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PoliGAF 2012 Community Thread

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T

thatbox

Banned
Chichikov said:
I read it regularly and I haven't noticed it.

They didn't print it, they posted it on a blog, and they corrected that mistake.
Now yeah, that wasn't the proudest moment in the Washington Post's history, but come on, it's one of the most respected newspapers in the history of the world, especially when it comes to investigative journalism.
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I don't read it regularly, so mostly when I'm exposed to it it's because they're doing or saying something dumb. I'm being exposed to it more often now than I used to be. Sure, they've done some great work, but the industry as a whole is looking shabbier and my perception is that the Washington Post is annoying me more often than other "big" papers on the way down. In any case, it was a pretty offhand comment and I don't feel incredibly strongly about this. It's obviously still a great publication.
 
A

AlteredBeast

Fork 'em, Sparky!
It is still a great paper, and overall they are pretty fair. I have noticed though that they are becoming a bit more "populist" to get readership back up...and it is probably working.
 
T

TacticalFox88

Banned
To recover from the recession of 1920-21, which is one of the most severe economic contractions in U.S. history, the Harding-Coolidge administration reduced taxes and cut government spending to get the government out of the way so that the private sector could make the necessary adjustments. By 1923, the economy was back on track. Despite this, President Obama still says this approach to strengthening the economy has never worked. LIKE this if you think that President Obama and his administration need to get government out of the way to let American businesses build the economy.
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I don't think I've laughed this hard at a Facebook post in a good long while.
 
empty vessel

empty vessel

Member
Chichikov said:
I read it regularly and I haven't noticed it.

They didn't print it, they posted it on a blog, and they corrected that mistake.
Now yeah, that wasn't the proudest moment in the Washington Post's history, but come on, it's one of the most respected newspapers in the history of the world, especially when it comes to investigative journalism.
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I think the Washington Post has moved to the right. I don't even pay attention to it anymore. Although I agree the one slip talked about here isn't very demonstrative of anything. When you say you read it regularly, since when are you talking about? I think it's been pretty conservative since at least Bush's election. So I don't think it's a particularly recent phenomenon. Of course, all media has moved right, so the WaPo isn't unique in this regard, but I think it's moved a lot more than, e.g., the New York Times. (Both papers pushed hard for the Iraq war.)
 
D

Dr. Pangloss

Member
The former head of the Israel FBI, Yuval Diskin, criticized the way the Israel government is handling the Iran situation: http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/world/middleeast/yuval-diskin-criticizes-israel-government-on-iran-nuclear-threat.html?_r=1&hp&gwh=15BB32EF71EAC4334EF23E74608B55A5. Why is there no similar push back here in America? In fact one could say that public opinion is pushed more in favor of war with Iran. No large public figure, which a lot of people respect, is getting air time here in America. Who would be considered a neutral authority that could push us away from intervention? Richard Clarke?
 
C

Clevinger

Member
Romney is now taking credit for the auto bailout:

"[Romney's] position on the bailout was exactly what President Obama followed. I know it infuriates them to hear that," Eric Fehrnstrom, senior adviser to the Romney campaign, said.

"The only economic success that President Obama has had is because he followed Mitt Romney's advice."

"The fact that the auto companies today are profitable is because they've shed costs," Fehronstrom said. "The reason they shed those costs and have got their employee labor contracts less expensive is because they went through that managed bankruptcy process. It is exactly what Mitt Romney told them to do."
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there aren't enough lols in the world
 
O

Oblivion

Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
Maddow complains endlessly about right wingers not coming on her show. Hell, she was begging for more to show up just yesterday.

I'm honestly baffled why so many of them are scared to come on to Maddow's show, yet many go on Matthews, and Soledad O'Brien's show and they're pretty tough interviewers too.

adamsappel said:
The Washington Post is so poorly-edited. Even the analogy on that first page is wrong and should have been caught; "While the Democrats may have moved from their 40-yard line to their 25, the Republicans have gone from their 40 to somewhere behind their goal post." That says the Democrats have moved left in their policies, even as the previous line says they are now center-left.
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lol, I read that line and was wondering if that's what the writer meant, but wasn't sure.

