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[ManUtdRedDevils]

This whole situation is gross. It just makes me sad. I cancelled all of my current pledges and deleted my kickstarter account. Crowd funding was fun while it lasted but with everything on the Internet, people find a way to exploit a system using keywords to allow them immunity to do so while the society as a whole is too dumb to think for themselves.

 

[thiscoldblack]

I'm still in disbelief this Kickstarter is still opened or that many people are supporting it.

 

[Dr.Acula]

This is the new economy. It's based on hits and noteriety. I really am past blaming the mother on this, because honestly, you cannot stop people throwing their money away.

The difference here is that it is occuring on KS, which is a bit of a darling in the indie-dev scene, and as such has a high-profile on GAF. There are dumb scam campaigns in every corner of the Internet, and it's stupid to waste your energy being mad.

By all means write to KS, research the mother's previous businesses, contact media etc. But if you can't do that without being personally invested to the point of seething anger, you gotta step back, because the Internet is full of this shit.

 

[Matrix]

I guess I'll keep my project Eternity pledge, but Kickstarter won't ever see my money again.

I'm done with them once the Veronica Mars movie funding is over.

This is so f-ing disgusting and wrong on so many levels.

 

[Stet]

I'm done with them once the Veronica Mars movie funding is over.

This is so f-ing disgusting and wrong on so many levels.

I actually thought the Veronica Mars fund was the beginning of the end, and lo and behold this woman uses it as an excuse for why hers is legit.

 

[Muku]

Brothers need to be kept in their place (which is *equal* to their sister, but so many brothers don't realise this). There need to be more pictures of the AMAZING shoes. Far more importantly, Kenzie? You ROCK! You have drive and vision. Sadly, you've had to learn that sometimes people can be REALLY NASTY when they see that someone has an idea and the gumption to follow it up - but you've also learned that if you speak up and don't let the blighters get you down, a lot of other REALLY COOL PEOPLE will support you.

You need, very much, to look at that total every day. Not just now. Not just this year. When you're 23, and trying to sell a concept for another game to a company who thinks that "girls don't do this stuff", you need to look at your total here, and say to yourself "This person doesn't believe in me, but so many other people do - and not just my family!"

Kenzie, you rock, your mum rocks, the head of Kickstarter rocks for being so sensible, and I can't wait to see how this goes.

The bolded part just made me go "..." First I thought it was a jab. Then I kept reading and it sounds like they're on board. How do we even know this kid has vision? We haven't seen or heard form her. All we've seen is what her mom wrote for her. Plus, for all we know, especially at that age, she'll be into it for a weekend then move on. I can't tell you how many things I wanted to be when I grew up at that age. There were several things on my mind, but I didn't do any of them. And yeah she could break the mold, but I somehow seriously doubt it.

I wonder how many are going to complain though in the end when they can't make heads or tails of this "game". And that's assuming she even finishes it.

Spoiler

Some of the comments make me laugh, because they're talking about making two or three games. Hell, from a 9 year old, you'd be lucky to see one at all. A finished one anyway.

By all means write to KS, research the mother's previous businesses, contact media etc. But if you can't do that without being personally invested to the point of seething anger, you gotta step back, because the Internet is full of this shit.

You're right, the internet is full of it. But I think what makes people upset is that there really are no rules. Just potentially "guidelines" on a website folks liked. If they didn't have those on the rules page, I think people would be chill about it. It's just disappointing is all for many. And yes, someone always comes in and finds a way to abuse things. This is why we can't all have nice things.

 

[gamma]

Open thread only to get punched in the face by OP. Can someone point me to a summery of what's going on?

 

[Annubis]

Actually, I just Googled "Susan Wilson scam" and is it me or does it seem to be a popular name for Internet scams?

 

[Muku]

Actually, I just Googled "Susan Wilson scam" and is it me or does it seem to be a popular name for Internet scams?

Looking into it now. What I find hilarious though is top of the Google search is her current KS. Ouch.

 

[ido]

What in the fuck is wrong with the gaming media? I mean, HuffPo had the only article worth a shit. Every gaming website has spun this story into some kind of internet hate machine attacking a nine year old.

Reading this from the beginning, I honestly cannot believe what all has been uncovered here. Does this woman even have real children? And if she does, do they have any idea that she is posing as them online for profit?

 

[vg260]

This whole situation is gross. It just makes me sad. I cancelled all of my current pledges and deleted my kickstarter account. Crowd funding was fun while it lasted but with everything on the Internet, people find a way to exploit a system using keywords to allow them immunity to do so while the society as a whole is too dumb to think for themselves.

