Xenosaga hate thread, special guest Fady K

Sep 27, 2006
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Hadji said:
Alright, now I'm definately locking my door...
Oops, i made that sound wrong :/

Avalon said:
Maybe my tolerance for that kind of material is gone now that I'm older? Quiet frankly, I found those scenes to be quiet bad, almost inappropriate. I almost turned off the console during the scene with
Allen, Kevin and Shion
towards the end. Angst meter went through the roof!

God damn Rule of Rose. Even now when I think about it... some of that stuff was almost unbearable to watch.

Mostly Neverwinter Nights 2. Finishing up my Valkyrie Profile: Lenneth (hard mode) and Final Fantasy XII game as well.
Rule of Rose had some crazy scenes alright.

Im finishing up Valkyrie Profile: Lenneth on hard mode too, i just really hate how every character starts out at level 1 :( It sucks even more that I usually have to send out my best Einjeriar to Odin. Also playing though Godhand, great game, at the end.

trejo said:
Oh man, this thread turned out to be hilarious!!! :lol :lol :lol
Welcome aboard. I didnt think it would break the page 2 barrier, actually.

Ginko said:
you keep saying play, but i wonder, how can you play a movie?

can i say anything without Fady K responding?
Yeah, sure you can. But i had to respond here - there was very little gameplay in Episode I, ill tell you that. But in Episode III, i actually spent a whole lot more time playing than watching.

cicero said:
A raging voice of wisdom looking down with sadness on this pitiable thread. Seriously though, your BFFL is still waiting for you to go hug it out with him, Xenosaga didn't let him down, don't you start.
Ok.

Adam Blade said:
...wtf :lol :lol :lol those 2 need tags..! :lol :lol :lol
As soon as I get the chance to, i probably will :D

Hey, what dya know, 6 pages. Not too shabby.
 
Sep 22, 2006
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A raging voice of wisdom looking down with sadness on this pitiable thread. Seriously though, your BFFL is still waiting for you to go hug it out with him, Xenosaga didn't let him down, don't you start.
Can't believe I didn't see that one coming... <__<

I'll get you back for that... O' raging voice of wisdom.
 
Jul 22, 2006
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One thing I feel hurt the series a lot was the lack of consistency.

As a consumer, I don't really care who develops a game as long as it's entertaining. One glaring problem I found while playing through Episode I,II and III in succession for the second time is that I could actually feel the developers conflict. The format and tone in which the story is told changes in every Episode. This is also true for the music style and just about every aspect of the gameplay. After playing through the games for the second time, I realized they often don't even feel like they are related at all.

Even in Xenogears disc 2... Despite the heavy reformat, it still felt like the same people were telling the story. This isn't the case for Episode I-III.
 
Sep 27, 2006
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Hadji said:


Ah, the memories...
:lol Good one btw! You nailed it, especially with Shion's constant "i-i-i-it's nothing".

Avalon said:
One thing I feel hurt the series a lot was the lack of consistency.

As a consumer, I don't really care who develops a game as long as it's entertaining. One glaring problem I found while playing through Episode I,II and III in succession for the second time is that I could actually feel the developers conflict. The format and tone in which the story is told changes in every Episode. This is also true for the music style and just about every aspect of the gameplay. After playing through the games for the second time, I realized they often don't even feel like they are related at all.

Even in Xenogears disc 2... Despite the heavy reformat, it still felt like the same people were telling the story. This isn't the case for Episode I-III.
You played the series twice? Thats cool...i felt the developer conflict as well.

Error2k4 said:
edit your post please too many pics, just put a link to them.
Why, does it cause some sort of slowdown or something? (im not being sarcastic btw)
 
Jun 10, 2004
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As a consumer, I don't really care who develops a game as long as it's entertaining. One glaring problem I found while playing through Episode I,II and III in succession for the second time is that I could actually feel the developers conflict. The format and tone in which the story is told changes in every Episode. This is also true for the music style and just about every aspect of the gameplay. After playing through the games for the second time, I realized they often don't even feel like they are related at all.
It was mostly the same team for all three though, just a few of the lead developers left after the first.
 
Jun 15, 2004
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I guess Fady K's strategy of being a ****ing dumbass and posting too many images to make the last page readable worked, since I couldn't scroll down a couple posts past his giant image spam without some new image popping up and messing it up constantly. Good show, kid, now I'm personally never going to play a Xenosaga game. I almost wanted to because it'd give me $40 worth of laughs, but now I won't even buy it for the "so bad it's good" value.
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
You played the series twice? Thats cool...i felt the developer conflict as well.
You have no idea how much I wanted to love the series.

