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[MilkyJoe]

I think his/her analysis is actually a very fair assessment of the Xbox One strategy, it backfired but they did have their business case made for the strategy they took.

My thoughts were - say TV supplier's signal is passed through the XBone, during ad breaks does the bone overlay it's own ads? So the subscriber does not see the ads the supplier is being paid to show, and if so where does the MS stand from a legal point of view with respects to this ad blocking? If that's how it works....

Adding advertising to a subscription movie service is just fucking bonkers, who would use the service? How long did they think it would take for people to just use another streaming method?

 

[Freeman]

MS overall strategy with Xbox has always being poor. They missed the opportunity to become the dominant digital distribution platform for games on PC while they never managing to put windows in the living room (Valve again is ahead of them on trying to put the PC on the living room, etc). They were too focused on trying to be/beat Sony/Nintendo, that they missed every opportunity they had.

Funny enough when they tried to implement their DRM dream (pretty much a reality on PC already) on their consoles it completely failed and combined with other mistakes it pretty much took them back to where they were when they first introduced the Xbox.

To me it makes no sense that the company that has a completely dominant OS on PC, chose to invest on console gaming instead of PC gaming. The sad thing is that Age of Empires and Flight Simulator would have survived and even things like Kinect/voice command would have mattered much more.

 

[Birgitte2004]

Server not to be rude but the problem with your argument is that it fails to explain the initial numbers we're trying to build off of.

We have these numbers to work with for XB1 sales.

US 2013 YTD = 1817k
WW 2013 YTD = 3000k

People said when the 3 million number was announced that that didn't add up either, that it appeared that Microsoft took the real numbers, waited a few days, then added a fudge factor to announce the 3 million number early.

I can't speak to the truth of that, but it had the exact same problem you are trying to explain now, where were all the unaccounted for sales coming from.

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

I hope sales pick up. Owner of an XBO and I am fairly happy with it.

Great endorsement!

 

[nynt9]

I hope sales pick up. Owner of an XBO and I am fairly happy with it.

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

Also, Microsoft used to proudly announce exact 360 sales numbers all the time, but they haven't been doing so for the XB1 for a while, and they've been intentionally fudging numbers. Could the situation be a lot worse than we've been estimating?

 

[Ottoni_Bastos]

Howw much Xone sold in usa LTD?

 

[Exploratory]

"We purposefully did not target the highest end graphics. We targeted it more as a broad entertainment play."

Source: video at http://www.engadget.com/2013/05/21/building-xbox-one-an-inside-look/

I would argue that gaming was, at best, 1/3 of the original Xbox One vision, alongside original TV programming, TV pass through, Kinect voice commands, snap, apps, water coolers and NFL.

That was dumb but having the highest end graphics doesn't necessarily mean you are unequivocally the best gaming machine.

 

[Bgamer90]

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

He said he hopes the sales pick up, so how could that mean that he feels that the discussion doesn't matter?

Howw much Xone sold in usa LTD?

Close to 3 Million. PS4's a little bit above 3.5 Million.

 

[Brad Grenz]

Bear in mind we live in a world where people embrace Android as an OS, which is solely designed to maintain Googles search presence and advertising revenues

Sure, and they did it by offering numerous free, cutting edge and eminently useful services and products. If Android was like Xbox One it would be a ludicrous $300 device you strap to an iPhone to intercept Siri commands and cover Apple's search results with Google ones.

 

[BrokenIcarus]

Close to 3 Million. PS4's a little bit above 3.5 Million.

This is kinda misleading, PS4 is at 3.6M vs Xbox at 2.9.

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=857224

 

[Exploratory]

You can't just say that and not tell us which side of the argument you're falling on.

The mentality that there are two "sides" at all is already a problem.

 

[BabyFaceKillah]

I hope sales pick up. Owner of an XBO and I am fairly happy with it.

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

All he said was that he hopes sales pick up, when did he say this discussion doesn't matter? lol wtf

 

[michaelius]

Not counting out ms either.. Ps3 managed to recover despite being in deeper shit than what xbone is currently facing.

Technically every console is salvagable - only question is if their parent company is willing to invest one or two bilions of dollars into such recovery.

 

[Bundy]

July NPD will only be 4 weeks again.
I have a feeling that the XBone sales will go back to the ~100K range

 

[travisbickle]

The mentality that there are two "sides" at all is already a problem.

