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PoliGAF 2016 |OT9| The Wrath of Khan!

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W

Wolfgunblood Garopa

Member
remist said:
Primarily that someone who doesnt feel represented by the two major parties won't be wasting their vote if they support a third party that is ideologically closer to them. Also party leadership has to be more responsive to their constituents because there are real alternatives.
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General elections seem to provoke this kind of anxiety in some people.

Let's say your priorities or beliefs is that we should all live in space, and most of our national budget should go towards advancing technology to live in space. Neither of the two parties are really on board with that. You could run for office yourself, or support a challenger to your Representative who also believes in living in space, or write to your Representative and try to get others to join your space movement, and maybe others around the country also have similar priorities and do the same. Eventually if it's successful, one of the two parties should adopt Space Party ideas into their platform. At the very least, your representation would more closely reflect your space values, as you'd have Space Party Representatives in Congress.

Just because you don't like the two people running for President right now, and you think your vote is thrown away on a 3rd party candidate, doesn't have anything to do with the effectiveness of the US political system. The opportunity is there for you. Maybe your values aren't that different from one of the two major parties after all. Or maybe your values are that different and would require a lot of work to bring like minded people together to get that representation. Or maybe you are just anxious about the cult of personalities that seems to be the case in a general election.
 
R

rjinaz

Member
"this country is worth saving"

Really rubbed me the wrong way. Probably because they want to harm it more than anything.

Ben Carson preaching about this country being divided. ugh
 
N

nature boy

Member
Economists Who’ve Advised Presidents Are No Fans of Donald Trump


In a WSJ survey, no former members of the White House Council of Economic Advisers—spanning eight presidents—openly support Mr. Trump

Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump, who has broken with many of the GOP’s traditional positions on economic policy, garners no support from any of the White House economists who have advised U.S. presidents for the past half-century.

The Wall Street Journal this month reached out to all 45 surviving former members of the White House Council of Economic Advisers under the past eight presidents, going back to Richard Nixon, to get their views on this year’s presidential election.

Among 17 Republican appointees who responded to Journal inquiries, none said they supported Mr. Trump. Six said they did not support Mr. Trump and 11 declined to say either way. An additional six did not respond to repeated messages. Among the 20 Democrats who responded to the Journal, 13 said they supported Mrs. Clinton, none said they opposed her and seven declined to say either way. Two Democratic appointees didn’t respond to messages.

...
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TOTAL LOSERS! WHAT DO EXPERTS KNOW?
 
G

gutter_trash

Banned
Fragamemnon said:
I think in countries where the voter base is linguistically, ethnically, and ideologically more uniform parlimentary systems offer a lot of value since the "you own everything!" approach generally results in a pretty centrist (w/ leaning towards progressive/conservative) government. Even under Harper Canada wasn't ruled by an extreme conservative agenda. Same with the UK.

Belgium has deep linguistic, historical, and economic divisions that make governing from the center extremely difficult. I think the USA would be even worse off given our diverse population and increasing tendency to politically self-segregate.
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Harper tried to play the identity card in 2015 and lost.

Canada does have a base of Right wingers but the country is overall pretty centrist and Canadian politicians are cautioned to not veer too far to the Right nor to the Left.

Canadians love their Centristism.

The Conservative Party of Canada is currently doing soul searching and have finally accepted marriage equality 11 years late.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
"Our victory is going to be for the majority of Americans whose voices hasn't been heard for many, many years."

Nothing slightly dog whistling about that....
 
P

pigeon

Banned
remist said:
If it was politically possible would you guys support switching to a parlimentary system instead of a 2 party system?
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Depends on the details, but yes, in general I would. As I noted in the other thread, I don't think it would really make as much difference as people imagine. I think the people who imagine a huge groundswell of support for third parties mostly just overestimate the support for out-of-mainstream positions in America.
 
F

Fragamemnon

Member
The thing about policy leaders not buying into Trump-even if they aren't foreign policy experts, can you really be that educated and in-tune with what goes on in the White House and not immediately disqualify Trump just off his NATO comments?

I think Trump's foreign policy remarks are a giant problem-the positions are indefensible, and greatly offend anyone with a remote understanding of how world politics works. You can get people who might hold their nose with the race hating and hope the House keeps that part under control, but see stuff like abandoning NATO members and being cozy with Tsar Putin I as immediately disqualifying. The Presidency has great control over how our foreign policy is conducted-much more so than how domestic policy is done.
 