Let KS know why as well.

 

[khaaan]

Open thread only to get punched in the face by OP. Can someone point me to a summery of what's going on?

There's been a whole lot of stuff so if someone sees that I messed something up please correct me.

-Lady creates kickstarter to send her nine year old daughter to RPG camp because her big brothers think she can't make a RPG
-Lady has already registered the daughter in said camp
-People start digging
-She is in Fortunes top 10 Female Entrepreneurs, also a scam artist
-Uncovered cyber squatting and an indiegogo project that shows her trying to fund a project where she sells an existing product for profit.
-A GAF user who sent her an email to complain about her kickstarter was unethical, that user was classified as abusing the system and has had KS features withheld
-When confronted she spins it into a feminist piece
-Media bites and portrays it as "Internet Trolls try to attack nine year old girl"
-I am unclear as to whether the project breaks KS rules but I think it's safe to say the way she is advertising does definitely break the terms of service.

 

[Bedlam]

Reading these comments is making me lose faith in humanity:

@Henrik OMG!!! Let it go!!!! You're not getting anywhere. You actually think the game isn't going to be awesome and completed by Kenzie with all of the media involved. The media will be following her progress until it's completed. Kenzie will probably get a movie out of this frenzy.

If you ask me this project is probably one of the safest projects on Kickstarter to support and back by pledges. We all know at this point it will happen.

The backers will be part of something big in the end!! And the pledgers will be able to say "I supported that little girl".

Also, quoting myself so it doesn't get lost:

Someone should set up a "I want to make a (nonspecific) game but I know nothing about development. Fund my courses, PC and dev tools!"-KS. Leave out all the pseudo-feminist "get woman in tech", "brothers are mean" etc. crap. Then let's see if KS takes it down. edit: And also flood twitter with the link to the KS.

 

[Parallacs]

I find it interesting that funding has pretty much stalled.

She was at $21,801 three days into the project.

Now in the three days since the OP, she has only gained $500?

With all the plublicity and positive articles in CNET, CBS, penny-arcade, you would think it would continue to rise.

 

[foobarry81]

The bolded part just made me go "..." First I thought it was a jab. Then I kept reading and it sounds like they're on board. How do we even know this kid has vision? We haven't seen or heard form her. All we've seen is what her mom wrote for her. Plus, for all we know, especially at that age, she'll be into it for a weekend then move on. I can't tell you how many things I wanted to be when I grew up at that age. There were several things on my mind, but I didn't do any of them. And yeah she could break the mold, but I somehow seriously doubt it.

Susan Wilson thinks her kid is so extremely talented the world should fund her life. Isn´t that convincing enough for you? ;-)

 

[Grecco]

I guess this is Kickstarters jumping the shark point. Cant get any worse than this right?

 

[robovanburen]

The existence of an RPG camp was the most shocking info in this thread.

Edit: Also, it seems like excess fundraising is a constant issue with Kickstarter. Some projects have defined stretch goals but in other cases there's no need for money above the goal whatsoever. What's this woman going to do with the extra thousands of dollars? Hire Chris Avellone as her daughter's private RPG tutor?

 

[Monroeski]

Cant get any worse than this right?

You must be new to the internet.

 

[ironichaos]

I checked the "boys" indigogo and saw that they have contributed to this project http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/boycode2-0?c=home which going by the wording i think it's Susan and if you check the comments it pretty much confirms it.

Wow, she's a pathological liar using the personas of her kids (and potentially other people such as the woman in that indiegogo) to deceive and manipulate people. I knew someone like this once. He was so engulfed by his tsunami of lies that he actually believed in his new made-up reality. He was also surprisingly charming, knowing exactly the right buttons to push to make his stories believable.

On one hand, I feel sorry for Susan - she needs serious counseling. On the other hand, I'm disgusted that she's taking advantage of so many people. And further, the mainstream journalism that's taken place to cover these events doesn't deserve to be called journalism

 

[foobarry81]

What does US law say about child labour btw?

Because Susan seems to be wanting to add stretch goals like a pen and paper RPG. When is that 9yo going to create all of that?

Allthough it seems she won´t actually be doing it anymore. Seems like they will be hiring people to implement the "vision" of little Kenzie. Which makes sense, because Susan also has other people´s money and other people´s ideas do the work in this project.

