lastflowers
Banned
That's... not true i hope?
If so, wow. that's just the saddest thing I've ever seen.
That's... not true i hope?
It's very frequent I have to ask questions of others and bring the answers back. I did the same thing here - went to an expert, got an answer, and brought it back.
People don't like the answer, cool, and I have absolutely no problem with questioning my specific answers or calling them into debate. That's part of the deal on here.
It's somewhat bothersome when people think you're out to just lie or fud or make it a personal thing.
Gamers buy games, the only way any console is getting into my home is if it has games I want to play. You'll find most people who exist outside the gaming entusiast bubble feel the sake way.
By the way, given that everything else in that leaked Microsoft documentation turned out to be true, it seems the focus is very services heavy and that the Fortezella or whatever they're called augmented reality glasses will be coming sometime next year. Guess they might announce it at E3 next year, unless they've now delayed it.
Xbox One GPU:
768 GCN shader cores with 853MHz
48 TMUs
16 ROPs
1.31 TFLOPS
40.9 GTex/s
13.6 GPix/s
8GB DDR3 with 68GB/s + eSRAM voodoo
2 compute command processors
something between 2 and 16 parallel compute queues
GPU cache bypass: no
PS4 GPU:
1152 GCN shader cores with 800MHz
72 TMUs
32 ROPs
1.84 TFLOPS
57.6 GTex/s
25.6 GPix/s
8GB GDDR5 with 176GB/s
8 compute command processors
64 parallel compute queues
GPU cache bypass: yes
I was getting a bunch of people asking about it, so just wanted to put it to rest.
Partly from the Hotchips slides from a few weeks ago.
As a note, they didn't cover the entire SoC at Hotchips either, just the overview really. Not trying to tinfoil hat anything though.
unfortunately, now over on the misterX blog they are spinning your comment as confirmation of a FIRST dGPU, and denial of a THIRD overall GPU...
they are looking at it as
APU (CPU+GPU) + discreet GPU (in the 3+Tflop range)
they are actually saying your comment confirms that ^^^ you just denied the existence of a SECOND discreet GPU
Albert, thanks for coming on this board, and especially for continuing to post in the face of some pretty outlandish vitriol. Seeing you and Larry do this outreach here on your own time is really great.
Sure he can also be talking about 3 titans in a single machine. Hell he might even have prototype next gen cards .
But I he never mentioned that did he. He only mentions the two consoles and thus he is only comparing the two.
The two are very close . Its the only way to actually read those comments from carmack unless you have an agenda and you introduce things into his words that aren't there.
Yeah I made a mistake: I meant one GCN CU and not two. ^_^
It's easy math:
One GCN CU = 64 shader cores
64 shader cores x 800MHz x 2 FLOPS = 102.4 GFLOPS
8 Jaguar cores x 1600MHz x 8 FLOPS = 102.4 GFLOPS
PS4 has 18 GCN CUs, by the way.
No sorry that shit doesn't fly. You can't say Sony has the better developers, the more powerful console by 50% and it's clearly the easier console to develop for and then turn around and call launch game comparisons a trap. That's bull shit pure and simple.
go read it for yourself lol...just google misterXmediaThat's... not true i hope?
I just read that blog...man, that's some different kind of crazy.
No. PS4 is significantly optimized for maximum GPGPU performance. Devs will unload many compute jobs to the powerful GPU. To put that into perspective: Using two GCN CUs for GPGPU is like adding a second 8-core Jaguar to the PS4 system.
Sony also designed the PS4 with a technique called "asynchronous fine-grain compute" in mind which allows devs to use the compute grunt without a penalty for graphics performance. To do that you split your compute load into as many smaller jobs as possible and "feed" it to your shader cores when they are underutilized during rendering tasks.
No sorry that shit doesn't fly. You can't say Sony has the better developers, the more powerful console by 50% and it's clearly the easier console to develop for and then turn around and call launch game comparisons a trap. That's bull shit pure and simple.
