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[AHA-Lambda]

Ok, I know that he is not a popular persona around here but regardless TotalBiscuit has just put up a very good breakdown of something that far too many sites passed off as "oh that's really nice of WB isn't it?"

https://youtu.be/cVM5g4MFnzs

Now, the long and short of it:

- WB will not donate all of the revenue from this DLC to charity - 30% remains (either to WB or the platform holder I'm guessing)

- Anywhere outside of the US is exempt from this (along with certain exempt US States (Alabama, Hawaii, Illinois, Massachusetts, Mississippi and South Carolina)), and so WB would presumably be keeping all of the revenue from this.

They have stated that any purchases made outside of the 44 valid US States, there will be NO donations.

Ergo, while WB will indeed be donating money to the family, they're also advertising and making money off of it too.

In the video, TB suggests that people should be trying to engage with WB (calmly of course) that they match those donations for purchases outside of those 44 states to other charities if not the family themselves.

If you wish to donate to the Forgey family directly, it's much better to do it here
https://www.youcaring.com/michael-forgey-479259

Now, unless I am missing something, this may well be the slimiest thing I have ever seen a publisher do.
Due to the sensitive nature of this of course, I think it's great WB are donating money to the Forgey family at all, but them using it for their own, is simply contemptible.

If this is inappropriate or old, then please lock.

 

[Alexious]

Ok, I know that he is not a popular persona around here but regardless TotalBiscuit has just put up a very good breakdown of something that far too many sites passed off as "oh that's really nice of WB isn't it?"

https://youtu.be/cVM5g4MFnzs

Now, the long and short of it:

- WB will not donate all of the revenue from this DLC to charity - 30% remains (either to WB or the platform holder I'm guessing)

- Anywhere outside of the US is exempt from this (along with certain exempt US States (Alabama, Hawaii, Illinois, Massachusetts, Mississippi and South Carolina)), and so WB would presumably be keeping all of the revenue from this.

They have stated that any purchases made outside of the 44 valid US States, there will be NO donation.



Ergo, while WB will indeed be donating money to the family, they're also advertising and making money off of it too.

If you wish to donate to the family directly, better to do it here
https://www.youcaring.com/michael-forgey-479259

Now, unless I am missing something, this may well be the slimiest thing I have ever seen a publisher do.
Due to the sensitive nature of this of course, I think it's great WB are donating money to the Forgey family at all, but them using it for their own, is simply contemptible.

If this is inappropriate or old, then please lock.

It's the latter. Steam's cut is 30%.

 

[NoblesseOblige]

WB taking a cut was to be expected (still 30% is about 10 times more than it should be). But that's trash if purchases outside the US or from certain states aren't being donated.

edit: oh it's Valve taking the 30%? You'd think a publisher like WB could talk them into reducing it for a good cause.

 

[FelipeMGM]

- WB will not donate all of the revenue from this DLC to charity - 30% remains (either to WB or the platform holder I'm guessing)

30% is the platform cut, thats standard for the traditional storefronts (Steam, PS Store, Win/Xbox Store)

 

[jem0208]

30% is a pretty standard cut for a platform isn't it?

Edit: I see I have been significantly beaten.

 

[LonelyGreyWolf]

Now, unless I am missing something, this may well be the slimiest thing I have ever seen a publisher do.

Idk, just based on the information in the OP, it seems fine? The 30% has been addressed by posters above, and I understand your concern with marketing but I mean yeah, that's how it works.

 

[Pikma]

Well fuck

 

[Spyware]

Platform cut is 30% so they will not be getting anything from those states.
They will get the money from the rest and I don't see the problem to be honest. Are you saying it should be free for everyone except in those states where the donations could be done? (because it's not a pick and choose thing by WB, it's most probably hindered by laws everywhere else)

 

[DocSeuss]

It's presumably something they can't actually do in specific states/other countries, like how certain giveaways aren't allowed outside of the US.

 

[RPGam3r]

What's slimy exactly?

 

[13ruce]

30% is the platform cut, thats standard for the traditional storefronts (Steam, PS Store, Win/Xbox Store)

No exceptions for charity reasons?
I kinda think they should lower it if the money is used for goodwill/charity reasons. Like maybe half or cut it down to 5-10% or simply nothing.

Anyway imo it should be available worldwide tbh. Will the family get the money forever if that character is bought or only till a specific date or time? If the latter it certainly should be world wide atleast.

 

[Wulfram]

I don't think WB are actually intending to exploit this, though I do think they've screwed up a bit with the purchases from outside of 44 states not counting being in the small print

 

[AHA-Lambda]

What's slimy exactly?

