3 didn't even attack my salvage corvettes. That was an underwhelming rescue compared to the original one where they are really aggressive against any salvage operation.

Oh in Mission 4 or 5 when Destroyers first show up, they went whole hog after my Salvage corvettes. I had to have a fleet of Repair corvettes repair them as they were hauling enemy ships away. XD

And I agree w/ Lime that this isn't a cynical cash grab. Gearbox themselves didn't even do these remasters - they hired many folks from the original Homeworld teams to work on them. They posted a blog early in the week about some of the differences that arose from the change in engines (that was announced some time ago) like no more fuel, or rebalancing resource availability for research repair costs. Their community manager today made a post acknowledging the issues people were having, and also indicating that crash bugs were their #1 priority, followed by listening to feedback on how to improve things and directing people how and where to send that feedback.

There's definitely a vocal set of folks incredibly disappointed that HW1R isn't exactly the same as HW1C. For me, I'm fine that it's not 100% the same. Sure it's frustrating that some gameplay aspects aren't working properly (grrr....Sphere attack formations), but I think most of the other, intentional changes are improvements. The original version is still there for those who don't like the Remaster and available to easily purchase for the first time in over a decade. Sure you can argue that you shouldn't have to pay for the whole kit 'n caboodle, and hopefully they'll release the games standalone. I don't think that you can argue that $35 for two of the most unique, best RTS games out there including both their original and updated versions is a value - especially when tracking down original copies of the games is going to run you about $20-$40 each.

The biggest shame to me is that Cataclysm's source code and assets have apparently been lost, thus causing its omission from the collection.
 
Having not played HW when it came out it's kind of crazy to think that this game came out the same year as AOE 2. AOE 2 is a classic and I love it to death but AOE 2 and Homeworld feel like games from two different eras.
 
The biggest shame to me is that Cataclysm's source code and assets have apparently been lost, thus causing its omission from the collection.

I'm sure the HW2 engine could do a decent version of Cataclysm if you had a team being paid to do it instead of individual modders picking it up on and off.

Having not played HW when it came out it's kind of crazy to think that this game came out the same year as AOE 2. AOE 2 is a classic and I love it to death but AOE 2 and Homeworld feel like games from two different eras.

Seriously. When this game came out it was absolutely stunning and hugely ahead of its time. What's so strange is that nobody's done a 3D space RTS that even comes close to it since (discounting its sequels).
 

Tenrius

Member
I'm sure the HW2 engine could do a decent version of Cataclysm if you had a team being paid to do it instead of individual modders picking it up on and off.



Seriously. When this game came out it was absolutely stunning and hugely ahead of its time. What's so strange is that nobody's done a 3D space RTS that even comes close to it since (discounting its sequels).

Star Wolves came pretty close.
 
Mission 14 in HW1Remaster has a serious bug. Destroying your main objective(s) does not give you your mission credit. No way of getting to mission 15. (I even destroyed the 50 frigates that are in the sphere formation, I feel like I wasted half a day on this crap...)

You would think they would at least test the main objectives in the campaign. I don't care for small bugs/inconveniences in games, but when you literally can't progresses... that just pisses me off.

Good thing I saved right before attacking the objective, will wait for the patch.

Strange, I finished the campaign yesterday and didn't have any trouble with that mission.
Once I destroyed all the parts of the array it let me hyperspace out. Left pretty much all the ion frigates alone.
 

ultron87

Member
If I wasn't able to buy the Drone Tech the first time the Bentusi offered it can I buy it later on? I reaalllllly don't want to do this asteroid mission again. Because it sucks and isn't fun.

Would've had enough money too if my harvesters didn't inexplicably stop collecting.
 

A-V-B

Member
The whole point of the port to the HW2 engine was because the HW1 engine is antiquated. the HW2 engine despite being over 12 years old still has the basics of a modern engine so they could do all the stuff they did visually with it.

The question remains as to whether they'll stick by the product and work to fix things or not.

They can't fix fundamental engine conflicts. They won't fix it. They won't spend the resources. They went in cheap on gameplay, they're going to maintain it cheap, and anyone looking for restored HW1 features is probably holding onto a fool's dream because they just don't have the time or money. They might fix some bugs they've uniquely introduced, but beyond that? Yeah. This is a holdover until the actual sequel comes out where they use the visual tricks they learned here.

If you didn't like HW2, too bad, eh.
 

buffelo

Neo Member
Their community manager today made a post acknowledging the issues people were having, and also indicating that crash bugs were their #1 priority, followed by listening to feedback on how to improve things and directing people how and where to send that feedback.

Thanks for posting this. I feel a lot more confident in the dev team knowing that they are listening to feedback and working on getting patches out. In the meantime I think I just need to relax a bit about the state of the game and enjoy it for what it is and not what I thought it might be.
 

Lime

Member
Regarding Homeworld Cataclysm and a possible remastering, check out this recent Twitch interview with two of the guys from Barking Dog Studios about Cataclysm and the time back then in the late 90's:

Found a video stream/interview about Cataclysm. The interviewee's aren't necessarily very popular these days, given SotS2. So of course I'm referring to Martin and Chris from Kerberos, formerly of the Homeworld and Cataclysm dev teams.

They go all over the place in the first hour. Important spans were the first 15 minutes and around the 40 minute area. I stopped halfway (it's 2 hours long). Don't focus too much on the Cata game in the background; I screamed silently every time I watched them play, *shudder*.

Of particular note, is the commentary about Cata not appearing in the Remaster. They don't think the lack of source code is the issue if the idea is to remaster it. The old engine isn't useful there. It's more likely that Gearbox are testing the waters and limiting their risk.

(from the Relicnews forum)

The interview has some really nice stories about developing Cataclysm and late-stage work. It's also pretty telling hearing how business-minded and cold Sierra was back then.
 

Jinroh

Member
At the beginning of hw1r mission 3 I captured 5 of the ships that were attacking the cryo pods at the beginning, but they then never showed up in my fleet. Does anyone else had a similar issue?
 
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