I have both consoles at home and bought/buy games for 360 because they usually look better and perform better than on the PS3. I'll end up buying both next gen consoles due to the exclusive games but if the games look somewhat better on PS4, then that's my gaming platform of choice. And that company will get my money in terms of games, online service, accessoires and so on.
Surely, the performance of a console ranks behind things like price and (launch) games for the majority of people but it *is* and *will* be an issue for MS.
It's a better balance to be heavier on the GPU specs, as it's more important for games performance. PS4 has this, X1 doesn't. That's reality, stop accusing people of being delusional, it's rude.You do know that flops are not the only thing a cpu does. Cu's are good at somethings and cpu's are good at other things.
Cu's are not going to make up for a lack of cpu power because if that was the case they would have removed cpu's a long time ago and just made chips of Cu's .
Even today you need fast cpus to drive games that use Cu's for physics .
If cu's were so great why did sony even put in an 8 core jaguar cpu. Why not use that space for more Cu's ...
I know a lot of neogaf really wants sony to be great but some of you guys need to come back to reality.
I wouldn't say that because even though the GPGPU is able to do fine-grain general purpose computing it's still not a CPU so it's going to do some things better & something worse.
go read it for yourself lol...just google misterXmedia
sure is
To be fair to Microsoft, you can't really expect their PR to be like, "Yeah, we done fucked up. There's a 40% difference here, you guys. Did you hear me?? Forty fucking percent! Where's my whiskey bottle?"
It's a better balance to be heavier on the GPU specs, as it's more important for games performance. PS4 has this, X1 doesn't. That's reality.
Joking about what exactly?
Compelling software is the issue. Infamous Second Son comes out about the same time as Titanfall. Second Son is clearly the better looking of the two games but to me it's also clearly the less compelling of the two games. Can I see myself playing Titanfall a year after release? Certainly. Infamous? That's a game that has very short legs, so no.
Graphical fidelity means a lot but there's a point where compelling gameplay determines what it means to be a great game.
This is the kind of stuff I was talking about! This is what they need to be emphasizing instead of these lame attempts to muddy the water. I dont even know who they are trying to sway with specs, dont they see the results of these threads? Every Time they make a comment like this, people bring out the lists and the x1 starts to look weak. Reading these kind of threads only makes people more certain of the power gap.
Damn. When you lay it all out like that..
GPUs are much better at tasks that can utilize the massively parallel arithmetic power of many shader cores. CPUs are much better at taks that utilize single-threaded performance with branch prediction.
If you unload the former to your GPU, your CPU will automatically have more time to do the latter. ^_^
True, and FPS is just one quality measurement. If one game is scaled from 480p to 1080p, but runs at a higher frame rate, what does that tell you?That's a bit of a loaded question. Single digit difference can mean many things. It can mean a difference between 59 and 60FPS, which is indeed nothing, or it could mean a difference between 21FPS and 30FPS, which is literally huge, and equals the 40-50%.
Titanfall is coming out in February!? That game is also competing against Destiny not Infamous. They are different genre and different gamers buy those games for different reasons.
Compelling software is the issue. Infamous Second Son comes out about the same time as Titanfall. Second Son is clearly the better looking of the two games but to me it's also clearly the less compelling of the two games. Can I see myself playing Titanfall a year after release? Certainly. Infamous? That's a game that has very short legs, so no.
Graphical fidelity means a lot but there's a point where compelling gameplay determines what it means to be a great game.
Sure. What would you rather have . A radeon 7790 with a i7 or Sli titan with an i3 for your gaming needs ?
now note , i'm not saying these are the diffrences between the systems , just pointing out how silly what you said is .
That comparison doesn't really make sense. I prefer the singleplayer experience of inFamous over the multiplayer experience of Titanfall, regardless of graphics.
If a multiplat title like NFS looks better on one console than the other, as has been indicated by a dev and this continues to be a trend for other games as well, then the PS4 will be where I'm going to play my multiplat games in the future.
what system did you play your multiplat games last gen ?
