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[StereoVsn]

Tablets & phones is the new target.

They will fight with Apple for dominance in the console level games on phones market but Portal will already be giving everyone a taste of this.

What console level games? Mobile players don’t buy them, most phones can’t run them (even 15 pro max runs re4 like shit) and if you are talking Genshin type Gatcha games, MS doesn’t own a mobile store.

Yes, 3rd party stores will be out in Europe and other countries but I disbelieve most folks will use them.

 

[onQ123]

What console level games? Mobile players don’t buy them, most phones can’t run them (even 15 pro max runs re4 like shit) and if you are talking Genshin type Gatcha games, MS doesn’t own a mobile store.

Yes, 3rd party stores will be out in Europe and other countries but I disbelieve most folks will use them.

Just wait

 

[geary]

The next xbox is supposed to come out in 2025 or 2026 so the design is finished at this point. He works with Microsoft so he knows

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Obviously there is some truth to the fact that you saturate the subscriptions to a certain point and then the only new growth on console will be a percentage of the new users coming on board. That's true for Sony as well. I'm not sure why Warren is trying to make that a negative here. Even with Sony selling as many units as they are, a lot of those users will be people that already had a PS4 so growth for the subscriptions will be somewhat limited. PC is a bit more wide open for the moment, just because subscription services are a newer idea in that space.

I'm not sure how a hybrid system of any kind is going change that overall. The easy growth is always going to be at the beginning, MS has a lot of software in the works that should help their subscription numbers (CoD potentially on GP, etc.).

Sony is still selling a tremendous number of units, many of which to new PSN users. So somewhat of a difference there.

You'll also notice that Sony hasn't really started their PS+ PC/Mobile push yet, but that will come too.

 

[diffusionx]

We've all speculated about this sort of thing for a long time, as the sales numbers came out and stuff, but it's interesting how all these people with "connections" are dropping it all at once. Can't be an accident, they got permission to start leaking/discussing it from their sources.

 

[BennyBlanco]

If they really want to attract to more subs on PC they should probably work on their launcher. It is absolutely dogshit and has been since it’s inception. Also try to work something out with Valve to get it working natively on steam deck, but that is probably asking too much.

 

[GHG]

If they really want to attract to more subs on PC they should probably work on their launcher. It is absolutely dogshit and has been since it’s inception. Also try to work something out with Valve to get it working natively on steam deck, but that is probably asking too much.

I don't think they will fuck with Linux, but stranger things have happened and they might be getting desperate.

 

[kruis]

Tablets & phones is the new target.

They will fight with Apple for dominance in the console level games on phones market but Portal will already be giving everyone a taste of this.

If MS wants to target tablets and phones, they've bought the wrong companies. Bethesda, Activision and Blizzard make games primarily for consoles and PCs, not mobile devices.

 

[mckmas8808]

Its no longer the no-brainer deal that it used to be as it's too expensive now. They lost 3 subs just from my house. Now 2 kids in my house only sub for 1 month when there is an expensive game they want to play and then cancel immediately.

And people forget that those $1 subs were a real thing. At some point, those people had to choose to stay at $17 a month or not. Xbox gamers thought we were trolling, but nope. It's the reality.

 

[//DEVIL//]

Tom Warren is dried up

 

[jm89]

Any what's going on with the PC sub numbers?

MS boast about PC being a big market, but is that really a market that is going to give them the growth they want in the long term?

Biggest hurdle is gamepass is linked to the windows store, whilst alot of the PC gamers are on steam.

I think that will be the problem to getting gamepass to really grow on PC in the long term.

Can't see valve wanting gamepass on steam either.

 

[Heisenberg007]

We've all speculated about this sort of thing for a long time, as the sales numbers came out and stuff, but it's interesting how all these people with "connections" are dropping it all at once. Can't be an accident, they got permission to start leaking/discussing it from their sources.

Their source:

 

[ungalo]

Any what's going on with the PC sub numbers?

MS boast about PC being a big market, but is that really a market that is going to give them the growth they want in the long term?

