suck it lakers!!!!!!!!
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NBA Finals 2017 |OT| Same As It Ever Was
- Thread starter Jarate
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They did have a choice and all those moves were sweetheart moves between the players and former Celtics best buds running those franchises. Lebron didn't start anything which didn't already exist.
Perhaps more than any player or athlete in sports, Lebron was branded the Chosen 1 since HS and his every achievement always paled in comparison to MJ and his every failure further cemented his legacy as "not good enough". What's shocking is that this level of pressure and expectation would usually sink most people, yet Lebron has actually lived up to the hype and then some.
With all this on his head and shoulders, knowing he can't win the championship by himself, and knowing he couldn't get players like Wade or Bosh to come to Cleveland, he made the best decision for himself, his legacy, and his family. But back then it was a bitch move. he wasn't man enough, tough enough, or just wanted the easy way out. He should have gone to the worst team in the West to earn his title!!!
The same people you see in these threads now sticking up for KD and how good of a choice it was for him, I bet almost all were ready to destroy Lebron for what he did. For the record, I have nothing against what KD did, but it is not even of the same magnitude as Lebron.
He didn't go join the Celtics. He went to a team with a no-name coach, a bad team in the EAST, and joined 2 top players but none who were MVPs or MVP caliber any longer.
The larger problem here is that for most fans there is acceptable idea that if a GM stacks a team by trades and FA then somehow that is genius! but if players decide to make moves or players dictate where they want to play, for who, and with who, then that is cheating the system. Somehow it isn't as organic as the GM or FO putting it all together. Only then is it legit or right.
Players shouldn't have the ability to change their own legacy or have any upward mobility. I don't even doubt race plays a huge part in this. From the slave owner type letter, the Cavs owner wrote to the whole bunch of assholes burning his jersey. Yet you won't find a similar reaction for when famous white athletes tell teams or organizations they don't want to play for them.
Elway is a hero. Eli is a hero. But Lebron decide what he want to do and where to play? Oh the humanity!
People invented and still do reasons for not liking Lebron. Had he stayed and never won it would be omg he never lived up to the hype is garbage. He left and took full control over his legacy and chances to win then somehow that is "calculated" as if that is bad. Oh he came back it must be for sinister reasons!
No shit he came back when it suit him and the pieces were in place. Or should he have come back again when they had nobody but him on a team?
Money? Though I find the concept of just chasing the rings and taking less admirable. Again this was not what people said about Lebron when he went to Miami. Back then it was pure hate against him.
Who exactly is losing their minds? KD has faced 1/10th of the criticism his entire career and for the move to go to GS than Lebron did for going to Miami.
and LOL at setting precedent. Yeah, no super teams or stacked teams existed before Lebron. You are a sad sad sad person.
CountAntonius
Member
JinjoUnchained
Member
The Cavs have enough shooting and rebounding to hang with the Dubs in a shootout, especially at home. Problem is their D. Last season they loaded up on a hobbled Steph and held him to 22 PPG. This year, they've often looked a step slow on rotations and individual D. That's a death sentence against this Warriors team. Cavs need to step up their D, and that starts with Tristan Thompson.
This works a whole lot better without 'Kevin Durant Be Like..."
Latvian Hitman
Member
Defensive win shares, huh?
#11- Russell Westbrook
#17- Kevin Love
#20- James Harden
...
...
...
...
#41- Kawhi Leonard
Analytics fail hard, yet again.
CountAntonius
Member
I didn't make it I just shared it. Fixed. Thanks IMG crop.
Analytics don't fail, only peoples understanding of them.
MegaManTrigger
Banned
What choice did Allen and KG have? They weren't in unrestricted free agency trying to decide what team they wanted to go to like Lebron and Durant did, that's the key difference that you're not taking into account. This all started when KG said no to Timberwolves trading him to Boston, despite the fact that Boston seemed to be the only one out of the group of teams that offered a good enough package. In spite of that, KG wanted to be a Sun and was still handcuffed by the Timberwolves needing to do what was best for their franchise. Lebron and Durant didn't have to deal with that, so to say that KG and Allen should be latched onto what Lebron and Durant did is absolutely nonsensical. It disregards that at the time of the Allen and Garnett trade that the GM and front office still had more power over personnel movement than players did (even if they had NTC/NMCs). I'm not trying to say that if a GM does it, that it's better than players doing it, but there's context for each situation and it's important to note the balance of power when GMs do it vs. the balance of power when players make the move.
