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[Brian Griffin]

This thread is so depressing. Sad how some get so angry when people try to make an effort to be inclusive.

Seriously. It feels very similar to the "We can't have gay marriage because then people will want to marry their dogs and tables!"

Gendered terms are VERY ingrained in society and they are not going anywhere for a LOOOOOONG time so calm the fuck down. This school wants to try something different in an effort to simply acknowledge the existence of kids who don't align with the gender binary of society.

There is no reason not to support this at this stage unless you have a problem with accepting gender non-conforming kids.

 

[MIMIC]

Assumption and expectation goes hand in hand, no?

Kind of like "sex" and "gender". Getting wrapped up in unnecessary distinctions serves no purpose when we already know what the person means.

But if we need to get wrapped up in the differences between "expectation" and "assumption"....

 

[Frog-fu]

Why is this absurd?

You're seriously asking why I think referring to kids as "purple penguins" is absurd?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

You're seriously asking why I think referring to kids as "purple penguins" is absurd?

You should read the guideline document.

You're all getting caught up in the headline, as National Review wants you to do, without caring for the context.

 

[Interfectum]

This is just flat out ridiculous. If you don't identify with the gender you were born with, that's fine, you have every right to do so, but what I don't understand is why the rest of society has to bend over backwards to accommodate the very small minority that does this. If I'm aware you don't identify with gender you were born into, I'm happy to refer to you with the correct pronouns, but this purple penguin shit is nonsense. The vast, vast majority of people are happy be with and identify as the gender they were born into. That's why I refuse to use words like "cis" to identify myself or others. I'll use the pronouns you want me to use to refer to you if that is what you prefer, but I think this expectation that society needs to abandon all traditional gender pronouns and use neutral pronouns because a very slight minority is just absurd.

Here is the document that teachers are going by in that district:
https://www.scribd.com/doc/24059504...Easy-Steps-on-the-Way-to-Gender-Inclusiveness

Here is Snoops article on this obvious right-wing propoganda bullshit that you fell for:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/education/purplepenguins.asp

Nothing about this is absurd besides you falling for the National Review's bait.

 

[ExplodingKetchup]

You're seriously asking why I think referring to kids as "purple penguins" is absurd?

No - why is using gender neutral language in general absurd?

 

[The Real Abed]

I always rooted for the Green Monkeys or Silver Snakes.

 

[v1lla21]

Purple penguin sounds like something you'd pop at a club.

 

[Blargonaut]

By quoting me you have all entered the Contract.

Henceforth, your names shall be:

Lost my shit at this point.

I anoint thee: Dump Scarab

Dancing Squid reporting in, M'Person.

Otherkin are abominations.

Very well, you are Dancing Squid.

Most of these sound like Megaman X bosses.

BRINE LEEMUUUR

I anoint thee: Sublime Harrier

Shit, I can bust out my chinese name, Majestic Mountain Stream reporting in!

Welcome, Majestic Mountain Stream.

You can name your kid after an ubuntu release. Linux masterrace penguin that will keep its V-card until the grave.

I anoint thee: Choke Baboon

So name your kids Mega Man X villains?

I anoint thee: Insight Gecko



Bathe in the starlight, my banner-bearers.

 

[DECK'ARD]

By quoting me you have all entered the Contract.

Henceforth, your names shall be:



I anoint thee: Dump Scarab



Very well, you are Dancing Squid.



I anoint thee: Sublime Harrier



Welcome, Majestic Mountain Stream.



I anoint thee: Choke Baboon



I anoint thee: Insight Gecko



Bathe in the starlight, my banner-bearers.

You are doing great work, I feel compelled to join.

 

[poppabk]

What about the little girl that feels like a little boy? Fuck that kid because another kid might be maybe possibly confused?

How is denying them the opportunity to identify as the gender they believe themselves to be going to help them?

 

[Kano on the Phone]

Kind of like "sex" and "gender". Getting wrapped up in unnecessary distinctions serves no purpose when we already know what the person means.

But if we need to get wrapped up in the differences between "expectation" and "assumption"....

You're completely missing the point and i have to believe it's intentional. Why call someone something that they might not identify with or enjoy being called at all? Is it not possible for you to get someone's attention without calling them a boy or a girl?

If I started every response to you with "listen, dickhead" it wouldn't be cool of me because that's a word with some associations you might not want to have.

How is denying them the opportunity to identify as the gender they believe themselves to be going to help them?

Show me where this ability to identify oneself is being denied.

 

[Takuan]

A topic change is in order, init?

U wot m8?

Discussion is still flowing along on topic.

But a lot of people think 'purple penguins' is still in play when, in fact, it isn't. At the very least, it's as misleading as the NR article.

 

[SmokyDave]

We are, even if it's not intentional. I've referred to people by the wrong pronoun all the time, and I can see the wincing in their faces. Feels bad.

Unless you're particularly active in the LGBTQQIAA community, I find this hard to believe. That, or you have some form of gender-based prosopagnosia.

 

[SquiddyCracker]

A topic change is in order, init?