Biggest hurdle is gamepass is linked to the windows store, whilst alot of the PC gamers are on steam.

I think that will be the problem to getting gamepass to really grow on PC in the long term.

Can't see valve wanting gamepass on steam either.

Especially when Microsoft themselves want that Steam money. That's basically the only place where they can hope to make some cash with each individual release.

They're on all fronts following every opportunity that presents itself to boost revenue even at the cost of the consistency of their so-called strategy on the long term.

Just like they precipitated the Gamepass strat on console because they had no hope of competing when the situation wasn't that desperate imo.

Xbox are king at undermining themselves then acting like they got pushed into a corner by the state of the industry.

 

[mckmas8808]

Still blows my mind how they managed to screw things up midway through the 360 gen. I mean, that console (hardware) was TRASH and it still became a success. They could have offed Sony by now. Instead, they ruined it all. What a waste.

The bolded would have NEVER happened!

I have sub for less then a years before saying fuck this shit, it made me play less don’t know why.

This is very interesting! I wonder if it was the "too many options" theory. Like it's hard to focus on one thing, when there's 50 items in front of you at the same time.

In December during Christmas Jez, Warren, etc...denying all this, January begins and they already take off their mask, so the new strategy is to kneel and become a third party and that is now fine for Xbox, a few years ago Not weeks but now yes...ok, and while Spencer and Greenberg are hiding in the cave waiting for the storm to pass.

In the end everything was said about the mistake of a series S, the GP that that was not sustainable and so many other things for which they called you everything...we were right and it was time to pull out the cable.

I wish more people would have listen to people like us. We been saying this for years!

 

[Freelance Yakuza]

Shill "journalists" got the latest script, so they're trying their best to calm down the hardcore fans.

The shift is pretty obvious.

Remember when folks kept saying, "Oh, Microsoft has to put their games on other consoles or go third party" after the ABK acquisition?

The shills went all crazy, calling it trolling or just plain stupid. People on Era got banned because of this.

And now? Now they're like, "Hey, it's the perfect strategy, totally makes sense..." Funny how things change, huh?

 

[mckmas8808]

He was able to deny the 3rd party push right before christmas so they could still sell XBS over the holidays, as much as they can to get inventory levels lower, but he knows they have to start publishing games soon. How long can you deny a thing when it's literally happening?

Why announce Blade, but not announce that it is exclusive? Why not confirm it's exclusive when asked? It's because by leaving in question what games will be exclusive or not, they can maintain the narrative in fanboy communities that there are still potential exclusives and thus value in owning an Xbox. Eventually, we'll hear that Blade is multiplatform, but the time between then and now, Xboxes can still sell and people aren't trading their Xboxes in.

The last thing Microsoft wants is people canceling Gamepass and trading their Series S and X back in to get PS5s only for people to buy 2nd hand Series S/X for pennies on the dollar, but have no interest to get GamePass because they're already cheap and don't spend money like that. A liquidation of the fanbase is entirely possible.

I never thought about it this way. The bolded would be INSANE!!!

I think people are overthinking the ARM thing. He's just saying they're going for an inexpensive streaming box that also can play games. What that means as far as performance is the most interesting detail to find out about this approach. I'm sure all of those power crown Xbox enthusiasts are going to be pissed if this becomes their focus.

Nah man. The bolded is why people aren't overthinking the ARM thing. It's HUGE news if true.

 

[Kings Field]

You are being malevolent, you know that streaming from a console to the deck doesn't mean having gamepass on steam.

what are you talking about? Gamepass works flawlessly on Steam Deck with the XBplay app….

 

[gothmog]

Nah man. The bolded is why people aren't overthinking the ARM thing. It's HUGE news if true.

Yeah I see your point. Mine was more around I work with ARM all the time (primarily migration of expensive workloads from X86 to ARM) and people really don't understand that ARM is as close to apples to apples as it has ever been while being in some cases faster and more power efficient. I end up having to do FUD fighting sessions with my clients often because their engineers overthink the architecture change. Most libraries out there have updated to support these architectures and those that didn't had to after apple went ARM with the M series chips.