To your point about the double standard with Lebron, I actually see the other way around more often than I see people who bash Lebron: people complain that when KD does it, it's bad for parity, he's a ”bitch" for going to a 73-win team but when Lebron did the Decision, it was a great thing and that he was a forward thinker and how Dan Gilbert was a cheap owner who did nothing to help Lebron. Also, the Heat were bad? They got killed by the Celtics in the playoffs but they had a 47-35 record before the Decision. Hardly a bad team and sounds like a bit of revisionist history going on to justify Lebron's choice. Moreover, what difference does the whole 3-1 vs. Miami Heat being .570, Bosh and Wade not being MVP caliber make when the Heat were guaranteed finalists vs. a weak Eastern Conference? Regardless of what happened in the past with both franchises, the point still remains, both were moves that lessened competition to prioritize winning championships. In that regard, I'm just amazed that people ignore that about Lebron while piling on KD for doing something that Lebron did.
You know that wasn't the point. The point is that Lebron set the precedent in the sense that UFAs will sign with a great team in order to have a chance to win. He didn't say Lebron set the precedent for superteams.
Only makes sense that one of the most loyal owners has the most loyal fanbase. Wish we could attract some bigger talent though.
LeBron made it okay for a star player to willingly leave his team and join the team of his greatest on court rival. Dwayne Wade was the second best player in the league when LeBron made the decision. He was the first player ever to choose to play WITH his greatest competition as opposed to try and beat it.
That decision paved the way for Durant to leave OKC to go play WITH the team that just beat him and also to play WITH one of the top 5 players in the league (Curry) as opposed to trying to beat him.
I also want to be clear I'm not a fan of either of LeBron's decisions or KD's. I get that they have the right to play wherever they want, but as a neutral fan of basketball, all three decisions hurt the overall product.
The NBA has many problems that are hurting its parity issues, and solving one of them isn't going to fix the entire system (As Durant mentioned himself with his comments about Orlando and Brooklyn). But star players wanting to compete WITH each other as opposed to against each other is a problem for parity.
Yes there have been stacked teams in the past, but they were done through great work by a general manager. Like the Lakers in the 80's making multiple trades to acquire the draft rights to both Magic and Worthy to pair with Kareem. And the 80's Celtics trading for both McHale and Parish to put with Bird. But even those teams had more competition than the two best teams currently have.
Latvian Hitman
Member
Potato, potato.
Macadinho94
Member
Hahahaha
Lol I am sure he considered it during these playoffs
beat
Member
I think I found the answer to your question.
That said I answered it more fully in a previous post, which you already read. KG had a choice. Because he was on an expiring contract, teams weren't going to trade for him at all if he didn't sign-and-trade.
You say that's not wide open because not every team had the assets to make a viable trade. Well, there were only a handful of teams in the KD sweepstakes because only a few had both the cap space to take him and a situation he wanted to go to. How is that different from only a few teams with the assets to trade for KG and a situation KG wanted to go to?
CopperPuppy
Member
beat
Member
Now that you mention it, I am reminded that Uber poached one of the leads of the self-driving project at Google/Alphabet (Waymo)...
To be fair, everyone thought giving up Bogut and Ezeli would matter. Ezeli was an athletic center and Bogut an excellent screen setter and passer. The Dubs lucked out by getting David West in full ring-chasing mode plus Zaza and esp McGee have outperformed expectations.
Cocky KD thinkin he's a better shooter than Max Barnes. /s
Fluffhead14
Member
i don't begrudge guys leaving teams to play with people they want to play with to win a championship. and this warriors team is far from the first "super team"
but to join the team you were up 3-1 against, one win from the finals?
just does not sit right with me.
but to join the team you were up 3-1 against, one win from the finals?
just does not sit right with me.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
He omitted the Magic but kept the Raptors and Grizz, huh?
SlackAdjuster
Member
I try to be as un-homer as I can.
I feel like the Warriors have pretty much painted themselves into a lose-lose situation.
If they get Bron'd again, after adding Durant, they are gonna get clowned even worse than the blowing of the ole' 3-1 lead.
If they win, well, all things considered, they kind of should.
I feel like the Warriors have pretty much painted themselves into a lose-lose situation.
If they get Bron'd again, after adding Durant, they are gonna get clowned even worse than the blowing of the ole' 3-1 lead.
If they win, well, all things considered, they kind of should.
The way Bogut and Ezeli's seasons turned out ameliorates GSW's center situation, but a healthy Bogut is soooo much better than anything they currently have. With Iggy essentially washed, there's gonna be more center play and it's not looking good.