Bizarro Sun Yat-sen said:
It was mostly the same team for all three though, just a few of the lead developers left after the first.
I think it's pretty obvious that there were more internal problems then Takahashi simply stepping down...
 
Sep 27, 2006
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firex said:
I guess Fady K's strategy of being a ****ing dumbass and posting too many images to make the last page readable worked, since I couldn't scroll down a couple posts past his giant image spam without some new image popping up and messing it up constantly. Good show, kid, now I'm personally never going to play a Xenosaga game. I almost wanted to because it'd give me $40 worth of laughs, but now I won't even buy it for the "so bad it's good" value.
Well, im glad you wont have to waste any money now.

Avalon said:
You have no idea how much I wanted to love the series.



I think it's pretty obvious that there were more internal problems then Takahashi simply stepping down...
I feel you, i got friends who tried to love the series too. I wonder what really went on with the development team. The whole..what was her name..Takahashi's wife who wrote the script with him..Soriyama Saga i think? I wonder what went on with her too.

One other thing im interested in is knowing what the hell happened to Yasumi Matsuno and why he left the development team of FFXII soooo close to it's completion.
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
Well, im glad you wont have to waste any money now.



I feel you, i got friends who tried to love the series too. I wonder what really went on with the development team. The whole..what was her name..Takahashi's wife who wrote the script with him..Soriyama Saga i think? I wonder what went on with her too.

One other thing im interested in is knowing what the hell happened to Yasumi Matsuno and why he left the development team of FFXII soooo close to it's completion.
Soraya Saga continued to contribute to the Xenosaga project even after being fired I'm told... She was the one who wrote the script for Pied Piper. I only have the translated version to go by, but it's a really great story. She tried to commit suicide after the project as well.

I had no idea Yasumi Matsuno left BEFORE FFXII was finished. I guess that expains why FFXII's story sort of falls apart towards the end. :lol
 
Sep 27, 2006
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Avalon said:
Soraya Saga continued to contribute to the Xenosaga project even after being fired I'm told... She was the one who wrote the script for Pied Piper. I only have the translated version to go by, but it's a really great story. She tried to commit suicide after the project as well.

I had no idea Yasumi Matsuno left BEFORE FFXII was finished. I guess that expains why FFXII's story sort of falls apart towards the end. :lol
She did?? Holy...you got any links to the stories by any chance? Im really interested. Did she work on Episode III's script? And whats this about suicide? What happened :S

Actually, Yasumi Matsuno left at the very end of the development, the game was 95% complete IIRC. I think the story was completed by then. The story falls apart in the end?? Are you for real? I thought the FFXII fans say it ends great?
 
Jun 15, 2004
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Xenosaga kinda proved how short-sighted and broken is concept of episodic RPGs especially when handled by incompetent publishers, I'm sure lot of people might want to check EP3 after all the noise rabid fans are making (me!), but once you tell regular person that's being new to the series, how they first need to go through previous two rather inferior games (or at least watch 10hrs of FMVs) to 'truly get' the third and final game, chance is they won't want to bother afterall.
I don't understand Namco's logic here either, EP2 sold much less than the first game, so instead of trying to atract more newcomers and making it easy for them to get into series with EP3, they pretty much restricted new game for those that played previous two and therefore guaranteed themselves even lesser sales for EP3. Like they wanted series dead and buried afterall.
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
She did?? Holy...you got any links to the stories by any chance? Im really interested. Did she work on Episode III's script? And whats this about suicide? What happened :S

Actually, Yasumi Matsuno left at the very end of the development, the game was 95% complete IIRC. I think the story was completed by then. The story falls apart in the end?? Are you for real? I thought the FFXII fans say it ends great?
I can't find any information on it. It was all posted on her web page a while back along with the list of alterations/cut content from Episode II. Namco had her take it down though.