T

thestopsign

Member
I got through about 2 minutes of Trump's speech.

rmdSx.gif
 
P

PBY

Banned
i think the pivot is real


this is actually a pretty effective speech

full of bullshit, but pretty good

edit: and come on. the ap is still credible, its a "ehh" headline, but come on. i can't go down the path of cherry picking media like that
 
A

Abinash117

Member
The pivot thing that Donald Trump is trying to do is something that many have said is something that he would do. The issue is that most have said he would have either done it after he has won the primary or right after the convention. He has done neither and made things worse for himself. I do not think it was a strategy that he thought he should do, but is a reactive action that he thinks he needs to do probably with Conway's and Bannon's help.

Considering only around 4 days after Donald got in Conway and Bannon, Hillary is quickly going to start a speech about Trump's ties to racist people and groups. It looks like the whole thing was pre-planned for a bit( the Alt-right stuff is probably new). Although, again it was expected that Trump would 'pivot', but I doubt the Clinton campaign had trouble finding info to counter the new approach. I bet that they was planning these around when Manafort was in.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
PBY said:
i think the pivot is real


this is actually a pretty effective speech

full of bullshit, but pretty good

edit: and come on. the ap is still credible, its a "ehh" headline, but come on. i can't go down the path of cherry picking media like that
Click to expand...

I mean, this isn't that great of a speech,.There have been about six pants on fire lies so far. He's terrible at a teleprompter. There's no policy in this speech, which would be the thing that you need for an actual pivot. He's been saying this shit all along.
 
D

Debirudog

Member
Given the Cooper interview, Hillary isn't going to let Trump go with his pivot. She's going to pin him down and call him out with the hateful rhetoric and harm he caused. It's too little, too late for Donald.
 
S

Slayven

Member
adam387 said:
I mean, this isn't that great of a speech,.There have been about six pants on fire lies so far. He's terrible at a teleprompter. There's no policy in this speech, which would be the thing that you need for an actual pivot. He's been saying this shit all along.
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worst it is just the same shit they been saying for months
 
S

shem935

Banned
Slayven said:
I thought this was going to be about the immigration flip flop?
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More likely than not that was probably just inane bullshit that fell out of his head because the guy has no filter. Expecting trump to put forward coherent and cohesive strategy seems like an exercise futility. His statement was probably as much of a surprise to him and his campaign as it was to us.
 
P

PBY

Banned
adam387 said:
I mean, this isn't that great of a speech,.There have been about six pants on fire lies so far. He's terrible at a teleprompter. There's no policy in this speech, which would be the thing that you need for an actual pivot. He's been saying this shit all along.
Click to expand...

i agree on the policy point. but to me, this isn't what he's been saying all along, he's actually staying on message w/r/t hillary's supposed malfeasance. I dont think the lying matters tbh, he isnt saying crazy shit and hes hammering home the points where hillary is weakest
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
PBY said:
i think the pivot is real


this is actually a pretty effective speech

full of bullshit, but pretty good

edit: and come on. the ap is still credible, its a "ehh" headline, but come on. i can't go down the path of cherry picking media like that
Click to expand...

The AP will always be credible, but the reporting as a whole in that story is suspect. Whoever their editor was didn't do their job properly, that article was not ready for print. They needed way more background research and a far better focus than a Nobel prize winner who fights extreme poverty. It needed another month in the incubator at least.
 
J

Joeytj

Banned
She's waiting for Trump to finish, isn't she?

This gonna be good. It's the first time they will go at each other (even if it's long distance) in a long time, if ever.

The GE show is finally starting for real.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
B-Dubs said:
Maybe I shouldn't have gone to the bar to watch the Met game and stayed home to watch this. Sounds like a riot.
Click to expand...

Basically "SHe's going to say something. I don't know what it is. But I heard she's going to say all of you are racist. And she's the bigot, not you. This whole thing is a smear campaign, and it's a lie"
 
J

Joeytj

Banned
This is a clumsy, and obvious attempt at preemptive strike, put together at the last minute.

But Hillary is probably chuckling right now, amused that Donald thinks he's got the upper hand on her.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
Sopan Deb ‏@SopanDeb 4m4 minutes ago
Trump: "[Clinton] supports open borders that violate the civil rights of African-Americans by giving their jobs to people here unlawfully."
 
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