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[ultron87]

The Garnett freak out was totally worth it. Personally I've never put any psychological value to loot beyond how it helps my character since A) there will always be someone with something better and b) it's all the result of a random number generator anyway, but I can see how someone who did take value in having the +3 really cool sword could get really pissed about the RMAH.

Hopefully they just have some drops be BoP so that there are still items where you know you got it instead of bought it.

The "Just in case you're joining us, we're talking about Game X" breaks weird me out. It's not like people often jump into podcasts mid episode.

 

[Zzoram]

The problem with Garnett's rant was that it was from a position of ignorance. How could he not know that real money selling of Diablo loot has existed for 10 years and this is just bringing it in-house? If he did know that, then how would the RMAH make things any different then before?

 

[DaBuddaDa]

The problem with Garnett's rant was that it was from a position of ignorance. How could he not know that real money selling of Diablo loot has existed for 10 years and this is just bringing it in-house? If he did know that, then how would the RMAH make things any different then before?

I really would like to hear what Garnett would say to this.

 

[Zzoram]

I really would like to hear what Garnett would say to this.

He's too busy boycotting Diablo III and flipping off Blizzard to think about this rationally.

Instead he'll be playing Torchlight 2, a game where he believes everyone earned every piece of loot. He'll be playing on their open online, with no hacking protection whatsoever, and where people can simply mod in godly items on a whim.

 

[CartridgeBlower]

I really would like to hear what Garnett would say to this.

Didn't he respond to exactly that on the last page?

 

[CartridgeBlower]

The problem with Garnett's rant was that it was from a position of ignorance. How could he not know that real money selling of Diablo loot has existed for 10 years and this is just bringing it in-house? If he did know that, then how would the RMAH make things any different then before?

But that's his exact problem with it -- bringing it in-house.

He doesn't like the fact that Blizzard is endorsing it. Agree or disagree, his stance isn't that crazy or unheard of. He just got a little riled up and people are reacting more to his emotion than what his actual point was, which for sure is partly his fault. But again, not too crazy.

 

[DaBuddaDa]

Didn't he respond to exactly that on the last page?

He posited that most people wouldn't "take the risk" to buy something in D2, and Blizzard endorsing it would make it more widespread. He's probably right, but, he didn't answer the question of why that's any worse. Still, a LOT of people bought stuff in D2, enough to be very noticeable.

 

[pieatorium]

He posited that most people wouldn't "take the risk" to buy something in D2, and Blizzard endorsing it would make it more widespread. He's probably right, but, he didn't answer the question of why that's any worse. Still, a LOT of people bought stuff in D2, enough to be very noticeable.

It's become even more widespread since WoW aswell, not just the hardcore out there buying stuff to get that pvp advantage or whatever but alot of casual players spend quite a bit on rare mounts and miscelanious items.

 

[Zzoram]

But that's his exact problem with it -- bringing it in-house.

He doesn't like the fact that Blizzard is endorsing it. Agree or disagree, his stance isn't that crazy or unheard of. He just got a little riled up and people are reacting more to his emotion than what his actual point was, which for sure is partly his fault. But again, not too crazy.

Maybe it would increase the number of people doing it. However, how is Torchlight 2 going to be better? They allow you to mod items right into the game, you could give your level 1 character infinitely good gear from day 1 if you want. It'll be especially easy once someone publishes the mods and people just have to download it, not make it themselves. It's about the same effort as using an auction house, only it'll be free. The same people who lack self control would make Torchlight 2's online far worse due to the lack of restriction.

 

[SkinnyPupp]

Nope. If the RMAH existed in WoW, everything would be exactly the same, except Gold Farmers would be selling their stuff through the game instead of Ebay or sketchy websites.

All that the RMAH does is bring a formerly unsanctioned illegal activity into the game, making it sanctioned and legal.

The difference being, gold buying and gold selling is specifically defined as illegal in the game, and a direct TOS violation. Even though it is rampant, they do actively look for people doing it, and ban accounts accordingly.

And that is probably the crux (take a shot) of Garnett's argument. Just because item selling has existed for 10 years or whatever does NOT make it okay. Just like you said, what they are doing is justifying 'cheating' in the game, and making it PART of the game. I think that's a legitimate reason to be upset (but not freak out) over.