Maybe fall apart isn't the best way to put it. It goes in a very... awkward direction. Similar to VP2, except this time I didn't expect much from it in the first place so it really didn't matter.

bloke said:
Xenosaga kinda proved how short-sighted and broken is concept of episodic RPGs especially when handled by incompetent publishers, I'm sure lot of people might want to check EP3 after all the noise rabid fans are making (me!), but once you tell regular person that's being new to the series, how they first need to go through previous two rather inferior games (or at least watch 10hrs of FMVs) to 'truly get' the third and final game, chance is they won't want to bother afterall.
I don't understand Namco's logic here either, EP2 sold much less than the first game, so instead of trying to atract more newcomers and making it easy for them to get into series with EP3, they pretty much restricted new game for those that played previous two and therefore guaranteed themselves even lesser sales for EP3. Like they wanted series dead and buried afterall.
I'm glad you brought up some of these points. It really makes me sick when people bitch and moan that it was Episode II that killed the series. In reality, the recline in fans started in Episode I.
 
Sep 27, 2006
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Avalon said:
I can't find any information on it. It was all posted on her web page a while back along with the list of alterations/cut content from Episode II. Namco had her take it down though.

Maybe fall apart isn't the best way to put it. It goes in a very... awkward direction. Similar to VP2, except this time I didn't expect much from it in the first place so it really didn't matter.



I'm glad you brought up some of these points. It really makes me sick when people bitch and moan that it was Episode II that killed the series. In reality, the recline in fans started in Episode I.
Yup, I remember her info was taken down :( Damn, if only I checked back then. Awkward direction for FFXII's story you say? Gotta see through it on my own first...

I think for most people Episode II did kill the series, cause a lot of people were fine with Episode I, the critics too. They all graded Episode I really well. To them, Episode II was the Devil May Cry 2 of the Xenosaga trilogy. Speaking of Devil May Cry, the situation is really similiar! I thought DMC1 was great, same as XSI. I was disappointed with Episode II, but not as much as I was disappointed with DMC2 (actually, not even close). When I heard DMC3 was being made by the core of 2's team, i was worried. When I heard that a lot of Episode II's team is working on Episode III's, i got a little worried. But after playing DMC3 and Episode III, all my worries were put to rest as I have surprisingly experienced the best of the trilogy for both series.
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
cause a lot of people were fine with Episode I, the critics too.
I think many of the fan (including you) were misinformed by how well Episode I did. The game was riding a massive hype train and not only that, but it was also riding the momentum of Xenogears.

Here is a question. Xenosaga Episode I sold around 500k copies in Japan. As you said, everyone agreed it was a good game. If it truly had established a such a loyal fanbase, why were Episode II's initial sale numbers so much lower (around half of what Episode I sold)? Considering that a very high percentage of sales happen within the first week, what would convince half of the fanbase to simply forget about the series?

Another question. Okay, Episode II discouraged the fans. It was altered from the the original script and the gameplay had been destroyed. Xenosaga I and II DS hits the stores. It pretty much fixes the story elements, restores the anime look and gameplay that everyone loved from the original. Now, why did the game perform so poorly (around 20k sales I believe), on the DS no less, a system that was selling anything like crazy at the time.

My answer: People simply were/are not interested. The reviews for the first game might not have been bad, but they certainly weren't stellar. As I recall, a lot of the games appeal at the time was graphics (at least in NA). The game always had very limited appeal and that was always it's problem.
 
Sep 27, 2006
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Avalon said:
I think many of the fan (including you) were misinformed by how well Episode I did. The game was riding a massive hype train and not only that, but it was also riding the momentum of Xenogears.

Here is a question. Xenosaga Episode I sold around 500k copies in Japan. As you said, everyone agreed it was a good game. If it truly had established a such a loyal fanbase, why were Episode II's initial sale numbers so much lower (around half of what Episode I sold)? Considering that a very high percentage of sales happen within the first week, what would convince half of the fanbase to simply forget about the series?

Another question. Okay, Episode II discouraged the fans. It was altered from the the original script and the gameplay had been destroyed. Xenosaga I and II DS hits the stores. It pretty much fixes the story elements, restores the anime look and gameplay that everyone loved from the original. Now, why did the game perform so poorly (around 20k sales I believe), on the DS no less, a system that was selling anything like crazy at the time.