- Anywhere outside of the US is exempt from this (along with certain exempt US States (Alabama, Hawaii, Illinois, Massachusetts, Mississippi and South Carolina)), and so WB would presumably be keeping all of the revenue from this.

They have stated that any purchases made outside of the 44 valid US States, there will be NO donations.

Ergo, while WB will indeed be donating money to the family, they're also advertising and making money off of it too.

In the video, TB suggests that people should be trying to engage with WB (calmly of course) that they match those donations for purchases outside of those 44 states to other charities if not the family themselves

.

 

[Spyware]

No exceptions for charity reasons?
I kinda think they should lower it if the money is used for goodwill/charity reasons. Like maybe half or cut it down to 5-10%.

Anyway imo it should be available worldwide tbh. Will the family get the money forever if that character is bought or only till a specific date or time? If the latter it certainly should be world wide atleast.

I have seen no exceptions so far for charity DLC. Could have missed them tho. I get why, if they allowed it people could just claim to donate and get rid of the "platform cost".

The'll get the money for a little over two years, Dec 2019 iirc.
It isn't ww due to laws, most probably. Nothing anyone can do about that.

 

[harriet the spy]

I'm not sure what WB could do about this tbh. It's to the platform owners to do the right thing.

 

[Dynasty]

OP forgot to mention the places excluded from the charity in the trailer weren't really properly disclosed, major websites when reporting on this never made it clear that is the major issue.

 

[Zombie James]

Why can't they accept donations outside the US? Makes no sense.

 

[Maledict]

It's presumably something they can't actually do in specific states/other countries, like how certain giveaways aren't allowed outside of the US.

Utter nonsense. Sorry but I live in the UK and have given charity through purchases before in America. There's no law that would prevent this.

 

[RPGam3r]

.

They're being upfront and there are obviously legal reasons they can't get it to work in every state. I don't think they are went "muhaha don't let AL money help, we'll take all of that".

This feels like someone looking for a problem.

 

[Bluth54]

edit: oh it's Valve taking the 30%? You'd think a publisher like WB could talk them into reducing it for a good cause.

My guess is the platform holders probably don't want to make any sort of exception on the amount of revenue they take from sales because if they do it for one company/game (even for a good cause like this) a bunch of other companies will probably come out wanting lower cuts for different reasons.

In the past Valve actually ran a charity drive though Team Fortress 2 for funds for the the 2011 Japanese Earthquake where they donated all revenue off of the sale of 3 hats minus the taxes to the American Red Cross (In the end over $430,000 was donated) so it's not like they have a problem with donating all funds off of something to charity.

 

[Justinh]

What I gathered the issue was from TB's video, is that the exemptions of countries outside of US and those certain states needs to be more visible. I could totally see some laws or restrictions preventing purchases in those places contributing to the family's donations, but it probably should be more front and center and not in tiny text. I guess he suggests putting those donations towards a charity organization in lieu of the family if that would clear things up, but I have no idea how these things work/if that would work or whatever.

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

I hope people use this as an opportunity to approach the platform managers about not taking fees for charitable causes.

Also, they really should be donating to cancer organizations for sales that take place outside the US.

 

[Alexander DeLarge]

I'm not sure what WB could do about this tbh. It's to the platform owners to do the right thing.

Let's ignore the 30% entirely. WB should be donating to charity for sales outside of the US if there's some legal reason as to why they can't donate to individuals outside of the country for whatever reason.

 

[MikeBison]

Faux outrage.

 

[FelipeMGM]

No exceptions for charity reasons?
I kinda think they should lower it if the money is used for goodwill/charity reasons. Like maybe half or cut it down to 5-10% or simply nothing.

Anyway imo it should be available worldwide tbh. Will the family get the money forever if that character is bought or only till a specific date or time? If the latter it certainly should be world wide atleast.

I never heard about something like that, but this would be a good time to pressure them to look into it

 

[tsab]

I think they didn't handled it very good.

They could make it part of the main game instead of a DLC, have WB announce that they will donate a small percentage of their profits from their game to the family, promote this and get a free advertisement from press and social media. I bet the review would score better too.

 

[Rellik]

OP, are you new to charity? Most are earning a nice profit off you.

Always do heavy research before donating or your donation will go on the coffee refills in the office.

 

[Maledict]

Faux outrage.

This really isn't. I live in the Uk, I've donated to charities in the USA before via purchases easily and without issue. The fact this isn't the case here, and WB gets to keep the profit from monatrising a dead staff member, it's actually very fucking shitty.

