Glorified G
Member
lol, forgot about that one. I don't get how people here crap on Arthur Gies and give Sessler get a pass.
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Adam Sessler's: On Xbox One and PS4's Resolutiongate, and Day One Patches
- Thread starter Tripon
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lol, forgot about that one. I don't get how people here crap on Arthur Gies and give Sessler get a pass.
That's the crux of the argument, isn't it?
The difference isn't worth talking about whatsoever, it's that inconsequential = crazy talk
The difference and the price make the PS4 the much better option = reasonable
The difference in price and power exist but I prefer the upcoming games on the Xbox One = reasonable
The difference and the price make the PS4 the only choice and you are crazy and doing every gamer a disservice by accepting lower power at a higher price = crazy talk
Wolves Evolve
Member
It is also so so so demeaning to tell people what they care about is not what they should care about. Say it's a minor issue but don't undercut their interest.
You know the worst thing though? Right now. all we have is footage and screenshots! Gee I wonder why people are picking over screen resolution more than normal? Could it be because they want to know whether to spend 500 bucks on a console and games right after the worst financial crisis to step on the middle class in 80 years is really going to deliver the entertainment they're after? Could it be that maybe - just maybe - picking over the details before a major non-essential expense is one of the few times people feel empowered to make choices at all? Could it be with a highly stratified industry with lots of multi-platform games, it provides a feeling of being informed, by immersing yourself in those details?
That we're not even at the stage where we can talk about console war culture constructively is hugely weird to me. We are enjoying the lead-up because of things like resolution details, not despite.
IAmRandom31
Banned
Hell this kind of talk goes all the way back to the hayday of the industry.
Remember the cartridges with 16-bits of data! plastered all over. " Speed Processing " commercials from Sega. 32,768 colors on 32X marketing. True 128-bit processing from the Atari Jaguar. List goes on and on. This generation it just happens to be " Native 1080p resolution vs. Upscaled 1080p resolution " and " 60fps vs. 30fps "
I can nearly guarantee at some point you will see the games resolution and fps on the front cover of the game.
This is nothing new. With how long he has been in the industry it amazes me he actually makes it sound like this type of thing is new. Gameplay mattering has never been a point that had to be made ... EVER. Each new generation comes talk of the new potential of that hardware graphically because THAT is the only new thing that comes with each generation! There is hardly ever that game breaking change in the dynamic of how we play our games to where it takes over the conversation in a new console launch ( Wii ) compared to how different the games look compared to the last generation.
Gameplay is king, obviously, or else the handheld markets and smartphone markets and indie markets would not exist. In the console world however, we have waited 8 years to see a new standard in graphical potential. So a big F you to all the analysts in the industry who think it is not worth talking about. It is 7-8 years in the making, it will be talked about, get over it.
Lord Panda
The Sea is Always Right
As others have mentioned, the PS4 can deliver a better experience but for 100 smackeroos cheaper. That's the real topic that most of these dudes aren't so keen on addressing. They pick and choose on what to report but skirt around more substantial aspects between the two consoles.
Seriously ... 'up-res'ed 1080p' ...
SEGAvangelist
Member
I usually take up for the guy, but when he avoid saying "native 720p"
...
... wow.
...
... wow.
travisbickle
Member
It's looking unlikely you'll get it for the xbox one either.
JetBlackPanda
Member
Also if resolution and power and hardware don't matter and it's all about the games then shit everyone looks like Wii U already won the holidays. I mean some games are1080p and some are 720p but who gives a shit they are fun as hell.
It's always been about the games for me but it's crazy that all of a sudden we are pretending there wasn't a graphic/hardware arms race last gen between the HD twins.
It's always been about the games for me but it's crazy that all of a sudden we are pretending there wasn't a graphic/hardware arms race last gen between the HD twins.
toddhunter
Member
But do you concede that a console running 1080p games now could drop down to 720p later with a big increase in framerate/ai/gameplay elements? Similarly a console already at 720p could not do the same?
That is a simplified view of the current situation due to launch issues and everything else, but it is still a significant point of discussion at this stage of the game and you would think not one to be so continuously glossed over.
You could tell he was hesitating too.
Why should I try when people will hate the guy no matter what I say?
Chuck Norris
Banned
The games media created this. They framed it as a big deal when Madden was 30 FPS less on PS3, when Bayonetta ran at a lower resolution, when Fallout looked worse, when Red Dead Redemption had less foliage. Places like Eurogamer made their name pointing these issues out and framing them as a point of legitimate discussion
But now suddenly that the shoe is on the other foot and it looks like Sony will win the vast share of these comparisons, they seem to want to shut off the conversation entirely. You don't see a massive, concerning double standard there?