(doesn't know shit about football)
 
C

Chichikov

Member
empty vessel said:
I think the Washington Post has moved to the right. I don't even pay attention to it anymore. Although I agree the one slip talked about here isn't very demonstrative of anything. When you say you read it regularly, since when are you talking about? I think it's been pretty conservative since at least Bush's election. So I don't think it's a particularly recent phenomenon. Of course, all media has moved right, so the WaPo isn't unique in this regard, but I think it's moved a lot more than, e.g., the New York Times. (Both papers pushed hard for the Iraq war.)
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The American media as a whole really betrayed its duty in the lead-up to the Iraq war, but it's not really a right vs. left issue.
It was (theoretically at least) a GOP vs. Democrats issue, but I don't think anyone would accuse the Washington Post of leaning Republican in any meaningful way.
 
empty vessel

empty vessel

Member
Chichikov said:
The American media as a whole really betrayed its duty in the lead-up to the Iraq war, but it's not really a right vs. left issue.
It was (theoretically at least) a GOP vs. Democrats issue, ...
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Agreed about the first part, but that's why I disagree about the last. The Iraq war was bipartisan. Of course, I don't consider "bipartisan" to be "right and left." I consider it to be far right and right.

Chichikov said:
...but I don't think anyone would accuse the Washington Post of leaning Republican in any meaningful way.
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I'm not sure about that. Either way, I'm not equating the Washington Post to Fox News. I'm just saying I think it's a pretty damn conservative, business-friendly paper, much more so than it used to be and more so than the New York Times (which for context I don't think is all that liberal itself).
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
Clevinger said:
Romney is now taking credit for the auto bailout:

there aren't enough lols in the world
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Pathetic. He's clearly recognized how toxic his position was in Michigan, but his repeated reversals on the issue will do him no favors in the election.
PhoenixDark said:
He's partially right. GM did go through a managed bankruptcy, as Romney suggested. The area where he's dead wrong is the bailout. No private companies were looking to invest in GM, especially during the financial crash of 08/09. If it wasn't for the bailout, GM would have either died or taken years to recover.
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Obama and his team did not follow Romney's advice, which is literally what he's claiming.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Copernicus said:
Well to be fair, when your position is every position, it's hard to not be responsible for everything that works out.
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iuxbF.png


Also I'm 98% sure that is part of Romney's strategy.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
PhoenixDark said:
He's partially right. GM did go through a managed bankruptcy, as Romney suggested. The area where he's dead wrong is the bailout. No private companies were looking to invest in GM, especially during the financial crash of 08/09. If it wasn't for the bailout, GM would have either died or taken years to recover.
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But he is 95% wrong. He was against the bail-outs and he was against government money for the managed bankruptcy. Without the government money for the bankruptcy, it would have been a liquidation, not a restructuring.
 
P

Particle Physicist

between a quark and a baryon
speculawyer said:
But he is 95% wrong. He was against the bail-outs and he was against government money for the managed bankruptcy. Without the government money for the bankruptcy, it would have been a liquidation, not a restructuring.
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Exactly what I was going to respond with. You can't be partially right if the result of your advice would have lead to a completely different outcome.
 
P

PhoenixDark

Banned
GhaleonEB said:
Obama and his team did not follow Romney's advice, which is literally what he's claiming.
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True. On one hand Romney claims Obama followed his advice, on the other hand he constantly argues Obama SHOULD have followed his advice; it's ridiculous. But it's certainly true that the managed bankruptcy Romney supported did go through. Was that a case of Obama "following" Romney's advice? Eh, I don't think so
 
D

DeathbyVolcano

Banned
speculawyer said:
But he is 95% wrong. He was against the bail-outs and he was against government money for the managed bankruptcy. Without the government money for the bankruptcy, it would have been a liquidation, not a restructuring.
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It's going to be hilarious to see Romney trump this during the debates, and Obama easily refuting him.

Also, all Obama needs to do is note Michigan's severe drop in unemployment as noted in that graph several pages back.
 
F

Flying_Phoenix

Banned
Jackson50 said:
Who analogizes Iraq to Somalia? I can understand portraying the situation as "okay." Many are invested in portraying Iraq as a stable, functioning state. Goodness, some even portray Afghanistan positively. But Somalia?
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People on other political message boards do so (such as PolitcalForum). I also recall hearing some comments about it being hugely unstable in some documentaries. It always sounded extreme to me so I indirectly asked about it here.

Jackson50 said:
How unstable? It's on the precipice of succumbing to the strife which beset the country a few years ago. And without the presence of coalition troops, the situation is even more problematic. The IISS produced a fairly accurate assessment of the situation. Although, I think they are singularly focused on Maliki while ignoring Iraq's broader institutional predicament. Iraq's federal structure was intended to capture the acquiescence of the Kurds by decentralizing power. But it simultaneously introduced fissures between a few of the provinces and Baghdad. The National Interest published an article on this problem a few months ago.Bilateral relations have deteriorated precipitously. We're annoyed with their duplicity and toleration of insurgent groups that destabilize Afghanistan. They're incensed at the drone strikes and repeated violations of their sovereignty. Really, our interests in Afghanistan are diametric. So there's little hope of a productive solution. We might cajole them into opening the supply routes. But beyond that, the situation will not improve.
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Thank you.
 