 

[mattiewheels]

I sort of feel bad for Kickstarter, since essentially this lady is holding them hostage with this thing. If they pull it, they could be in for a shitstorm. Not that I think they're right, since it's their duty to monitor their own site for integrity's sake. But they're in a tight spot because this lady framed everything so perfectly.

 

[Muku]

Susan Wilson thinks her kid is so extremely talented the world should fund her life. Isn´t that convincing enough for you? ;-)

Yeah. I think I should go give her my whole wallet.. you in?!

Because Susan seems to be wanting to add stretch goals like a pen and paper RPG. When is that 9yo going to create all of that?

Allthough it seems she won´t actually be doing it anymore. Seems like they will be hiring people to implement the "vision" of little Kenzie. Which makes sense, because Susan also has other people´s money and other people´s ideas do the work in this project.

9yo is going to have no summer yo. TIME TO GET TO THE PAPER GIRL AND WORK OUT DAT RPG. Actually, it's not so much when a 9yo would create that, but whether she'd even be interested in that. It's not something you can "see" right off the bat. And I imagine she wants to impress people with something more to it.

Spoiler

Don't get me wrong. A good pen and paper RPG is freaking amazing, I just don't see how a 9yo would create her own, be interested in it long enough to create one from start to finish.

Yeah. Though I think Susan is thinking they will teach/help her .. at least that would be useful and worthwhile than actually creating it for her. But I guess when you got money flowing from other folks wallets, anything is possible. Or maybe they'll create it for her to cover her ass when she tires of making this game. Guess we'll see. I hope these backers aren't expecting anything spectacular, epic story, or anything in great length.

I wish that these people making the comments would stop using the phrase '.....ROCKS!', it's embarrassing.
Even that reeks of them all being written by the same person.

Glad I'm not only one noticing this. I just assume they're all the same person, all given the same phrases to use, or just think it's something that Kenzie can relate to. They should change it up with gnarly, tubular, or something crazy. Actually, those awesome words make me think of Super Mario World.

 

[basic_text]

I wish that these people making the comments would stop using the phrase '.....ROCKS!', it's embarrassing.
Even that reeks of them all being written by the same person.

 

[MBison]

Wow the boycode indiegogo is just another puzzle piece that confirms how much of a scam this is.

If anyone hasn't checked it out, I encourage you to do so.

 

[Doczu]

I sort of feel bad for Kickstarter, since essentially this lady is holding them hostage with this thing. If they pull it, they could be in for a shitstorm. Not that I think they're right, since it's their duty to monitor their own site for integrity's sake. But they're in a tight spot because this lady framed everything so perfectly.

Don't feel bad for them. It's their fault they let it go live. Now they have to deel with the backlash.

 

[foobarry81]

Yeah. I think I should go give her my whole wallet.. you in?!

I was planning on throwing my money out on the streets, but maybe I should reconsider and try and see which is worse...

 

[foobarry81]

I wish that these people making the comments would stop using the phrase '.....ROCKS!', it's embarrassing.
Even that reeks of them all being written by the same person.

You´re not thinking Susan, are you?

 

[Red Liquorice]

people find a way to exploit a system using keywords to allow them immunity to do so while the society as a whole is too dumb to think for themselves.

You just described every business, ever.

 

[Kikujiro]

Don't forget that Kickstarter takes 5% of the money, so they are basically running a scam.

 

[semiconscious]

I knew someone like this once. He was so engulfed by his tsunami of lies that he actually believed in his new made-up reality. He was also surprisingly charming, knowing exactly the right buttons to push to make his stories believable...

same. & sorta glad i did, to the extent it made it really clear to me that people like this exist ...

 

[RPGCrazied]

Scam or not, but who would want an RPG made by a 9yo girl? Uh, no thanks.

 

[Azih]

Question for you guys. If Susan Wilson had just posted this on her own fundher.com and indiegogo.com would anyone have cared?

Is it that Kickstarter started being seen as this bastion of goodness and noble creativity that is making this so dissapointing?

 

[Spwn]

So Mackenzie Wilson's Indiegogo profile has been deleted in the past 24h. Don't know if this has been mentioned here. The funny thing is that the profile had a big picture of the girl herself, although we haven't been shared any video or audio of her explaining her ideas for a game in the current crowdfunding project because the mother is protecting her from pedophiles.

Question for you guys. If Susan Wilson had just posted this on her own fundher.com and indiegogo.com would anyone have cared?

Is it that Kickstarter started being seen as this bastion of goodness and noble creativity that is making this so dissapointing?

