• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Breaking Bad - Season 3 - Sundays on AMC

Status
Not open for further replies.
C

CygnusXS

will gain confidence one day
Kal said:
... but the whole episode could have been split into other episodes...
Click to expand...
It was though. Fly was the culmination of an entire season's worth of obsessive-compulsive, neurotic behaviour. Fixing the rot in his house, cutting the crust off his sandwiches, scooping the band-aid out of the pool, fixing the table in the hospital. They were all symptoms of the same psychological issue that Walt faced head-on in this episode. There have been similar scenes of Jesse's intense vulnerability folllowing Jane's death strewn throughout season 3. They took those minor background threads and tied them together here. It's not like they just pulled this stuff out of nowhere.
 
K

Kal

Member
CygnusXS said:
It was though. Fly was the culmination of an entire season's worth of obsessive-compulsive, neurotic behaviour. Fixing the rot in his house, cutting the crust off his sandwiches, scooping the band-aid out of the pool, fixing the table in the hospital. They were all symptoms of the same psychological issue that Walt faced head-on in this episode. There have been similar scenes of Jesse's intense vulnerability folllowing Jane's death strewn throughout season 3. They took those minor background threads and tied them together here. It's not like they just pulled this stuff out of nowhere.
Click to expand...


We already knew Walt was neurotic and Jesse missed Jane. We really didn't need a whole episode to re-emphasize those points. The episode would have salvaged if Walt did tell Jesse he did nothing while Jane choked on her own vomit. Nothing happened in this episode. Nothing.
 
C

Costanza

Banned
Kal said:
We already knew Walt was neurotic and Jesse missed Jane. We really didn't need a whole episode to re-emphasize those points. The episode would have salvaged if Walt did tell Jesse he did nothing while Jane choked on her own vomit. Nothing happened in this episode. Nothing.
Click to expand...
.
 
J

jacobs34

Member
I have to say that the scene in which Walt contemplates what would have been the perfect time for him to die was one of the best written, heartbreaking scenes that the show has produced. Between that scene and the Lost finale I couldn't help but get a little choked up.
 
L

Leunam

Member
Kal said:
We already knew Walt was neurotic and Jesse missed Jane. We really didn't need a whole episode to re-emphasize those points. The episode would have salvaged if Walt did tell Jesse he did nothing while Jane choked on her own vomit. Nothing happened in this episode. Nothing.
Click to expand...

Like Cygnus said, they were small threads (at least in Walts case) that brought him to this. Before, it was just, "LOL Walt is so funny look how he's always being a nut and fixin things and cleanin pools." Now it's been stressed that Walt is having some major issues, especially since he's willing to stop a major operation with a certain drug lord that now allows "no room for error." All because of a small, ultimately harmless, fly. His problem is now crippling his job to the point where it may have some major repercussions, especially now since there isn't really any other excuse he can fall back on as to why his output may be lacking.
 
S

Speevy

Banned
The thing is, whenever compelling events take a backseat on this show, writing and acting take over in such a way that you can't call any episode bad.
 
W

water_wendi

Water is not wet!
This was Breaking Bads Across the Sea. Horrible. Easily the worst of the entire run. Like Kal said.. there is nothing here but reiteration of what we already know.
 
S

Speevy

Banned
water_wendi said:
This was Breaking Bads Across the Sea. Horrible. Easily the worst of the entire run. Like Kal said.. there is nothing here but reiteration of what we already know.
Click to expand...


Don't ever compare an episode of Breaking Bad to an episode of Lost.

Ever.
 
D

dave is ok

aztek is ok
The show doesn't work without episodes like 'Fly' or 'Four Days Out'. The reason the tension and action sequences work so well in Breaking Bad is because you know the characters so well - if the show needs to show me how badly Walt needs to be in control for 45 minutes, so I'll feel thrilled for him when he reasserts himself and takes control or feel horrible when he loses grip even more - so be it.
 
D

daw840

Member
Holy shit at people thinking that episode was terrible. The dialogue was fucking riveting in the last half. The first half was a little slow and off, but it was totally redeemed by the second half.
 
S

SystemShock2

Member
I thought the episode was ok by the end, but for the first half, I was incredibly disappointed. At the half way point, I was about to label the episode filler. Watching a guy chase a fly around with predictable comedic results wasn't very entertaining. Luckily they had some good dialogue and incite to Walt's thoughts, realizations, and feelings, but I'm not sure it was enough to save the episode.
 