ProfessorMoran
Member
Do you still game in SD?
It is a big deal, we (as in most people on these forums, hardcore gamers and those debating in the resolution threads) DO care. It's why the resolution threads are so popular and why the power advantage was one of the main reasons cited by people buying a PS4 over an Xbox One in a poll carried out recently online. Cost being the other major one.
If you honestly believe the only reason the PS4 is tracking so many more pre orders than the Xbox One globally, is the price difference, you're fooling yourself. People care about the price, performance, games and more. To get better games for less money is a no brainer. So far the differences between multplatform games have been bigger than those between the PS3/360 and that matters.
How are these people who write and review about this technology not ostracized for saying they can't see or barely see a visual difference when the difference is 2x?
I can't imagine this happening with any other technology field. The writer would have their dedication and expertise questioned.
I can't imagine this happening with any other technology field. The writer would have their dedication and expertise questioned.
Have you not seen his cringe worthy review of GTA 5? These Sessler vids are usually just complete nonsense and make little sense. The last one i watched was him talking about how i shouldn't pre order a console because we don't know all the information about the consoles. I can pre order both consoles at Amazon and cancel whenever i want without being charged a penny.
Sessler's advice is terrible lol
BakedSardine
Banned
Came to post this. It's just weird at this point the histrionics he goes through to explain away the issues with the Xbone.
So much this...
Oh god. That was hard to watch.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
I'm not so sure anymore.
I guess if you pretend the 360/PS3 Generation never happened...
Patrick spoke on this- he mentioned that all the developers he spoke with think the gap will narrow, and the differences won't be huge. I agree with his wait and see stance- report on the differences still tho.
Netherscourge
Banned
I like Adam and I agree with some of his points.
Everyone is pushing 1080p/60fps as the Next-Gen standard.
The problem is that the XB1 can't make that mark comfortably, while the PS4 can.
The problem is that the PS4 is $100 cheaper than the XB1.
The PROBLEM is that Microsoft misjudged the importance of the native 1080p/60fps unwritten standard that gamers were expecting. MS thought 720p upscaled would suffice.
MS was wrong. MS will suffer.
32MB of eSRAM cached to 8GB of DDR3 RAM is a bottleneck.
MS was wrong. MS will suffer.
Everyone is pushing 1080p/60fps as the Next-Gen standard.
The problem is that the XB1 can't make that mark comfortably, while the PS4 can.
The problem is that the PS4 is $100 cheaper than the XB1.
The PROBLEM is that Microsoft misjudged the importance of the native 1080p/60fps unwritten standard that gamers were expecting. MS thought 720p upscaled would suffice.
MS was wrong. MS will suffer.
32MB of eSRAM cached to 8GB of DDR3 RAM is a bottleneck.
MS was wrong. MS will suffer.
Oh my god, he said that? That is Newt Gingrich-tier shit.
TheExecutive
Member
The difference is that 100% of the games that matter on nintendo platforms are built for the nintendo platforms. Parity has not been a big deal for nintendo for the majority of the last decade.
Nintendo are masters at what they do and MS touted the graphics with the 360. The nintendo platforms KNOW what they are and are very good at doing so. I feel that MS was in the middle of an identity crisis when they started architecting the X1 due to the desire to pick up on the Wii crowd and couldnt fire Mattrick in time to change the vision to realign what it meant to be xbox. They will scramble this entire generation to keep up with sony instead of the other way around. Lots of speculation in this post but I don't see much that doesnt align with it.
I think he's just trying to say that he doesn't see a big difference between the two, and that he doesn't look forward to the next gen because of graphics/resolution, but because of other things that will be possible with game design on the new systems. He's not saying that it's not a big deal to some, but it just (to him) shouldn't be a huge discussion point, and isn't that big of deal to him.
I really don't think they will, not for this.
Obscene Jester
Banned
Up-rezed 1080p, the new feel of 1080p.
People are investing a fairly large chunk of money into these machines, I do not think it is unreasonable for them to expect to be able to get 1080P / 60 FPS in 2013, without losing 'better AI' and animations he mentions in the video. It shouldn't be an either/or situation, we should be getting improved everything, and not have to settle for mediocrity because it's 'good enough'. Just because Adam can't tell the difference between 720p and 1080p doesn't mean there isn't one, which is unacceptable in this day and age I think, especially seeing the competition is $100 cheaper and is accomplishing it. Another thing he doesn't seem to get is that people are pissed off not just because the X1 isn't 1080P, it's that Microsoft has tried their hardest to obfuscate facts and details from us and expect us to take their bullshit. This whole fiasco would of gone over much smoother if they didn't add nonsense buzzwords like Cloud and secret sauce or saying things like they won't let Sony have a 30% advantage or Major Nelson saying he can't wait for the truth to come out. If they told the truth from the start, didn't use PR garbage constantly and didn't treat us as walking dollars they would be in a lot better situation in my opinion.