I don't think this would've been funded if it was on fundher or indiegogo. The reason she may have switched from indiegogo to kickstarter is probably that her past indiegogo projects weren't successful.

 

[chickdigger802]

Out of curiosity, any articles written by female writers been against her?

 

[Spwn]

Out of curiosity, any articles written by female writers been against her?

Only one close is the Huffington Post one. It's pretty much the only article to point out the possibility of the project being scam.

 

[Clockwork]

Question for you guys. If Susan Wilson had just posted this on her own fundher.com and indiegogo.com would anyone have cared?

Is it that Kickstarter started being seen as this bastion of goodness and noble creativity that is making this so dissapointing?

I wouldn't have cared. I still wouldn't have donated but I wouldn't have an issue if someone did (EDIT - actually I would because there is no tangible benefit to doing so other than the warm fuzzy feeling obtained from foolishly parting with your money which really shouldn't be justification to pledge in this case). I might think what Susan is doing is totally distasteful, but if someone thinks it's a good idea to waste money on such an effort that is their prerogative.

I'll go as far as to say that I don't even consider this a scam. It is a bit manipulative in that it clearly isn't written by Kenzie, it's heavily weighted towards obtaining donations based on sympathy pledges, and uses gender politics to coerce people into supporting the project. If anything it's a feel good fluff piece that makes people (especially if they aren't paying full attention) want to donate because they think they are doing something nice. The fact that people continued to donate above and beyond the original goal is just as much the fault of the backers as it is Susan's. I mean what is the thought process going through their heads?

Unfortunately, I feel this "project" is completely outside of Kickstarter's intended use/purpose and has no place being on that site. Even more, it takes attention away from the more legitimate projects that deserve pledges. By Kickstarter supporting (even if unofficially by not taking it down) this project it also negatively reflects on the service as a whole.

 

[semiconscious]

Question for you guys. If Susan Wilson had just posted this on her own fundher.com and indiegogo.com would anyone have cared?

Is it that Kickstarter started being seen as this bastion of goodness and noble creativity that is making this so dissapointing?

a) no...
b) ks, unlike indigogo, has had terms of service. it's their willingness to ignore their own guidelines that's disappointing. it's not about goodness & noble creativity, it's about integrity...

 

[foobarry81]

Out of curiosity, any articles written by female writers been against her?

This one is not really picking sides: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-205_162...s-kickstarter-project-stirs-emotional-debate/

So not against her, but also not for. It´s also one of the better articles.

One of the commenters, a woman, is clear about it though:

ellensmithee says:
I think this is REPREHENSIBLE. This wealthy mother decided to USE a resource designed for people who cannot afford their creative dreams. That's pretty typical for the rich to device ways to make others pay for what they want. And she just taught it to her daughter. Super mothering, BTW. The world needs more self-centeredness.

Now the people who donated $21,000 paid to send a rich kid to camp. Awesome. I doubt seriously they knew that. This is FRAUD. And it's evil and psychopathic. This is why society looks the way it does. No one cares about fairness anymore, particularly the winners, the rich.

Mom should be charged with FRAUD.

 

[Enco]

Joseph Cecil Smith about 7 hours ago

with a strong creative team in place, a child can dream WAY BEYOND their own skills, literally nothing is a true obstacle, if you hit a wall, ask for help, strong game designers could help a child create a really interesting range of games, game experiments, aspects or elements of games. The industry would completely listen and answer to any 9 year old who has serious questions about the game they are designing.. It's an adventure game already, the first chapter started here.. and the endless journey is already unfolding.. Beyond the 1st game, a 2nd game, the 3rd game, and onward is where your daughter will start to realize her artistic identity, it takes practice builds and builds and testing and more sandbox..

that's why programmers have such even keel.. they can't afford to get upset every time a technical problem emerges.. if everyone got upset, there were be no techies left to solve the crisis..

wut

 

[Muku]

Question for you guys. If Susan Wilson had just posted this on her own fundher.com and indiegogo.com would anyone have cared?

Is it that Kickstarter started being seen as this bastion of goodness and noble creativity that is making this so dissapointing?

I wouldn't have cared if it was on either of those places. But she has failed on indiegogo and her own site doesn't even have enough traffic to fund crap I imagine. The issue we take with it that she's broken numerous, now apparent GUIDELINES rather than RULES.

Out of curiosity, any articles written by female writers been against her?