 

[hey_it's_that_dog]

The difference being, gold buying and gold selling is specifically defined as illegal in the game, and a direct TOS violation. Even though it is rampant, they do actively look for people doing it, and ban accounts accordingly.

And that is probably the crux (take a shot) of Garnett's argument. Just because item selling has existed for 10 years or whatever does NOT make it okay. Just like you said, what they are doing is justifying 'cheating' in the game, and making it PART of the game. I think that's a legitimate reason to be upset (but not freak out) over.

Who is cheated by this cheating? Other than the fact that it was previously forbidden, what makes this sort of economic activity wrong?

 

[Aaron]

Maybe it would increase the number of people doing it. However, how is Torchlight 2 going to be better? They allow you to mod items right into the game, you could give your level 1 character infinitely good gear from day 1 if you want. It'll be especially easy once someone publishes the mods and people just have to download it, not make it themselves. It's about the same effort as using an auction house, only it'll be free. The same people who lack self control would make Torchlight 2's online far worse due to the lack of restriction.

Are people going to be stupid enough to buy items with real money off people in Torchlight 2? The fact that it's open to modding basically sidesteps this problem.

Basically, Blizzard had a choice between 'war on drugs (item selling)' and 'legalize it.' With so many F2P MMOs out there, they made the modern choice, rather than fighting a losing battle. Just ignoring the issue would have severely damaged their game.

 

[Zzoram]

Are people going to be stupid enough to buy items with real money off people in Torchlight 2? The fact that it's open to modding basically sidesteps this problem.

Basically, Blizzard had a choice between 'war on drugs (item selling)' and 'legalize it.' With so many F2P MMOs out there, they made the modern choice, rather than fighting a losing battle. Just ignoring the issue would have severely damaged their game.

No. But anyone will be able to get super rare loot easily by modding it into their game since the game, which makes things EVEN WORSE than Diablo 3, where at least the loot in the market is limited by what people have found, and people will have to pay or trade for it.

If Garnett would feel bad because somebody with top tier gear didn't "earn" it, he should feel worse in Torchlight 2, where everyone can have it by installing a loot mod somebody puts out. In Diablo 3, people at least have to "earn" the gear before they can sell it.

 

[firehawk12]

Aren't you basically assuming everyone will cheat when they play Torchlight 2? Or are they including a character editor with the game or something.

 

[Aaron]

Now I want to get on his friend's list, and hop into a T2 game with my specially made 'Ultimate Awesome Axe of Garnett Envy,' and tell him I bought it in D3.

The original Torchlight came with an editor. T2 will most likely also.

 

[Gaaraz]

I'm quite behind (as you can tell) but ugh @ Garnett's rant about the auction house in Diablo 3.

I think it's an awesome idea - people without much time on their hands still get the chance to experience some of the best equipment, and the people who dedicate a lot of time to this game get some kind of tangible reward if they sell their items.

Not everyone has a lot of time on their hands, not everyone works as a game reviewer who can do nothing but sit and play video games all day, every day. For those of us with actual lives, people who spend a lot of our time working and then in the evenings doing things other than just playing video games, I think it's a perfect solution.


Who the hell is Garnett to question that?

 

[Duffyside]

I'm quite behind (as you can tell) but ugh @ Garnett's rant about the auction house in Diablo 3.

I think it's an awesome idea - people without much time on their hands still get the chance to experience some of the best equipment, and the people who dedicate a lot of time to this game get some kind of tangible reward if they sell their items.

Not everyone has a lot of time on their hands, not everyone works as a game reviewer who can do nothing but sit and play video games all day, every day. For those of us with actual lives, people who spend a lot of our time working and then in the evenings doing things other than just playing video games, I think it's a perfect solution.


Who the hell is Garnett to question that?

I agree with you on everything but the bolded part. He's allowed to question it, for pete's sake; I understand where he's coming from.

 

[Gaaraz]

Sorry that was badly phrased - sure he can question it, but it was more the manner of it which I was questioning - lots of shouting, lots of swearing and generally it was a little embarrassing.

Saying that, I'm probably biased since I have bought gold in both Guild Wars and World of Warcraft before, I work a lot of hours in my job, and most evenings I spend doing things with my girlfriend so time is at quite a premium to myself - doesn't seem fair that having less free time also means I wouldn't get to experience the best equipment in these games.

He kept labouring the point that people would do it because they were lazy, yet there's a very good chance they worked a lot harder for that money than he would just by playing the game.