G

GhaleonEB

Member
PhoenixDark said:
True. On one hand Romney claims Obama followed his advice, on the other hand he constantly argues Obama SHOULD have followed his advice; it's ridiculous. But it's certainly true that the managed bankruptcy Romney supported did go through. Was that a case of Obama "following" Romney's advice? Eh, I don't think so
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It's a pattern with Romney. He could make his claim more specific and accurate: he argued for a managed bankruptcy, which is what the Obama administration ultimately did, and then talk about the ways they differed. But he wants more than that: to claim the leadership position on the issue (Obama followed him) while ignoring critical details (such as his call for no government backing of the companies during the bankruptcy - which would have meant their liquidation).

But no. He's gotta shoot for the stars.
 
A

Al-ibn Kermit

Junior Member
PhoenixDark said:
True. On one hand Romney claims Obama followed his advice, on the other hand he constantly argues Obama SHOULD have followed his advice; it's ridiculous. But it's certainly true that the managed bankruptcy Romney supported did go through. Was that a case of Obama "following" Romney's advice? Eh, I don't think so
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It's like Romney doesn't know that he will have to debate these issues right in Obama's face. "You just did what I said you should do!! Well kinda."
 
A

AlteredBeast

Fork 'em, Sparky!
Every time Obama speaks creatively, I can't help but like him more and more. His White House Correspondents Dinner speech, while obviously not written (entirely?) by him, he has a pretty good knack for comedy and pretty great comedic timing.

Compare that to Mitt Romney's joke that had a pretty good setup, but he totally could not deliver.
 
T

thatbox

Banned
AlteredBeast said:
Every time Obama speaks creatively, I can't help but like him more and more. His White House Correspondents Dinner speech, while obviously not written (entirely?) by him, he has a pretty good knack for comedy and pretty great comedic timing.

Compare that to Mitt Romney's joke that had a pretty good setup, but he totally could not deliver.
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Yes.
 
A

Al-ibn Kermit

Junior Member
So actually about Mitt Romney and the bail outs.....

http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/can-perrys-staff-run-president

Mitt Romney and Rick Perry were both involved in a discussion of bailouts of Europe and the UAW during the current debate. Perry failed to attack Romney when given a huge opening. His press staff sent a copy of what he should have said:

Mitt Romney on Auto Bailout

In 2008, Mitt Romney promised Michigan voters he would "spend billions more in federal money to bolster struggling automakers." He proposed a five-fold increase in federal funding for the automotive industry: $20 billion in new taxpayer-funded spending.

Romney claimed, "I'm not open to a bailout, but I am open to a workout," he said. "Washington should not be a benefactor, but it can and must be a partner."

Gannett News Service called Romney's plan a "massive federal bailout."

The Associated Press said Romney "told voters what he thought they wanted to hear" and would "do whatever it takes to be president" after his promise to Michigan voters.
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What's so different than what Obama did?
 
A

Aaron Strife

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
Romney's going to look so awkward at the WH Correspondent's Dinner next year
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"I see Mitt Romney is here tonight. Of all the men in the room, I must thank him the most - I wouldn't be here if it weren't for him. Or would I be? I asked him but he gave me a different answer each time. Either way, in the crucial state of Pennsylvania, not knowing who the Steelers were was a big asset to my campaign." - President Obama
 
M

makingmusic476

Member
I just realized how bad Louisiana is a victim of gerrymandering:

800px-LA_2011_HB6_Re-engrossed.jpg


That lovely district 2? Stretches all the way from the center of New Orleans to East Baton Rouge and LSU. They've crammed as much of our urban centers (in particular black dominated areas) into a single district as possible, ensuring the Democrats can only get one of our six spots in the House, even though that doesn't accurately represent our demographics.

I'm just discovering this because I only got into politics within the past couple of years, and this will be my first major election. I was trying to figure out which district I'm in and who I'd be able to vote for, which hasn't been going well.

Does anybody know of a place I can go to figure out who's running against my representatives for the U.S. and state Houses? I can't seem to find out who, if anybody, is challenging these guys (not that they'll lose anyway).
 
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