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[DBT85]

Title should say Northern Irish.

http://www.skysports.com/football/n...ireland-and-republic-of-ireland-fined-by-fifa

England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland have all been fined by FIFA for wearing poppies during World Cup qualifiers.

The (English) Football Association's fine of £35,000 is the largest levied, with the Welsh and Scottish FA both fined £15,700, and Northern Ireland's IFA £11,800.

The Republic of Ireland's FAI was also fined just over £3,900 for displaying a political symbol on their shirt in a friendly clash with Switzerland back in March.

England and Scotland both agreed to wear poppies on their shirts for the qualifier at Wembley on Armistice Day, November 11, with both FAs fined for the "display by the host association, the team and spectators of a political symbol and several cases of spectator misconduct."

FIFA's statement confirmed the same reasoning behind fines for Wales and Northern Ireland from their matches last month against Serbia and Azerbaijan respectively.

Chairman of the FIFA Disciplinary Committee, Claudio Sulser, said: "With these decisions, it is not our intention to judge or question specific commemorations as we fully respect the significance of such moments in the respective countries, each one of them with its own history and background.

"However, keeping in mind that the rules need to be applied in a neutral and fair manner across FIFA's 211 member associations, the display, among others, of any political or religious symbol is strictly prohibited. In the stadium and on the pitch, there is only room for sport, nothing els

 

[SomedayTheFire]

We (Ireland) weren't fined for wearing poppies, though. We were fined for a 1916 commemoration.

 

[Acorn]

Really shouldn't count as a political thing. It's closer to black armbands. FIFA needs to learn nuance.

 

[Khaz]

Celebrating the Armistice is a political statement? What?

 

[gutter_trash]

Russia 2020 and Quatar 2024 = FIFA in a nutshell

 

[StayDead]

I don't get why it was made a political thing. I thought the idea of remembrance day was to remember all those who died in the war, not just people from x country.

 

[Triggerhappytel]

I don't get why it was made a political thing. I thought the idea of remembrance day was to remember all those who died in the war, not just people from x country.

Pretty much. This seems like bullshit.

 

[Acorn]

I don't get why it was made a political thing. I thought the idea of remembrance day was to remember all those who died in the war, not just people from x country.

FIFA allowed it previously too. FIFA gon FIFA.

 

[Coxy100]

Celebrating the Armistice is a political statement? What?

This. FIFA really is pathetic. Add corrupt as well.

 

[Napoleonthechimp]

Worth it.

 

[Fur_Q]

Cunts, take the hit. Fuck em.

 

[Media]

I don't get why it was made a political thing. I thought the idea of remembrance day was to remember all those who died in the war, not just people from x country.

This. It's almost universal at this point. It's one of last things I'd consider political.

 

[Glass Rebel]

FIFA was a mistake it is nothing but trash dot jaypeg

 

[Charles Brandon]

The counter argument is that the poppy is a symbol of support for the armed forces, which is a political statement, arguably. The money raised is used to support injured service men and women.

However, the nuance is that the poppy does not symbolise support for war or the army, it symbolises support for the service men and women who are the victims of war, irrespective of how just any particular war was.

 

[DeathyBoy]

I don't get why it was made a political thing. I thought the idea of remembrance day was to remember all those who died in the war, not just people from x country.

We were all wrong, bruh.

 

[Maledict]

I'm going to take the other side I'm afraid. FIFA should not be in the position of deciding what is political and what isn't, and the only way to accomplish that is to forbid any form of symbol or commereration for any event.

 

[kirblar]

Pretty sure the only political statement here is FIFA's.

 

[spons]

Pay up or make your own football organization. No sense in arguing here as it's probably in the contract they all signed.

 

[DKehoe]

Celebrating the Armistice is a political statement? What?

There are people, Irish player James McClean for example, who view the poppy as a symbol of support for all of the British military operations. In McClean's case he doesn't want to have to wear something during club games that can be taken as a symbol of support for the British occupation of Ireland and the deaths that came from that.

 

[Vivalaraza]

The right decision.

It is a political symbol.

And the ruling is clear. The FA knew this would be the result. Pay up, they can afford it.

 

[Symphonia]

The right decision.

It is a political symbol.

And the ruling is clear. The FA knew this would be the result. Pay up, they can afford it.

