-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Pitchford: Fans wrong to sue Gearbox over Aliens: Colonial Marines
- Thread starter BY2K
- Start date
Audioboxer
Member
Yup, paging Jim Sterling, Jim Sterling to this topic, please.
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Oh hes been here. I too am excited.
Poetic.Injustice
Member
Did you pay $60 for it?
Hypereides
Member
The blame isn't Pitchford's alone. Sega, likely, evaluated and allowed to publish the game in its ultimate state. That speaks volumes about Sega's role and assesment in this case.
People really sued them over a false demo? Why they didn't sue with the other million cases?
Bioshock Infinite also presented a fake demo and no one sued them, Ubi would be out of business if people would sue them over any false presentation, the examples are too many so why this fake demo was so special?
By now this is almost like a common practice.
Bioshock Infinite also presented a fake demo and no one sued them, Ubi would be out of business if people would sue them over any false presentation, the examples are too many so why this fake demo was so special?
By now this is almost like a common practice.
soundscream
Member
Randy, it's been more than 2 years. This is the part where you apologise for your garbage game and promise that you will never do it again (only to do it again). I suggest you contact Mr. Molyneux for training since he has perfected this craft.
This is just not the way.
But @ 8:01 he says it's clear that the Wii U version will be the best looking console version. You know the version that never came out.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZuUQy_T2I4
jim-jam bongs
Member
The best part about this is that I fucking hate Randy Pitchford with the irrational passion of a Kentucky preacher at a marriage equality protest, and now you all do too. The worst part is that now I feel like some kind of hatred-hipster.
It was stated by insiders who worked at gearbox who also provided other information that turned out to be true about the project
that's as close to confirmed as you're ever gonna get about this kinda thing
SmartWaffles
Member
Raise your pitchforks!
Jim Sterling
Member
The North remembers.
Randy, it's been more than 2 years. This is the part where you apologise for your garbage game and promise that you will never do it again (only to do it again). I suggest you contact Mr. Molyneux for training since he has perfected this craft.
This is just not the way.
Delusion, thy name is pitchford.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
This combined with how much they're charging for the Handsome Collection just makes me dislike Gearbox even more.
Oh jesus, I didn't know about this. I used to praise Borderlands for it's unique art style, this is utterly shameful.
How do people get away with this kind of thing? It's really saddening.
EDIT: o man, I posted that link on his twitter and called him out (I know it's old news, but I couldn't not say something) and he blocked me...
Jim Sterling
Member
Welcome to the club. It's his only response to criticism of his business practices.
"Likely" is the key word you used here, because there's really more to it - Sega pulled the plug, multiple times if I remember correctly, but Gearbox (maybe Randy himself) kept pressing Sega, promising they will deliver. The final straw Sega saw they were way deep into the project (past projected timeline) and had to ship as-is to mitigate loss.
I'm a huuuuuuge Alien fan and find this to be one of the worst things ever, but I wouldn't blame Sega. They do good work with 3rd party devs. This isn't normal for them. Look at Isolation, for a recent instance.
This Aliens thing is one of the biggest disasters for me ever. I LOVE the franchise, so what has been done is heart breaking. I can't think of ANYONE else I'd want to be vocal about this than Jim Sterling, son. Most critics that have an audience don't do enough to defend what's dear to them.
Glass Rebel
Member
No lies detected tbh
I think you'll find that's 2K's doing given it's the publisher.
Weltall Zero
Member
I don't understand what's the debate here. Is false advertising not prohibited under US laws?
Obviously the best course of action is not suing anyone at all. That's sure to correct the sorry state of things.
Obviously the best course of action is not suing anyone at all. That's sure to correct the sorry state of things.
old manatee
Banned
Serious question: did they ever bother to patch Colonial Marines and make it decent?
What are they doing with Handsome Collection ? I haven't heard of any changes to the games....
Charging, not changing.
KoopaTheCasual
Junior Member
Fixed.
Wow, what the fuck.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
Once again, I'm struck by how few people seem to grasp the difference between development and publishing.
