Callo Merlose
Banned
The whole "just following orders thing" isn't originally from X-Men. It was a common defense during the Nuremberg trials. I think his organs should be harvested and kept alive in some kind of coma to be a blood donor.
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World War II war criminal emerges in Minnesota
- Thread starter Angelus Errare
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The whole "just following orders thing" isn't originally from X-Men. It was a common defense during the Nuremberg trials. I think his organs should be harvested and kept alive in some kind of coma to be a blood donor.
Angelus Errare
Banned
So let's pretend you're married and someone brutally slays your wife and kids and they weren't found until 51 years later...you'd be fine with him not being brought to justice for his actions because of an "expiration date"?
Punishment of an individual is irrelevant. The lesson we must ALWAYS teach ourselves is literally NEVER FORGET.
That is why that phrase is a mantra. Because of the guy you think should be allowed to relax in a retirement home. And forgotten.
NEVER FUCKING FORGET.
That is the entire point.
Fuuuuuuuuuu
I'm out. This is literally insane.
And how many people on Gaf posted about the Armenian Genocide on April 24?
Did you? I was one of the few people continually bumping that thread so it could gain traction.
Don't get all up in arms out of principle. Everyone here has chosen to forget things.
ymoc
Member
Say what?
RunWhiteBoyRun
Member
But some people in this thread seem to want to forgive and forget. There is not an expiration date on shit.
Callo Merlose
Banned
We can draw some good out of him. Spare the anesthetics!
Worst first post ever.
Lamel
Banned
Exterminieren
Banned
Are you people insane?
I don't care if the guy is old, he still stands accused of atrocities. Enough time has been wasted, and we owe it to the people who died because of him to make him answer for his crimes.
I don't care if the guy is old, he still stands accused of atrocities. Enough time has been wasted, and we owe it to the people who died because of him to make him answer for his crimes.
This thread is about WWII.
Your goal posts are made of strawman and you're an entire world war off the subject.
Has anyone in this thread belittled the Armenian genocide? Has anyone here suggested we let bygones be bygones about a completely unrelated incident? Because you are inferring its OK to dismiss a far greater, far more recent loss of human life.
Maninthemirror
Banned
Conflicting stories
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/14/michaelkarcok-revelations-nazi-leader-minneapolis_n_3443784.html
so which is it? the OP or this?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/14/michaelkarcok-revelations-nazi-leader-minneapolis_n_3443784.html
so which is it? the OP or this?
Maybe it's too late for throwing him in jail, but never too find him guilty.
childplease
Banned
Guy was just following orders.
One has to remember the victor always writes history.
Had we lost ww2 the people who decided to nuke Japan would have been labeled war criminals also.
One has to remember the victor always writes history.
Had we lost ww2 the people who decided to nuke Japan would have been labeled war criminals also.
I'm with you on this one, Frankie.
So recency has something to do with it, then?
Well, in my point of view it's not recent enough. World War 2 was 70 years ago. The man is near death. Any attempt to exact justice now would just be petty.
You don't know this. You have no idea how he personally felt about any of the orders he was given to carry out. Disobeying direct orders wasn't treated too favourably in the Nazi regime I would imagine. That's not to take away the idea of personal responsibility...but I hate the fact that everyone thinks it would be just so simple black and white, refuse the orders and walk away and go get a cup of tea back at your house.
How is it petty? What makes bringing this man to justice any different from bring any other criminal to justice?
Callo Merlose
Banned
I honestly see where you're coming from, but an example has to be made. It might seem petty, but it's necessary. He's gotta pay.
No kidding. People say that and the first thought is "Well, not for everything, right?"
But here we are. Nazi War Criminal Defense Force.
We have to think about the message we're giving other people who have committed appalling acts of evil. "You're free if you manage to get away with it after X years!" is clearly not the right message.
Karsticles
Member
What does forgetting have to do with hurting someone? I know what he did, I just don't see the point in hurting him for it.
If someone is a rapist, it makes some kind of sense to put that person on trial so that he/she can't continue to hurt people. That's the point of prison, in my opinion. This guy is not going to do anything, so why would we go out of our way to hurt him now? What is it helping? Especially since you don't know what he has been through. Does he regret his actions, etc.?
F0rneus
Tears in the rain
I think my post is easy enough to understand, no? I think we can all understand and judge that the Nazis did through WWII but no, I don't think I can fully measure the impact, as a Jewish person can. My people never underwent genocide, so I don't think my understanding of the matter is the same as Jewish people. But let's not derail the thread shall we? Let's just celebrate the unmasking of a war criminal. Or let's lament the persecution of an old man if that's your POV.