How dare we remember the fallen.

How dare we.

 

[dalin80]

The right decision.

It is a political symbol.

And the ruling is clear. The FA knew this would be the result. Pay up, they can afford it.

What political party does the poppy represent?

 

[D4Danger]

They should donate the money to the poppy appeal and tell FIFA to stick it up their arse.

 

[Walshicus]

I'm going to take the other side I'm afraid. FIFA should not be in the position of deciding what is political and what isn't, and the only way to accomplish that is to forbid any form of symbol or commereration for any event.

Agreed.

 

[amanset]

The right decision.

It is a political symbol.

And the ruling is clear. The FA knew this would be the result. Pay up, they can afford it.

I'd like to see them refuse to pay it and then make a donation the size of the fine to the British Legion

 

[Mesousa]

There are people, Irish player James McClean for example, who view the poppy as a symbol of support for all of the British military operations. In McClean's case he doesn't want to have to wear something during club games that can be taken as a symbol of support for the British occupation of Ireland and the deaths that came from that.

He gets death threats for this too.

 

[Maledict]

How dare we remember the fallen.

How dare we.

What it means to you is not what it means to everyone. That's why, as good and as right as armistice day the poppy celebrations are, FIFA was right o ban this because otherwise it makes FIFA into a tribunal who have to judge what symbols are allowed and what aren't. Which is a bad place for an international sports body to be in, and best avoided by banning all and every symbol.

I mean, for heavens sake, did the players wearing poppies actually accomplish anything? Was there a worry that people in the UK had forgotten armistice day? Maybe if the players donated their salary for that match it would be more impactful? Right now it feels like a huge storm in a teacup.

 

[QuicheFontaine]

Worth it.

Yeah, I would chip in for the fine. Better than backing down to FIFA demands.

 

[Vivalaraza]

How dare we remember the fallen.

How dare we.

That's not what I said. But it's a typical example of the kind of shaming some people engage in whenever the poppy is discussed these days.

You can remember them without wearing a poppy.

 

[amanset]

What it means to you is not what it means to everyone. That's why, as good and as right as armistice day the poppy celebrations are, FIFA was right o ban this because otherwise it makes FIFA into a tribunal who have to judge what symbols are allowed and what aren't. Which is a bad place for an international sports body to be in, and best avoided by banning all and every symbol.

I mean, for heavens sake, did the players wearing poppies actually accomplish anything? Was there a worry that people in the UK had forgotten armistice day? Maybe if the players donated their salary for that match it would be more impactful? Right now it feels like a huge storm in a teacup.

Yet they allowed it as recently as 2011.

 

[Vivalaraza]

What political party does the poppy represent?

It doesn't have to represent a political party for it to be political...

 

[RocknRola]

It kinda sucks, since it's a powerful (and good) symbol for Peace, but by allowing it then others would also have to be allowed. Since they don't want to allow any, it makes sense to not allow this one too. Sucks, but alas it is what it is.

Out of all the crappy things FIFA does, this is fairly understandable (considering their own set of rules).

Besides this is just in regards to National Teams qualifiers, clubs at the various British leagues can still wear them since those are regulated by the local FA's.

 

[ClosingADoor]

Rules apply to everybody, they have to draw a line somewhere. Otherwise you'd get endless discussion about what is and isn't allowed.

 

[purseowner]

How refreshing. Yep, it's a highly political symbol.

 

[Symphonia]

That's not what I said. But it's a typical example of the kind of shaming some people engage in whenever the poppy is discussed these days.

You can remember them without wearing a poppy.

It's a symbol of remembrance, not a symbol of political alignment. The poppy has been, and always will be, a sign of tribute to every single life that was lost in the war. Much like how the two-minute silence held on 11/11 is a sign of remembering the fallen. It's considered highly disrespectful to many if you willingly choose to ignore the silence and what it stands for, much like how many consider it disrespectful of FIFA to not allow players to display this sign of remembrance. But, hey, FIFA's gonna FIFA.

 

[7aged]

The right decision.

Frankly, in the UK the amount of political and social pressure to conform and glorify the British army with the whole poppy appeal is insane.