Yeah, everyone knows there are three.

 

[Bgamer90]

This is kinda misleading, PS4 is at 3.6M vs Xbox at 2.9.

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=857224

???

Don't see how what I said was misleading. Oh well, that wasn't my intention. Said it because I didn't know the exact figures (down to the ten hundreds) by heart.

July NPD will only be 4 weeks again.
I have a feeling that the XBone sales will go back to the ~100K range

Thinking Xbox One will be around 120K with PS4 being a bit above 200K.

 

[SerTapTap]

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

Also, Microsoft used to proudly announce exact 360 sales numbers all the time, but they haven't been doing so for the XB1 for a while, and they've been intentionally fudging numbers. Could the situation be a lot worse than we've been estimating?

It can't be THAT much worse, we've seen NPD numbers which they can't fudge, right?. At a bare minimum they're doing well enough to be viable in the US.

 

[shinnn]

I hope sales pick up. Owner of an XBO and I am fairly happy with it.

Great endorsement!

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

Also, Microsoft used to proudly announce exact 360 sales numbers all the time, but they haven't been doing so for the XB1 for a while, and they've been intentionally fudging numbers. Could the situation be a lot worse than we've been estimating?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Close to 3 Million. PS4's a little bit above 3.5 Million.

This is kinda misleading, PS4 is at 3.6M vs Xbox at 2.9.

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=857224

Those comments doesn't exists right? They are product of my mind right? Just my persecution complex creating false impression that people jump on anyone that do not downplay the xbox. lol.

 

[QaaQer]

I'm still perplexed as to what the entire point of this was,

The actual vision of the X1 was pretty epic. MS would control software distribution 100%, have users paying a monthly fee, and have a biometric device in people's homes that could be used to tailor and evaluate advertising effectiveness.

If Sony had pulled another ps3, and the Kinect2 hadn't been torpedoed by the overpromising and subsequent backlash from Kinect1, the X1 could have been wildly profitable.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

Also, Microsoft used to proudly announce exact 360 sales numbers all the time, but they haven't been doing so for the XB1 for a while, and they've been intentionally fudging numbers. Could the situation be a lot worse than we've been estimating?

I think that is a given.

Just look how awful all XBone hardware SKUs are performing on the Amazon best sellers rankings for an immediate indication of how it is selling online.

It's way off the pace of the PS4.

 

[Dragonborn]

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Those comments doesn't exists right? They are product of my mind right? Just my persecution complex creating false impression that people jump on anyone that do not downplay the xbox. lol.

There's nothing wrong with the second part, he was being misleading by rounding down for one and up for the other. The first one, yea it was a bit harsh on the dude, but I guess some people are fed up with people coming into sales threads and downplaying sales... still, rather harsh in my opinion.

 

[QaaQer]

Sure, and they did it by offering numerous free, cutting edge and eminently useful services and products. If Android was like Xbox One it would be a ludicrous $300 device you strap to an iPhone to intercept Siri commands and cover Apple's search results with Google ones.

so funny...

 

[Bgamer90]

There's nothing wrong with the second part, he was being misleading by rounding down for one and up for the other. The first one, yea it was a bit harsh on the dude, but I guess some people are fed up with people coming into sales threads and downplaying sales... still, rather harsh in my opinion.

Heh, I wasn't being misleading. PS4's sales are a bit above 3.5 Million and the Xbox One should hit 3 million with this month's NPD (we'll see though).

FYI, the Xbox One is actually at 2.92 Million if you want to be more precise so he was ::gasp!:: "rounding down" too.

Edit: And the PS4 is at 3.57 million; he said 3.6 Million. Yet I'm the one being really misleading. OK. Wow.

 

[Dragonborn]

Heh, I wasn't being misleading. PS4's sales are a bit above 3.5 Million and the Xbox One should hit 3 million with this month's NPD (we'll see though).

FYI, the Xbox One is actually at 2.92 Million if you want to be more precise so he was ::gasp!:: "rounding down" too.

Downplaying sales? Haha, seriously?

I didn't say you did it intentionally, just that it was misleading (perhaps by accident, I certainly don't remember sales by heart either)

The downplaying sales part wasn't about your post, it was the first half of Shinn's comment (the dude who said he's fairly happy). I'm saying the response to his post was rather harsh.