 

[crunchyBiscuits]

Sounds like the tide is changing for Xbox and quite soon.

Quite appropriate that it's Sea of Thieves that's being ported, then

 

[Killjoy-NL]

Game pass is amazing. Bringing it to more platforms makes sense. Netflix didn't stay on PCs.

It's a double-edged sword.

If they want GP to grow, they need to expand. And they need it to grow for revenue.

At the same time, expanding the service to other platforms, they either have to acquire more studios/publishers or pay an immense fee per game to compensate for the possible loss in revenue on Playstation and Nintendo.
This doesn't seem sustainable for major titles day one and/or will force them to (drastically) increase sub-fees.

 

[foamdino]

Yeah I see your point. Mine was more around I work with ARM all the time (primarily migration of expensive workloads from X86 to ARM) and people really don't understand that ARM is as close to apples to apples as it has ever been while being in some cases faster and more power efficient. I end up having to do FUD fighting sessions with my clients often because their engineers overthink the architecture change. Most libraries out there have updated to support these architectures and those that didn't had to after apple went ARM with the M series chips.

This is our experience also. For server workloads ARM is very good and much more energy efficient than intel xeons.

 

[Nydius]

Tom Warren is dried up

All the flavors available to you and you chose salt.

Tom's just telling the truth. Game Pass subs plateaued a year ago, perhaps longer. Xbox console sales have significantly slowed down and, to no one's surprise, people on PC prefer Steam and GOG over Windows Store where Game Pass resides. If Game Pass was still growing, Microsoft would be shouting that fact from the rooftops. Instead, they have spent the last several years going out of their way to obfuscate sales numbers, subscription numbers, hardware numbers. They rely on easily manipulated "player metric" numbers.

Microsoft went all in on Game Pass and it has hit a wall. The two markets they need to expand (per Spencer's testimony at the FTC hearing), PC and Cloud, aren't growing. Console sales have practically dropped off a cliff. The potential market for Game Pass is tapped out unless they start putting it in other places (like Samsung TVs).

It's really no wonder the rumors about them moving some first party IPs onto competing platforms are coming fast and furious.

 

[mckmas8808]

Yeah I see your point. Mine was more around I work with ARM all the time (primarily migration of expensive workloads from X86 to ARM) and people really don't understand that ARM is as close to apples to apples as it has ever been while being in some cases faster and more power efficient. I end up having to do FUD fighting sessions with my clients often because their engineers overthink the architecture change. Most libraries out there have updated to support these architectures and those that didn't had to after apple went ARM with the M series chips.

Interesting......I wonder how much this can complicate the creation of programming when the majority of games will be built on the x86 architecture though. I'm "assuming" the workloads that you are migrating aren't as sensitive to break things like making a video game though. Is it?

On one hand, you'd have PC, Nintendo Switch 2, and PS6. And on the other hand, you'll have ARM for mobile phones, tablets, MacBooks, and the next Xbox next-gen console. It feels like one group isn't like the other.

 

[balls of snow]

Guess what?!!! If you actually release some AAA 1st party games and some exclusive 3rd party games on GamePass then the subscribers will grow. There has been basically nothing in a year other than a good HiFi Rush, bad Redfall, mediocre Starfield and a niche Forza. That is it. That won't drive new subscribers. They are out there. I for one, would re-subscribe if they ever started coming out with new games......but they rarely have.

Not true. Lies of P, Warhammer Darktide and Like A Dragon Gaiden were day 1 gamepass. Quality games.

 

[GHG]

what are you talking about? Gamepass works flawlessly on Steam Deck with the XBplay app….

You're joking right?

Do you understand what that video you linked is showing?

 

[Topher]

You're joking right?

Do you understand what that video you linked is showing?

eh.....I pointed this out to him earlier.

Yeah, but that only streams from an Xbox console. I doubt we will see a native Xbox app on Steam Deck. Microsoft wants those Steam sales.

 

[Beechos]

How can you grow gamepass console sales if you don't sell any consoles smh

 

[Heisenberg007]

The shift is pretty obvious.