This disclaimer should be loud and front on all of this, and WB should look to another way to pass on the charity in some form. It's not hard, and right now this is profiteering from the death of a staffer which is frankly disgusting.

 

[MikeBison]

This really isn't. I live in the Uk, I've donated to charities in the USA before via purchases easily and without issue. The fact this isn't the case here, and WB gets to keep the profit from monatrising a dead staff member, it's actually very fucking shitty.

This disclaimer should be loud and front on all of this, and WB should look to another way to pass on the charity in some form. It's not hard, and right now this is profiteering from the death of a staffer which is frankly disgusting.

So 30% goes to the platform holder (of which I'm sure they have no control).
A man is immortalised as part of something he loves.
The family get 70% (has anyone asked them if they're happy with this deal, I'm sure they are)
They get some press, which is unavoidable.
No one hear seems to know the exact details behind the out of the US thing, so lots of conclusions being jumped to.

 

[Maledict]

So 30% goes to the platform holder (of which I'm sure they have no control).
A man is immortalised as part of something he loves.
The family get 70% (has anyone asked them if they're happy with this deal, I'm sure they are)
They get some press, which is unavoidable.
No one hear seems to know the exact details behind the out of the US thing, so lots of conclusions being jumped to.

Um, we do know the answer. It's in the thread, confirmed by WB. The money from the sale goes to the family only in the 44 states. The rest of it currently goes to WB. This is nothing to do with the 30% platform holders decision.

Immortalizing dead staff members in games is great, and has been going on for years without issue. The problem here is that WB is lying to the majority of its customers and telling them that if they buy this DLC the profits go to charity, when they don't. They go to WB. Earning a profit off a lie about charity for a dead staff member is gross, and there's absolutely no reason for it - given it's been done so many times before by other companies.

At the very least WB needs to come out with a statement saying that profits from this will go to a cancer charity if they can't go straight to the family.

 

[Alexious]

The only real bummer is about them possibly devolving sales gathered from other territories to charity. Other than that, I'm not sure what they should have done differently.

 

[Wulfram]

On Reddit some guy called SuperSpikeVBall says

"I am not a lawyer, but in case you were wondering what those states have in common (AL, HI, IL, MA, MS, and SC), it is the fact that they require registation for something called a "Commercial Co-Venture."
These are efforts where (just like we see here) a brand pledges to donate a portion of purchase price to charity. When these things are small, companies don't want to go through the hassle of filing paperwork with the above states, so they just make the disclaimer above.
Again, IANAL, but TB's recommendation to make a donation to ANOTHER charity probably wouldn't change anything, since it's still a commercial co-venture. I bumped into this running a marketing campaign once"

 

[LonelyGreyWolf]

The problem here is that WB is lying to the majority of its customers and telling them that if they buy this DLC the profits go to charity, when they don't.

?

Seem pretty honest about it to me.

 

[Maledict]

?



Seem pretty honest about it to me.

It's a response on a twitter query that won't be seen by 99% of people after being directly asked!

This should be front and centre for all purchases outsid the USA, and it shouldn't even mention charity.

 

[erawsd]

It's a response on a twitter query that won't be seen by 99% of people after being directly asked!

This should be front and centre for all purchases outsid the USA, and it shouldn't even mention charity.

Its also stated in the video and video description of the trailer. Its not like this is something suddenly unearthed by TB. If anything its on the sites who reported it for not mentioning that stipulation.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

It's unreasonable to expect WB to donate every cent of their revenue earned on this DLC to charity. They have to give digital storefronts a cut of those earnings and they may want to break even on development costs as well, which isn't a bad thing.

 

[MikeBison]

Um, we do know the answer. It's in the thread, confirmed by WB. The money from the sale goes to the family only in the 44 states. The rest of it currently goes to WB. This is nothing to do with the 30% platform holders decision.

Immortalizing dead staff members in games is great, and has been going on for years without issue. The problem here is that WB is lying to the majority of its customers and telling them that if they buy this DLC the profits go to charity, when they don't. They go to WB. Earning a profit off a lie about charity for a dead staff member is gross, and there's absolutely no reason for it - given it's been done so many times before by other companies.

At the very least WB needs to come out with a statement saying that profits from this will go to a cancer charity if they can't go straight to the family.

I said we don't know the REASON for the money from those outside states or rest of the world going. I'm sure there is one, other than just trying to make profit.

So if they had just immortalised him and given no money to charity, it would have been better than the situation here where there are given a substantial amount to charity?

Don't see any lying here. Just people like Totalbiscuit digging into details for the sake of clicks on his own channel. Gotta have a new outrage to make that ad money amiright.