My answer: People simply were/are not interested. The reviews for the first game might not have been bad, but they certainly weren't stellar. As I recall, a lot of the games appeal at the time was graphics (at least in NA). The game always had very limited appeal and that was always it's problem.
Actually, you bring up a very good point, at least for the fanbase. Critics were happy with it, but the fanbase did grow smaller obviously by looking at Episode II's sales. Most of my buds loved Episode I but hated II though, i guess its just personal experience. I think Episode I + II (DS) performed poorly for many reasons. First of all, it looked very dull. Even as a hardcore Xenofreak, i was very very disappointed with I + II's DS look. Also, the fact that the music and design team behind the anime were leading here actually discouraged more fans, because the anime was a disappointment, even to me. Also, even though the system in question is the crazy-selling DS, XSI+II DS barely utilized any DS functionality (aside using the second screen for not too crucial reasons). Also, XSI+II DS actually cuts a lot of stuff back from the bigger picture of the entire story of EpI+II. Having looked at such things, Im not surprised it sold poorly. I mean I wouldve purchased the English version if it existed solely because im a xenonut (or is it xenosucker :p), but from a gameplay standpoint, i look down on it. Still though, i guess many people were disappointed with Episode I because they expected gameplay like Xenogears. After playing Episode I, i was a little let down by the gameplay in the sense that there werent any awesome combos to perform (or stock) like there was in Xenogears, also was disappointed how gears were BARELY used, and lastly, i was extremely disappointed at Mitsuda's soundtrack because there werent too much variety here. Having said that, the story got me hooked, and i enjoyed the gameplay for what it is, but compared to Xenogears, the gameplay does not 'stand tall and shakes the heavens' at all. With Episode III, i felt the gameplay, even more than I did with Xenogears. For a guy like me who enjoyed Episode I and even Episode II to an extent, Episode III is the game we've been waiting for for a good 4 years.

But i can understand why people lost interest after the first Episode. Xenosaga was no Xenogears, so many people, most, were most probably disappointed. I was happy, i kept playing, and Xeno3 paid off big time, because, dare i say it, it trumped Xenogears in my book.
 
Jun 8, 2004
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Avalon said:
I can't find any information on it. It was all posted on her web page a while back along with the list of alterations/cut content from Episode II. Namco had her take it down though.
I assume you're talking about this?

Overview of January-March 2005 FAQ
Answers to frequently asked questions
This page is a summary of FAQ section that was once temporarily placed due to hundreds of inquiries arising from unexpected media coverages of Jan/18/2005 about Soraya's leaving Xenosaga series. Answers were offered only for the purpose of clearing so many misunderstandings. Soraya and this site have no intention of announcing the answers loudly.

1. Soraya noted "Soraya has quit this series. No questions please." in very small fonts on her job history page in this site January 1st, 2005. She used the word "quit" for "to depart from", but not for "to abandon". It was simply her current job status.

2. January 19, 2005 morning (JST), Soraya received some threatening E-mails from upset people. Mails accused Soraya as if she were the traitor, deserter deserved to die.

3. Soraya wondered how the situation suddenly happend. An E-mail from North America has kindly let her know that several game-news sites reported her leaving. Some of those sites brought somewhat misleading views, without any confirmation of the facts.

4. Soraya decided to give answers to most frequently questions. The following are the summary of answers.

* Leaving was not Soraya's decision. Soraya was said goodbye same as in the case of other Episode I artists including Mr. Yasunori Mitsuda, Mr. Kunihiko Tanaka, and the Mr. you-know-who. (Please do not ask Soraya who he is.)

* Soraya is a freelance artist.

* There was no particular reason behind the displacement of old artists. The new director of Xenosaga II/III just wants the saga all new.

* The official advertisement says the new saga will have new sounds, new designs (as seen in Epsode II) and more easier story to read (as seen in the disc 2 of the Episode II).

* Soraya and Tetsuya Takahashi were marginally involved in the Episode II by contributing the first version of the script. (It was not a plot outline but a complete script including actual characters' lines.)

* Soraya's last contribution to the saga was the first version of the script for the Episode II and rewrites of The Pied Piper. (The game for Vodafone sold in Japan 2004)

* The shortened/adapted script of the Episode II is by Monolithsoft.

* You can see Soraya's mark she left to the Episode II in:

o The conversation between Juli and Ziggy

o Momo Encephalon (In first version, It was not Juli's idea of destroying Momo's memory, but a subcommitteeman's. Juli hesitated.)

o The story about U.R.T.V. (with the exception of the chapters after Momo Encephalon and young Albedo's verbal abuse/violent acts against Sakura. They were added by Monolithsoft.)

o Albedo's short speech about the higher dimension. (His last words "You look like you lost your sweetheart ... anyway I hate you both" were added by Monolithsoft.)

