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[Sephzilla]

I think the best thing DMC5 could do story wise is to move forward and not dwell on the past. The franchise needs to get past circle jerking about Sparda and establish that Dante (and Vergil) have both surpassed him at this point. Open the game up with a set of new villains showing up, perhaps some kind of primeval demons that neither Mundus or Sparda knew about, have them scoff at the legend of Sparda and be all like "that guy wasn't even shit" and have them try to take over Earth. Dante needs to find Vergil in order for CUHRAZY JACKPOT TIME, the story is about Dante and Vergil truly surpassing their father and setting up their own legacies instead of cleaning up their dad's messes.

Alternatively, take a page out of Bayonetta's playbook and instead of having demons as the villains perhaps make this game Dante vs Heaven. Just say that God and company think Dante's too powerful of an out-of-their-control force. Seeing Dante trying to throw shade at God would be pretty crazy.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

Prequel with sparda would be cool while platinum games work on that DMCxBayo game..

Spoiler

I want DMC5 tho

 

[Sesha]

I think we've thoroughly established that few of us want more humans seeking powers shenanigans.

Alternatively, take a page out of Bayonetta's playbook and instead of having demons as the villains perhaps make this game Dante vs Heaven. Just say that God and company think Dante's too powerful of an out-of-their-control force. Seeing Dante trying to throw shade at God would be pretty crazy.

Itsuno has confirmed Heaven doesn't exist in the DMC-verse though. It's just humans and demons.

 

[AgentLampshade]

I don't want angels to appear in DMC. They did the angel motif already in 4 (and in 3 with The Fallen) and I'd rather not draw more comparisons to Bayonetta. Keep DMC about demons, let Bayonetta have the big convoluted trinity of realities stuff.

 

[Sephzilla]

Itsuno has confirmed Heaven doesn't exist in the DMC-verse though. It's just humans and demons.

Source? Because where did the Order of the Sword get all of that Angel shit from?

Also, what is the point of having Hell if Heaven doesn't exist?

 

[GuardianE]

Itsuno has confirmed Heaven doesn't exist in the DMC-verse though. It's just humans and demons.

Yeah, the games even hint at this with enemies like Fallen, and the ethereal heavenly look of parts of the Demon world when Dante is navigating it.

Though some Demons in DMC could be considered angels in another universe.

 

[Sesha]

Source? Because where did the Order of the Sword get all of that Angel shit from?

It was in the interviews with Itsuno and Shimomura shortly before E3. Link

My theory is all the angel shit in 4 was because the Ascension ceremony meant they got their powers from Mundus.

 

[Sephzilla]

Also, it's not like they couldn't just change their minds about the existence of heaven in the DMC verse. Thematically having hell without heaven makes no fucking sense, though.

 

[Sesha]

Also, it's not like they couldn't just change their minds about the existence of heaven in the DMC verse. Thematically having hell without heaven makes no fucking sense, though.

They address this in the video and in one of the interviews in the art book. The Heaven-Humans-Hell paradigm for them is a Judeo-Christian thing, while their ideas of hell and demons are influenced by Buddhism.

Berserk does a similar thing, if you've read it.

 

[Sephzilla]

They address this in the video and in one of the interviews in the art book. The Heaven-Humans-Hell paradigm for them is a Judeo-Christian thing, but their ideas of hell and demons are influenced by Buddhism.

Spoiler

My headcanon still says heaven exists though since my headcanon says DMC and Bayonetta are in the same universe

 

[GuardianE]

Also, it's not like they couldn't just change their minds about the existence of heaven in the DMC verse. Thematically having hell without heaven makes no fucking sense, though.

It does make sense if you consider that people misinterpreted that Mundus was god, hell was heaven, and demons were angels. Just because people believe something in universe doesn't make it true. The Order also worshipped Sparda as a god.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

I don't think that's necessarily true. Nero could be approached in his role in Fortuna after the fall of the Order. There were a lot of aspects of the Order that weren't fleshed out in DMC4, and maybe characters that both Kyrie and Nero knew that didn't make an appearance. He could continue cleaning up the remnants of the Order. I also don't think that Nero's mother is explored in any particular fashion, though my memory is hazy. And what about Kyrie ' s family outside of Credo? I think there are a lot of options to expanding Nero's back story.