 

[NoMoreTrolls]

Sure, and they did it by offering numerous free, cutting edge and eminently useful services and products. If Android was like Xbox One it would be a ludicrous $300 device you strap to an iPhone to intercept Siri commands and cover Apple's search results with Google ones.

Okay, that's funny
Off topic, but does anyone else get annoyed at the rampant use of "heh" in disagreement posts? I'm seeing it more and more nowadays. Don't know why, but it gets under my skin.

That aside, those shipment numbers don't sound very promising, and the disparity between reported sales that we know from the US and European countries and the 3M sold announcement back in the day is interesting. Thanks to the GAF consensus for the analysis--interesting, indeed.

 

[AnthonypUK]

Heh, I wasn't being misleading. PS4's sales are a bit above 3.5 Million and the Xbox One should hit 3 million with this month's NPD (we'll see though).

FYI, the Xbox One is actually at 2.92 Million if you want to be more precise so he was ::gasp!:: "rounding down" too.

Edit: And the PS4 is at 3.57 million; he said 3.6 Million. Yet I'm the one being really misleading. OK. Wow.

Yours was more misleading

his 2.9 versus 3.6 - 0.7 lead

actual 2.92 versus 3.57 - 0.65 lead

Yours 3m versus 3.5 - 0.5m lead

so yeah yours was more wrong, he was rounding correctly, your supposed to do it to the nearest whole, you did it up on one and down on the other which was incorrect.

 

[QaaQer]

...

Just watched that movie yesterday, really surprised to see a reference here. kudos.

 

[zomgbbqftw]

Heh, I wasn't being misleading. PS4's sales are a bit above 3.5 Million and the Xbox One should hit 3 million with this month's NPD (we'll see though).

FYI, the Xbox One is actually at 2.92 Million if you want to be more precise so he was ::gasp!:: "rounding down" too.

Edit: And the PS4 is at 3.57 million; he said 3.6 Million. Yet I'm the one being really misleading. OK. Wow.

Including July sales for XB1 to hit 3m and cutting off 70k from PS4 to make it 3.5m vs rounding to the nearest 0.1m. It is pretty clear who is being misleading and trying to make an apples vs oranges comparison. Including July sales the PS4 is likely going to be at ~3.8m vs ~3.1m for XB1, a gap of 700k.

And at the end of it all, he was off by 50k while you were off by 150k, in pure mathematical terms you were more misleading.

 

[mightynine]

My thoughts were - say TV supplier's signal is passed through the XBone, during ad breaks does the bone overlay it's own ads? So the subscriber does not see the ads the supplier is being paid to show, and if so where does the MS stand from a legal point of view with respects to this ad blocking? If that's how it works....

Adding advertising to a subscription movie service is just fucking bonkers, who would use the service? How long did they think it would take for people to just use another streaming method?

No, you're over thinking it a bit. The X1 wouldn't overtake commercial breaks on TV, but if you wanted to pull up the Xbox guide to see what else is on during a commercial break, you can bet there would be a spot for an ad there.

Or if you searched Netflix through the Xbox UI, there could be an ad there as well.

Or if you were watching a Xbox Entertainment Studios production, the commercial breaks could be highly tailored to you based on what Kinect was gathering. You know how Hulu will sometimes ask you what ad you want to sit through, or asks if the current commercial is relevant to you? This could all be done on the back end without your input.

In my opinion, Microsoft's vision with the X1 was to make it a continuous part of your media experience, not just when you wanted to play games or watch Netflix. By adding their layer into the mix, that was a layer they could sell - and with Kinect just sucking up data left and right, they could offer advertisers very specific audiences.

Now, all of that opportunity for the Xbox One to make money is somewhat gone - Kinect is still in play, but it won't be on every Xbox going forward, and you don't know how many might just throw it in the closet now that it's definitely not necessary and developers probably won't do more than a passing inclusion of some Kinect feature going forward knowing it's a fragmented user base.

So now you have Microsoft trying to adjust the X1 as a mainly gaming box - something that it wasn't made to be. That's going to be the problem going forward - you can change the window dressing and the presentation all you want, but that thing was built from the ground up to serve a very different purpose. You're going to be fighting that going forward.

 

[Percy]

Heh, I wasn't being misleading. PS4's sales are a bit above 3.5 Million and the Xbox One should hit 3 million with this month's NPD (we'll see though).

FYI, the Xbox One is actually at 2.92 Million if you want to be more precise so he was ::gasp!:: "rounding down" too.