C

Clipjoint

Member
I think this episode is a litmus test. Anyone who just cares about plot progression is bound to be disappointed. Those of us who love the experience of the series on all levels - from the dialogue to the acting to the cinematography to the subtext - were all thrilled with the progression.
 
T

tokkun

Member
Kal said:
We already knew Walt was neurotic and Jesse missed Jane. We really didn't need a whole episode to re-emphasize those points. The episode would have salvaged if Walt did tell Jesse he did nothing while Jane choked on her own vomit. Nothing happened in this episode. Nothing.
Click to expand...

Saying "Oh, he's always been neurotic" is a little ridiculous. Did you miss the part where Walt said that he wished he had died already? Did you miss his borderline psychosis? The stuff that happened went way beyond neurotic.
 
C

Costanza

Banned
tokkun said:
Saying "Oh, he's always been neurotic" is a little ridiculous. Did you miss the part where Walt said that he wished he had died already? Did you miss his borderline psychosis? The stuff that happened went way beyond neurotic.
Click to expand...
That was pretty obvious last week when he drove in front of that truck.

There was literally no new insight into anything during this episode. It was fucking worthless.
 
J

jacobs34

Member
Clipjoint said:
I think this episode is a litmus test. Anyone who just cares about plot progression is bound to be disappointed. Those of us who love the experience of the series on all levels - from the dialogue to the acting to the cinematography to the subtext - were all thrilled with the progression.
Click to expand...

This. I find it incredible that people are so down on this episode. If ever there was a show that earned an episode like this, it was this show. Breaking Bad is great because of it's writing and acting, and this show was a great example of both. It was a microcosm of the entire series and reinforced why we care about both Walt and Jesse, flawed as they may be. Next week we'll get back to the plot heavy stuff, but "Fly" stripped the story back to it's bare elements, and I loved every minute of it.
 
W

water_wendi

Water is not wet!
Speevy said:
Don't ever compare an episode of Breaking Bad to an episode of Lost.

Ever.
Click to expand...
Look i know Breaking Bad is not even in the same ballpark as Lost in terms of.. well, everything.. but besides BB being a little hokey and tiresome here and there, its good show overall.
 
F

Freyjadour

Member
Speevy said:
Don't ever compare an episode of Breaking Bad to an episode of Lost.

Ever.
Click to expand...

Jesus can we cut the shit? This is the worst sort of discussion on the forum and really no better than console warring in the Gaming section.



Episode: First half of it I was thinking they just needed another episode to fill out 13, but the writing on the second half was top notch as usual. Still a weak episode for Breaking Bad overall.
 
D

daw840

Member
water_wendi said:
Look i know Breaking Bad is not even in the same ballpark as Lost in terms of.. well, everything.. but besides BB being a little hokey and tiresome here and there, its good show overall.
Click to expand...

Breaking Bad>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Pile of Dog Shit>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>LOST.
 
F

Freyjadour

Member
daw840 said:
Breaking Bad>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Pile of Dog Shit>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>LOST.
Click to expand...

Congratulations on your fantastic contribution to the discussion.

I'm out, later folks.
 
C

Clipjoint

Member
Quoting Sepinwall, since he nailed it in his review:

Sepinwall said:
I am going to talk to you for a few paragraphs about how the sausage gets made in television. If you'd rather not think too much about production logistics and budgets and whatnot and just focus on why "Fly" was such an unusual, incredible hour for this series, just skim until I start talking about "The Sopranos."

But I want to start off with sausage-making because it was clear to me that "Fly" was what's known in the industry as "a bottle show" - that is, an episode of the series shot almost entirely on existing sets, with a minimum of guest stars. The idea is to keep the budget as small as possible, so that you can then spend whatever money you saved on another episode down the road. (Or, in some cases, so you can compensate for a previous episode that cost more than anticipated.)

Last year, "Breaking Bad" tried to do a bottle show with "4 Days Out," the episode with Jesse and Walt trapped in the desert after the RV's battery runs down. The idea was that it would only feature Cranston and Paul and take place largely on the standing RV set and therefore be dirt-cheap. Instead, it wound up being one of that season's most expensive episodes, as more and more of the action began creeping outside of the camper and into the desert itself, which meant lots of location filming, often at irregular hours (a lot of that episode, you may recall, took place around dawn and dusk to get a particularly beautiful light quality), and that costs man-hours, it costs crew overtime, and it costs simply to transport all the men and materials back and forth from the studio to the desert.

