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First Tomb Raider Review out in the wild - Embargo up on Monday 02/25

Excellent start. The game was always going to review well, and the fact that the embargo lifts on Monday screams confidence. Can not wait to read more!

By the way, Jim Sterling is reviewing the game for Destructoid. It should be interesting to see what he gives it...I'm looking forward to his review.


90%?

Not bad. Maybe this isn't the disaster people seem to be craving.

It was never going to be a disaster. Not what some Tomb Raider fans wanted? Sure. But it was never for one moment looking like an outright bad game.


Is there any reason why people want this to be a wreck?


It's mostly bitter die-hard Tomb Raider fans being extra vocal because they don't like the direction the franchise has taken. They’re brutal, angry people.


tricky i shadow post if you're okay

^_^
 

Shinta

Banned
I'm just sick of getting told I've shut my ears and turned off my brain by people who won't do me the courtesy of considering both of these points of view when they expect me to.

Your stance that only your #1 is necessary to give a fair assessment of the game is what I disagree with. Both would be necessary for a fair assessment in my book. It is perfectly reasonable for someone to argue solely from either perspective, but not even thinking the other side worthy of consideration would be folly.

I think the bulk of any review should be #1, and that's all that should govern the score as well.

There's nothing at all wrong with putting in a whole section on #2 for fans of the previous games though, and explaining how similar they are to past games and what kind of things they can expect.

That's just my opinion on it. Scores driven by #2, and reviews solely driven by #2 are a major bane on the industry.
 
I think the bulk of any review should be #1, and that's all that should govern the score as well.

There's nothing at all wrong with putting in a whole section on #2 for fans of the previous games though, and explaining how similar they are to past games and what kind of things they can expect.

That's just my opinion on it. Scores driven by #2, and reviews solely driven by #2 are a major bane on the industry.

I agree that #2 is important.

Remember the point of a review, ultimately, is to help people decide if they should buy and play a game. Comparing to old games that I have already played is a great point of reference. You can explain really well why RE6 is a great game in isolation and run down the features, but unless I really know the reviewers likes and dislikes, it will not help a great deal.

...

On topic, I hate the direction they have taken this tomb raider game, however I still want it to be a really good game that I can enjoy.
 
I think the bulk of any review should be #1, and that's all that should govern the score as well.

There's nothing at all wrong with putting in a whole section on #2 for fans of the previous games though, and explaining how similar they are to past games and what kind of things they can expect.

That's just my opinion on it. Scores driven by #2, and reviews solely driven by #2 are a major bane on the industry.

Well, perhaps you will appreciate the effort I'll be putting into my impressions on this.

What's gonna happen though if the unthinkable occurs and I end up thinking this is kind of a fun Tomb Raider game, but is objectively shit? ;p
 

Shinta

Banned
Well, perhaps you will appreciate the effort I'll be putting into my impressions on this.

What's gonna happen though if the unthinkable occurs and I end up thinking this is kind of a fun Tomb Raider game, but is objectively shit? ;p

I don't know lol. We'll cross that bridge when we come to it I guess!

I'm going to try and run through the game on Spring Break, so I'll post some impressions if there's a thread for it.
 
What's gonna happen though if the unthinkable occurs and I end up thinking this is kind of a fun Tomb Raider game, but is objectively shit? ;p

You'll need to be very clear about which tomb raider game you mean. The old good ones or the old shit ones or the new ones that are somewhere in the middle or the other new one which is terrible or the reboot of the old good one which was great or the other reboot which was good but different.

;)
 
You'll need to be very clear about which tomb raider game you mean. The old good ones or the old shit ones or the new ones that are somewhere in the middle or the other new one which is terrible or the reboot of the old good one which was great or the other reboot which was good or different.

;)

Tomb Raider |OT| Who Gives a Shit as Long as It's Better than Angel of Darkness
 

kunonabi

Member
I think the bulk of any review should be #1, and that's all that should govern the score as well.

There's nothing at all wrong with putting in a whole section on #2 for fans of the previous games though, and explaining how similar they are to past games and what kind of things they can expect.

That's just my opinion on it. Scores driven by #2, and reviews solely driven by #2 are a major bane on the industry.