Is the difference in role and responsibility really so opaque? Or are people so desperate to blame Pitchford personally that they are deliberately giving Sega a free pass?
For example I'm kinda aghast that a supposed media professional like Jim Sterling would chime in with the ludicrous charge that its somehow the developer's fault that: "The game is still being sold on official sites and Steam using media that is unrepresentative of the product and is NOT marked as unrepresentative."
That is as pure an example of the publisher failing to live up to their responsibilities as you can possibly find.
Is the difference in role and responsibility really so opaque? Or are people so desperate to blame Pitchford personally that they are deliberately giving Sega a free pass?
For example I'm kinda aghast that a supposed media professional like Jim Sterling would chime in with the ludicrous charge that its somehow the developer's fault that: "The game is still being sold on official sites and Steam using media that is unrepresentative of the product and is NOT marked as unrepresentative."
That is as pure an example of the publisher failing to live up to their responsibilities as you can possibly find.
Get out of here with this bullshit. Randy went on record countless times saying Gearbox was treating this with care, and showcased completely fake gameplay of the game. How sega mysteriously made the game shit outside of that fact makes no sense.
Oh and of course Sega eats a lot of blame too, by proxy of the devs shitting up the place.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
It doesn't matter. The buck stops with the guy selling you the product. And Sega are the ones who decided that they were happy duplicating, marketing, and distributing it. And continue to earn from that decision to this day.
Its open-and-closed. Unless you somehow think that a vendor knowingly selling defective product is ok?
Pathfinder
Member
Not really, no.
There were a couple of patches released to improve lighting and some textures, but that's about it.
So then the people sue Sega and Sega sues the shit out of Gearbox. Im fine with that. I dont have much investment in this as i never bought it but still angers me how much of a blatant liar Randy is.
The real tragedy of Colonial Marines is that it made people wary of the next Alien game. I'm playing through Alien Isolation right now and it's an incredible game. Last I heard Isolation sold 2.1 million though so what do I know?
But yeah, screw Pitchford. I'll never buy anything day one from Gearbox.
But yeah, screw Pitchford. I'll never buy anything day one from Gearbox.
Cardon
Member
Yeah, I don't think Sega is entirely to blame in this case. As was stated by another chap in the thread, Sega in all likelihood had to release CM in however shoddy a form it was in simply to recoup costs and because I think canning a game a few months from release would've been a bit much for folks to swallow without knowing the full story.
Additionally, it seemed like internally those at Sega who were attached to this project on the base level seemed to be passionate for it, or at least wanted it to turn out good. I remember chatting with a Sega Producer attached to this project and he seemed legit interested in the game, without coming across as an obvious PR hype man type thing, and he even invited me to offer feedback on a gameplay clip that was being shown (no, it wasn't the faux E3 demo that Randy lied about).
So yeah, I'm sure there's a ton more about this that we don't know about for some time, but I don't think the fault for CM being garbage should be entirely be placed upon Sega.
And just to clarify, I'm not doing an angry poster attack on you or anything. Just thought I would throw my two cents on the matter.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
In the final analysis had Sega taken their responsibility to the consumer seriously, it would never have involved you or any other member of the public. Which is why any public action against Gearbox doesn't have a leg to stand-on, legally speaking.
Its really stupidly simple: Sega made their problem, your problem. It was a quality/delivery issue between two private institutions, that was made into a public debacle due to one of the parties inflicting it on the public.
Had Sega shown proper due diligence the situation would never have arisen in the first place (I'm sorry but I just don't buy that the quality of the release candidate came as any sort of a surprise to them), and its a plain undeniable fact that it was within their power to either cancel or further delay its release if they truly believed it to be of insufficient quality at any point.
Dictator93
Member
Randy described DNF as a "greasy burger" once in a way to talk down how absolute shit it was.
He is a talking head regarding their games, and not someone with credibility any longer.
He is a talking head regarding their games, and not someone with credibility any longer.
There's a difference between what CDPR did with The Witcher 3 and what Gearbox did with Aliens. Watch the Sterling video where he literally compares segments of the game to the pre-release playthroughs and points out how little there is in common. The pre-release stuff is a complete fabrication.