Edit: And the PS4 is at 3.57 million; he said 3.6 Million. Yet I'm the one being really misleading. OK. Wow.

Uh... if you had the exact numbers why didn't you just post those in the first place? Would have been a lot quicker to type out if nothing else.

 

[MilkyJoe]

No, you're over thinking it a bit. The X1 wouldn't overtake commercial breaks on TV, but if you wanted to pull up the Xbox guide to see what else is on during a commercial break, you can bet there would be a spot for an ad there.

Or if you searched Netflix through the Xbox UI, there could be an ad there as well.

Or if you were watching a Xbox Entertainment Studios production, the commercial breaks could be highly tailored to you based on what Kinect was gathering. You know how Hulu will sometimes ask you what ad you want to sit through, or asks if the current commercial is relevant to you? This could all be done on the back end without your input.

In my opinion, Microsoft's vision with the X1 was to make it a continuous part of your media experience, not just when you wanted to play games or watch Netflix. By adding their layer into the mix, that was a layer they could sell - and with Kinect just sucking up data left and right, they could offer advertisers very specific audiences.

Now, all of that opportunity for the Xbox One to make money is somewhat gone - Kinect is still in play, but it won't be on every Xbox going forward, and you don't know how many might just throw it in the closet now that it's definitely not necessary and developers probably won't do more than a passing inclusion of some Kinect feature going forward knowing it's a fragmented user base.

So now you have Microsoft trying to adjust the X1 as a mainly gaming box - something that it wasn't made to be. That's going to be the problem going forward - you can change the window dressing and the presentation all you want, but that thing was built from the ground up to serve a very different purpose. You're going to be fighting that going forward.

Thanks for that!

Last paragraph, agree entirely. Can't beleive that they chose this path, well I can, but i still can't it ... Dicks...

 

[Banjo-Kazooie]

Yeah, thanks for the "I have an XB1 and I am happy with it so this discussion doesn't matter" post, we had been going for about 60 posts without one so you brought us back on track.
Why do people always do this?

Also, Microsoft used to proudly announce exact 360 sales numbers all the time, but they haven't been doing so for the XB1 for a while, and they've been intentionally fudging numbers. Could the situation be a lot worse than we've been estimating?

Stop, you're trying too hard, reading into stuff that isn't there, lol.

 

[Coulomb_Barrier]

So now you have Microsoft trying to adjust the X1 as a mainly gaming box - something that it wasn't made to be. That's going to be the problem going forward - you can change the window dressing and the presentation all you want, but that thing was built from the ground up to serve a very different purpose. You're going to be fighting that going forward.

Yes, I echoed this comment earlier.

The legacy in it's other purpose is in the chosen lower specifications. But most immediately, from a physical point of view the design of the console tells a tale.

It looks like a set-top box. It is so huge because it was designed to be switched on all day as you'd use it in the background of your TV viewing. So the Xbone had to operate silently and stay cool at the same time to avoid the diabolical overheating problems of the original 360.

So they overengineered. The unit box is so big so that they could put a huge, slower moving (in comparison to what's in the PS4) fan inside which operates more silently. But I also think I remember reading that the design of the insides is quite clumsy compared to the PS4 which has a more intricate way of dissipating heat through it's vents.

 

[Chobel]

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Those comments doesn't exists right? They are product of my mind right? Just my persecution complex creating false impression that people jump on anyone that do not downplay the xbox. lol.

THIS PROVES IT. THE INTERNET HATE THE XBOX!

 

[Game4life]

I hope XB1 sells well enough for MS to continue. MS obviously made mistakes but have rectified as much as they can without taking massive losses. They also seem to be investing in more exclusives as well. I hope by the end of this gen they manage to develop a first party line up that is similar to Sony's. MS is making the right moves. Hopefully customers forgive the initial goof up and give this product a chance. Its not perfect but its not bad either in my opinion.

 

[Jimmyfenix]

THIS PROVES IT. THE INTERNET HATE THE XBOX!

Confirmed

 

[DustyVonEric]

Some of our local stores had a end of the month 'send back' shipment, where excess product is sent back to the warehouses, either to be re-distributed, or be 'bought back' by the manufacturer. Some of our original remaining Kinect SKU packs (Standard SKU, not TF) XB1s were on those shipments. Does this mean MS is buying back the old SKUs? I can't track those exact shipments after they leave the stores, but considering we had some of that inventory sitting there for well over 2 months, it seems likely.

