DICKS AHOY
Banned
I don't want to live in a world where Roy Koopa is the 'wrong Roy'
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Sakurai on Smash clone haters: "A lot of them are children, it cannot be helped."
- Thread starter Fiktion
- Start date
Sir Ilpalazzo
Member
Not all opinions are created equal.
Sakurai is on a roll. He's right though. Alts aren't taking the place of wholly original characters, they're just cool alternatives that satisfy some fans while taking less time to develop. They really are the cherry on top. And no one can deny that the roster is already packed even without the alts.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Pretty much my feelings. I have no qualms with clones in general. I just have issues with the clones they chose. I feel like there were some better options that wouldn't have lent themselves to as much criticism
EmCeeGramr
Member
Isn't this one of those things that Sakurai never actually said but everyone just "read somewhere" that he said it years ago.
nckillthegrimace
Member
He should have taken out dumb characters like Jigglypuff, Yoshi, and Lucario so that the team had more time and money to implement Hades.
Zomba13
Member
Dark Pit should have been an alt and Hades should've been in. But you know, time and cost and man hours so just change Pit's texture model a new side-b using assets from KI:U and record like, a minute more dialouge with the same VA and then count him as a separate character.
I like that we have Dark pit, Lucina, Dr Mario etc in the game but I think at this point, when we have alt costumes now, it'd be nice to trim the fat a bit and have them as alt costumes. I know that would mean "less" characters but those things happen when you give a character a new coat and count him twice.
KittenMaster
Member
Yep. I'm so sick of the whole "character slots" argument to begin with because people always assume the character slots are some kind of commodity instead of what is usually "how many characters we can manage to develop in a time frame". If the clones didn't exist, they would not be replaced by your favorite character(s).
Wario already had more costumes than anyone else in Brawl, and they most likely designed the Koopa Kid, Villager & Alph alts before realizing how much of a hassle it would be to continue to do so as they got late in development with little time to squeeze in more characters.
I've been very defendant of the clones to people, so what is his explanation for making new clones instead of older clones like Lucas and Wolf? That's my only jab at him.
But I agree, people who thinks there are "slots" in the game. Or that Dr. Mario, Dark Pit, and Lucina were put in the game over their favorite characters, they deserve a dunce hat.
But I agree, people who thinks there are "slots" in the game. Or that Dr. Mario, Dark Pit, and Lucina were put in the game over their favorite characters, they deserve a dunce hat.
Vermillion
Banned
Mihael Mello Keehl
Banned
Basically. The whole internet could be asked that everytime theres bickering. Like seriously if you dont know nothing zip it
AnkiRendan
Member
Was it really necessary to give your precious Dark Pit a separate Final Smash and his own victory theme, Sakurai? Why not use that time
and money on, oh, I don't know, making new victory themes for the other franchises or giving Toon Link and Lucina different final smashes?
and money on, oh, I don't know, making new victory themes for the other franchises or giving Toon Link and Lucina different final smashes?
I would have sacrificed them for Hades but you know that'd never happen.
Although Hades might find his way into Smash one day
as a third Falcondorf
Sounds to me like someone twisting the notion that Sakurai prioritizes unique characters that are different from others on the roster. But those
Clones are a win-win all around. They take away from nothing, but they add playstyle variants to the roster and get another character represented. And that's great.
Zomba13
Member
I am still baffled why Falco came back and not Wolf. I guess it was easier to put Falco in rather than Wolf because it's cheaper to clone a Fox than port a Wolf.
MagiusNecros
Gilgamesh Fan Annoyance
Well his free dessert analogy is pretty dumb. Since most people I know don't eat or want dessert after a luxurious meal.
It's just his classy way of saying that he made the roster bigger by pulling in other characters that are largely the same but with different properties.
And wouldn't require too much extra time to implement.
It's just his classy way of saying that he made the roster bigger by pulling in other characters that are largely the same but with different properties.
And wouldn't require too much extra time to implement.
Who could blame him? Hardcore Smash fans are probably some of the most cringeworthy and embarrassing in all of gaming.
balladofwindfishes
Member
The only animations Dark Pit has that Pit doesn't is a final smash and his taunts/victory animations. Everything else is shared 100%. Lucina has some very slight variations, mostly because she's a little shorter.
Doc has a new down aerial, and a new down special in addition to everything else everyone else has. He also has a new entrance animation, the other two do not.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
Seriously, stop saying this until you pull up evidence of him saying this.