 

[7aged]

It's a symbol of remembrance, not a symbol of political alignment. The poppy has been, and always will be, a sign of tribute to every single life that was lost in the war. Much like how the two-minute silence held on 11/11 is a sign of remembering the fallen. It's considered highly disrespectful to many if you willingly choose to ignore the silence and what it stands for, much like how many consider it disrespectful of FIFA to not allow players to display this sign of remembrance. But, hey, FIFA's gonna FIFA.

That's the white poppy. The red poppy is for the British legion.

 

[DBT85]

Should add that in March England played France in Paris in the Six Nations (Rugby) tournament and wore the poppy and nothing happened. France wore the bleuet.

 

[Uzzy]

It's clearly not an apolitical symbol, not anymore, especially after it got co-opted by certain elements in society to use as a stick to bash anyone who chooses not to wear one. So this is the right decision.

It's just a shame the money will be going to build Gianni Infantino a new house extension, rather than anything useful.

 

[Septy]

It has been co-opted into a symbol of British nationalism. If you don't wear one as a celebrity or when on television, you will recieve a lot of flak including death threats.

 

[Maledict]

It's a symbol of remembrance, not a symbol of political alignment. The poppy has been, and always will be, a sign of tribute to every single life that was lost in the war. Much like how the two-minute silence held on 11/11 is a sign of remembering the fallen. It's considered highly disrespectful to many if you willingly choose to ignore the silence and what it stands for, much like how many consider it disrespectful of FIFA to not allow players to display this sign of remembrance. But, hey, FIFA's gonna FIFA.

That's what *you* think it means. In this very thread you can see examples of people who disagree. For some people the red poppy absolutely is political.

(Again, not me, I wear one - but I think people should be able to not wear one and not get attacked for it, and likewise I don't think the massive public argument over this helps anyone anywhere and certainly not the aims of Remembrance Day).

 

[SomedayTheFire]

It's clearly not an apolitical symbol, not anymore, especially after it got co-opted by certain elements in society to use as a stick to bash anyone who chooses not to wear one. So this is the right decision.

It's just a shame the money will be going to build Gianni Infantino a new house extension, rather than anything useful.

Yep, if you force people to wear it or attack them if they don't it becomes political and loses any and all meaning.

 

[faridmon]

The irony is that, UK at the moment is in a political turmoil. In fact Poppy is used as a Political symbol more than anything in UK and its fucked up.

 

[RenditMan]

Really shouldn't count as a political thing. It's closer to black armbands. FIFA needs to learn nuance.

That 35 grand will pay for first class flights to the next bung paying country though.

Naunce would get in the way of that.

 

[RocknRola]

Should add that in March England played France in Paris in the Six Nations (Rugby) tournament and wore the poppy and nothing happened. France wore the bleuet.

Different organizations really. Rugby in many ways is far more of a forward thinking sport than football, though I prefer the latter myself (I mostly just watch the World Cup as far as Rugby goes).

 

[Maledict]

Yet they allowed it as recently as 2011.

And?

Maybe they changed the rules because recently the red poppy has been hijacked mor and mor as a nationalist symbol and used to browbeat propel into wearing it?

Things change. Expecting something to be the me, for ever after, seems a very restrictive way of running organisations,

 

[GeordieMark]

Pay the fines in coins.

 

[autumnleaf]

I think it's a stupid thing to punish anyone over but it is a very modern thing to get outraged about.

 

[Vivalaraza]

It's a symbol of remembrance, not a symbol of political alignment. The poppy has been, and always will be, a sign of tribute to every single life that was lost in the war. Much like how the two-minute silence held on 11/11 is a sign of remembering the fallen. It's considered highly disrespectful to many if you willingly choose to ignore the silence and what it stands for, much like how many consider it disrespectful of FIFA to not allow players to display this sign of remembrance. But, hey, FIFA's gonna FIFA.

It now extends to every war since the Great War. Including Iraq and Afghanistan. Illegal wars.

For the record - I did wear a poppy last year, didn't this year. I stand for the minutes silence. I was at the cenotaph this year also. You don't need the poppy to pay respect.

 

[Zaph]

Both FIFA and the FA's did what they had to do.

FIFA don't want to be in a situation where they're deciding what is and isn't political, and the FA's shouldn't let that stand in the way of doing the right thing.

A symbolic fine, with no points penalty, was the best way of getting this resolved.

Spoiler

But fuck FIFA