As for Dante, I agree that you cant really delve into his childhood without Vergil, but do they even need to go into his childhood in DMC5? Id much rather it focus on the future, as the entire series has been tethered to this past and the legend Sparda for so long.

I'd definitely like Vergil to be in DMC5, but I wouldn't call him essential for the next title except that he needs to be playable.

Nero is one thing, as that's the one thing we would need to explore in depth if we're ever going to finally close the book on Nero's parentage and if Vergil even knew he was a Daddy (and how he would deal with it, either way).

But the Dante & Vergil story arcI think is something that would need to evolve past their mutual past if either character is going to move forward. Not to mention the entire series probably could stand to move on past "yet MORE Sparda-related business that needs to be cleaned up by his heirs because of reasons".

I think they need to flesh out the characters origins and their pasts before trying to move forward or at least alongside it. It's getting really tiresome to see enemies coming to get the characters from a past (Sparda's in these cases) that we know nothing about, they really need to explore Sparda's past once and for all.

Exploring Sparda's past means that they need to get to Dante's past and of course you can't get into Dante's without getting into Vergil's as well.

I actually think it's high time we know more about Dante and what he has been through in the past. It's been 4 games yet we barley know anything about his origins besides being Sparda and Eva's son.

And as far as Nero goes, his biggest mystery that everyone is interested in is whether he is Vergil's son or not. So, while it is possible to ignore that and try to just tell a new story about him, I think it would be pretty foolish of Capcom to just completely ignore people's curiosity like that.

 

[GuardianE]

I think they need to flesh out the characters origins and their pasts before trying to move forward or at least alongside it. It's getting really tiresome to see enemies coming to get the characters from a past (Sparda's in these cases) that we know nothing about, they really need to explore Sparda's past once and for all.

Exploring Sparda's past means that they need to get to Dante's past and of course you can't get into Dante's without getting into Vergil's as well.

I actually think it's high time we know more about Dante and what he has been through in the past. It's been 4 games yet we barley know anything about his origins besides being Sparda and Eva's son.

And as far as Nero goes, his biggest mystery that everyone is interested in is whether he is Vergil's son or not. So, while it is possible to ignore that and try to just tell a new story about him, I think it would be pretty foolish of Capcom to just completely ignore people's curiosity like that.

I think Sparda's past is best explored in a Sparda standalone prequel after DMC5.

As for Nero, it's confirmed, man. Anyone who is still curious about that is being foolish. DMC3142 specifically calls him "son of Vergil" not to mention the less than subtle hints in DMC4SE.

 

[AgentLampshade]

I think it would be pretty foolish of Capcom to just completely ignore people's curiosity like that.

And yet they did it. Twice.

 

[Sesha]

It's the Usual Suspects thing again. The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing folks he didn't exist. Tricking people into worshipping demons by having them appear as celestial beings is a pretty good way for demons to conquer the human world. As we saw with Mallet Island, people actively worshipped Mundus. Even the Order of the Sword fell for the whole angel shtick.

 

[Sephzilla]

The more they flesh out Sparda's past the more they ruin the mystique of him, to be perfectly honest.

 

[GuardianE]

The more they flesh out Sparda's past the more they ruin the mystique of him, to be perfectly honest.

If they do it like MGS did with Big Boss in MGS3, then I think it'd be great. It can be difficult to do right, but it can be done.

 

[Astral Dog]

I think its slightly more unique to not include heaven or have Dante face the literall God, that has been done and besides DmC never did anything interesting with the concepts.

Anyways, we have our churches, popes, "angels" , fallen demons anyways.

 

[Sephzilla]

If they do it like MGS did with Big Boss in MGS3, then I think it'd be great. It can be difficult to do right, but it can be done.

Quite true, that would be neat. Still, personally, I'm sick of Sparda at this point.

I think its slightly more ynique to not include heaven or hace Dante face the literall God, that has been done and besides DmC never did anything interesting with the concepts.

Anyways, we have our churches, popes, "angels" , fallen demons anyways.

I also don't think we should use DmC's fan-fiction writing as any kind of base point. It didn't really do anything interesting with any of its concepts.

 

[Astral Dog]

I think the best thing DMC5 could do story wise is to move forward and not dwell on the past. The franchise needs to get past circle jerking about Sparda and establish that Dante (and Vergil) have both surpassed him at this point.

I think Sparda still should play an important part , he is too tied to the lore and after all this teasing they should do something with him, just not like DmC of course

 

[Sephzilla]

I think Sparda still should play an important part , he is too tied to the lore and after all this teasing they should do something with, just not like DmC of course

What more of a role could he play though in a future game? Also, does this mean we'd have to get introduced to more demons that remember Sparda and survived encounters with him? Because seriously, by DMC4 it was reaching the "okay, did Sparda actually defeat any bad guys?" level.

 

[Bronetta]

If they do it like MGS did with Big Boss in MGS3, then I think it'd be great. It can be difficult to do right, but it can be done.

So character assassinate Sparda and have him be a carbon copy of Dante?

 

[Astral Dog]

What more of a role could he play though in a future game? Also, does this mean we'd have to get introduced to more demons that remember Sparda and survived encounters with him? Because seriously, by DMC4 it was reaching the "okay, did Sparda actually defeat any bad guys?" level.

Hey, maybe Sparda loved his demon brothers and could not bring himself to kill them.

Something a bit more fresh, maybe, A demon that does not have anything to do with Sparda is a good idea, those demon apprentices was also a good idea, maybe Sparda did something that was not so heroic after all.

So character assassinate Sparda and have him be a carbon copy of Dante?

Maybe there were TWO Spardas, the original and punished Sparda :O
But that is going to be revealed on the new DMC legends of SPARDA

 

[GuardianE]

So character assassinate Sparda and have him be a carbon copy of Dante?

Did you consider MGS3 character assassination? Because to me, it did nothing more than humanize a legend, which is what I think Sparda needs more than any other character. There should be pieces of Dante and Vergil in Sparda, but he wouldn't be a copy. Its not the same situation. Snake was a clone of Big Boss after all.

 

[AgentLampshade]

It'd be interesting if they did something with Mundus instead of Sparda for once. The two should not be synonymous with each other.

 

[Village]

Im on team
Turn dmc in to monstermash.

I wanna fight and then play as dmc dracula.


Also on team, let angels exist.

Also on team pizza.

 

[Seyavesh]

prettyboy mundus is waiting in the shadows

 

[Akiller]

Put Daimon in DMC.

 

[Astral Dog]

It'd be interesting if they did something with Mundus instead of Sparda for once. The two should not be synonymous with each other.

True, something new could be done with the demon emperor, i love how each DMC has a different villain though, but something could be hinted at.

 

[Sesha]

Maybe they'll go the Supernatural/Devilman route. Sparda had a twin brother. Who may or may not be Mundus.

 

[Son Of D]

I think the only mention Sparda should get in DMC5 is a secret non-canon boss. He could be the ultimate test of your skill.

 

[Bronetta]

Did you consider MGS3 character assassination? Because to me, it did nothing more than humanize a legend, which is what I think Sparda needs more than any other character. There should be pieces of Dante and Vergil in Sparda, but he wouldn't be a copy. Its not the same situation. Snake was a clone of Big Boss after all.

I consider MGS3 one of the best games of all time but the Big Boss it showed is not the one the previous games built up. One could argue that was the beginning of his downfall but then Peace Walker and Phantom Pain didn't exactly do a great job showing the heel turn.

Maybe there were TWO Spardas, the original and punished Sparda :O
But that is going to be revealed on the new DMC legends of SPARDA

SUCH A LUST FOR COMBOS

 

[Village]

I consider MGS3 one of the best games of all time but the Big Boss it showed is not the one the previous games built up. One could argue that was the beginning of his downfall but then Peace Walker and Phantom Pain didn't exactly do a great job showing the heel turn.




SUCH A LUST FOR COMBOS

I tgink pp does a good job at the very end. Big boss on some fuckhead shit.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

I think Sparda's past is best explored in a Sparda standalone prequel after DMC5.

As for Nero, it's confirmed, man. Anyone who is still curious about that is being foolish. DMC3142 specifically calls him "son of Vergil" not to mention the less than subtle hints in DMC4SE.

I agree about Sparda but let's not kid ourselves, Capcom will never do that.

They never explicitly said it in the games and besides that, people wanna know more than just a simple confirmation. Who is his mother? What happened to her? Does Vergil know he has a son? etc...

And yet they did it. Twice.

It's really baffling how deaf Capcom can be sometimes.

 

[GuardianE]

I consider MGS3 one of the best games of all time but the Big Boss it showed is not the one the previous games built up. One could argue that was the beginning of his downfall but then Peace Walker and Phantom Pain didn't exactly do a great job showing the heel turn

I'm definitely just considering MGS3 and not the future titles involving Big Boss.

 

[Sephzilla]

It's really baffling how deaf Capcom can be sometimes.

After this

I'm no longer surprised by how deaf Capcom can be. I just hope that DmC: Apology Edition and DMC4SE are signs that maybe, just maybe, Capcom's listening again.

 

[Seyavesh]

Put Daimon in DMC.

????

 

[Mr. Smiley]

I consider MGS3 one of the best games of all time but the Big Boss it showed is not the one the previous games built up. One could argue that was the beginning of his downfall but then Peace Walker and Phantom Pain didn't exactly do a great job showing the heel turn.

I feel like you could blame that on PW and PP though. MGS3's ending implies enough to suggest his downturn instead of its direct continuations going back and forth.

I mean MGS3's Big Boss had a level of nativity that alone differentiated enough from Solid, so I don't about a "clone personality."

????

Daimon from Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen.

Though your suggestion ain't bad.

 

[Sesha]

My experience with animu and mangoo tells me that we'll never receive a proper explanation of who Nero's mother was. Most modern Japanese popular fiction is more interested in the what than the how and why. Bingo Morihashi strikes me as the kind of writer who's more interested in telling than showing.

It'd be interesting if they did something with Mundus instead of Sparda for once. The two should not be synonymous with each other.

I think Mundus' stranglehold on the story is as bad as Sparda's. The series hasn't really moved on from either of them. DMC1 was about Dante's final conflict with Mundus, DMC3 was focused around building up to that point. While DMC4 was seemingly building up to a Mundus revival with the "mundus vivendi/Mundus lives" sign that's visible in Berial's intro cutscene, the presence of demons like Assault and Frost which Mundus created, and the whole angelic imagery which is typical of Mundus. Even DmC focused on Mundus by rehashing elements from DMC1 and 3.

 

[Dahbomb]

Sparda would be dope as an over powered nigh unbeatable secret boss in DMC5.

 

[TreIII]

I think the only mention Sparda should get in DMC5 is a secret non-canon boss. He could be the ultimate test of your skill.

Now, THIS is what I'm talking about.

I mean, I do have ideas of how they could feasibly work Sparda into the series' modern day setting. But "super bosses" that would be far beyond anything that you could fight in the game's story mode is the kind of thing me, badcrumble and a few others have been wanting in this series for years, or at least certainly after both Bayo games delivered when it came to

Spoiler

Rodin

.

 

[Sephzilla]

Sparda would be dope as an over powered nigh unbeatable secret boss in DMC5.

This i would be totally cool with

 

[Village]

Sparda would be dope as an over powered nigh unbeatable secret boss in DMC5.

And you could unlocknhim

And he was the gouken character. Like his move set is like master version of Dante and Virgil.

 

[AgentLampshade]

Yeah, a non-canon fight with Sparda would be fine. I actually keep trying to think of optional bosses like

Spoiler

Rodin

, but none fit in DMC. They're either dead or tied to the story. Suppose they could always introduce a new character to fill the role.

 

[GuardianE]

Sparda as a secret boss. Legacy bosses from past games. Multiple legacy bosses at the same time (Credo and A&R/Nevan and Echidna). All this stuff is what we want in an extra coop enabled mission mode.

Just think about fighting both Dante and Vergil at the same time as Nero or any other character. Any of donguris recent videos against multiple Credos or Dante+Nero play should highlight the true potential here.

 

[Mizerman]

I think the only mention Sparda should get in DMC5 is a secret non-canon boss. He could be the ultimate test of your skill.

Sparda would be dope as an over powered nigh unbeatable secret boss in DMC5.

Indeed.

 

[AgentLampshade]

Sparda as a secret boss. Legacy bosses from past games. Multiple legacy bosses at the same time (Credo and A&R/Nevan and Echidna). All this stuff is what we want in an extra coop enabled mission mode.

Just think about taking on Dante and Vergil at the same time as Nero or any other character. Any of donguris recent videos against multiple Credos or Dante+Nero play should highlight the true potential here.

All made possible by the Goddess of Space and Time. You're onto something here buddy.

 

[Son Of Sparda]

After this

I'm no longer surprised by how deaf Capcom can be. I just hope that DmC: Apology Edition and DMC4SE are signs that maybe, just maybe, Capcom's listening again.

If SFV's launch is anything to go by, they are still as deaf as ever.

 

[TreIII]

I think Mundus' stranglehold on the story is as bad as Sparda's. The series hasn't really moved on from either of them. DMC1 was about Dante's final conflict with Mundus, DMC3 was focused around building up to that point. While DMC4 was seemingly building up to a Mundus revival with the "mundus vivendi/Mundus lives" sign that's visible in Berial's intro cutscene, the presence of demons like Assault and Frost which Mundus created, and the whole angelic imagery which is typical of Mundus. Even DmC focused on Mundus by rehashing elements from DMC1 and 3.

Difference there, at least for me, is that as the series' designated Big Bad, his influence would and should be more overreaching, because he could always find a way to come back (even promising to do so!) and he still has compelling connections to most of the central cast, by virtue of their connection to Sparda and/or Dante. He's basically the "Dracula" (Castlevania) of the DMC series, with perhaps the only difference being is that they haven't physically forced him into every game just because of who he is and what he represents. Besides, there are at least unresolved plot points involving him, such as regarding what exactly did he do to Vergil to turn him into Angelo, among others.

Or another possibility is that they do something entirely different with Mundus, such as doing the Soma Cruz thing and having a new character that inherited his powers or whatever.

 

[Sesha]

Keep in mind that Inafune was responsible for DmC, even while he claimed DMC5 would be tailored to fan wishes, and that SF5 released early to cater to the FGC. They're not really comparable scenarios.

Difference there, at least for me, is that as the series' designated Big Bad, his influence would and should be more overreaching, because he could always find a way to come back (even promising to do so!) and he still has compelling connections to most of the central cast, by virtue of their connection to Sparda and/or Dante. He's basically the "Dracula" (Castlevania) of the DMC series, with perhaps the only difference being is that they haven't physically forced him into every game just because of who he is and what he represents. Besides, there are at least unresolved plot points involving him, such as regarding what exactly did he do to Vergil to turn him into Angelo, among others.

Or another possibility is that they do something entirely different with Mundus, such as doing the Soma Cruz thing and having a new character that inherited his powers or whatever.

The problem for me is I just find Mundus to be ineffectual. Even if he's the biggest bad we know, he's not a threat after having been defeated twice, once by Dante. Even if he's more diabolical and careful the second time around, he still had way more time to build his strength when he fought Dante the first time. Why would he be more of a threat now? It's even worse when lore-wise we know that he's not the OG demon.

Mundus being turned into a Devil Arm and then being dual-wielded along with Sparda by someone, that's what I would call a threat.