Remember when folks kept saying, "Oh, Microsoft has to put their games on other consoles or go third party" after the ABK acquisition?

The shills went all crazy, calling it trolling or just plain stupid. People on Era got banned because of this.

And now? Now they're like, "Hey, it's the perfect strategy, totally makes sense..." Funny how things change, huh?

Yep, the narrative until just last week was "you don't buy publishers for $75 billion only to put games on your competitors' consoles LOL!"

 

[kruis]

I think people are overthinking the ARM thing. He's just saying they're going for an inexpensive streaming box that also can play games. What that means as far as performance is the most interesting detail to find out about this approach. I'm sure all of those power crown Xbox enthusiasts are going to be pissed if this becomes their focus.

A low-powered ARM box only makes sense for streaming Xbox games, not for playing next gen console games. There are no ARM SOCs that can compete with AMD when it comes to price and game performance. Even Apple fails in that regard. A $3000 Apple M3 Max laptop can't match the $500 Xbox Series X' visuals.

 

[Kerotan]

Like I said before Xbox brand as a console is dead.

Game pass on ps5 alongside other subs like EA Play, GTA+, Uni Play is the future. Sony get their 30% cut on all revenue and everyone's happy.

 

[Moriarty1889]

R.I.P. Xbox consoles……….very sad but all because of Phil. He has destroyed the console platform for MS. Pushing gamepass more than the console for years now and putting their games on PC day one and devaluing the console brand even more. Insane how this man has been allowed to destroy Xbox from within.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

Its no longer the no-brainer deal that it used to be as it's too expensive now.

Can’t do the XBL $1 trick anymore, eh?

 

[mayham2199]

I wonder what happened to those billions of gamers out there.

They are still out there. They just aren't interested in paying for a sub service when most of them hop on a game while they take a dump or wait for their appointment\meeting to start. From the beginning I didn't think a sub service would work but I wasn't sure. Now I think it's clear, it doesn't work for gaming the same way it does for passive entertainment like music and tv.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

They're on all fronts following every opportunity that presents itself to boost revenue even at the cost of the consistency of their so-called strategy on the long term.

It almost seems like someone internally is pushing for Xbox division to start showing profitability after 20 years…

 

[Hollowpoint5557]

Can’t do the XBL $1 trick anymore, eh?

Never did. Was subscribed for 3 years but they priced me out.

 

[Kings Field]

You're joking right?

Do you understand what that video you linked is showing?

do I understand it? Lmfao.

Bro, I play fucking gamepass at work on my steam deck with that fucking app.

Are you people fucking goombas or something?

You can use the fucking app for remote play OR cloud gaming AND play gamepass. It bypasses the need to screw around with the Edge browser and use other shit on the deck.

Like holy fuck.

 

[Kings Field]

eh.....I pointed this out to him earlier.

I use it when I’m at work.

 

[bender]

At the same time, expanding the service to other platforms, they either have to acquire more studios/publishers or pay an immense fee per game to compensate for the possible loss in revenue on Playstation and Nintendo.

If they bring Game Pass to PlayStation and Nintendo, they could just offer new, lower cost service tiers that only offer MGS titles that would look a lot like EA Play and Ubisoft+.

 

[Topher]

I use it when I’m at work.

To connect and stream from your Xbox console, yes. I bought the app the first time you mentioned it and found out that it only connects to an Xbox console. I refunded it immediately.

From the app description on Steam:

ABOUT THIS SOFTWARE​

Experience gaming freedom like never before with XBPlay — effortlessly stream your console to your device and immerse yourself in your favorite titles anytime, anywhere.

Without an Xbox console, this is useless.

 

[Kings Field]

To connect and stream from your Xbox console, yes. I bought the app the first time you mentioned it and found out that it only connects to an Xbox console. I refunded it immediately.

From the app description on Steam:

ABOUT THIS SOFTWARE​

Experience gaming freedom like never before with XBPlay — effortlessly stream your console to your device and immerse yourself in your favorite titles anytime, anywhere.

Without an Xbox console, this is useless.