U wot m8?

Discussion is still flowing along on topic.

 

[TheChocolateWar]

Perhaps the rules will just need to be wiggly until we can all settle on something. After all, look at what the word "queer" has been through in just a decade.
t.

Yes, lets bend the essential rules of linguistics so we can make up words with very little objective, substantive meaning. That is why I am, and remain, an advocate of gender neutrality.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Unless you're particularly active in the LGBTQQIAA community, I find this hard to believe. That, or you have some form of gender-based prosopagnosia.

I live in the genderfree liberal dystopia of America. (Pacific Northwest) It's never something I encountered on the east coast, for sure, but then a lot has changed in the last decade about trans awareness. A cashier at my Safeway goes by Erica, and to anyone who didn't see her nametag, you'd just assume it was an old man with a ponytail.

 

[Deified Data]

I anoint thee: Sublime Harrier

I'll take it.

My boss weapon creates razor sharp feathers that circle around you and deal damage to nearby enemies, I bet.

 

[JinjoUnchained]

By quoting me you have all entered the Contract.

Henceforth, your names shall be:

I anoint thee: Insight Gecko


Bathe in the starlight, my banner-bearers.

Hah, love it. Can my weapon give 15% or more damage.

 

[Moral Panic]

Do they have non-gendered toilets at this school?

 

[MIMIC]

You're completely missing the point and i have to believe it's intentional. Why call someone something that they might not identify with or enjoy being called at all? Is it not possible for you to get someone's attention without calling them a boy or a girl?

Why are you acting like this isn't based on a reasonable observation? If my friend wears sailor's hat every day, subscribes to "Sailors Monthly", always talks about sailing, has a boat, lives near the water, goes sailing at every waking opportunity, am I out of line if I get him something boating-related for his birthday?

I didn't just close my eyes, stick my hands out, grab the nearest body and go "Hey little boy"

 

[Kano on the Phone]

Why are you acting like this isn't based on a reasonable observation? If my friend wears sailor's hat every day, subscribes to "Sailors Monthly", always talks about sailing, has a boat, lives near the water, goes sailing at every waking opportunity, am I out of line if I get him something boating-related for his birthday?

I didn't just close my eyes, stick my hands out, grab the nearest body and go "Hey little boy"

Do you think that you know every transgendered person by sight? Really? Every transgendered person is out and dresses accordingly?

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

How many of these negative reactions are based on fear of not knowing how to interact with other human beings who are different than you, which then reinforces just how necessary it is that this teaching begins early?

 

[FStop7]

Harrison Bergeron.

 

[entremet]

Purple penguins is just ridiculous. I'm fine with progressive constructs, but let's not use such outlandish terminology. It's beyond stupid.

 

[SmokyDave]

I live in the genderfree liberal dystopia of America. (Pacific Northwest) It's never something I encountered on the east coast, for sure, but then a lot has changed in the last decade about trans awareness. A cashier at my Safeway goes by Erica, and to anyone who didn't see her nametag, you'd just assume it was an old man with a ponytail.

Eh, fair enough. I've had a few moments on the phone before, but never face to face. Mind you, I probably reflexively avoid gendered pronouns if my subconscious is in doubt.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Purple penguins is just ridiculous. I'm fine with progressive constructs, but let's not use such outlandish terminology. It's beyond stupid.

Is it? We already had one guy in here say his school gave every class a color and an animal and called them by that. We had a game show on Nickelodeon that used this classification. It's a normal thing.

 

[GravityMan]

This is silly, won't accomplish much of anything and will just cause more confusion. I have a feeling that the Nebraska school district will reverse this policy in the near future.

This is one of those things that look good in the lofty abstract but are effectively useless in the implementation. Even if you get it to work in the classroom (big if), it'll all fall apart once you go outside of that controlled scenario. Society is just too grounded in its gendered nouns and views for this to ever work. It would be a lot better to teach children to be more inclusive and accepting of those of different gender identities than going about it like this.

Exactly, good post.

 

[Kano on the Phone]

Purple penguins is just ridiculous. I'm fine with progressive constructs, but let's not use such outlandish terminology. It's beyond stupid.

They're children. It's intentionally silly.

This is silly, won't accomplish much of anything and will just cause more confusion. I have a feeling that the Nebraska school district will reverse this policy in the near future.

Can you explain? Why do you think just teaching kids not to think in a gender binary won't accomplish anything? Doesn't that seem like the doorway to exactly the thing you quoted and agreed with?

 

[entremet]

Is it? We already had one guy in here say his school gave every class a color and an animal and called them by that. We had a game show on Nickelodeon that used this classification. It's a normal thing.

They're children. It's intentionally silly.

I'd rather children be grounded in reality, not some silly nomenclature. Teach acceptance.

 

[Bulbo Urethral Baggins]

Is it? We already had one guy in here say his school gave every class a color and an animal and called them by that. We had a game show on Nickelodeon that used this classification. It's a normal thing.