Still, the basic idea of that episode went to the core of "Breaking Bad" - that of teacher and pupil stuck together, getting on each other's nerves, and revisting all the damage they've done to themselves, to each other, and to the world at large since they teamed up. So it wasn't surprising that the show would try to revisit the basic conceit - nor that Vince Gilligan and company (here with Sam Catlin and Moira Walley-Beckett on script, and Rian Johnson directing) would find a way to do a bottle show as a bottle show. Having already spent the money to build the huge Walt-cave set, they were able to dwell inside it for 95% of an episode, with no castmembers other than the two leads (which is valuable, since most TV shows these days can only sign a few regulars to appear in every episode), and no other speaking parts.

And it was through that attempt at minimalism and frugality that we got the "Breaking Bad" equivalent of the "Pine Barrens" episode of "The Sopranos." Only this one was, heresy though it may be, better.

Both "Pine Barrens" and "Fly" were black comedies about crooks out of their element (Paulie and Christopher lost in the woods, Walt and Jesse trying to play exterminator), but much as I love "Pine Barrens," it stayed in that minor key. "Fly" started out as slapstick; one critic on Twitter compared it, not inaccurately, to Wile E. Coyote trying to catch the Road Runner, and certainly Walt's fall off the railing was as broad a moment as this show has had. But as Jesse realized the only way to control Walt's obsession with the fly was to play along, it turned into something much darker, and deeper, and tenser, until we got to that riveting scene where Jesse is standing atop the rickety ladder, with his only support coming from a Walt who's barely conscious from sleeping pills, and Walt is talking about Jane, and we wonder...

...will this be the moment Walt finally fesses up about what he did?

We've seen Walt make damaging admissions under the influence of anesthesia before, and I think we all assume that the series can't end without that ugly truth coming out. But what would Jesse do in this moment when there are no witnesses and Walt would be defenseless to help himself? Or would the shock of the news be so great that Jesse would lose his balance and break his neck, once again sparing Walt of the consequences of his actions?

What an incredible moment, and what an incredible scene leading up to it, with Jesse telling the story of his aunt's cancer(*), and that story (and the influence of the sleeping pills) in turn inspiring Walt to be reflective and to admit that he's lived too long and hurt too many people. A fatal cancer diagnosis allowed him to justify becoming a meth-lord. But instead of his dream of a quick payday that wouldn't harm anyone except the users, it's become a long blood bath, and one that's driven away his wife and will drive away his surrogate son if Jesse ever finds out the truth of what happened to Jane. Had Walt found a way to die that night before he left the house, things might have gone very differently. Jane wouldn't have died - at least not that night, though Jesse fairly points out that the money from Gus probably would have led to an overdose within weeks - Donald in turn wouldn't have caused the plane crash and Walt wouldn't have been there for his surgery, and to make the damning second cell phone admission to his wife.

(*) Aaron Paul has been given a lot of opportunities to monologue this year, and there's a reason for that: he's great at it. Bryan Cranston's best moments tend to come when Walt is silently reacting to something he's just done, or that's been done to him, but Paul's gifts seem at their greatest when the show just steps back and lets the man talk. Doesn't matter what the subject is - high school wood shop, a trapped opossum, his plan for revenge on Hank - it is always sensational.

Now where is he? He's making more money than his family will be able to spend (even if he's still getting royally hosed by Gus), but he works for a man so smart and ruthless that Walt's death could come at any time without warning. His wife has once again made it clear that she hates and fears him. And every day, he goes to work with a reminder of all the deaths he helped cause because he was so afraid Jane would tell Skyler a truth that she found out anyway.

He is empty and broken, and all he has left is this fancy underground lair, and even that's been contaminated - not just by the fly (who becomes the latest tiny thing to draw Walt's obsessive-compulsiveness, ala the band-aid in the swimming pool or the alleged rot under the house or the uneven table leg at the hospital), but by his knowledge of all the danger that comes with the joint.

Jesse ultimately kills the fly, Walt gets some sleep, and the batch gets made, but the contaminant never goes away, as we see when yet another fly turns up on the smoke detector in Walt's sterile fake apartment.

What's left for this sorry pair? Jesse is still trapped back in time in his relationship with Jane, dwelling on any little memento of her (first the voicemail, and here a cigarette butt with her lipstick stain on it), self-destructively skimming meth from the batch and getting indignant when Walt gently warns him about it. And Walt has nothing but his cash and his lab and his paranoia, and I wouldn't be surprised at all if, sometime before this season ends, he blurts out the truth about Jane without need of pharmaceuticals.

And then Jesse is going to wish he hit him a hell of a lot harder with that ridiculous homemade fly swatter.

Simple episode. Cheap episode. Brilliant episode. A series high point. I love the explosions and the shoot-outs and the mind games, but all this show needs to achieve greatness are these two horribly flawed characters, and the two tremendous actors playing them.
Click to expand...
 
C

Charmicarmicat

Banned
daw840 said:
Breaking Bad>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Pile of Dog Shit>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>LOST.
Click to expand...

So I take it you sit around and watch a lot of dog shit to be able to judge?
 
D

Dr. Strangelove

I'M COOCOO FOR COCO CRISP!
Kal said:
We already knew Walt was neurotic and Jesse missed Jane. We really didn't need a whole episode to re-emphasize those points. The episode would have salvaged if Walt did tell Jesse he did nothing while Jane choked on her own vomit. Nothing happened in this episode. Nothing.
Click to expand...
How would that have salvaged the episode? That would have RUINED the episode. It would have been incredibly lazy writing to introduce another major plot point revelation due to Walt being under the influence of a sedative.

Also, if you find yourself agreeing with Costanza, ever, then you're doing it wrong. Dude has some of the worst taste in all of GAF.


harSon said:
http://neogaf.net/forum/showpost.php?p=21166520&postcount=10
Click to expand...
:lol
 
O

OptimoPeach

Banned
jacobs34 said:
This. I find it incredible that people are so down on this episode. If ever there was a show that earned an episode like this, it was this show. Breaking Bad is great because of it's writing and acting, and this show was a great example of both. It was a microcosm of the entire series and reinforced why we care about both Walt and Jesse, flawed as they may be. Next week we'll get back to the plot heavy stuff, but "Fly" stripped the story back to it's bare elements, and I loved every minute of it.
Click to expand...
Gonna ignore the impulse to call Costanza and Lost retarded and just say that I agree entirely with this post, and it deserves to be quoted.

I can see someone thinking it was just okay, or even a little weak, but to say that it was 100% filler and absolutely terrible is just ridiculous
 
D

daw840

Member
Charmicarmicat said:
So I take it you sit around and watch a lot of dog shit to be able to judge?
Click to expand...

Well, I do have two dogs. I have watched them shit many times. Also cleaned up quite a bit of it. It can be pretty interesting. Sometimes it's green, sometimes there is a balloon mixed in with it, or a hot sauce packet. I tell you what though, there is never a Tyranosaurus Rex or a death cloud in dog shit. That puts it pretty far ahead.
 
C

Charmicarmicat

Banned
daw840 said:
Well, I do have two dogs. I have watched them shit many times. Also cleaned up quite a bit of it. It can be pretty interesting. Sometimes it's green, sometimes there is a balloon mixed in with it, or a hot sauce packet. I tell you what though, there is never a Tyranosaurus Rex or a death cloud in dog shit. That puts it pretty far ahead.
Click to expand...

Well there's neither of them things in Lost either, but congrats on proving you really have no idea what you are talking about.
 
D

dave is ok

aztek is ok
I don't get how can you watch this show week after week and hate an episode like this. Makes no sense :lol

Maybe there wasn't any plot progression in terms of moving pieces and revelations, no one found out anything they didn't already know (except for Walt figuring out that Jesse is probably stealing) but you can't call an episode that gives you so much insight into the thoughts and feelings of its main character "skippable".
 
D

daw840

Member
Charmicarmicat said:
Well there's neither of them things in Lost either, but congrats on proving you really have no idea what you are talking about.
Click to expand...

Them things? Sorry, I don't speak hillbilly. Can someone translate?



Geeze, some people get so touchy on this board. Just a fucking joke. Calm down a little.
 