Very few reviewers actually operate according to number 2. You seem oblivious to the fact that most of the games you mentioned were crapped on because they were awful games regardless of how different they played from the rest of the series. It always looks worse when you release a poor title in a series that has a certain expectation of quality. It's a double-edged sword because you're more likely to get people to buy the next title since they had good experience with the previous titles but you also create expectations for the quality of the work.

I don't like castletroids at all. They just don't provide the type of gameplay I desire out of Castlevania. I still recognize them as well-made games but I am not obligated to play to them. If a series revokes everything that made me a fan of it then I have every right to stop caring about it. I like game companies trying new things but new does not always equal quality. From a conceptual point of view I loved the possibilities that SH4 and Shattered Memories brought but the games ended up being complete garbage. I'm not going to them a pass purely for being different.

My issue with Tomb Raider isn't that they completely changed it but that they changed it into amalgamation of EVERYTHING I dislike about modern games. You seem incapable of grasping that these games are being critiqued for a variety of reasons from people with all sorts of different perspectives. If you're happy to follow every major release like a sheep that's your business but the rest of us aren't obligated to spend 60$ for every piece of crap the game industry pushes out.
 

Shinta

Banned
Very few reviewers actually operate according to number 2. You seem oblivious to the fact that most of the games you mentioned were crapped on because they were awful games regardless of how different they played from the rest of the series.
Bullshit. You write this same post probably once a week, and I pretty much ignore it every time.
 

Shosai

Banned
I agree that #2 is important.

Remember the point of a review, ultimately, is to help people decide if they should buy and play a game. Comparing to old games that I have already played is a great point of reference. You can explain really well why RE6 is a great game in isolation and run down the features, but unless I really know the reviewers likes and dislikes, it will not help a great deal.

...

On topic, I hate the direction they have taken this tomb raider game, however I still want it to be a really good game that I can enjoy.

Generally, it sounds like good practice to review games independently, based solely on their own merits. But games don't exist in a vacuum, and no one has time to play every game. The result is reviewers and gamers comparing any given title in front of them to what else is already out there.

MoH: Warfighter got savaged by reviewers. Not because it had some crippling flaws, but because CoD existed and did everything Warfighter attempted to do, but better. The common tagline was, "In a universe where CoD exists, why bother with Warfighter?".

Alternatively, think of the worst game you ever played. If it was the the only video game ever made, it would sell millions of copies and be universally hailed as an entertainment milestone. Reviews written from the perspective of someone who has never played a game before generally aren't that helpful to readers

I think the bulk of any review should be #1, and that's all that should govern the score as well.

There's nothing at all wrong with putting in a whole section on #2 for fans of the previous games though, and explaining how similar they are to past games and what kind of things they can expect.

That's just my opinion on it. Scores driven by #2, and reviews solely driven by #2 are a major bane on the industry.

Reviews are written for people considering buying the game. Most of the people who consider buying RE6 or FFXIII are fans of the franchise. And they want to know certain information about the new games. Specifically, they want to know how the new entries compare to the previous titles. What did they change, what are the new mechanics, are are they as fun of an experience as the previous titles, etc

On the other hand, gamers who have never played an entry in the franchise are mostly interested in knowing how the game compares to other entries in the same genre, and whether a similar but superior experience can be found elsewhere.
 
I feel iffy about my pre-order on this game. I'm not sure how it comes togther. I want to like it, but I feel ambivalent about it. If only someone could basically tell me how this game breaks down, I could get a better understanding of it.
 

RyudBoy

Member
I know a lot of people will bitch that it's not really Tomb raider anymore but I'm perfectly fine with a new Uncharted featuring boobs.

Nonetheless, I'm eager to hear more opinions on Monday before I decide to buy. Looking good so far!
 

Harlequin

Member
Tomb Raider |OT| Who Gives a Shit as Long as It's Better than Angel of Darkness

If you play the patched version on PC it's actually a great TR game (I've been told the PS2 controls are crap but I've never played that version so all I can say is that the PC controls shouldn't give you too many problems). Sure, it's unfinished and has got a few plot holes because of it. Controlling Kurtis is a pain in the arse and the same goes for turning Lara around on staircases :p. But other than that it's got good to great level design, puzzles and platforming, a great atmosphere and soundtrack and pretty decent graphics for its time.

I feel iffy about my pre-order on this game. I'm not sure how it comes togther. I want to like it, but I feel ambivalent about it. If only someone could basically tell me how this game breaks down, I could get a better understanding of it.