Unless I'm missing something, a lot of the Witcher stuff was "the fire looked better, there was more smoke in the early versions", which isn't great from CDPR's perspective but it's simply something from the game that had to be downgraded for one reason or another. It's still basically what they showed early on, unlike Aliens where it's clearly different. Most people won't notice that stuff, and taking into account the realities of game development where these sacrifices have to be made it's unfair to assume the developers have tried to deceive you.
Ubisoft have got a load of shit for Watch Dogs and WB aren't very popular at the moment either so I dunno about the idea that people are letting them off the hook. Pitchford's attitude doesn't really allow people to mellow on Gearbox though, every time he comes out with shit like this it pisses people off all over again.
Throwaway123456789
Member
Story time:
I went to the SEGA booth to have a demo of Colonial Marines at Gamescom 2012. It's a horrible demo, sure, and obviously not controlled by the guy standing there with the controller, but it's what happened after the demo ended that was oh so wrong.
In a room with four journalists, a PR guy and what I presume was a developer - a huge applause from the speakers erupted. The PR guy and developers started clapping and cheering like crazy. What was going on?! I met the horrified looks of the other guys and then we all tried to find the cure for cancer in the floor carpet. Had to stare down for a good ten seconds until the applause stopped and we could leave.
I went to the SEGA booth to have a demo of Colonial Marines at Gamescom 2012. It's a horrible demo, sure, and obviously not controlled by the guy standing there with the controller, but it's what happened after the demo ended that was oh so wrong.
In a room with four journalists, a PR guy and what I presume was a developer - a huge applause from the speakers erupted. The PR guy and developers started clapping and cheering like crazy. What was going on?! I met the horrified looks of the other guys and then we all tried to find the cure for cancer in the floor carpet. Had to stare down for a good ten seconds until the applause stopped and we could leave.
Denton
Member
AFAIK Gearbox/Sega showed fake footage right until release, and A:CM was a stinking pile of buggy, ugly shit on release.
CDPR started showing 100% final ingame footage 6 months before release, and the game was a total masterpiece.
Of course, people actually did hate on CDPR and Ubisoft for the graphics not being the same as in 2 years old trailers, but I guess you missed that.
Oblong Schlong
Member
"Blah blah blah the market makes me a decent person"
Fuck off with that, Ayn Randy.
Fuck off with that, Ayn Randy.
Jim Sterling
Member
Randy's. Fucking. Attitude.
Sega isn't blameless, but it made a concerted effort not to repeat its mistakes with Isolation, and only recently admitted how badly it had been fucking up over the past few years.
Humility and recognition of your culpability goes a long way.
Randy's. Fucking. Attitude.
Somebody needs to give your av hipster glasses.
Not me though, I suck at that stuff.
Why is he still even talking about it? Yes the market responded, but the market was also lied to by your company, Randy. This is in addition to the lies you told Sega, and the misuse of funding that reportedly went into a different game. You, your company, lied to the public, lied to the financial backers, and pretty much lied to everyone.
Was legal action the wrong move? Maybe. But there is no denying you did some really crappy stuff that ruined what should have been a good game, especially based on your companies own reputation and based on the amount of pure funding it received.
Was legal action the wrong move? Maybe. But there is no denying you did some really crappy stuff that ruined what should have been a good game, especially based on your companies own reputation and based on the amount of pure funding it received.
Because they didn't do the same thing.
Gearbox did the following:
- Showed fake footage of the game all the way up to release.
- Did not allow for reviews to go public until after the game was out.
- Siphoned the game off to another party for development.
- Reportedly used funds Sega provided for the game on a different game (basically, cutting down the budget for the game despite the fact their was money for it)
- Reportedly lied to Sega about the game, who was developing it, and where all their investment money went
WB, Ubisoft, and CDPR simply had graphical downgrades in the final project. All of them showed live footage of the actual game before it came out. All of them had playable demos before the game came out. All of them had reviews allowed to go live before the game came out. Yes, they all got crapped on for the graphical downgrades, but we as the public KNEW what the game was all about before it was released. AC: M - everything we thought we knew was a total lie.