B

backflip10019

Member
dave is ok said:
I don't get how can you watch this show week after week and hate an episode like this. Makes no sense :lol

Maybe there wasn't any plot progression in terms of moving pieces and revelations, no one found out anything they didn't already know (except for Walt figuring out that Jesse is probably stealing) but you can't call an episode that gives you so much insight into the thoughts and feelings of its main character "skippable".
Click to expand...
I agree 100%. I really enjoyed it.
 
K

KingGondo

Banned
OptimoPeach said:
I can see someone thinking it was just okay, or even a little weak, but to say that it was 100% filler and absolutely terrible is just ridiculous
Click to expand...
thisisneogafdude.gif

My sense of outrage at stupid opinions has been thoroughly desensitized by NeoGAF.

Godfather thread? Somebody hates and always has. Beatles appreciation thread? Overrated--Oasis is better. It becomes pretty comical after a while, I just try to laugh at rubes like Costanza.
 
X

xbhaskarx

Member
dave is ok said:
For some reason, it really makes me feel better about this show using such a HUGE coincidence like Walt meeting Donald when the character acknowledges how big of a coincidence it was.

This episode did a great job of showing that Walt really considers letting Jane die be the turning point in his life. He feels tremendous guilt towards Jesse, Donald and even the people on the airplane. He even wishes he died before it happened.
Click to expand...

I agree. The Walt-Donald conversation at the bar really bugged me, until this episode.
 
C

Cornballer

Member
bridegur said:
Has anyone confirmed if this is the last season of the show?
Click to expand...
Should be at least one more season, though I don't know if there's been any official news about this. From an interview w/ Gilligan.
"It's always good in a perfect world that folks who make a TV show know where it's going to end," he said, "and yet so often we don't. I'd say at least one more season, season 4. Maybe to season 5 for Walt and Jesse and the family. And my perfect wish would be that we would know at least a year in advance when we're going to end... like 'Lost' is doing. That way you can write to it... I think all TV shows should do it that way. That's a good way to do it."
Click to expand...
 
T

tokkun

Member
Costanza said:
That was pretty obvious last week when he drove in front of that truck.

There was literally no new insight into anything during this episode. It was fucking worthless.
Click to expand...

The truck scene was impulsive and he swerved out of the way to safety before he was hit. In this episode he was consciously and deliberately saying "I have lived too long." If that is too subtle a difference for you to discern, well, I'm sure you can find a large selection of Michael Bay movies at your local Blockbuster.
 
W

Wiggum2007

Junior Member
So was there ever any significance to the plane crash besides something to weigh on Walt's conscience? Just finished re-watching Season 2 and it just seems weird to me that there was all that build-up the whole season, I think it's the only thing that rubs me wrong with the show so far.
 
F

Freyjadour

Member
dave is ok said:
I don't get how can you watch this show week after week and hate an episode like this. Makes no sense :lol

Maybe there wasn't any plot progression in terms of moving pieces and revelations, no one found out anything they didn't already know (except for Walt figuring out that Jesse is probably stealing) but you can't call an episode that gives you so much insight into the thoughts and feelings of its main character "skippable".
Click to expand...

I don't think it was skippable. Jesse and Walt have been needing a talk for a very long time, I just don't think that this particular conversation needed to happen in the context of an entire episode.

Furthermore, we didn't need an episode like this to confirm that Breaking Bad has good writing, we get it every time the show is on the air. When people sink to slinging shit at other popular shows, I think it becomes pretty apparent that they understand the weaknesses of such an episode as well.

Nevertheless, I thought Jesse's attitude after Walt's heart to heart with him and his attitude afterwards towards Walt's honest concern for the kid were totally at odds. I understand he's a wishy-washy character, but I'm ready for him to grow up. I don't really care for this particular subplot at all.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

  • Locked
Twitch launches Power Rangers Marathon starting Tuesday
397 398 399 400 401
20K
698K
LongDongJunon replied
Fear the Walking Dead - Season Three, Part Two - Sundays on AMC
2 3 4 5
201
26K
Baron Aloha replied
  • Locked
Los Pollos Hermanos From ‘Breaking Bad’ Is Popping Up in LA This Week
36
8K
daffy replied
  • Locked
Star Wars Celebration 2017 |OT| A thread forty years in the making. You'll be Omazed.
127 128 129 130 131
7K
322K
DoctorFling replied
Fear the Walking Dead - Season Three, Part One - Sundays on AMC
2 3 4 5
232
31K
Boss X replied
Top Bottom