I'm sure at least one of the reviews arriving on Monday will answer that question :).
 

sueil

Member
So when this game sells poorly I am wondering what the line of blame will be. Fans fault for not buying it, female lead games don't sell, or just a bad time for video games all around.
 

Derrick01

Banned
So when this game sells poorly I am wondering what the line of blame will be. Fans fault for not buying it, female lead games don't sell, or just a bad time for video games all around.

When it bombs I think they'll just pretend it doesn't exist in their next few financial reports like they've been doing with Hitman Absolution.
 

Deadbeat

Banned
So when this game sells poorly I am wondering what the line of blame will be. Fans fault for not buying it, female lead games don't sell, or just a bad time for video games all around.
Im going with the woman one. DmC was already the fans fault one.
When it bombs I think they'll just pretend it doesn't exist in their next few financial reports like they've been doing with Hitman Absolution.
I guess thats another possibility.
 
I loved the original tomb raider series... I love the uncharted series... I'm very interested to see how well they've really mixed the 2 or if the tomb raider of old is gone for good.


Really excited to protect Lara though.............
 

sleepykyo

Member
Unbiased reviews are the new genuine reviews.

Epic, stirring, gripping, emotional, gritty, mature.. expect to see these words being used a lot in the future.

I was thinking more along the lines unbiased reviews = "fair and balanced" for video games.
 

iNvid02

Member
always felt like games master was geared toward a very young teenage audience, explains the language they use .
 

Squire

Banned
Bullshit. You write this same post probably once a week, and I pretty much ignore it every time.

You have a nasty habit of grand standing for awful games that are reviewed as such not because of any bias on a reviewers' part, but because they're just that: awful.

If you can't argue design (or argue at all), then fine. But why reply so childishly? LuuKyK does the same thing. (See: Every FFXIII thread in the past year.)
 

Shinta

Banned
You have a nasty habit of grand standing for awful games that are reviewed as such not because of any bias on a reviewers' part, but because they're just that: awful.

If you can't argue design (or argue at all), then fine. But why reply so childishly? LuuKyK does the same thing. (See: Every FFXIII thread in the past year.)

So I have to go into a long explanation of why I think FFXIII and RE6 are good games every week when this guy posts the same comments? No thanks. I've gone into extensive detail on both over and over and over in threads dedicated to those games.

You really think I haven't typed out my reasons for liking those games on here?

It's funny how your opinion of the games being awful is considered fine, but my opinion that they're good is way out of bounds. This is why calling it bullshit is 100% justified. His post has no reasons why he thinks those games are awful, nor does yours. Talk about hypocritical.

And why are you calling me chlidish? The guy types out a post with personal attacks against me, instead of my position which goes against the sticky EvilLore has up at the top of the forum and I don't respond with any personal insults towards him.

And why drag LuuKyK into this? His posts are fine. If you really think he's the problem with FF threads, you need to really take a step back and reevaluate a few other posters on here.
 
eh i don't trust those early reviews at all, good or bad.
Too much bullshitting has happened with those in the past (e.g. DA2 PC gamer review)
 
It'll really be something! There may be casualties. Lara will be exclaiming apologies- with a shotgun in her hands!

rambolaralkqfb.gif


headshot22estl.gif


That's what the entire thread will be. It'll be Tricky and Derrick murdering each other over and over again. I just feel it in my bones.
 

Squire

Banned
So I have to go into a long explanation of why I think FFXIII and RE6 are good games every week when this guy posts the same comments? No thanks. I've gone into extensive detail on both over and over and over in threads dedicated to those games.

You really think I haven't typed out my reasons for liking those games on here?

It's funny how your opinion of the games being awful is considered fine, but my opinion that they're good is way out of bounds. This is why calling it bullshit is 100% justified. And what are you, 5 years old? The guy types out a post with personal attacks against me, instead of my position which goes against the sticky EvilLore has up at the top of the forum and I don't respond with any personal insults towards him.

And why drag LuuKyK into this? His posts are fine. If you really think he's the problem with FF threads, you need to really take a step back and reevaluate a few other posters on here.

Two wrongs don't make a right. You claim you've made your case before, but this is a new thread. What do you expect us to do, search your post history so we can discover your brilliant thesis statements on why FFXIII and RE6 are magnificent? "This post is bullshit and you always post it and I always ignore it!"

Seriously?

Are you a five-year-old?

I mention Luu because you both are good at childish replies and awful at actually debating points. If you disagree with his (very sound) argument, than say why; pick it apart. The moment wrote, "Oh, same old BS" he won.
 

dreamfall

Member
headshot22estl.gif


That's what the entire thread will be. It'll be Tricky and Derrick murdering each other over and over again. I just feel it in my bones.

There will be blood! That Shotgun gif is eerily reminiscent of The Last of Us!

Where will we find each other on the battlefield of Modern game adaptations? Will Tricky's optimism for the Lara reboot prevail over Derick's educated cynical critique?

We're going to have to take sides.
 
There will be blood! That Shotgun gif is eerily reminiscent of The Last of Us!

Where will we find each other on the battlefield of Modern game adaptations? Will Tricky's optimism for the Lara reboot prevail over Derick's educated cynical critique?

We're going to have to take sides.

icH6tkqNNM1QS.gif


See you on the other side, brotha.

Actually, this might have been more apt:

tumblr_m7og1dB3rI1r30wq7o1_500.gif
 
http://www.abload.de/img/rambolaralkqfb.gif[IMG]

[IMG]http://www.abload.de/img/headshot22estl.gif[IMG]

That's what the entire thread will be. It'll be Tricky and Amir0x murdering each other over and over again. I just feel it in my bones.[/QUOTE]

fixed

You know, I'd be terrified of shooting a shotgun that close to my foot
 

Shinta

Banned
Two wrongs don't make a right. You claim you've made your case before, but this is a new thread. What do you expect us to do, search your post history so we can discover your brilliant thesis statements on why FFXIII and RE6 are magnificent? "This post is bullshit and you always post it and I always ignore it!"

Seriously?

Are you a five-year-old?

I mention Luu because you both are good at childish replies and awful at actually debating points. If you disagree with his (very sound) argument, than say why; pick it apart. The moment wrote, "Oh, same old BS" he won.

You said I have a history of grandstanding for those games, so you're pretty much saying that you see me posting about those games all the time. If you want to know my positions on why I like those games, look at virtually every XIII or RE6 thread and you'll find it. I had posters insulting me in the last one for posting it too much.

It's really not a mystery. You're just trying to make an argument out of nothing. XIII is still one of the most gorgeous games I've ever seen, has a really great battle system, a strong cast (certainly stronger than FFXII), possibly my favorite game OST of all time, and an extremely interesting mythology. RE6 has some of the most innovative and nuanced TPS combat I've seen since Vanquish. Super fun game packed with 4 campaigns worth of content and online co-op that works perfectly.

I had a great time with both. In both cases, I think players skew way more negative than they otherwise would have just because of series expectations. It's really not a very complicated theory.

Then someone shows up and says, nuh uh they are objectively shit cause I say so. And you say he won? Not sure what else to say here lol. This is an extremely stupid conversation. Grasp at those straws I guess. It won't change my mind.

And I say again, dragging LuuKyk into this is bullshit. His posts are totally fine. You're insulting a commenter behind his back who isn't even posting in this thread. He's not even here to defend himself. That's some bullshit. I'm not even sure what you think he does that's so bad. He likes the XIII series and posts in XIII threads? That's apparently the worst sin you can commit on this site.
 
Who is going to protect me from Lara?

The only one who is as equally skilled as Lara in the arts of death, destruction, and murder. You all cursed him. But now you will fall to your knees and pray that he will come and save you from our beautifully homicidal beauty.





























uncharted_3_21koqs1.jpg
 

C.Monkey

Banned
It's good to hear someone touting a good final third for once, rather than 'it all goes to shit' which seems to be what usually happens with games these days.
Seriously. Aside from Portal 2 , I have a hard time thinking of games that had a strong finish in the past year or 2.
 
The only one who is as equally skilled as Lara in the arts of death, destruction, and murder. You all cursed him. But now you will fall to your knees and pray that he will come and save you from our beautifully homicidal beauty.

"Drake, you're a loose cannon and you've this city millions but, you're a damn fine cop."
"If I do this, Captain, it's gonna be my way."
"Whatever you say. Just remember, I'm putting my ass out on the line for you here. Don't fuck me, Drake"
"I can't make any promises"

 
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