* Soraya doesn't know what the story of the Episode III will be like. The new writer of the Episode III will write a new story in his style. (The chapters after Momo Encephalon and Disc 2 are his style.)

* The new team has the right to change or ignore Takahashi's plot outline.

* Soraya wrote approximately half of of the script for the Episode I. She is responsible for:

o Ziggy and his family, Voyager, Momo, Mizrahis, Godwins, Yuriev, U.R.T.V.s, and the part of Shion during her stay in Durandal and the Kookai Foundation

* Soraya is not an expensive artist.

* Soraya has created no delay.

* The parent company is not responsible to the changeover.

* The first version of the script by Soraya and Takahashi was not religiously or politically sensitive. It had just harmless chapters like:
o Ziggy's past history (as seen in The Pied Piper)

o U.R.T.V.'s past history (as seen in the Episode II)

o Shion's past history with Febronia (removed)

o Jr's rapid growing (removed)

o Both juvenile and grown-up Jr. available in the battle (removed)

o The ghost of the old Miltia (removed)

o The death of Sakura (removed)

o Brief reunion with grown-up Citrine (removed)

o Gaignun vs Zohar emulators (removed)

o Jr.'s transformation/overdrive (removed)

o Jr. & Albedo vs U-DO vs KOS-MOS 3rd armament (removed)

o Shion's spiritual seeking/witnessing/awakening (removed)

o The truth about KOS-MOS (removed)

o Conversation between chaos and the red cloak man (removed)

o Conversation between Nephilim and the boy with the blocks (removed)

o An antimatter annihilation of Albedo (removed)

* Soraya has no intention of playing for attention. No one has to pay attention to this.

* Soraya has no option to come back. And she knows well the saga no longer needs Saga.

A message from Soraya
Thank you all who sent us heartwarming messages. I loved the Xeno universe and its wonderful fan base, that's what I'll miss the most. Forget about good old days and enjoy whole new saga.

Best wishes.


Fady K said:
Also, the fact that the music and design team behind the anime were leading here actually discouraged more fans, because the anime was a disappointment, even to me.
The anime staff worked on the game, but Takahashi himself wrote it. There were a lot of interesting changes made to it. Most of them were pretty good.
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Xenogears definitely played a large role in the demise of Xenosaga. It told a story of a much larger scope and of arguably better quality since the concepts felt more fresh. Xenosaga was ultimately just a retelling of those concepts which certainly didn't help it feel original. It also had gameplay to back it up. I'm sure many people spent over 60 hours completing the game.

The main point I was trying to make by bringing up the DS version is that it was far closer to the original script then Episode II. That was one of the major complaints the fans had about Episode II, that the story had bad because it had stayed too far away from the original vision.

The anime staff worked on the game, but Takahashi himself wrote it. There were a lot of interesting changes made to it. Most of them were pretty good.
There was indeed a lot of good stuff added. For example, the stuff involving
Sakura and Albedo
. It makes
Albedo's
final moment in Episode III make so much more sense.

Also... The missing content from Episode II really makes it seem like Xenosaga was indeed following the outline set in Perfect Works...
 
Sep 27, 2006
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B.K. said:
* Leaving was not Soraya's decision. Soraya was said goodbye same as in the case of other Episode I artists including Mr. Yasunori Mitsuda, Mr. Kunihiko Tanaka, and the Mr. you-know-who. (Please do not ask Soraya who he is.)

* There was no particular reason behind the displacement of old artists. The new director of Xenosaga II/III just wants the saga all new.

* The new team has the right to change or ignore Takahashi's plot outline.



* The first version of the script by Soraya and Takahashi was not religiously or politically sensitive. It had just harmless chapters like:
o Ziggy's past history (as seen in The Pied Piper)

o U.R.T.V.'s past history (as seen in the Episode II)

o Shion's past history with Febronia (removed)

o Jr's rapid growing (removed)

o Both juvenile and grown-up Jr. available in the battle (removed)

o The ghost of the old Miltia (removed)

o The death of Sakura (removed)

o Brief reunion with grown-up Citrine (removed)

o Gaignun vs Zohar emulators (removed)

o Jr.'s transformation/overdrive (removed)

o Jr. & Albedo vs U-DO vs KOS-MOS 3rd armament (removed)

o Shion's spiritual seeking/witnessing/awakening (removed)

o The truth about KOS-MOS (removed)

o Conversation between chaos and the red cloak man (removed)

o Conversation between Nephilim and the boy with the blocks (removed)

o An antimatter annihilation of Albedo (removed)


* Soraya has no intention of playing for attention. No one has to pay attention to this.