I don't know. But in podcast we do weekly we touched upon this topic and I am totally against it. I guess technically I could have written something on our site, but meh. Last thing I want is Susan making 40 thousand new emails with her "bestie" and hoard of rich friends finding the one lone article on the internet that is against her. Plus, she and this whole thing is a lost cause sadly.

wut

LOL. Dat... wait, what the hell is this person even pulling out their ass?

Taylor Woolf

Mackenzie, you are truly exceptional for your age. I wish you the best of luck, and I can't wait to see what you come up with.

Because we obviously know she is exceptional. Right. I'm sure she's like any other 9 year old. Though, still not sure why she couldn't learn on her own. THAT is something to be proud of. When we were kids, we taught ourselves. And if we were tearing apart code or whatever to learn, we probably looked up tutorials. I'd say it's exceptional to learn on your own. It takes a lot more time and effort, but the rewards are amazing.

 

[foobarry81]

wut

He´s probably on coke or something.

I also love this one:

Taylor Woolf 1 minute ago

Mackenzie, you are truly exceptional for your age. I wish you the best of luck, and I can't wait to see what you come up with.

How does she know? Nobody´s every seen anything of Kenzie, let alone her "work". And this whole project was her mother´s idea.

 

[Red-Shift]

Sidenote - Do gamers feel the same about Lord British's aka Richard Garriott aka I'm so rich I spent my vacation in space Kickstarter project?

 

[foobarry81]

Sidenote - Do gamers feel the same about Lord British's aka Richard Garriott aka I'm so rich I spent my vacation in space Kickstarter project?

No, because Richard Garriott doesn´t ask people to fund his life. Just another one of his projects.

 

[Annubis]

How does she know? Nobody´s every seen anything of Kenzie, let alone her "work".

Few backers will play her game anyway. They are just having emotional outbursts and throwing their money at a cause they think they're supporting.

 

[Spwn]

Sidenote - Do gamers feel the same about Lord British's aka Richard Garriott aka I'm so rich I spent my vacation in space Kickstarter project?

Some do, but for different reasons. This isn't really about a millionaire needing a funding for their daughter's game anymore. This is about a millionaire not needing funding for anything, really, since the camp has been paid already (before the KS project even started) and it's all about gathering money covered with girls vs boys gender politics at this point.

 

[Muku]

Sidenote - Do gamers feel the same about Lord British's aka Richard Garriott aka I'm so rich I spent my vacation in space Kickstarter project?

Asking to fund a project is different than asking to fund someones life. Though, I felt like Garriott's project was all over the place in terms of ideas. The extended goals were also lackluster at best. But that's a different story I suppose. Asking to fund an actual project? Sure. Asking to fund your life? Not cool.

Few backers will play her game anyway. They are just having emotional outbursts and throwing their money at a cause they think they're supporting.

Actually, I bet a lot of them feel like they've somehow made a difference in girls working in the tech industry and all. Like sending one girl to RPG Maker camp would do that.

 

[Ramma2]

Sidenote - Do gamers feel the same about Lord British's aka Richard Garriott aka I'm so rich I spent my vacation in space Kickstarter project?

There's also the benefit of getting a potentially 60$ game for 25$.

 

[Trey]

I cannot believe she threw her sons under the bus like that. It's one thing to bring private matters like that to the public (i.e, Facebook), it's another thing to use the situation to fuel a feminist charge.

A "personal apology" for ten grand? Get the fuck outta here.

 

[Red-Shift]

No, because Richard Garriott doesn´t ask people to fund his life. Just another one of his projects.

Don't get me wrong! I think her Kickstarter is despicable as well, but I'm a bit curious why people seem to be pretty cool with Garriotts project. If I remember correct the outcry among the community was pretty loud a few months back when Peter Molyneux took his project to Kickstarter. Molyneux might be rich but not "Britannia Manor" rich.

 

[foobarry81]

Asking to fund a project is different than asking to fund someones life. Though, I felt like Garriott's project was all over the place in terms of ideas. The extended goals were also lackluster at best. But that's a different story I suppose. Asking to fund an actual project? Sure. Asking to fund your life? Not cool.

At least it´s a project. Susan Wilson literally admitted earlier today that she doesn´t even have a project (because the money is no longer going to the summer camp which was already paid for anyway), let alone ideas (which she expect the crowd to provide now).

Actually, I bet a lot of them feel like they've somehow made a difference in girls working in the tech industry and all. Like sending one girl to RPG Maker camp would do that.

Exactly, this is why it´s so bad Susan Wilson played that gender card in the first place. She should have just taught her sons that´s not the way you treat a little sister and be done with it.