Falco also has a lot more Smash legacy and fanfare than Wolf does.
I just hope he (and Lucas) can make it back as DLC, I really prefer him to the other SF chars so it hits me hard he got cut
WrenchNinja
Member
whens mewtwo
Red Arremer
Member
Because Lucas and Wolf weren't clones. Their normal moveset is ENTIRELY different, and the differences between their special moves are a LOT bigger than those between Marth/Lucina, Mario/Doc and Pit/Dark Pit, especially in regards to Wolf.
Those 3 characters are just alt costumes with a few differences. Lucas and Wolf are entirely different characters with a few similarities to their source. Big difference.
Zomba13
Member
He could have done it with Alph too, just replace Purple Pikmin with Rock. Change the model in the FS to the Pikmin 3 ship and make the character lighter/heavier/slower/faster or whatever and be done. There, super cheap and easy additional character. Different from Olimar because the rock does like 2% more damage or has better smash and worth of being his own character. Just like Lucina because her sword does damage equally and she was very slightly shorter than Marth.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I totally agreed with you. People complained about Alph don't really make sense because they basically did same thing in the games. My opinion is that Pikmin is main characters (and tool) of the Pikmin moveset. Some people are not aware of their original names in Japanese Smash. It was Pikmin and Olimar. (I could be wrong tho)
Well, there are a lot of adults that actually being childish so I'm pretty sure that it would apply to them too.
I'm pretty sure that someone faked that one. I haven't really hear that Sakurai actually said that. Where did you read that?
Lucina removes her mask in her entrance animation. Her Shield Breaker also has a unique animation, and I think her Counter does as well.
Doctor Decimate
Member
Failing to see how "clones are basically bonus characters that take up little to no manpower" is not directly addressing the criticism, especially when the bulk of the complaints about them is the absurd idea that they took up a "character slot."
MetalGuardian
Banned
Fucking lol. I <3 Samurai so much.
If Smash Bros. 3DS had skimped on content and newcomers, this response would be laughably insulting. Since this game is quite the contrary though, packing in more things to do than most other games on the market, with carefully crafted love and care placed into every digital crevice, Samurai absolutely deserves the benefit of the doubt (along with a heft round of applause for his insane work ethic and vision)
Long live Samurott, saviour of fighting games
If Smash Bros. 3DS had skimped on content and newcomers, this response would be laughably insulting. Since this game is quite the contrary though, packing in more things to do than most other games on the market, with carefully crafted love and care placed into every digital crevice, Samurai absolutely deserves the benefit of the doubt (along with a heft round of applause for his insane work ethic and vision)
Long live Samurott, saviour of fighting games
Spoken like someone who doesn't play fighting games.
Bahahahaha.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Oh, I hadn't noticed, I just thought it was the glowing ring thing Marth has.
But Doc has one of the best entrances in the game
Kacho
Member
DLC bruh
abstract alien
Member
So glad he said this.
Falco also has a lot more Smash legacy and fanfare than Wolf does.
I just hope he (and Lucas) can make it back as DLC, I really prefer him to the other SF chars so it hits me hard he got cut
Didn't they include Lucas's PK Freeze in Ness's moveset?
I don't think he's coming back.
WrenchNinja
Member
Lots of content is nice. What's nicer is when the content is actually good.
It's hilarious that Sakurai is so blunt with his opinions that a lot of people always get mad when he says something.
It gets even funnier later because every Sakurai quote gets misinterpreted and altered so much that people assume some crazy things (many people still believe Sakurai hates DLC).
It gets even funnier later because every Sakurai quote gets misinterpreted and altered so much that people assume some crazy things (many people still believe Sakurai hates DLC).
Zomba13
Member
Also, the thing about man hours/cost makes me feel that if there is DLC it'd just be costumes or classic stages rather than new or returning characters. A lot of work would have to go into a new character (slightly less for a returning vet).
As far as I know all of Lucas specials are alt specials for Ness.
balladofwindfishes
Member
Every one of Lucas' specials are in Ness' customs.
Red Arremer
Member
Well we don't know exactly how the resources have been spent. Perhaps Alph was planned to be added, but they didn't have the time so they kept him a unique costume.
Aside from that, just replacing 1 out of 5 possible Pikmin (and additionally to being the last one in the order) doesn't really help differentiating the character. That's not even the fraction of the moveset that changing always available specials/normals do.
The12thGripper
Member
will still whine over alt. costumes taking a space on the roster