Those two examples are irrelevant and a false equivalent to PS4/X1 specs.
I thought these "PS4's CPU is a bottleneck" fallacies have been torn apart dozens of times by now?
what system did you play your multiplat games last gen ?
They could have stayed silent.
When I say people I just mean people in general. Just become some threads on the internet is huge dont mean nothing. I see some people are making it a bigger problem than it is. You can state all the on paper facts and mathematics that you want but come launch day and if theres stuff looking way to close these "threads" will be funny in hindsight and will be laughing stock for next next gen.That people don't care.
Not how you could ever come to that conclusion given the length of this thread and the numerous other novel-sized threads that have come before on this forum and other gaming forums.
We need some tech wiz's to tear down Alberts post because he reiterated that mythical ESRAM number again.
Apparently Albert has Sony's specs too...lol.
You do know that flops are not the only thing a cpu does. Cu's are good at somethings and cpu's are good at other things.
Cu's are not going to make up for a lack of cpu power because if that was the case they would have removed cpu's a long time ago and just made chips of Cu's .
Even today you need fast cpus to drive games that use Cu's for physics .
If cu's were so great why did sony even put in an 8 core jaguar cpu. Why not use that space for more Cu's ...
Reading this thread made one thing clear to me. Somehow the events of this current generation has emotionally scarred a few people. They want revenge in the worst possible way. They want their King restored atop it's perch. And nothing can get in their way. Console wars is serious business folks.
Torn apart in the same way that people convinced them self that MS steam is anti consumer but Valve steam is great for consumers ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_equivalenceTorn apart in the same way that people convinced them self that MS steam is anti consumer but Valve steam is great for consumers ?
Torn apart the same way that the ps3 would be the graphical power house and the xbox 360 would look like xbox 1.5 next to it ? I remember that from 2005 /6 on these and other boards too.
The most obvious answer for lots of people == which ever console played them better.
Hence why all of this is so important to a lot of people.
When I say people I just mean people in general. Just become some threads on the internet is huge dont mean nothing. I see some people are making it a bigger problem than it is. You can state all the on paper facts and mathematics that you want but come launch day and if theres stuff looking way to close these "threads" will be funny in hindsight and will be laughing stock for next next gen.
People don't actually care about it . Those who wanted a ps3 last gen as their only system still did it dispite playing multi plats worse than the 360. Almost the same amount of people bought a ps3 as an xbox 360 dispite the 360 having the edge graphicly on multiplatform games.
All the arguing here about things the majority of the people on this forum don't even fully understand is just wasted key strokes. The vast majority of console buyers will buy what is postioned the best way or what is the same as they had last time.
the very fact that Microsoft's "Steam" forced you to check in daily or you had a $500 brick was anti-consumer....
People don't actually care about it . Those who wanted a ps3 last gen as their only system still did it dispite playing multi plats worse than the 360. Almost the same amount of people bought a ps3 as an xbox 360 dispite the 360 having the edge graphicly on multiplatform games.
All the arguing here about things the majority of the people on this forum don't even fully understand is just wasted key strokes. The vast majority of console buyers will buy what is postioned the best way or what is the same as they had last time.
And Steam doesn't allow me to sell my games while MS's steam would.
See how it works.
I don't think people are expecting severe differences come launch. It's a marathon not a race when it comes to these consoles.
It's already apparent in first party for sure. Killzone easily the best looking of the bunch and Infamous the best looking of the second-wave games.
How can you say people don't actually care about it?
There's been multiple people in this thread ALONE that said they bought the version that played best. Also see ANY digital foundry thread on this forum.
People VERY much care what system plays multiplats the best.
Why do you keep stating that the perfomance difference is greatly overstated? Is the ps4's Gpu and ram solution not better then X1? Unlike previous gens, the architecture is almost exactly similiar so how can such a large theoratical gap not make a difference? Have seen the machines back to back? Have you hands on stress reports? What is the basis for that statement?