Hmm I believe they are bros. Kevin Dent being their Joe Pesci from Lethal Weapon.
This Sessler thing saddens me in a way. I have really enjoyed his work for the past 10 years or so and ever since E3 he has just been in some sort of denial.
AyaisMUsikWhore
Member
"Resolution" itself isn't the problem and that's what people aren't getting. It's the fact that Resolution is being deflected away as something that doesn't matter for the average consumer who is buying something. Your telling me you would rather buy a 720p television for $100 more than to get a 1080p television of the same quality and features for $100 less? It's ridiculous. In the end, the content of what your purchasing is what matters but let's not deflect the huge elephant in the room. Less for more or more for less? People want value and quality.
After May 21st, I really have no problem using that dollar sign on their behalf.
Soooo you think there's an industry wide conspiracy to make the Bone look better than it is?
Quadraphonic
Member
I remember when I respected him.
That's a great way to put it. I think most people would agree with numbers 2 or 3. The press, however, is only capable of repeatedly stating number 1, while implying everyone who disagrees with them is endorsing number 4.
Fixed1979
Member
It's easier to say "Gaf Hivemind" then try to make an argument when you're in the minority.
TheExecutive
Member
Very good summary. Crazy talk= hits though... unfortunately.
Suikoguy
I whinny my fervor lowly, for his length is not as great as those of the Hylian war stallions
Conspiracy indicates an organized action of multiple parties.
So no.
A xbox bias in media?
Yes.
I understand the argument it's all about the gameplay not the graphics, but most of the games on the next-gen consoles are going to be multiplat anyways. They will have the exact same gameplay and different graphics.
A look at wikipedia shows that ~80% of games on both the 360 and ps3 are multiplat.
So about 80% of games will be at best even on the xb1 compared to the ps4, and likely worse. I don't think that's something to gloss over again and again.
Graphics and gameplay > gameplay > graphics
A look at wikipedia shows that ~80% of games on both the 360 and ps3 are multiplat.
So about 80% of games will be at best even on the xb1 compared to the ps4, and likely worse. I don't think that's something to gloss over again and again.
Graphics and gameplay > gameplay > graphics
Why would their be? I think you're seeing things that aren't there man, tbh.
Nymphae
Banned
My problem with this whole thing is that, the bolded is clearly obvious. I don't need to be informed by the press that "these "minor" technological differences don't matter because it's all about the games, man". Yeah, in a sense, game design is the most important thing, and simply having fun moreso than that. But the games press shouldn't be telling me what is and isn't worth worrying about when considering how I want to spend my half grand or more on a next gen console. Report the facts and tell me about the games. It's like they simply can't say this one is cheaper and performs better, without saying "but remember its all about the games guys!" No shit.
Sorry to jump in this discussion, but while I do agree that we can and should have both (performance and gameplay), what I think Adam is saying is that he isn't as interested in that (and it sounds like a personal opinion) if developers can't get to a good gameplay quality, despite the platform. Am I being clear here? I mean, I can see why it sounds like one or another, but I think he's just saying it doesn't bother him as much as new gameplay innovations.
Not clicking and watching, but if OP is accurate in the description, the whole "in the end it's the games that matter" argument makes zero sense to me, as if the visuals do not inform the game in a fundamental matter. It comes off as rather insincere and a strawman or red herring.
I like Patrick but he also said the PS4 will have the same DRM. Then it didn't. He of course said "well they recently changed their mind on this."
famousmortimer
Banned
1. He is right, 1080p/60fps doesn't make a game good.
2. Ignoring the fact that the more expensive system has a lower resolution and framerate in huge launch multiplats is dumb.
If microsoft somehow has a million amazing games, all at 720p, and the PS4 has like 2... at 1080p - Sessler will be right. In reality what will happen is that most games will be multiplats and the will look and play better on the ps4. And then it comes down to exclusives and that's personal preference. This past gen I preferred Sony's.... will I this gen? I don't see it changing but I guess it could...
2. Ignoring the fact that the more expensive system has a lower resolution and framerate in huge launch multiplats is dumb.
If microsoft somehow has a million amazing games, all at 720p, and the PS4 has like 2... at 1080p - Sessler will be right. In reality what will happen is that most games will be multiplats and the will look and play better on the ps4. And then it comes down to exclusives and that's personal preference. This past gen I preferred Sony's.... will I this gen? I don't see it changing but I guess it could...
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