* Soraya has no option to come back. And she knows well the saga no longer needs Saga.

A message from Soraya
Thank you all who sent us heartwarming messages. I loved the Xeno universe and its wonderful fan base, that's what I'll miss the most. Forget about good old days and enjoy whole new saga.
Best wishes.
Daaaaaaaaaaaaaamn! Why did all this happen??? I wonder why they didnt want her involvement anymore. Those plot points are freakin HUGE! Jr growing? Reunion with Citrine? Shion's awakening? Damn! I know Takahashi supervised the 3rd episode, so at least it didnt alter course too much. In the end, much of the story makes sense though. But damn, this is crazy. I wonder what went on, why they gave such treatment to Takahashi and his wife...


B.K. said:
The anime staff worked on the game, but Takahashi himself wrote it. There were a lot of interesting changes made to it. Most of them were pretty good.
Oh, i didnt know this. However, the gameplay still seemed way too bland, and the reviews indicated this. A missed opportunity i'd say. Btw, dya have any idea about what happened with the whole Soraya story BK?? Last question, any place on the net that details the additions to the story in I+II DS? Thanks for your time either way for clearing up a big mess about what info was taken down.

Avalon said:
Xenogears definitely played a large role in the demise of Xenosaga. It told a story of a much larger scope and of arguably better quality since the concepts felt more fresh. Xenosaga was ultimately just a retelling of those concepts which certainly didn't help it feel original. It also had gameplay to back it up. I'm sure many people spent over 60 hours completing the game.

The main point I was trying to make by bringing up the DS version is that it was far closer to the original script then Episode II. That was one of the major complaints the fans had about Episode II, that the story had bad because it had stayed too far away from the original vision.



There was indeed a lot of good stuff added. For example, the stuff involving
Sakura and Albedo
. It makes
Albedo's
final moment in Episode III make so much more sense.

Also... The missing content from Episode II really makes it seem like Xenosaga was indeed following the outline set in Perfect Works...
Woah...this sucks, my favorite game has an alternate story that was originally intended by its creators but I dont know what it is :( Its like I have to choose one that satisfies me more. Any idea where the original script is (I think this is the craziest question I have ever asked :/ )

Also, can you explain to me how
Albedo's final moment in Episode III makes more sense with the added stuff in EpI+II
. Thanks!!
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
Daaaaaaaaaaaaaamn! Why did all this happen??? I wonder why they didnt want her involvement anymore. Those plot points are freakin HUGE! Jr growing? Reunion with Citrine? Shion's awakening? Damn! I know Takahashi supervised the 3rd episode, so at least it didnt alter course too much. In the end, much of the story makes sense though. But damn, this is crazy. I wonder what went on, why they gave such treatment to Takahashi and his wife...
Essentially, all that missing content is what Episode III was made up of... remnants of a much of a much greater story. Takahashi might have supervised it, but the damage was already done. He was only there to help them make the best of what they had.

Do you understand now why I called Episode III "compromised"?

As for why Namco treated them so badly... The answer is quiet simple. Money.

Xenosaga failed to meet Namco's financial expectations after Episode I. So after that, they started losing interest in the series. So they decided that the game needed more mainstream appeal so they had a younger team of developers work on the game. Takahashi removed as director and Soraya fired. I don't no if this was just a rumor, but Soraya was pretty desperate to stay connected to the series, Pied Piper was pretty much written for free.


Basicly, Sakura discovers Abeldo's wish to reunite with Jr... before she dies If I recall.
 
Sep 27, 2006
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Avalon said:
Essentially, all that missing content is what Episode III was made up of... remnants of a much of a much greater story. Takahashi might have supervised it, but the damage was already done. He was only there to help them make the best of what they had.

Do you understand now why I called Episode III "compromised"?

As for why Namco treated them so badly... The answer is quiet simple. Money.

Xenosaga failed to meet Namco's financial expectations after Episode I. So after that, they started losing interest in the series. So they decided that the game needed more mainstream appeal so they had a younger team of developers work on the game. Takahashi removed as director and Soraya fired. I don't no if this was just a rumor, but Soraya was pretty desperate to stay connected to the series, Pied Piper was pretty much written for free.