David West could be flat out unplayable against the Cavs as well.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
I'm sure people will see it that way if they win. There may not even be a parade since it's just so whatever.
I'm assuming that is KD's crib? He and I have the exact same taste in coffee tables, lol.
He played really well in the 15 game stretch in the regular season when KD was out I thought. Hopefully this time off lets him heal up, and he'll be ready for finals.
Speaking of Finals, damn WE ALMOST THERE.
The best you can hope for is that old man glory where he can summon it for a half or some quarters here and there. But he never was D Wade in the first place and he's as scared as I've seen anyone on the floor. It also pisses me off that he's probably second behind Steph in unforced turnovers. It's like he knows he doesn't have it so he tries to compensate with these passes that have no place in the playoffs when defenders are on it.
I would never have said this in the regular season, but they should try some more McCaw.
7 all stars, 3 of the top 4 players in the world, everyone in their prime? Popcorn.gif
Latvian Hitman
Member
Not everyone thought that. There were plenty of people, myself included, that felt they could pretty much plug any pair of minimum-contract bigs into those spots with little to no dropoff, because these replacements would benefit from the same situation Bogut and Ezeli did: nobody can afford to pay any damn attention to you on the court when you're out there with 3 or 4 all-stars.
Take any of the guys mentioned away from GS and put them on an average team and the world forgets about them entirely.
Stabby McSter
Member
its his old crib. i wanna say this pic was from the 14-15 season or something, with all the dank memes added
Defensively, not offensively. Most thought losing those guys would hurt them with pts in the paint and def rebounding. So far that hasn't been the case, but we'll see against the Cavs.
Pretty sure he got that leg tattoo of Rick James after he became a Warrior.
Latvian Hitman
Member
That's a good point- though that's really where the addition of Durant comes in. He gives you an extra 7-footer with a ridiculous wingspan. And while he isn't going to overpower other bigs for boards or challenges at the rim, he's good at being "sneaky" and racking up those things up over the course of a game.
George Claw M.D.
Member
Thanks for that!
He's in his mental prime. But his physical prime was during his Miami days. Too bad the 2 don't often lineup. Imagine him today with his athleticism of back then. whew
BlazinSkatinAxel
Member
Had GSW had MAX Barnes, they'd win in 5.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Just like championships, you barely got us beat and you out there yapping.
Also, I was told by haters that LA was full of fake Laker fans and was a Clipper Town.
LMAO.
Utah being really low and Atlanta being really high are pretty shocking to me. I would have expected those two to be reversed.
It was from when he went down a few months ago with the knee injury
I know you'd be doing the same if you were on top <3
MegaManTrigger
Banned
You cut out the important part of my quote, where Timberwolves weren't just gonna trade him because he said he wanted to go to the Suns. KG had to either wait until Timberwolves were satisfied with the package they were getting in offers (and they had no problems rejecting trade packages iirc), or accept that Boston/Golden State was the best situation for him despite being deadset on the Suns. And that's not taking into account when ownership decides to intervene and veto the trade. That's the difference between KG and KD situations. As for your point about cap space and situation, Golden State didn't have the cap space at the time that they signed KD and had to make a couple of roster moves like renouncing rights to Harrison Barnes, Festus Ezeli, and trade Andrew Bogut to the Mavs to be able to fit him in the line-up.
ryutaro's mama
Member
Psssh...11 of those chips happened when
1) neither of us were born
2) the league was 8 teams
at least they were won by the team representing my city!
LyleLanley
Banned
Bread is Bill Russell.
For the gap between now and Finals, ESPN brings you
LaVar Ball Highlights On Lonzo Ball, Lakers and NBA Draft | ESPN
LaVar Ball Highlights On Lonzo Ball, Lakers and NBA Draft | ESPN
You don't choose to be a Big Baller, Big Baller chooses you. Magic better pray LaVar makes him a Big Balla.
Bogut's screen setting and tag teaming defense in the paint with Draymond.
*nostalgic sigh*
He actually looks better in Cleveland than he did his last year in Miami. He had to be the best on court at everything except getting the opening tip for those Heat teams, dude was worn down. He got to Cleveland and they were like you don't have to guard anyone, you don't have to dive head first for every rebound, you don't have to be in the post. Then he got back on HGH and clips like these were a thing of the past.
Look at this 60 point game in Miami, no lift at all, no fast break points, everything below the rim.
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