 

[Alucrid]

i'm glad that totalbiscuit cares more about this deceased developer than his greedy coworkers selling this dlc

/s

 

[Trup1aya]

Wow.

You know, WB could have done nothing at all, the family would get nothing, and there would be no scrutiny what-so-ever.

They do something nice for the family, w/o obligation, and people want to poke holes in it.

I don't see how this is gross of money-grubbing at all. People die all the time, game developers are no exception. Its unprecedented to donate proceeds (dlc or full game sales) to the families. Even if not every penny gets donated - he's getting immortalized in the game - as a baddass character no less.

 

[MikeBison]

Wow.

You know, WB could have done nothing at all, the family would get nothing, and there would be no scrutiny what-so-ever.

They do something nice for the family, w/o obligation, and people want to poke holes in it.

I don't see how this is gross of money-grubbing at all. People die all the time, game developers are no exception. Its unprecedented to donate proceeds (dlc or full game sales) to the families. Even if not every penny gets donated - he's getting immortalized in the game - as a baddass character no less.

/thread

 

[IdreamofHIME]

Hating this charity drive boils down to

WB and Shadow have been the whipping boys for a few months now and doing something nice isn't gonna change the haters.
I'd expect a Jimquisition on it too, because that's right up his alley.

 

[Dynasty]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-15muasKW58&feature=youtu.be

This is the trailer they used to announce the charity DLC. Skip towards the end, they dont make it clear enough about who is excluded from contributing to the family, they should have made this much more clear than just put it in the fine print at the end of a video.

 

[dubq]

There is nothing slimy about this. And as far as WB taking a cut goes, well, not a shock. Many non profit charities even have a "donor tax" to fund operations. Ie: they take a chunk of the donation as the people who work there still need to get paid.

 

[Alucrid]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-15muasKW58&feature=youtu.be

This is the trailer they used to announce the charity DLC. Skip towards the end, they dont make it clear enough about who is excluded from contributing to the family, they should have made this much more clear than just put it in the fine print at the end of a video.

"Donations will be made on purchases from any 1 of the 50 U.S. or D.C. (but excluding purchases made from AL, HI, IL, MA, MS and SC). Void where prohibited by law. Your purchase is not tax deductible."

seems pretty clear to me and the fine text is up there for a good 15 seconds.

 

[VibratingDonkey]

The DLC page doesn't mention anything about donations or charity.
Or maybe it does in relevant regions?

Or are they just advertising this on social media?
Sure, they should mention which regions donations are valid in.
But they have done that? Very clearly. At least on Twitter.

 

[CHC]

Hating this charity drive boils down to
WB and Shadow have been the whipping boys for a few months now and doing something nice isn't gonna change the haters.
I'd expect a Jimquisition on it too, because that's right up his alley.

Exactly. Sometimes this kind of thing is just intolerable. Any reason to get mad about something though, right?

They're making some charity DLC, with a couple caveats. They could (a) not have done it at all, (b) given less to charity, (c) been non-transparent about which customers' purchases contribute. What they're doing is fine, it's a nice gesture, let's leave it at that.

 

[kiguel182]

There's always something to gain from charity for companies. Either directly or indirectly.

At least some of the money will go to someone who needs it instead of all the money going to WB. Better than nothing.

 

[Dynasty]

"Donations will be made on purchases from any 1 of the 50 U.S. or D.C. (but excluding purchases made from AL, HI, IL, MA, MS and SC). Void where prohibited by law. Your purchase is not tax deductible."

seems pretty clear to me and the fine text is up there for a good 15 seconds.

The size is much smaller compared to all the other writing. It should've been made much more clear. Watching on mobile and I never caught it. What is the need to make that specific info much less visible?

 

[Kinyou]

"Donations will be made on purchases from any 1 of the 50 U.S. or D.C. (but excluding purchases made from AL, HI, IL, MA, MS and SC). Void where prohibited by law. Your purchase is not tax deductible."

seems pretty clear to me and the fine text is up there for a good 15 seconds.

I'd say it's not a huge deal, but I have to wonder why they made that disclaimer text so super tiny. It's rather crucial information.

 

[Loz246789]

There's a lot of shady stuff going on in the videogame industry, but I legitimately don't think this is an example of that. Hypothetically, if this was all a ruse to make money, there are much better loopholes to take advantage of rather than it not being available in some parts of the world. For example, having a cap on the amount of money being donated, or saying that any purchases past the first week won't count, or something. Being not available in some parts of the world is too broad of a limitation to be done maliciously. At worst, this is the result of laziness, more likely, exchange rates and laws make things too complicated for what was probably a nice gesture suggested by someone on the dev team without much concern for the specifics.