Basicly, Sakura discovers Abeldo's wish to reunite with Jr... before she dies If I recall.
Holy shit. Very interesting, very interesting. I still love EpIII :D but, these are all very interesting. Thanks for the info, pal! If you happen to know any site that contains the extra content of the DS game or the original scripts, please let me know. Thank you very much!
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
Holy shit. Very interesting, very interesting. I still love EpIII :D but, these are all very interesting. Thanks for the info, pal! If you happen to know any site that contains the extra content of the DS game or the original scripts, please let me know. Thank you very much!
Only two people know what was really suppose to happen. I don't think we will ever get to hear their story.

I know a lot of people might disagree with me, but the closes thing to the original Xenosaga script is Xenogears: Perfect Works. There are some translations floating around the net.
 
Jun 8, 2004
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Avalon said:
As for why Namco treated them so badly... The answer is quiet simple. Money.]
Actually, it wasn't Namco. It was Monolithsoft. Soraya said that the parent company (Namco) wasn't responsible for the changes. There were just internal problems at Monolithsoft.

Fady K said:
Reunion with Citrine?
That was also seen in Xenosaga I&II.

Before Yuriev first takes control of Nigredo, he feels an urge to go to Fifth Jerusalem. When he gets there, he meets Citrine and she tells him that she called him there using telepathy. Then Yuriev takes control.

There are a lot of interesting changes in I&II. For example, Sergius shows up in the Episode I part of the game, Voyager actually speaks, you see more of the Testaments and Wilhelm, you fight E.S. Naphtali, and the Gnosis appear in the Episode II part. The Episode I half of the game is mostly intact, but the entire Episode II part of the game is rewritten.
 
Sep 27, 2006
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Avalon said:
Only two people know what was really suppose to happen. I don't think we will ever get to hear their story.

I know a lot of people might disagree with me, but the closes thing to the original Xenosaga script is Xenogears: Perfect Works. There are some translations floating around the net.
Damn, thats a real shame. I wonder if Takahashi can release it and make some pocket money :p Would that be legal?

I think i once tried looking at perfect works, but i felt...drunk :S Its crazily detailed. And now that ive finished the Xenosaga trilogy, i might confuse myself even more. Do you still think its worth a look?

B.K. said:
Actually, it wasn't Namco. It was Monolithsoft. Soraya said that the parent company (Namco) wasn't responsible for the changes. There were just internal problems at Monolithsoft.



That was also seen in Xenosaga I&II.

Before Yuriev first takes control of Nigredo, he feels an urge to go to Fifth Jerusalem. When he gets there, he meets Citrine and she tells him that she called him there using telepathy. Then Yuriev takes control.

There are a lot of interesting changes in I&II. For example, Sergius shows up in the Episode I part of the game, Voyager actually speaks, you see more of the Testaments and Wilhelm, you fight E.S. Naphtali, and the Gnosis appear in the Episode II part. The Episode I half of the game is mostly intact, but the entire Episode II part of the game is rewritten.
Gah! Monolith!! How could they do that?? I thought Namco would be since they are responsible for most of the funding :/ BK, these story scenes you mentioned are really interesting, is there a script for it floating around that you'd know about by any chance? Im so curious about these extra details.

And...the entire Episode II part of the game is REWRITTEN??? Please tell me theres a script or faq detailing the story somewhere :'(

Avalon said:
I did not know that.
Same here! Im still surprised...
 
Jun 11, 2005
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I'm really surprised you didnt know this stuff fady, i mean it's your favorite game, and you had absolutely know idea what a mess it was?

I thought it was common knowlege among fans/dissillusioned ex-fans
 
Jul 22, 2006
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Fady K said:
I think i once tried looking at perfect works, but i felt...drunk :S Its crazily detailed. And now that ive finished the Xenosaga trilogy, i might confuse myself even more. Do you still think its worth a look?
It's essentially the foundation for Xenogears/saga, so yeah.
 
Jun 10, 2004
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I had no idea Yasumi Matsuno left BEFORE FFXII was finished. I guess that expains why FFXII's story sort of falls apart towards the end.
According to the developers though, the early and late parts of the game were given a detailed script by Matsuno and they mostly stuck to it --- in fact the actual ending FMV was completed early in development, well before he left. However for the middle third of the story Matsuno never wrote anything beyond a vague outline and that's where they had to improvise.
 