There is an option to stream gamepass now that might not have been there when you had it. It’s a separate “link” when you’re in the app right below the remote play button. It’s for gamepass. Right hand to God brother.

 

[ungalo]

It almost seems like someone internally is pushing for Xbox division to start showing profitability after 20 years…

Problem is, it's an internal contradiction. If they wanted to make profit it would have been easier the traditional way, at least that's what i'm convinced of, perhaps i'm wong. Just release the games on PC to have a larger player base, and don't condition your console audience to never pay for full price games.

 

[GHG]

do I understand it? Lmfao.

Bro, I play fucking gamepass at work on my steam deck with that fucking app.

Are you people fucking goombas or something?

You can use the fucking app for remote play OR cloud gaming AND play gamepass. It bypasses the need to screw around with the Edge browser and use other shit on the deck.

Like holy fuck.

Holy fuck indeed.

People are asking for gamepass games to be natively playable on their steam decks and you're here talking about some app that streams from some shitty console which most people in the Steam ecosystem don't have.

It's not what people are asking for, not even close.

 

[bender]

Right hand to God brother.

Take a picture of your wife streaming My Friend Peppa Pig on your Steam Deck from your living room with your dog sleeping next to her or I'm calling bullshit.

 

[mckmas8808]

Game pass on ps5 alongside other subs like EA Play, GTA+, Uni Play is the future. Sony get their 30% cut on all revenue and everyone's happy.

Why would Sony want to do this?

 

[Topher]

There is an option to stream gamepass now that might not have been there when you had it. It’s a separate “link” when you’re in the app right below the remote play button. It’s for gamepass. Right hand to God brother.

Hmmm, fair enough then. Yeah I guess they could have added cloud later. It certainly wasn't an option when I tried it.

 

[bender]

Why would Sony want to do this?

Gaming subscription services are going to go the route of TV/Movie streaming services in that every publisher is going launch their own rather than having one provider. I mentioned it a few posts back, but Microsoft could launch an MGS only tier of Game Pass for PlayStation/Nintendo which would solve the issue with all the 3rd party offerings that are currently offered on Game Pass. One way or the other, I do think that's the future of Game Pass and why they've been so aggressive in acquiring developers and publishers. Selling consoles was never the end game.

 

[gothmog]

Interesting......I wonder how much this can complicate the creation of programming when the majority of games will be built on the x86 architecture though. I'm "assuming" the workloads that you are migrating aren't as sensitive to break things like making a video game though. Is it?

On one hand, you'd have PC, Nintendo Switch 2, and PS6. And on the other hand, you'll have ARM for mobile phones, tablets, MacBooks, and the next Xbox next-gen console. It feels like one group isn't like the other.

Without getting into details I can say that there are gaming companies that use ARM on the back end.

Front end the vast majority of mobile gaming is ARM based. I'm not a game developer but have heard that it's about as simple as it has ever been to get games running on mobile. That doesn't mean they run well at first, though.

 

[mckmas8808]

Gaming subscription services are going to go the route of TV/Movie streaming services in that every publisher is going launch their own rather than having one provider. I mentioned it a few posts back, but Microsoft could launch an MGS only tier of Game Pass for PlayStation/Nintendo which would solve the issue with all the 3rd party offerings that are currently offered on Game Pass. One way or the other, I do think that's the future of Game Pass and why they've been so aggressive in acquiring developers and publishers. Selling consoles was never the end game.

Now that could work. But Sony would require everyone with the smaller Playstation Gamepass to still have PS+ too. Plus they'd want their 30% on top of that from MS.

 

[bender]

Now that could work. But Sony would require everyone with the smaller Playstation Gamepass to still have PS+ too. Plus they'd want their 30% on top of that from MS.

Sony would be selling the subscription on their service so they'd get 30% of that. Call of Duty being part of that service would insure PS+ subscriptions. They'd also get 30% of any sold game conversions plus DLC/MTX. It be no different from any other 3rd party on PSN.

 

[Hawking Radiation]

You are right and I take no comfort from this. The Xbox 360 era was incredible and Xbox blew it afterwards. I’ll never understand how or why.

Here's your answer: