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The Hugo Awards 2016 - Revisiting "Ethics in SF Awards"

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W

whatsinaname

Member
SigmasonicX said:
The big change is that currently, you can vote for any number of things in each category, which allows for everyone to vote for a single slate, which is how we got where we are now.

Next year, you can still vote for any number of things in a category, but you have to divide a single vote among them all evenly. So if you vote for one thing, that gets 1 vote. If you vote for two things, each gets 1/2 vote. If you vote for three things, each gets 1/3 vote, etc. This still allows for a large group to rally under a single work in a category, but they can't flood a category with works of their choice as easily.
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That makes a little bit of sense. We'll see how it goes I guess.
 
S

studyguy

Member
Sirpopopop said:
http://www.vox.com/2016/5/26/11759842/chuck-tingle-hugo-award-rabid-puppies-explained

Looks like Chuck Tingle backfired big time on the Puppies.

First getting Zoe Quinn to accept the award on his behalf, and then stealing the domain name.

Hehe.
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That's incredible.
Almost as incredible as his books.
tingle-raptor.jpg
 
S

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
I don't want the sad puppies to have a new one torn. I want them to get bored of the pointless flailing, meet cooler people, get better influences and move out of a pointless teenage feedback loop and do something decent with their lives. We all do or say dumb things when we're young, and we regret them and grow out of them.

Of course the thirty something's, cynical disciple recruiters and true believers are beyond help or respect. They can have a gaping gaiman hole I suppose.
 
S

Stumpokapow

listen to the mad man
Sad/rabbid puppies are such paper-thin skinned butthurt politically correct morons. "Wahh, wahh, why does no one in sci-fi / fantasy like me? I want a participation medal". Whining fucking millennials, and then they slink back to their safe spaces to cry about it. I'm just fed up with free speech being curbed by the professionally offended.
 
D

Dongs Macabre

aka Daedalos42
It would have been amazing to see Zoe Quinn accept Chuck Tingle's award, but it's good that an actual story won instead of "Space Raptor Butt Invasion".
 
N

Not

Banned
For the second year running, the biggest prize in science fiction and fantasy writing has been monopolised by nominations from Sad and Rabid Puppies groups, who campaign against works ‘overtly to the left’
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Oh Jesus
 
F

Freeza Under The Shower

Member
Stumpokapow said:
Sad/rabbid puppies are such paper-thin skinned butthurt politically correct morons. "Wahh, wahh, why does no one in sci-fi / fantasy like me? I want a participation medal". Whining fucking millennials, and then they slink back to their safe spaces to cry about it. I'm just fed up with free speech being curbed by the professionally offended.
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*squint*
 
A

Acorn

Member
I love it when pathetic sad sacks of shit lose in something that deeply matters to them, especially when it's of their own making.

Hopefully this will be etched into their collective memories as a constant reminder of the worthless oxygen theives they are. They are a bunch of gigantic, mouth breathing losers and they will forever will be.

It's beautiful like an angel getting it's wings.
 
P

Paganmoon

Member
PhoncipleBone said:
Having not read any of his works, why? I am curious.
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He's not a very good writer. He has good stories, great settings, but his writing can be very amateur hour at times. Just started reading Seveneves (third book of his I'm reading) and he has not gotten better with age.

Messofanego said:
Maybe because "he appears to have gone full SJW [Social Justice Warrior] with a Gamma [male] sauce. Female presidents, token ethnic melanges, you name it, he’s got it to such an extent that were it not for Stephenson’s past gamma [male] markers, I would almost suspect an epic, master-class trolling of the current genre.”

lol
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The fuck?

OniBarubary said:
Holy shit no.

I just think that he's a super influential and important author but he's not actually that great of a writer. His prose is tepid and boring and his characters are flat and uninteresting.
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Agreed.


ryseing said:
I thought Seveneves was the last of his works you could apply that argument to. I can see that for stuff like Anathem but Seveneves was surprisingly readable.
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It's not about readability for me, the prose is just... bad. The introduction to the characters feels so cold, quite a few "asides" just sprinkled everywhere. People being referred to by different monikers from one paragraph to the next (not by other characters, but by the author himself).
And dialog like the following:
"My father desires raw data from Konrad's Wide-Field Infrared Observation Platform, which he has read about on the Internet, so that he can satisfy his personal curiosity about
the thing that hit the moon
" Says one character... who's been established as talking in acronyms a lot, and also, just a few paragraphs earlier said:
"Sorry baby, I was just thinking... You and Cal are still going to get married, and have a great life, no matter what"

It's just not that consistent (just one small examples, so you can tear it apart as much as you want, the whole book is rife with stuff like this.)

Now, I'm going to finish the book, I find the idea interesting, but I am definitely not reading it for the prose.

OniBarubary said:
I'm aware it's not a popular opinion but I stand by it. Stephenson is an amazing idea and world builder and I adored his concepts and everything about the world in Snow Crash which kept me going through his technical manual explanations of shallow characters and absurdly lengthy pages of boring and dry prose.

I've tried 3 books and found them all fascinating and incredibly boring at the same time, sometimes as near as on the same page.

There's no doubt how incredibly influential and important he is to the genre though, which I appreciate fully
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Pretty much saying exactly what I'm thinking about Stephenson.

Loved the world of Snow Crash, the writing, not so much. Liked Diamond Age, but again, the writing. not so much.

Edit3: all this discussion is probably better suited for the What are you reading? thread, so I'll just drop out from here, we can continue it over there if you like :)
 
D

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
aidan said:
Full nomination/voting statistics available here, for those interested: http://www.thehugoawards.org/content/pdf/2016HugoStatistics.pdf

Second year in a row that I would have been on the ballot if not for the puppy campaigns.

Don't cry for me, I've got my rocket, but there are a lot of great folk pushed off the ballot who deserved a spot.
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I never knew they did a separate set of votes to determine 2nd, 3rd, etc. spots.


edit: OK. I'm confused. How exactly do they go about voting for the categories? Does everyone know who won before the award so they can do these runoff votes?
 
K

kswiston

Member
Turin Turambar said:
How the new nomination rules will work?
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Puppies were all voting for a campaigned slate of books/works. Doing this, they were able to dominate the more spread out vote by regular voters. Next year, you get 1 vote per category. If you nominate 5 books, each gets a fifth of a vote instead of a vote each.

They will still be able to push a single choice or two in most categories, but we shouldnt see as many instances of entire categories being all puppy choices.
 
T

tomtom94

Member
aidan said:
Full nomination/voting statistics available here, for those interested: http://www.thehugoawards.org/content/pdf/2016HugoStatistics.pdf

Second year in a row that I would have been on the ballot if not for the puppy campaigns.

Don't cry for me, I've got my rocket, but there are a lot of great folk pushed off the ballot who deserved a spot.
Click to expand...

The most obvious case of Puppy brigading (that I can tell, anyway - I'm afraid I'm not as well-versed in the literary side of SF at the moment) would seem to be Dramatic Presentation - Short Form, where Hardhome lost out in the nominations to that episode of My Little Pony which reactionaries have taken as "fuck you SJWs" for some reason... and the final results are basically the nominations in reverse.
 
F

Faddy

Banned
The Hugos are dumb as hell and while they claim to be "The Fan" award they are really just small insular community in the huge landscape of SciFi/Fantasy. Basically they got derailed by as few as 500 people out of less than 3000 total voters.

People are much better off spending their time and effort on the new awards that Dragoncon are going to hand out which has a true public vote. Worldcon already got bumped from Labor Day weekend by Dragoncon, now their awards are going to be obsoleted as well.
 
T

The Dink

Member
tomtom94 said:
The most obvious case of Puppy brigading (that I can tell, anyway - I'm afraid I'm not as well-versed in the literary side of SF at the moment) would seem to be Dramatic Presentation - Short Form, where Hardhome lost out in the nominations to that episode of My Little Pony which reactionaries have taken as "fuck you SJWs" for some reason... and the final results are basically the nominations in reverse.
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Hahaha. What? I haven't seen an episode of FiM in years and I can tell this is BS. Makes no sense. Sounds like one of those seeing what they want to see kind of things.

Hope the Hugo Awards can be free of such drama next year. But it's probably going to get worse. Sigh...
 