Sep 27, 2006
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pancakesandsex said:
I'm really surprised you didnt know this stuff fady, i mean it's your favorite game, and you had absolutely know idea what a mess it was?

I thought it was common knowlege among fans/dissillusioned ex-fans
Actually, most of this stuff is based off of a script that never came to light and a japanese game which was never localized (and i dont read japanese nor speak it) so i dont know how I was supposed to access that info. Im still looking for a script of XSI+II.

Bizarro Sun Yat-sen said:
According to the developers though, the early and late parts of the game were given a detailed script by Matsuno and they mostly stuck to it --- in fact the actual ending FMV was completed early in development, well before he left. However for the middle third of the story Matsuno never wrote anything beyond a vague outline and that's where they had to improvise.
Yeah? I read that he wrote the entire story. I wonder.
 
Jun 11, 2005
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Fady K said:
Actually, most of this stuff is based off of a script that never came to light and a japanese game which was never localized (and i dont read japanese nor speak it) so i dont know how I was supposed to access that info. Im still looking for a script of XSI+II.
Because it was all fairly well publicised at the time it happened.
 
Jun 7, 2004
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Oh man, now Fady's really getting a beat down. This is what happens when a stupid uneducated American fanboy of Xenosaga tries to tell others what they should be thinking when in reality he has no idea who the real fans of Xenosaga were when it was originally released and why everyone HATES THE GODDAMN SERIES so much. :lol :lol :lol
 
Jun 8, 2004
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duckroll said:
Oh man, now Fady's really getting a beat down. This is what happens when a stupid uneducated American fanboy of Xenosaga tries to tell others what they should be thinking when in reality he has no idea who the real fans of Xenosaga were when it was originally released and why everyone HATES THE GODDAMN SERIES so much. :lol :lol :lol
I'm a true fan and I thought Episode 3 was superior to Episode 1.
 
Sep 8, 2005
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I hate to inform you but pounding nails through your scrotum >>>> Xenosaga 1. It doesn't take a genius nor a Xeno-fan from Japan or even anyone remotely related to MonolitheSoft to tell you that. >:p

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol
 
Sep 27, 2006
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duckroll said:
Oh man, now Fady's really getting a beat down. This is what happens when a stupid uneducated American fanboy of Xenosaga tries to tell others what they should be thinking when in reality he has no idea who the real fans of Xenosaga were when it was originally released and why everyone HATES THE GODDAMN SERIES so much. :lol :lol :lol
Alright, first off - who said Im American? Boy, you sure are one hell of a hypocrite (Dont talk out of your ass, Fady!) - why dont u learn that yourself first. Uneducated? what the hell? Man, you're a bigger waste of time than i thought. I cant believe you're three years older than I am, you sure dont act like it. Grow up, Ducky, and you to keep offending me? Stupid American Uneducated Fanboy? I respected you back then, but what you're doing is low. A little advice - stop talking out of your ass Oh - and before you do it - yeah i knew your age cause i checked ur birthdate. Why? Oh, im just a stalker thats all.

Error2k4 said:
so much for being a hardcore Xenosaga fan hahaha
Oh, i didnt know being a hardcore fan meant that you have to know EVERYTHING about the game. Im really sorry :lol

Tabris said:
I'm a true fan and I thought Episode 3 was superior to Episode 1.
Yeah, same here.

Tabris said:
Time for more pictures! About the scenes that make Xenosaga/gears so amazing.















Very very nice selection Tabris :)

Hadji said:
Funny how this was pretty much the climax of the series... and it sums it up so well.
Its funny these days, people sum up an entire series when they havent gotten through it. I'll wait till you finish it and hear what u have to say.
 
Sep 22, 2006
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Alright, first off - who said Im American?
From his tone, I don't think duckroll literally mean that you're an American, but it was more of an insult. It's 2006 dammit! Being an American is no longer a good thing.

... >___>

Not that there is anything wrong with being an American. =X *flees from warmongers*
 

Error

Jealous of the Glory that is Johnny Depp
Jun 9, 2005
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Puerto Rico
twitter.com
Fady K said:
Oh, i didnt know being a hardcore fan meant that you have to know EVERYTHING about the game. Im really sorry :lol
that and you need to buy all the games from the series like this

:)

hardcore fans buy every shit from the crap they love even if what they love is crap to begin with.