Well, then I'd say you have a very different conception of justice than the prevailing view. The definition of justice is to give each their due. Hence, crime is inherently tied to punishment—but I don't think there's anything wrong with that. That's the very purpose of justice. You commit a "wrong" action, then society punishes you because you are due a corresponding negative consequence.
And in this case, there is no statute of limitations (I can only speak on the US at least) on heinous crimes like murder so I certainly don't see a problem with some kind of trial/punishment for this man.
Whoosh. I brought up the time difference because YOU are suggesting that there is some expiry date on the reperussions of evil.
You guys want to bring justice against a 24 year old war criminal who doesn't exist anymore. In his place is a frail man who probably wears Depends because he can't tell when he needs to go anymore. Label him a war criminal. Put a sign in front of his house that marks him for who he is. But leave him be.
I'm being realistic.
Falcs
Banned
Punishment. You commit a crime, you should be punished. Doesn't matter how old you are.
So what. By this logic, a man dieing of cancer who goes on a shooting spree when he has 5weeks to live should be let free.
Fuck that.
I say punish the old bastard.
This guy should definitely be investigated and tried. Otherwise other war criminals will think it's fine to commit their crimes as long as they can hide until they reach an old and infirm age.
War criminals should live with the paranoia that they can be caught one day no matter how far into the future. Josef Mengele was never caught but he lived a notoriously paranoid life because of the fear that he would be caught; that paranoia at least caused him some discomfort.
War criminals should live with the paranoia that they can be caught one day no matter how far into the future. Josef Mengele was never caught but he lived a notoriously paranoid life because of the fear that he would be caught; that paranoia at least caused him some discomfort.
He doesn't exist anymore? Bullshit. He's the same guy, except he didn't pay for his crimes the first time around. Hell, he should be delighted he got to live a full (presumably fulfilling) life before he pays for them this time around. I don't care if he's forgiven himself or it torments him at night; he has a duty to society (in this case, the world society) that has yet to be fulfilled.
Megalosaro
Banned
War crime tribunals always were and always have been a joke. Let him be. What's done is done.
I cant believe what i am reading. I hope all you guys saying this bullshit are 14. You have to be.
Haha, wow. This is amazing.
Foreign Jackass
Member
"Find this guy and lynch him!" says the crowd of Americans caring about a war's atrocities that went on about 70 years ago while letting their own army decimate people everyday in foreign countries.
You gotta admire this nation's capacity for self-delusion. Seriously, there's barely anyone alive who suffered through World War 2, isn't it time to focus on humanity's current atrocities instead of dwelling on memories?
You gotta admire this nation's capacity for self-delusion. Seriously, there's barely anyone alive who suffered through World War 2, isn't it time to focus on humanity's current atrocities instead of dwelling on memories?
Klendathu Club Owner
Member
I have to say that the opinions of some people in here disgust me.
Yup, there shouldn't be an expiration date for doing things like this:
Let's not forget that not only Jewish people were persecuted and murdered during the Nazi occupation of Europe.
Yup, sure seems like a frail man.
Yup, there shouldn't be an expiration date for doing things like this:
F0rneus said:
Let's not forget that not only Jewish people were persecuted and murdered during the Nazi occupation of Europe.
Bombadil said:
Yup, sure seems like a frail man.
That would explain a lot.
F0rneus
Tears in the rain
That is a very good point. Apologies.
Good reasoning. Maybe we should free some murderers because its not like they're going to kill the same person again is it?
Some people dont deserve to walk the earth and have human rights. Thats what prison is for.
Jack Scofield
Member
Idiot-GAF out in full force today.
soundscream
Member
This fucking thread.
The two aren't mutually exclusive.
Letting him get away with this sends a message that genocide is okay as long as you can evade authorities long enough.
WeaponJohnnyX
Member
There is no justice, only revenge.
Indrid Cold1
Member
This is the most chilling thread I've ever read. A defence force assembling and calling for a nazi war criminal to be let off for crimes against humanity just cause he's old. The thought of how many idiots like yourselves out there who are most assuredly not learning from history and forgetting what the nazis actually did to people is frankly terrifying. And there is even a post throwing up the "he was probably just following orders" excuse! No words.
Ah yes the Nuremberg Defence, So I imagine every Nazi besides Hitler were just following the Fuhrer's orders then?
There is also heavy debate that Truman and other should be branded war criminals for the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
Why hasn't the guy who murdered a dozen civilians in Afghanistan not being executed? Why hasn't the countless dictators backed by the US who massacre and continue to massacre their civilians not being brought to justice and executed?
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