S

SigmasonicX

Member
The Dink said:
Hahaha. What? I haven't seen an episode of FiM in years and I can tell this is BS. Makes no sense. Sounds like one of those seeing what they want to see kind of things.

Hope the Hugo Awards can be free of such drama next year. But it's probably going to get worse. Sigh...
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This was discussed earlier. It's one or more of the following:
* The episode involved a villain who wants everyone to be equal, in the sense that she doesn't want anyone to be better at anything. Rabid Puppies could have chosen it as a willful misinterpretation of the episode, since they're against everyone being equal, even though the hero's alternative from the episode is to accept everyone's differences. This is the "fuck you SJWs" thing tomtom94 mentioned.
* It's a "black best friend" situation, where they try to show that they aren't really against women by electing a show with a majority female cast. It's just that MLP was the only show they could think of.
* They were trying to make the nominations look absurd.
 
D

DrForester

Kills Photobucket
Chuck is taking the loss in stride...

51irZGiu1IL.jpg


https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01KS8I38E/?tag=neogaf0e-20

It’s the night before the Hugo Awards and nominated author Dr. Chuck Tingle is brimming with anxiety. Of course, he’d love to win the most prestigious award in science fiction literature, but winning comes with a lot of baggage and responsibility. On the other side of things, losing would be devastating in it’s own right.

All of this nervous tension comes to a head when Chuck is approached by the sentient physical manifestation of his potential Hugo Award loss, and is forced to confront his future as a writer head on.

Soon enough, Chuck and his Hugo Award defeat are conquering self-doubt and taking a surreal journey through the implications of what it means to be a Hugo Award loser… all culminating in a hardcore anal pounding that transcends space and time.

This erotic tale is 5,000 words of sizzling human on gay sentient award result action, including anal, blowjobs, rough sex, and Hugo Award losing love.
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C

Cyan

Banned
The Dink said:
Hope the Hugo Awards can be free of such drama next year. But it's probably going to get worse. Sigh...
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I expect things to get better, actually. The changes to nomination mean that it'll be substantially more difficult for the rabids to take an entire category. If they manage to get one nominee in each category, it's more of a minor annoyance than outright wrecking the awards. Their nominee will get no-awarded, people won't care that much, they'll eventually get bored of people not reacting to them as much and not push as hard.

The sad puppies on the other hand, seem to have decided to shift to legitimacy by making their list be broader and more inclusive, and a suggestion list rather than a slate. I don't think people will have much of a problem with what they're doing going forward.
 
D

DieH@rd

Banned
Seveneves lost? Wowza.


How was The Fifth Season? I was planning to get it eventually, but this might accelerate my plans.
 
T

The Dink

Member
DrForester said:
Chuck is taking the loss in stride...

51irZGiu1IL.jpg
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This guy is quickly becoming more and more amazing.

Cyan said:
I expect things to get better, actually. The changes to nomination mean that it'll be substantially more difficult for the rabids to take an entire category. If they manage to get one nominee in each category, it's more of a minor annoyance than outright wrecking the awards. Their nominee will get no-awarded, people won't care that much, they'll eventually get bored of people not reacting to them as much and not push as hard.

The sad puppies on the other hand, seem to have decided to shift to legitimacy by making their list be broader and more inclusive, and a suggestion list rather than a slate. I don't think people will have much of a problem with what they're doing going forward.
Click to expand...

That's good. Sounds like the Hugo people know what they're doing. Hope they can iron out any exploitable loopholes these jerks could take advantage of.

SigmasonicX said:
This was discussed earlier. It's one or more of the following:
* The episode involved a villain who wants everyone to be equal, in the sense that she doesn't want anyone to be better at anything. Rabid Puppies could have chosen it as a willful misinterpretation of the episode, since they're against everyone being equal, even though the hero's alternative from the episode is to accept everyone's differences. This is the "fuck you SJWs" thing tomtom94 mentioned.
* It's a "black best friend" situation, where they try to show that they aren't really against women by electing a show with a majority female cast. It's just that MLP was the only show they could think of.
* They were trying to make the nominations look absurd.
Click to expand...

Yeah I can see why they would nominate it now. Checks all their boxes. Still, sucks the internet is becoming more and more fractured and insular with crap like this every year.
 
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