What does this translate to? MS was able to make some serious numbers in the initial launch, but they are not sustaining momentum. We're not getting big shipments anymore, cause even smaller shipments last us longer. That's not good for MS. That means that our stores aren't needing as much inventory, and if we're sending back old inventory, that's even worse. Do I think this is doom and gloom? Not necessarily. It just doesn't sign off on sunshine and roses.

Damning. And with Amazon rankings, I'm actually beginning to believe that June really won't be a sustained climb in sales. I was thinking MS would wait until after the holidays for a price cut, but now it may happen just in time for the holidays.

I guess it depends on MS' "bloodlust" for Sony to quote Pachter from a Pach-Attack or Bonus Round. Be a successful and profitable second, or still really try for the win or at least tie at this point (like last gen sales). July NPD is gonna be crazy.

Edit:

I think this will be the last Xbox.

I feel this statement is very premature. The Xbox will have to sell gamecube numbers for this to be even a possibility.

Even if MS leaves consoles, I have no doubt that Xbox will spread to other devices.

Heck, we know that's where Playstation is headed, so I don't know if it really makes sense for MS to dump a fortune into trying to recapture market and mindshare for just a relatively small pool console buyers when the Xbox service could continue on PC, phones, tablets, tv's...

 

[entremet]

I think this will be the last Xbox.

 

[Game4life]

I think this will be the last Xbox.

I feel this statement is very premature. The Xbox will have to sell gamecube numbers for this to be even a possibility.

 

[AmaterasuOni]

July NPD will only be 4 weeks again.
I have a feeling that the XBone sales will go back to the ~100K range

Or below, because people are getting PS4 for Destiny.

 

[DC R1D3R]

cmon microsoft, wtf's wrong with you guys?

Step it up a notch man!

 

[Jimmyfenix]

cmon microsoft, wtf's wrong with you guys?

Step it up a notch man!

What do you want them to do ?

 

[MilkyJoe]

What do you want them to do ?

Buy the Bond licence, re-hire old Rare team and release that HD Goldeneye that never surfaced.... (but with better graphics)

 

[serversurfer]

Buy the Bond licence, re-hire old Rare team and release that HD Goldeneye that never surfaced.... (but with better graphics)

Yeah, but graphics don't really matter in the grand scheme of things.

Hey, speaking of graphics, did you hear they're remaking the old Halo games?? The exact same games you already played, except with better graphics!! And who can say no to better graphics?? Amirite???

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

The mentality that there are two "sides" at all is already a problem.

erm, okay?

 

[MilkyJoe]

Yeah, but graphics don't really matter in the grand scheme of things.

Hey, speaking of graphics, did you hear they're remaking the old Halo games?? The exact same games you already played, except with better graphics!! And who can say no to better graphics?? Amirite???

But Bond was great Halo was hmmm...

 

[Cthulhu_Steev]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------




Those comments doesn't exists right? They are product of my mind right? Just my persecution complex creating false impression that people jump on anyone that do not downplay the xbox. lol.

Mine was a stupid joke because he said 'fairly happy', you loon - nothing deeper than that. I think you need to take a break from forums, the last few days appear to have been hard on you.

Would you like me to make a joke at another console's expense? Just name your target and I'll give it a go.

 

[Dragonborn]

Buy the Bond licence, re-hire old Rare team and release that HD Goldeneye that never surfaced.... (but with better graphics)

I don't think HD Goldeneye would be possible without Nintendo's permission (in fact, iirc, that's why it didn't happen).

How I'd love a Goldeneye makeover similar to what they did with Perfect Dark.

 

[Krilekk]

The actual vision of the X1 was pretty epic. MS would control software distribution 100%, have users paying a monthly fee, and have a biometric device in people's homes that could be used to tailor and evaluate advertising effectiveness.

If Sony had pulled another ps3, and the Kinect2 hadn't been torpedoed by the overpromising and subsequent backlash from Kinect1, the X1 could have been wildly profitable.

Yeah, but they forgot the most important thing: To sell for more than the competition you better make sure you got better hardware. X1 wont take off until it is $100 cheaper than PS4, being 30% less powerful.

 

[zeromcd73]

What do you want them to do ?

Banjo Threeie and/or Conker 2 would certainly get them a sale from me