Considering 1 out of every 10 males is colorblind, that's a very fucking inconsiderate, non-inclusive thing to do.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

I'd rather children be grounded in reality, not some silly nomenclature.

They are, if you read the guidelines document linked in the OP. "Purple penguins" was purposely included in the headline by National Review to stir up emotion.

Considering 1 out of every 10 males is colorblind, that's a very fucking inconsiderate, non-inclusive thing to do.

If you genuinely believe this, which we know you don't, it's worth discussing and updating in a way that works for us.

 

[Kano on the Phone]

I'd rather children be grounded in reality, not some silly nomenclature.

"Daddy, I'm in the unicorn lunch group at school!"
"What is this nonsense? What have I told you about staying grounded in reality?"

 

[MIMIC]

Do you think that you know every transgendered person by sight? Really? Every transgendered person is out and dresses accordingly?

Seriously, what are you doing? Why are you acting like I'm more likely to misidentify a transgendered person than I am a person who is not?

 

[SquiddyCracker]

Tbh, it's starting to get really accusatory in this thread. There's no need to marginalize people simply because you believe they've committed a slight (and it's possible there hasn't even been a slight.)

 

[etrain911]

I think it's cute and more unifying that the school has asked the children to pick their own names for the classroom instead of coming up with one on their own. I'm always for creating an environment of gender inclusivity and unification. Good on them.

 

[Kano on the Phone]

Seriously, what are you doing? Why are you acting like I'm more likely to misidentify a transgendered person than I am a person who is not?

Because you are? How would you know what a female transgendered person who isn't out and isn't dressed as a female identifies as one? What magic are you using?

 

[Bulbo Urethral Baggins]

If you genuinely believe this, which we know you don't, it's worth discussing and updating in a way that works for us.

I'm fairly serious. I had to suffer through that shit throughout school. And there was another dude in my classes who was completely colorblind, yet colors were used for all sorts of learning exercises and crap like what you were referring too. Please tell me how anyone in education could have thought that through carefully and came up with color identification as a way of grouping children while ignoring the well-known fact that 10% of males have some sort of color-blindness. I'd call that careless and ignorant at best. Anyway... off-topic. And my version of what I think purple is sucks.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

Here is Snoops article on this obvious right-wing propoganda bullshit that you fell for:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/educa...lepenguins.asp

Came here to post this. Thanks.

 

[Jayof9s]

Call them people.

And what if they don't self-identify as people?! You insensitive clod.

 

[entremet]

Because you are? How would you know what a female transgendered person who isn't out and isn't dressed as a female identifies as one? What magic are you using?

No one really knows. I worked with a few transgendered co-workers and I always asked them straight out.

 

[Teremap]

Apparently I'm late here, but I just wanted to mention that this really does make quite a lot of sense.

Especially for pre-pubescent kids, as literally the only difference between 'boys' and 'girls' at that age is their genitals. That's it. That's literally the only difference. Well, okay, their social upbringing is also a big part of that, but that's malleable. That can be changed (and it has, quite a lot) over time.

I don't see any point to gendering kids until they hit puberty, and they should be the ones to decide where they fall on the spectrum once they do.

Also, seriously, stop associating the color 'pink' with femininity already! Grumble, grumble, mutter, mutter...

 

[Allez Phill]

Who the fuck thought that 'purple penguins' would be a good saying lol.

 

[AlimNassor]

How many of these negative reactions are based on fear of not knowing how to interact with other human beings who are different than you, which then reinforces just how necessary it is that this teaching begins early?

And why demonize people for using the term "boy" or "girl"? I don't have any issue with LBGT, but, i don't see how using the terms boy or girl somehow excludes everyone.

 

[SquiddyCracker]

And why demonize people for using the term "boy" or "girl"? I don't have any issue with LBGT, but, i don't see how using the terms boy or girl somehow excludes everyone.

You can see how it might force attached gender expectations & stereotypes down their throats though, right?

When people say boy, a number of sexist & patriarchal associations come to mind as a result of a gender biased and gender separatist society.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

And why demonize people for using the term "boy" or "girl"? I don't have any issue with LBGT, but, i don't see how using the terms boy or girl somehow excludes everyone.

That's not really what's going on, but the document provided describes their thought process: http://watchdog.wpengine.netdna-cdn...014/10/Gender-inclusive-training-handouts.pdf

 

[MIMIC]

Because you are? How would you know what a female transgendered person who isn't out and isn't dressed as a female identifies as one? What magic are you using?

Since the population of one vastly outnumbers the other, this incredibly false.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

Since the population of one vastly outnumbers the other, this incredibly false.

There are more intersex people than redheads.

 

[Kano on the Phone]

Since the population of one vastly outnumbers the other, this incredibly false.

People have shared stories of using the wrong gender pronoun to people in this very thread. You're just wrong.

 

[Admiral Bone to Pick]

You can see how it might force attached gender expectations & stereotypes down their throats though, right?

When people say boy, a number of sexist & patriarchal associations come to mind as a result of a gender biased and gender separatist society.

I want to say this is sarcasm but I can never be sure in these types of threads.